Career Advice Request

[bjensen]

I greatly respect the opinions of many of you, and thought you may be willing to respond to this off topic thread.

I have worked in sales for about 4 years, and like NavyDoc once said about his past, I have similarly lost the drive for sales.

I know that many of you are engineers, but I wondered what you all thought about the value of a law degree today.

I know there is a glut of JD’s. I have researched extensively about how lower tier graduates aren’t making enough doing temp work to pay down their student loans.

It seems like it is so much more a high stakes game now that tuition for 3 years is over 100k. It seems access to easy credit has also increased tuition, much like it did to home prices. Now the law professors who can only teach 6 hours a week get a plump salary, and money from university law schools is funneled away into the general fund.

Anyway, there are roughly 200 accredited law schools in the US. Because there is such competition for good jobs I probably wouldn’t go if I couldn’t get into a top 30 school. I think that would improve my chances of getting a decent job post graduation, IMHO. My grades could get me in at all but Harvard and Yale, but I haven’t taken the LSAT yet so who knows.

If you think law school is a bad idea, what other career paths would you consider? I’m 26, with a wife and a 6 month old baby .

I have always had a tough time with the hard sciences. Anything above algebra is out of the question. I wish I was better at math as I have found it extremely career limiting.

I graduated in communications only to find that I don’t really like PR/Advertising/Marketing and that they pay so little for the first many years that I could never support a family in the short term.

I know this is not a career advice website, but like I said I respect your collective intelligeceas you put on a clinic for me here daily, and have kept me from buying a home for the last few years. I just had to ask.

In fact the advice to rent has also done wonders for my flexibility as I consider grad school! Thanks!

Thanks

[Borat]

Learn Mandarin and become an international business consultant for Chinese companies in the US or vice versa. Unlimited upside potential there, no hard math or science classes — just unbelievably hard language classes. The smartest move anyone your age could make. You could also do Spanish or Portugese and specialize in Latin American business but I think Chinese is the way to go long term, especially since you are so young. Good luck to you.

[svelte]

If you’re interested in law, want to maximize your income, and want to stay in San Diego, this looks like an option that has long-term prospects:

http://www.signonsandiego.com/news/business/20071222-9999-1b22lawyers.html

$700/hr is not too shabby.

[bjensen]

SD-Maybe

I wouldn’t solicit career advice anywhere but Piggington. I know where the intelligent gather. 🙂

Svelte

I actually live in Orange County, but would LOVE to move to San Diego eventually.

Thanks for all the great advice!

[bjensen]

SD-Maybe

I wouldn’t solicit career advice anywhere but Piggington. I know where the intelligent gather. 🙂

Svelte

I actually live in Orange County, but would LOVE to move to San Diego eventually.

Thanks for all the great advice!

[bjensen]

SD-Maybe

I wouldn’t solicit career advice anywhere but Piggington. I know where the intelligent gather. 🙂

Svelte

I actually live in Orange County, but would LOVE to move to San Diego eventually.

Thanks for all the great advice!

[bjensen]

SD-Maybe

I wouldn’t solicit career advice anywhere but Piggington. I know where the intelligent gather. 🙂

Svelte

I actually live in Orange County, but would LOVE to move to San Diego eventually.

Thanks for all the great advice!

[bjensen]

SD-Maybe

I wouldn’t solicit career advice anywhere but Piggington. I know where the intelligent gather. 🙂

Svelte

I actually live in Orange County, but would LOVE to move to San Diego eventually.

Thanks for all the great advice!

[Borat]

From that article…

“The key phrase that really is guiding most of the law firm activity in San Diego is ‘intellectual property, copyright and patent law,’ ” said Reed of CB Richard Ellis.

Specializing in IP law almost always requires a bachelor’s degree in science or engineering. I can almost guarantee you that these firms are mostly dealing with biotech and hi-tech companies and that many of their lawyers are patent attorneys with engineering/science undergrad degrees. Also, the $700/hour figure is what the firm bills. The attorneys themselves don’t make anywhere near that although they do earn a very nice living.

Anyway, back to the original post. Unless you want to buckle down and get an engineering or science degree before heading off to law school, don’t expect to make a lot of money right away. Still, it might be a good option but you will have a lot of competition…

[bjensen]

Borat –

I think I would like to specialize in copyright/trademark law, of which most tech-centric law firms keep a couple attorneys on staff…

Bad move in your opinion?

[bjensen]

Borat –

I think I would like to specialize in copyright/trademark law, of which most tech-centric law firms keep a couple attorneys on staff…

Bad move in your opinion?

[bjensen]

Borat –

I think I would like to specialize in copyright/trademark law, of which most tech-centric law firms keep a couple attorneys on staff…

Bad move in your opinion?

[bjensen]

Borat –

I think I would like to specialize in copyright/trademark law, of which most tech-centric law firms keep a couple attorneys on staff…

Bad move in your opinion?

[bjensen]

Borat –

I think I would like to specialize in copyright/trademark law, of which most tech-centric law firms keep a couple attorneys on staff…

Bad move in your opinion?

[nostradamus]

Just from a salary perspective, my lawyer makes 4 times what I do and my income is pretty good (in the top 5% according to Forbes). He doesn’t work nearly as much or as hard as I do either. He is not a patent/trademark lawyer, his specialty is litigation. 9 out of 10 lawsuits don’t see their day in court (they reach settlements) so you might say he doesn’t work at all. 🙂

Law is the smart way to go if you’re lazy and want to get rich. It can also be very depressing and you will see the worst of society on a daily basis.

[bjensen]

Is your attorney a solo, or is he a partner? I assume making that much he isn’t an associate…

[bjensen]

Is your attorney a solo, or is he a partner? I assume making that much he isn’t an associate…

[bjensen]

Is your attorney a solo, or is he a partner? I assume making that much he isn’t an associate…

[bjensen]

Is your attorney a solo, or is he a partner? I assume making that much he isn’t an associate…

[bjensen]

Is your attorney a solo, or is he a partner? I assume making that much he isn’t an associate…

[Anonymous]

Nostradamus, I realize your post may have been totally tongue-in-cheek. But in case you were serious, I beg to differ. I have been a litigation attorney for nearly 12 years now, and in my experience, there is generally a pretty close relationship between a lawyer’s income and the number of hours worked. Also FYI, there is an incredible amount of work involved in litigation outside the courtroom. The notion that a lawyer whose cases end up settling out of court is not working is ridiculous. And to bjensen, you definitely should not go to law school just because you can’t figure out what else you want to do. If you graduate in the top 25% of your class from a top-20 law school, you can be pretty well assured of a good job and income. I would not even think of going to law school and taking on the debt burden if you cannot get into a top school. This means you will have to move out of San Diego to attend law school, as you may already know. Law school, especially the first year, is no walk in the park, and the practice of law is not for everyone. I recommend you think seriously about what you really want to do with your life, rather than focusing on law school as a semi-guaranteed path to a great paycheck, and only if you are fairly certain you want to practice law should you start down the law school path.

[Anonymous]

Nostradamus, I realize your post may have been totally tongue-in-cheek. But in case you were serious, I beg to differ. I have been a litigation attorney for nearly 12 years now, and in my experience, there is generally a pretty close relationship between a lawyer’s income and the number of hours worked. Also FYI, there is an incredible amount of work involved in litigation outside the courtroom. The notion that a lawyer whose cases end up settling out of court is not working is ridiculous. And to bjensen, you definitely should not go to law school just because you can’t figure out what else you want to do. If you graduate in the top 25% of your class from a top-20 law school, you can be pretty well assured of a good job and income. I would not even think of going to law school and taking on the debt burden if you cannot get into a top school. This means you will have to move out of San Diego to attend law school, as you may already know. Law school, especially the first year, is no walk in the park, and the practice of law is not for everyone. I recommend you think seriously about what you really want to do with your life, rather than focusing on law school as a semi-guaranteed path to a great paycheck, and only if you are fairly certain you want to practice law should you start down the law school path.

[Anonymous]

Nostradamus, I realize your post may have been totally tongue-in-cheek. But in case you were serious, I beg to differ. I have been a litigation attorney for nearly 12 years now, and in my experience, there is generally a pretty close relationship between a lawyer’s income and the number of hours worked. Also FYI, there is an incredible amount of work involved in litigation outside the courtroom. The notion that a lawyer whose cases end up settling out of court is not working is ridiculous. And to bjensen, you definitely should not go to law school just because you can’t figure out what else you want to do. If you graduate in the top 25% of your class from a top-20 law school, you can be pretty well assured of a good job and income. I would not even think of going to law school and taking on the debt burden if you cannot get into a top school. This means you will have to move out of San Diego to attend law school, as you may already know. Law school, especially the first year, is no walk in the park, and the practice of law is not for everyone. I recommend you think seriously about what you really want to do with your life, rather than focusing on law school as a semi-guaranteed path to a great paycheck, and only if you are fairly certain you want to practice law should you start down the law school path.

[Anonymous]

Nostradamus, I realize your post may have been totally tongue-in-cheek. But in case you were serious, I beg to differ. I have been a litigation attorney for nearly 12 years now, and in my experience, there is generally a pretty close relationship between a lawyer’s income and the number of hours worked. Also FYI, there is an incredible amount of work involved in litigation outside the courtroom. The notion that a lawyer whose cases end up settling out of court is not working is ridiculous. And to bjensen, you definitely should not go to law school just because you can’t figure out what else you want to do. If you graduate in the top 25% of your class from a top-20 law school, you can be pretty well assured of a good job and income. I would not even think of going to law school and taking on the debt burden if you cannot get into a top school. This means you will have to move out of San Diego to attend law school, as you may already know. Law school, especially the first year, is no walk in the park, and the practice of law is not for everyone. I recommend you think seriously about what you really want to do with your life, rather than focusing on law school as a semi-guaranteed path to a great paycheck, and only if you are fairly certain you want to practice law should you start down the law school path.

[Anonymous]

Nostradamus, I realize your post may have been totally tongue-in-cheek. But in case you were serious, I beg to differ. I have been a litigation attorney for nearly 12 years now, and in my experience, there is generally a pretty close relationship between a lawyer’s income and the number of hours worked. Also FYI, there is an incredible amount of work involved in litigation outside the courtroom. The notion that a lawyer whose cases end up settling out of court is not working is ridiculous. And to bjensen, you definitely should not go to law school just because you can’t figure out what else you want to do. If you graduate in the top 25% of your class from a top-20 law school, you can be pretty well assured of a good job and income. I would not even think of going to law school and taking on the debt burden if you cannot get into a top school. This means you will have to move out of San Diego to attend law school, as you may already know. Law school, especially the first year, is no walk in the park, and the practice of law is not for everyone. I recommend you think seriously about what you really want to do with your life, rather than focusing on law school as a semi-guaranteed path to a great paycheck, and only if you are fairly certain you want to practice law should you start down the law school path.

[nostradamus]

Just from a salary perspective, my lawyer makes 4 times what I do and my income is pretty good (in the top 5% according to Forbes). He doesn’t work nearly as much or as hard as I do either. He is not a patent/trademark lawyer, his specialty is litigation. 9 out of 10 lawsuits don’t see their day in court (they reach settlements) so you might say he doesn’t work at all. 🙂

Law is the smart way to go if you’re lazy and want to get rich. It can also be very depressing and you will see the worst of society on a daily basis.

[nostradamus]

Just from a salary perspective, my lawyer makes 4 times what I do and my income is pretty good (in the top 5% according to Forbes). He doesn’t work nearly as much or as hard as I do either. He is not a patent/trademark lawyer, his specialty is litigation. 9 out of 10 lawsuits don’t see their day in court (they reach settlements) so you might say he doesn’t work at all. 🙂

Law is the smart way to go if you’re lazy and want to get rich. It can also be very depressing and you will see the worst of society on a daily basis.

[nostradamus]

Just from a salary perspective, my lawyer makes 4 times what I do and my income is pretty good (in the top 5% according to Forbes). He doesn’t work nearly as much or as hard as I do either. He is not a patent/trademark lawyer, his specialty is litigation. 9 out of 10 lawsuits don’t see their day in court (they reach settlements) so you might say he doesn’t work at all. 🙂

Law is the smart way to go if you’re lazy and want to get rich. It can also be very depressing and you will see the worst of society on a daily basis.

[nostradamus]

Just from a salary perspective, my lawyer makes 4 times what I do and my income is pretty good (in the top 5% according to Forbes). He doesn’t work nearly as much or as hard as I do either. He is not a patent/trademark lawyer, his specialty is litigation. 9 out of 10 lawsuits don’t see their day in court (they reach settlements) so you might say he doesn’t work at all. 🙂

Law is the smart way to go if you’re lazy and want to get rich. It can also be very depressing and you will see the worst of society on a daily basis.

[larrylujack]

. Unless you want to buckle down and get an engineering or science degree before heading off to law school, don’t expect to make a lot of money right away. Still, it might be a good option but you will have a lot of competition…

I agree with the above since I am in the business. You don’t need to go to Harvard or Stanford for your JD to get a position with a good firm if you have a Biotech PhD or an egineering MS or BS. On the other hand, if you don’t have a technical degree, you do need to do well at a top tier law school or forget getting an associate position at a top firm, that’s just the plain facts- JDs who graduate from average law schools or do average in law school with econ or polisci majors are a dime a dozen.
However, the nice thing about being an attorney is that what you have learned can be used for many other professions, such as running a business, etc. You will find that a JD will expand your professional options tremendously. You will also use what you learned in law school in everyday life, for example, dealing with contracts. Thus, I really don’t think you can go wrong with a JD because it will provide you with skills you can use for the practice of law, as well as outside the traditional practice of law and in everyday life. I am glad I did.
Good luck,
LL

[larrylujack]

. Unless you want to buckle down and get an engineering or science degree before heading off to law school, don’t expect to make a lot of money right away. Still, it might be a good option but you will have a lot of competition…

I agree with the above since I am in the business. You don’t need to go to Harvard or Stanford for your JD to get a position with a good firm if you have a Biotech PhD or an egineering MS or BS. On the other hand, if you don’t have a technical degree, you do need to do well at a top tier law school or forget getting an associate position at a top firm, that’s just the plain facts- JDs who graduate from average law schools or do average in law school with econ or polisci majors are a dime a dozen.
However, the nice thing about being an attorney is that what you have learned can be used for many other professions, such as running a business, etc. You will find that a JD will expand your professional options tremendously. You will also use what you learned in law school in everyday life, for example, dealing with contracts. Thus, I really don’t think you can go wrong with a JD because it will provide you with skills you can use for the practice of law, as well as outside the traditional practice of law and in everyday life. I am glad I did.
Good luck,
LL

[larrylujack]

. Unless you want to buckle down and get an engineering or science degree before heading off to law school, don’t expect to make a lot of money right away. Still, it might be a good option but you will have a lot of competition…

I agree with the above since I am in the business. You don’t need to go to Harvard or Stanford for your JD to get a position with a good firm if you have a Biotech PhD or an egineering MS or BS. On the other hand, if you don’t have a technical degree, you do need to do well at a top tier law school or forget getting an associate position at a top firm, that’s just the plain facts- JDs who graduate from average law schools or do average in law school with econ or polisci majors are a dime a dozen.
However, the nice thing about being an attorney is that what you have learned can be used for many other professions, such as running a business, etc. You will find that a JD will expand your professional options tremendously. You will also use what you learned in law school in everyday life, for example, dealing with contracts. Thus, I really don’t think you can go wrong with a JD because it will provide you with skills you can use for the practice of law, as well as outside the traditional practice of law and in everyday life. I am glad I did.
Good luck,
LL

[larrylujack]

. Unless you want to buckle down and get an engineering or science degree before heading off to law school, don’t expect to make a lot of money right away. Still, it might be a good option but you will have a lot of competition…

I agree with the above since I am in the business. You don’t need to go to Harvard or Stanford for your JD to get a position with a good firm if you have a Biotech PhD or an egineering MS or BS. On the other hand, if you don’t have a technical degree, you do need to do well at a top tier law school or forget getting an associate position at a top firm, that’s just the plain facts- JDs who graduate from average law schools or do average in law school with econ or polisci majors are a dime a dozen.
However, the nice thing about being an attorney is that what you have learned can be used for many other professions, such as running a business, etc. You will find that a JD will expand your professional options tremendously. You will also use what you learned in law school in everyday life, for example, dealing with contracts. Thus, I really don’t think you can go wrong with a JD because it will provide you with skills you can use for the practice of law, as well as outside the traditional practice of law and in everyday life. I am glad I did.
Good luck,
LL

[larrylujack]

. Unless you want to buckle down and get an engineering or science degree before heading off to law school, don’t expect to make a lot of money right away. Still, it might be a good option but you will have a lot of competition…

I agree with the above since I am in the business. You don’t need to go to Harvard or Stanford for your JD to get a position with a good firm if you have a Biotech PhD or an egineering MS or BS. On the other hand, if you don’t have a technical degree, you do need to do well at a top tier law school or forget getting an associate position at a top firm, that’s just the plain facts- JDs who graduate from average law schools or do average in law school with econ or polisci majors are a dime a dozen.
However, the nice thing about being an attorney is that what you have learned can be used for many other professions, such as running a business, etc. You will find that a JD will expand your professional options tremendously. You will also use what you learned in law school in everyday life, for example, dealing with contracts. Thus, I really don’t think you can go wrong with a JD because it will provide you with skills you can use for the practice of law, as well as outside the traditional practice of law and in everyday life. I am glad I did.
Good luck,
LL

[svelte]

Sorry, just got around to re-reading this thread…

Specializing in IP law almost always requires a bachelor’s degree in science or engineering. I can almost guarantee you that these firms are mostly dealing with biotech and hi-tech companies and that many of their lawyers are patent attorneys with engineering/science undergrad degrees. Also, the $700/hour figure is what the firm bills. The attorneys themselves don’t make anywhere near that although they do earn a very nice living.

The article mentions that an engineering degree is typical for these positions. And you’re right, $700/hr is what the firm bills. My company charges customers about double what I make for my consulting time, so I would figure that a lawyer might see about $350/hr of that $700/hr…which equates to making $700,000/yr if working 40 hour weeks. As you say, a very nice living.

[bjensen]

I for one am not chasing money, but I do want to make sure that if I take on the equivalent of a mortgage in the Midwest, that I will be able to service my debts.

BTW, if I followed the motto repeated many times the result woud be, “Do what you love and end up a divorced ski bum.” =)

Another thread I just read raises an interesting question. Is there an education bubble? Has easy credit for education made higher education a less lucrative investment?

It seems that education costs have risen exponentially as private credit has pumped up the cost of a degree. The final result, at least for a bachelors degree, is lower earning power than the degree had 20 years ago.

From an investors point of view, is education still a BUY even at costs upwards of 150k in tuition?

[bjensen]

I for one am not chasing money, but I do want to make sure that if I take on the equivalent of a mortgage in the Midwest, that I will be able to service my debts.

BTW, if I followed the motto repeated many times the result woud be, “Do what you love and end up a divorced ski bum.” =)

Another thread I just read raises an interesting question. Is there an education bubble? Has easy credit for education made higher education a less lucrative investment?

It seems that education costs have risen exponentially as private credit has pumped up the cost of a degree. The final result, at least for a bachelors degree, is lower earning power than the degree had 20 years ago.

From an investors point of view, is education still a BUY even at costs upwards of 150k in tuition?

[bjensen]

I for one am not chasing money, but I do want to make sure that if I take on the equivalent of a mortgage in the Midwest, that I will be able to service my debts.

BTW, if I followed the motto repeated many times the result woud be, “Do what you love and end up a divorced ski bum.” =)

Another thread I just read raises an interesting question. Is there an education bubble? Has easy credit for education made higher education a less lucrative investment?

It seems that education costs have risen exponentially as private credit has pumped up the cost of a degree. The final result, at least for a bachelors degree, is lower earning power than the degree had 20 years ago.

From an investors point of view, is education still a BUY even at costs upwards of 150k in tuition?

[bjensen]

I for one am not chasing money, but I do want to make sure that if I take on the equivalent of a mortgage in the Midwest, that I will be able to service my debts.

BTW, if I followed the motto repeated many times the result woud be, “Do what you love and end up a divorced ski bum.” =)

Another thread I just read raises an interesting question. Is there an education bubble? Has easy credit for education made higher education a less lucrative investment?

It seems that education costs have risen exponentially as private credit has pumped up the cost of a degree. The final result, at least for a bachelors degree, is lower earning power than the degree had 20 years ago.

From an investors point of view, is education still a BUY even at costs upwards of 150k in tuition?

[bjensen]

I for one am not chasing money, but I do want to make sure that if I take on the equivalent of a mortgage in the Midwest, that I will be able to service my debts.

BTW, if I followed the motto repeated many times the result woud be, “Do what you love and end up a divorced ski bum.” =)

Another thread I just read raises an interesting question. Is there an education bubble? Has easy credit for education made higher education a less lucrative investment?

It seems that education costs have risen exponentially as private credit has pumped up the cost of a degree. The final result, at least for a bachelors degree, is lower earning power than the degree had 20 years ago.

From an investors point of view, is education still a BUY even at costs upwards of 150k in tuition?

[svelte]

Sorry, just got around to re-reading this thread…

Specializing in IP law almost always requires a bachelor’s degree in science or engineering. I can almost guarantee you that these firms are mostly dealing with biotech and hi-tech companies and that many of their lawyers are patent attorneys with engineering/science undergrad degrees. Also, the $700/hour figure is what the firm bills. The attorneys themselves don’t make anywhere near that although they do earn a very nice living.

The article mentions that an engineering degree is typical for these positions. And you’re right, $700/hr is what the firm bills. My company charges customers about double what I make for my consulting time, so I would figure that a lawyer might see about $350/hr of that $700/hr…which equates to making $700,000/yr if working 40 hour weeks. As you say, a very nice living.

[svelte]

Sorry, just got around to re-reading this thread…

Specializing in IP law almost always requires a bachelor’s degree in science or engineering. I can almost guarantee you that these firms are mostly dealing with biotech and hi-tech companies and that many of their lawyers are patent attorneys with engineering/science undergrad degrees. Also, the $700/hour figure is what the firm bills. The attorneys themselves don’t make anywhere near that although they do earn a very nice living.

The article mentions that an engineering degree is typical for these positions. And you’re right, $700/hr is what the firm bills. My company charges customers about double what I make for my consulting time, so I would figure that a lawyer might see about $350/hr of that $700/hr…which equates to making $700,000/yr if working 40 hour weeks. As you say, a very nice living.

[svelte]

Sorry, just got around to re-reading this thread…

Specializing in IP law almost always requires a bachelor’s degree in science or engineering. I can almost guarantee you that these firms are mostly dealing with biotech and hi-tech companies and that many of their lawyers are patent attorneys with engineering/science undergrad degrees. Also, the $700/hour figure is what the firm bills. The attorneys themselves don’t make anywhere near that although they do earn a very nice living.

The article mentions that an engineering degree is typical for these positions. And you’re right, $700/hr is what the firm bills. My company charges customers about double what I make for my consulting time, so I would figure that a lawyer might see about $350/hr of that $700/hr…which equates to making $700,000/yr if working 40 hour weeks. As you say, a very nice living.

[svelte]

Sorry, just got around to re-reading this thread…

Specializing in IP law almost always requires a bachelor’s degree in science or engineering. I can almost guarantee you that these firms are mostly dealing with biotech and hi-tech companies and that many of their lawyers are patent attorneys with engineering/science undergrad degrees. Also, the $700/hour figure is what the firm bills. The attorneys themselves don’t make anywhere near that although they do earn a very nice living.

The article mentions that an engineering degree is typical for these positions. And you’re right, $700/hr is what the firm bills. My company charges customers about double what I make for my consulting time, so I would figure that a lawyer might see about $350/hr of that $700/hr…which equates to making $700,000/yr if working 40 hour weeks. As you say, a very nice living.

[Borat]

From that article…

“The key phrase that really is guiding most of the law firm activity in San Diego is ‘intellectual property, copyright and patent law,’ ” said Reed of CB Richard Ellis.

Specializing in IP law almost always requires a bachelor’s degree in science or engineering. I can almost guarantee you that these firms are mostly dealing with biotech and hi-tech companies and that many of their lawyers are patent attorneys with engineering/science undergrad degrees. Also, the $700/hour figure is what the firm bills. The attorneys themselves don’t make anywhere near that although they do earn a very nice living.

Anyway, back to the original post. Unless you want to buckle down and get an engineering or science degree before heading off to law school, don’t expect to make a lot of money right away. Still, it might be a good option but you will have a lot of competition…

[Borat]

From that article…

“The key phrase that really is guiding most of the law firm activity in San Diego is ‘intellectual property, copyright and patent law,’ ” said Reed of CB Richard Ellis.

Specializing in IP law almost always requires a bachelor’s degree in science or engineering. I can almost guarantee you that these firms are mostly dealing with biotech and hi-tech companies and that many of their lawyers are patent attorneys with engineering/science undergrad degrees. Also, the $700/hour figure is what the firm bills. The attorneys themselves don’t make anywhere near that although they do earn a very nice living.

Anyway, back to the original post. Unless you want to buckle down and get an engineering or science degree before heading off to law school, don’t expect to make a lot of money right away. Still, it might be a good option but you will have a lot of competition…

[Borat]

From that article…

“The key phrase that really is guiding most of the law firm activity in San Diego is ‘intellectual property, copyright and patent law,’ ” said Reed of CB Richard Ellis.

Specializing in IP law almost always requires a bachelor’s degree in science or engineering. I can almost guarantee you that these firms are mostly dealing with biotech and hi-tech companies and that many of their lawyers are patent attorneys with engineering/science undergrad degrees. Also, the $700/hour figure is what the firm bills. The attorneys themselves don’t make anywhere near that although they do earn a very nice living.

Anyway, back to the original post. Unless you want to buckle down and get an engineering or science degree before heading off to law school, don’t expect to make a lot of money right away. Still, it might be a good option but you will have a lot of competition…

[Borat]

From that article…

“The key phrase that really is guiding most of the law firm activity in San Diego is ‘intellectual property, copyright and patent law,’ ” said Reed of CB Richard Ellis.

Specializing in IP law almost always requires a bachelor’s degree in science or engineering. I can almost guarantee you that these firms are mostly dealing with biotech and hi-tech companies and that many of their lawyers are patent attorneys with engineering/science undergrad degrees. Also, the $700/hour figure is what the firm bills. The attorneys themselves don’t make anywhere near that although they do earn a very nice living.

Anyway, back to the original post. Unless you want to buckle down and get an engineering or science degree before heading off to law school, don’t expect to make a lot of money right away. Still, it might be a good option but you will have a lot of competition…

[svelte]

If you’re interested in law, want to maximize your income, and want to stay in San Diego, this looks like an option that has long-term prospects:

http://www.signonsandiego.com/news/business/20071222-9999-1b22lawyers.html

$700/hr is not too shabby.

[svelte]

If you’re interested in law, want to maximize your income, and want to stay in San Diego, this looks like an option that has long-term prospects:

http://www.signonsandiego.com/news/business/20071222-9999-1b22lawyers.html

$700/hr is not too shabby.

[svelte]

If you’re interested in law, want to maximize your income, and want to stay in San Diego, this looks like an option that has long-term prospects:

http://www.signonsandiego.com/news/business/20071222-9999-1b22lawyers.html

$700/hr is not too shabby.

[svelte]

If you’re interested in law, want to maximize your income, and want to stay in San Diego, this looks like an option that has long-term prospects:

http://www.signonsandiego.com/news/business/20071222-9999-1b22lawyers.html

$700/hr is not too shabby.

[bjensen]

Borat –

Actually, I already speak Portuguese. I learned it over a year in Brazil, a year on the east coast in Rhode Island, and a year of international franchising going back and forth between Brazil and the US.

My worry is that for BRIC emerging markets… Brazil has been the laggard at best for the last decade plus.

Do you think that Mandarin is a must, or that there will be successes to be had in Latin America?

So do you think that law is too risky a gamble? Or do you thnk it would pay off as an investment? (Assuming a top 1-25 matriculation)

Thanks for the advice!

[gn]

So do you think that law is too risky a gamble? Or do you thnk it would pay off as an investment? (Assuming a top 1-25 matriculation)

I had a friend who quit his engineering job to go to law school. Like you, he did extensive research into the law profession. His conclusion was that one needs to graduate from one of the top 10 law schools to have a good chance of recuperating the investment (time/money/effort).

He said that because there is a huge surplus of lawyers, the employment prospects those who went to the schools ranked 11 – 25 is not that bright.

[bjensen]

Wow, if that is the case I sure pity the fools going to the 25-200 ranked schools!

[bjensen]

Wow, if that is the case I sure pity the fools going to the 25-200 ranked schools!

[bjensen]

Wow, if that is the case I sure pity the fools going to the 25-200 ranked schools!

[bjensen]

Wow, if that is the case I sure pity the fools going to the 25-200 ranked schools!

[bjensen]

Wow, if that is the case I sure pity the fools going to the 25-200 ranked schools!

[Anonymous]

well, I know a bunch of 2Ls at USD, ranked #85. Tier II.
I can say that:
-USD opens a lot of doors in San Diego and Orange County, not so many doors elsewhere (unless the doors are Catholic).
-some of the top national firms (Latham & Watkins, Baker & McKenzie, Jones-Day, etc) recruit from USD. They want local connections for local offices. Granted, they’re mostly grabbing the top 1-2% of the class, but they’re offering the equivalent of annual salaries of way way north of $100K/yr for summer internships for 2Ls.
-people in the top 5-15% of the class are getting offers of up to around 100K/yr I think, mostly from local firms. Not all of them, but a lot are.

It looks like a good strategy (unless you know you have the stones to compete at Wash U, etc) is to pick a school in which you will be competitive that’s located in the city in which you want to live. That school is not the top ranked school that accepts you, it’s the one that offers you a scholarship to join/stay. The most competitive school that accepts you will also probably be the one in which you have the lowest class rank. Maybe not a big deal in the top 20 schools, but the cutoff for job recruitment is pretty harsh in tier II.

[Anonymous]

well, I know a bunch of 2Ls at USD, ranked #85. Tier II.
I can say that:
-USD opens a lot of doors in San Diego and Orange County, not so many doors elsewhere (unless the doors are Catholic).
-some of the top national firms (Latham & Watkins, Baker & McKenzie, Jones-Day, etc) recruit from USD. They want local connections for local offices. Granted, they’re mostly grabbing the top 1-2% of the class, but they’re offering the equivalent of annual salaries of way way north of $100K/yr for summer internships for 2Ls.
-people in the top 5-15% of the class are getting offers of up to around 100K/yr I think, mostly from local firms. Not all of them, but a lot are.

It looks like a good strategy (unless you know you have the stones to compete at Wash U, etc) is to pick a school in which you will be competitive that’s located in the city in which you want to live. That school is not the top ranked school that accepts you, it’s the one that offers you a scholarship to join/stay. The most competitive school that accepts you will also probably be the one in which you have the lowest class rank. Maybe not a big deal in the top 20 schools, but the cutoff for job recruitment is pretty harsh in tier II.

[Anonymous]

well, I know a bunch of 2Ls at USD, ranked #85. Tier II.
I can say that:
-USD opens a lot of doors in San Diego and Orange County, not so many doors elsewhere (unless the doors are Catholic).
-some of the top national firms (Latham & Watkins, Baker & McKenzie, Jones-Day, etc) recruit from USD. They want local connections for local offices. Granted, they’re mostly grabbing the top 1-2% of the class, but they’re offering the equivalent of annual salaries of way way north of $100K/yr for summer internships for 2Ls.
-people in the top 5-15% of the class are getting offers of up to around 100K/yr I think, mostly from local firms. Not all of them, but a lot are.

It looks like a good strategy (unless you know you have the stones to compete at Wash U, etc) is to pick a school in which you will be competitive that’s located in the city in which you want to live. That school is not the top ranked school that accepts you, it’s the one that offers you a scholarship to join/stay. The most competitive school that accepts you will also probably be the one in which you have the lowest class rank. Maybe not a big deal in the top 20 schools, but the cutoff for job recruitment is pretty harsh in tier II.

[Anonymous]

well, I know a bunch of 2Ls at USD, ranked #85. Tier II.
I can say that:
-USD opens a lot of doors in San Diego and Orange County, not so many doors elsewhere (unless the doors are Catholic).
-some of the top national firms (Latham & Watkins, Baker & McKenzie, Jones-Day, etc) recruit from USD. They want local connections for local offices. Granted, they’re mostly grabbing the top 1-2% of the class, but they’re offering the equivalent of annual salaries of way way north of $100K/yr for summer internships for 2Ls.
-people in the top 5-15% of the class are getting offers of up to around 100K/yr I think, mostly from local firms. Not all of them, but a lot are.

It looks like a good strategy (unless you know you have the stones to compete at Wash U, etc) is to pick a school in which you will be competitive that’s located in the city in which you want to live. That school is not the top ranked school that accepts you, it’s the one that offers you a scholarship to join/stay. The most competitive school that accepts you will also probably be the one in which you have the lowest class rank. Maybe not a big deal in the top 20 schools, but the cutoff for job recruitment is pretty harsh in tier II.

[Anonymous]

well, I know a bunch of 2Ls at USD, ranked #85. Tier II.
I can say that:
-USD opens a lot of doors in San Diego and Orange County, not so many doors elsewhere (unless the doors are Catholic).
-some of the top national firms (Latham & Watkins, Baker & McKenzie, Jones-Day, etc) recruit from USD. They want local connections for local offices. Granted, they’re mostly grabbing the top 1-2% of the class, but they’re offering the equivalent of annual salaries of way way north of $100K/yr for summer internships for 2Ls.
-people in the top 5-15% of the class are getting offers of up to around 100K/yr I think, mostly from local firms. Not all of them, but a lot are.

It looks like a good strategy (unless you know you have the stones to compete at Wash U, etc) is to pick a school in which you will be competitive that’s located in the city in which you want to live. That school is not the top ranked school that accepts you, it’s the one that offers you a scholarship to join/stay. The most competitive school that accepts you will also probably be the one in which you have the lowest class rank. Maybe not a big deal in the top 20 schools, but the cutoff for job recruitment is pretty harsh in tier II.

[gn]

So do you think that law is too risky a gamble? Or do you thnk it would pay off as an investment? (Assuming a top 1-25 matriculation)

I had a friend who quit his engineering job to go to law school. Like you, he did extensive research into the law profession. His conclusion was that one needs to graduate from one of the top 10 law schools to have a good chance of recuperating the investment (time/money/effort).

He said that because there is a huge surplus of lawyers, the employment prospects those who went to the schools ranked 11 – 25 is not that bright.

[gn]

So do you think that law is too risky a gamble? Or do you thnk it would pay off as an investment? (Assuming a top 1-25 matriculation)

I had a friend who quit his engineering job to go to law school. Like you, he did extensive research into the law profession. His conclusion was that one needs to graduate from one of the top 10 law schools to have a good chance of recuperating the investment (time/money/effort).

He said that because there is a huge surplus of lawyers, the employment prospects those who went to the schools ranked 11 – 25 is not that bright.

[gn]

So do you think that law is too risky a gamble? Or do you thnk it would pay off as an investment? (Assuming a top 1-25 matriculation)

I had a friend who quit his engineering job to go to law school. Like you, he did extensive research into the law profession. His conclusion was that one needs to graduate from one of the top 10 law schools to have a good chance of recuperating the investment (time/money/effort).

He said that because there is a huge surplus of lawyers, the employment prospects those who went to the schools ranked 11 – 25 is not that bright.

[gn]

So do you think that law is too risky a gamble? Or do you thnk it would pay off as an investment? (Assuming a top 1-25 matriculation)

I had a friend who quit his engineering job to go to law school. Like you, he did extensive research into the law profession. His conclusion was that one needs to graduate from one of the top 10 law schools to have a good chance of recuperating the investment (time/money/effort).

He said that because there is a huge surplus of lawyers, the employment prospects those who went to the schools ranked 11 – 25 is not that bright.

[bjensen]

Borat –

Actually, I already speak Portuguese. I learned it over a year in Brazil, a year on the east coast in Rhode Island, and a year of international franchising going back and forth between Brazil and the US.

My worry is that for BRIC emerging markets… Brazil has been the laggard at best for the last decade plus.

Do you think that Mandarin is a must, or that there will be successes to be had in Latin America?

So do you think that law is too risky a gamble? Or do you thnk it would pay off as an investment? (Assuming a top 1-25 matriculation)

Thanks for the advice!

[bjensen]

Borat –

Actually, I already speak Portuguese. I learned it over a year in Brazil, a year on the east coast in Rhode Island, and a year of international franchising going back and forth between Brazil and the US.

My worry is that for BRIC emerging markets… Brazil has been the laggard at best for the last decade plus.

Do you think that Mandarin is a must, or that there will be successes to be had in Latin America?

So do you think that law is too risky a gamble? Or do you thnk it would pay off as an investment? (Assuming a top 1-25 matriculation)

Thanks for the advice!

[bjensen]

Borat –

Actually, I already speak Portuguese. I learned it over a year in Brazil, a year on the east coast in Rhode Island, and a year of international franchising going back and forth between Brazil and the US.

My worry is that for BRIC emerging markets… Brazil has been the laggard at best for the last decade plus.

Do you think that Mandarin is a must, or that there will be successes to be had in Latin America?

So do you think that law is too risky a gamble? Or do you thnk it would pay off as an investment? (Assuming a top 1-25 matriculation)

Thanks for the advice!

[bjensen]

Borat –

Actually, I already speak Portuguese. I learned it over a year in Brazil, a year on the east coast in Rhode Island, and a year of international franchising going back and forth between Brazil and the US.

My worry is that for BRIC emerging markets… Brazil has been the laggard at best for the last decade plus.

Do you think that Mandarin is a must, or that there will be successes to be had in Latin America?

So do you think that law is too risky a gamble? Or do you thnk it would pay off as an investment? (Assuming a top 1-25 matriculation)

Thanks for the advice!

[4826monongahela]

Stay in sales, you can move up to run a sales dept if you want then become CEO, esp if you like start-ups. Nothing limiting a very strong sales rep. You’ll probably make more $. If you’re very good at sales, you’ll likely make more than avereage corporate lawyer. Several folks I’ve worked with and learned from have gone this route, 3 have ultimately become CEO’s of SMB company. As you progress, you’ll learn contracts law a bit anyway.

Don’t recommend learning Chinese unless you are really, really in love with it & committed to working very hard and very long hours for a long time with large sacrifices. Chinese is very hard to learn and it’s not just language – there is culture, way of thinking, living and many years of developing contacts and trusting relationships before you will even come close to an even field with others who were born & brought up 1/2 & 1/2. Northern Asia is much different from doing business in NA, SA or EMEA, and “China” has many different regions each with different languages, cultures, etc which are all in turn much different from JP & KR. You need to really want to “go native” and jump in for a few decades, or forget it. It ain’t like a gringo living in SA for a bunch of yrs, learning language, culture and making contacts and then off you go doing business. It’s harder/takes longer.

[bjensen]

Despite what Jack Welsh has to say about learning Chinese, I agree with you all. There are far to many nuances especially in China. Brazil was bad enough when I used to do business/live there and I spent 4 years getting accustomed.

I would stay in sales, but just because I am good at it doesn’t help much when the fire is no longer there. Sales is kind of like being in Marines. You are always on the front lines. Some people are made for the Marines. Some are made for sales. I’m probably not made for either. It’s too bad, because I know I am leaving really good money. If it was a monetary decision only, I would probably stay in sales. But you only get one life you know…

[bjensen]

Would any of you attorneys who responded be willing to field a call/email from me for a little more advice at some point? I promise to set up a time with you so I don’t cut into your billables! 🙂

If so, would you email me your contact information?

[email protected]

Thanks for all your help!

[HarryBosch]

Jensen,

I have some attorneys in the family tree. None of them went to brand name recognition law schools. All are doing very well for themselves with incomes ranging from $250K to $1M+.

The ones doing very well have their own law practice. One of them has no attorneys working for him other than himself – he practices in the workers comp field, which, even though the laws are not as favorable to workers comp claims as they once were, he still earns a very high standard of living. The other attorney in our family who has his own law practice does have several attorneys working for him. He handles corporate bankruptcies and during bad times he does especialy well. The dot com bust era was a boom for his business.

To summarize, if you want to practice (lucrative) law, follow the money 🙂

But above all, as others have said before, do what you enjoy and success will follow.

Not earth shattering but definately words of wisdom.

[Anonymous]

A question for the lawyers or those in the know: Don’t family law attorneys do really well (private practice or working for a firm), especially in CA with all the divorces?

If I were a lawyer, I’d have to have my own practice instead of working for a firm that didn’t care about me personally, only how much income I bring in. Not my cup of tea.

To the OP, if you’re going to do this, make sure you love it. Not just like it, that will make the difference for you. Have you considered med school? Again, you have to really want to be a doctor. Have you considered engineering? These guys purportedly do pretty well on here. My field is psychology, but if I had to do it over, I probably would have gone to med school and been a psychiatrist.

Again, whatever you do, make sure you love it. Getting a law degree and finding out afterward that it’s not your cup of tea won’t be a good thing.

P.S. I know you said you aren’t good in math, but have you considered a tutor?

[Anonymous]

A question for the lawyers or those in the know: Don’t family law attorneys do really well (private practice or working for a firm), especially in CA with all the divorces?

If I were a lawyer, I’d have to have my own practice instead of working for a firm that didn’t care about me personally, only how much income I bring in. Not my cup of tea.

To the OP, if you’re going to do this, make sure you love it. Not just like it, that will make the difference for you. Have you considered med school? Again, you have to really want to be a doctor. Have you considered engineering? These guys purportedly do pretty well on here. My field is psychology, but if I had to do it over, I probably would have gone to med school and been a psychiatrist.

Again, whatever you do, make sure you love it. Getting a law degree and finding out afterward that it’s not your cup of tea won’t be a good thing.

P.S. I know you said you aren’t good in math, but have you considered a tutor?

[Anonymous]

A question for the lawyers or those in the know: Don’t family law attorneys do really well (private practice or working for a firm), especially in CA with all the divorces?

If I were a lawyer, I’d have to have my own practice instead of working for a firm that didn’t care about me personally, only how much income I bring in. Not my cup of tea.

To the OP, if you’re going to do this, make sure you love it. Not just like it, that will make the difference for you. Have you considered med school? Again, you have to really want to be a doctor. Have you considered engineering? These guys purportedly do pretty well on here. My field is psychology, but if I had to do it over, I probably would have gone to med school and been a psychiatrist.

Again, whatever you do, make sure you love it. Getting a law degree and finding out afterward that it’s not your cup of tea won’t be a good thing.

P.S. I know you said you aren’t good in math, but have you considered a tutor?

[Anonymous]

A question for the lawyers or those in the know: Don’t family law attorneys do really well (private practice or working for a firm), especially in CA with all the divorces?

If I were a lawyer, I’d have to have my own practice instead of working for a firm that didn’t care about me personally, only how much income I bring in. Not my cup of tea.

To the OP, if you’re going to do this, make sure you love it. Not just like it, that will make the difference for you. Have you considered med school? Again, you have to really want to be a doctor. Have you considered engineering? These guys purportedly do pretty well on here. My field is psychology, but if I had to do it over, I probably would have gone to med school and been a psychiatrist.

Again, whatever you do, make sure you love it. Getting a law degree and finding out afterward that it’s not your cup of tea won’t be a good thing.

P.S. I know you said you aren’t good in math, but have you considered a tutor?

[Anonymous]

A question for the lawyers or those in the know: Don’t family law attorneys do really well (private practice or working for a firm), especially in CA with all the divorces?

If I were a lawyer, I’d have to have my own practice instead of working for a firm that didn’t care about me personally, only how much income I bring in. Not my cup of tea.

To the OP, if you’re going to do this, make sure you love it. Not just like it, that will make the difference for you. Have you considered med school? Again, you have to really want to be a doctor. Have you considered engineering? These guys purportedly do pretty well on here. My field is psychology, but if I had to do it over, I probably would have gone to med school and been a psychiatrist.

Again, whatever you do, make sure you love it. Getting a law degree and finding out afterward that it’s not your cup of tea won’t be a good thing.

P.S. I know you said you aren’t good in math, but have you considered a tutor?

[HarryBosch]

Jensen,

I have some attorneys in the family tree. None of them went to brand name recognition law schools. All are doing very well for themselves with incomes ranging from $250K to $1M+.

The ones doing very well have their own law practice. One of them has no attorneys working for him other than himself – he practices in the workers comp field, which, even though the laws are not as favorable to workers comp claims as they once were, he still earns a very high standard of living. The other attorney in our family who has his own law practice does have several attorneys working for him. He handles corporate bankruptcies and during bad times he does especialy well. The dot com bust era was a boom for his business.

To summarize, if you want to practice (lucrative) law, follow the money 🙂

But above all, as others have said before, do what you enjoy and success will follow.

Not earth shattering but definately words of wisdom.

[HarryBosch]

Jensen,

I have some attorneys in the family tree. None of them went to brand name recognition law schools. All are doing very well for themselves with incomes ranging from $250K to $1M+.

The ones doing very well have their own law practice. One of them has no attorneys working for him other than himself – he practices in the workers comp field, which, even though the laws are not as favorable to workers comp claims as they once were, he still earns a very high standard of living. The other attorney in our family who has his own law practice does have several attorneys working for him. He handles corporate bankruptcies and during bad times he does especialy well. The dot com bust era was a boom for his business.

To summarize, if you want to practice (lucrative) law, follow the money 🙂

But above all, as others have said before, do what you enjoy and success will follow.

Not earth shattering but definately words of wisdom.

[HarryBosch]

Jensen,

I have some attorneys in the family tree. None of them went to brand name recognition law schools. All are doing very well for themselves with incomes ranging from $250K to $1M+.

The ones doing very well have their own law practice. One of them has no attorneys working for him other than himself – he practices in the workers comp field, which, even though the laws are not as favorable to workers comp claims as they once were, he still earns a very high standard of living. The other attorney in our family who has his own law practice does have several attorneys working for him. He handles corporate bankruptcies and during bad times he does especialy well. The dot com bust era was a boom for his business.

To summarize, if you want to practice (lucrative) law, follow the money 🙂

But above all, as others have said before, do what you enjoy and success will follow.

Not earth shattering but definately words of wisdom.

[HarryBosch]

Jensen,

I have some attorneys in the family tree. None of them went to brand name recognition law schools. All are doing very well for themselves with incomes ranging from $250K to $1M+.

The ones doing very well have their own law practice. One of them has no attorneys working for him other than himself – he practices in the workers comp field, which, even though the laws are not as favorable to workers comp claims as they once were, he still earns a very high standard of living. The other attorney in our family who has his own law practice does have several attorneys working for him. He handles corporate bankruptcies and during bad times he does especialy well. The dot com bust era was a boom for his business.

To summarize, if you want to practice (lucrative) law, follow the money 🙂

But above all, as others have said before, do what you enjoy and success will follow.

Not earth shattering but definately words of wisdom.

[dumbrenter]

Bjensen, I am in a similar situation as you…I am an engineer, but have been seriously considering law school. I have been following this thread with great interest.
My primary motive is not a love for law profession or anything. It is money. To make more money, I either have to do management or get a high-return education.
Check out the starting salary on the webpages of national law firms with offices in San Diego.

[dumbrenter]

Bjensen, I am in a similar situation as you…I am an engineer, but have been seriously considering law school. I have been following this thread with great interest.
My primary motive is not a love for law profession or anything. It is money. To make more money, I either have to do management or get a high-return education.
Check out the starting salary on the webpages of national law firms with offices in San Diego.

[dumbrenter]

Bjensen, I am in a similar situation as you…I am an engineer, but have been seriously considering law school. I have been following this thread with great interest.
My primary motive is not a love for law profession or anything. It is money. To make more money, I either have to do management or get a high-return education.
Check out the starting salary on the webpages of national law firms with offices in San Diego.

[dumbrenter]

Bjensen, I am in a similar situation as you…I am an engineer, but have been seriously considering law school. I have been following this thread with great interest.
My primary motive is not a love for law profession or anything. It is money. To make more money, I either have to do management or get a high-return education.
Check out the starting salary on the webpages of national law firms with offices in San Diego.

[bjensen]

Would any of you attorneys who responded be willing to field a call/email from me for a little more advice at some point? I promise to set up a time with you so I don’t cut into your billables! 🙂

If so, would you email me your contact information?

[email protected]

Thanks for all your help!

[bjensen]

Would any of you attorneys who responded be willing to field a call/email from me for a little more advice at some point? I promise to set up a time with you so I don’t cut into your billables! 🙂

If so, would you email me your contact information?

[email protected]

Thanks for all your help!

[bjensen]

Would any of you attorneys who responded be willing to field a call/email from me for a little more advice at some point? I promise to set up a time with you so I don’t cut into your billables! 🙂

If so, would you email me your contact information?

[email protected]

Thanks for all your help!

[bjensen]

Would any of you attorneys who responded be willing to field a call/email from me for a little more advice at some point? I promise to set up a time with you so I don’t cut into your billables! 🙂

If so, would you email me your contact information?

[email protected]

Thanks for all your help!

[bjensen]

Despite what Jack Welsh has to say about learning Chinese, I agree with you all. There are far to many nuances especially in China. Brazil was bad enough when I used to do business/live there and I spent 4 years getting accustomed.

I would stay in sales, but just because I am good at it doesn’t help much when the fire is no longer there. Sales is kind of like being in Marines. You are always on the front lines. Some people are made for the Marines. Some are made for sales. I’m probably not made for either. It’s too bad, because I know I am leaving really good money. If it was a monetary decision only, I would probably stay in sales. But you only get one life you know…

[bjensen]

Despite what Jack Welsh has to say about learning Chinese, I agree with you all. There are far to many nuances especially in China. Brazil was bad enough when I used to do business/live there and I spent 4 years getting accustomed.

I would stay in sales, but just because I am good at it doesn’t help much when the fire is no longer there. Sales is kind of like being in Marines. You are always on the front lines. Some people are made for the Marines. Some are made for sales. I’m probably not made for either. It’s too bad, because I know I am leaving really good money. If it was a monetary decision only, I would probably stay in sales. But you only get one life you know…

[bjensen]

Despite what Jack Welsh has to say about learning Chinese, I agree with you all. There are far to many nuances especially in China. Brazil was bad enough when I used to do business/live there and I spent 4 years getting accustomed.

I would stay in sales, but just because I am good at it doesn’t help much when the fire is no longer there. Sales is kind of like being in Marines. You are always on the front lines. Some people are made for the Marines. Some are made for sales. I’m probably not made for either. It’s too bad, because I know I am leaving really good money. If it was a monetary decision only, I would probably stay in sales. But you only get one life you know…

[bjensen]

Despite what Jack Welsh has to say about learning Chinese, I agree with you all. There are far to many nuances especially in China. Brazil was bad enough when I used to do business/live there and I spent 4 years getting accustomed.

I would stay in sales, but just because I am good at it doesn’t help much when the fire is no longer there. Sales is kind of like being in Marines. You are always on the front lines. Some people are made for the Marines. Some are made for sales. I’m probably not made for either. It’s too bad, because I know I am leaving really good money. If it was a monetary decision only, I would probably stay in sales. But you only get one life you know…

[4826monongahela]

Stay in sales, you can move up to run a sales dept if you want then become CEO, esp if you like start-ups. Nothing limiting a very strong sales rep. You’ll probably make more $. If you’re very good at sales, you’ll likely make more than avereage corporate lawyer. Several folks I’ve worked with and learned from have gone this route, 3 have ultimately become CEO’s of SMB company. As you progress, you’ll learn contracts law a bit anyway.

Don’t recommend learning Chinese unless you are really, really in love with it & committed to working very hard and very long hours for a long time with large sacrifices. Chinese is very hard to learn and it’s not just language – there is culture, way of thinking, living and many years of developing contacts and trusting relationships before you will even come close to an even field with others who were born & brought up 1/2 & 1/2. Northern Asia is much different from doing business in NA, SA or EMEA, and “China” has many different regions each with different languages, cultures, etc which are all in turn much different from JP & KR. You need to really want to “go native” and jump in for a few decades, or forget it. It ain’t like a gringo living in SA for a bunch of yrs, learning language, culture and making contacts and then off you go doing business. It’s harder/takes longer.

[4826monongahela]

Stay in sales, you can move up to run a sales dept if you want then become CEO, esp if you like start-ups. Nothing limiting a very strong sales rep. You’ll probably make more $. If you’re very good at sales, you’ll likely make more than avereage corporate lawyer. Several folks I’ve worked with and learned from have gone this route, 3 have ultimately become CEO’s of SMB company. As you progress, you’ll learn contracts law a bit anyway.

Don’t recommend learning Chinese unless you are really, really in love with it & committed to working very hard and very long hours for a long time with large sacrifices. Chinese is very hard to learn and it’s not just language – there is culture, way of thinking, living and many years of developing contacts and trusting relationships before you will even come close to an even field with others who were born & brought up 1/2 & 1/2. Northern Asia is much different from doing business in NA, SA or EMEA, and “China” has many different regions each with different languages, cultures, etc which are all in turn much different from JP & KR. You need to really want to “go native” and jump in for a few decades, or forget it. It ain’t like a gringo living in SA for a bunch of yrs, learning language, culture and making contacts and then off you go doing business. It’s harder/takes longer.

[4826monongahela]

Stay in sales, you can move up to run a sales dept if you want then become CEO, esp if you like start-ups. Nothing limiting a very strong sales rep. You’ll probably make more $. If you’re very good at sales, you’ll likely make more than avereage corporate lawyer. Several folks I’ve worked with and learned from have gone this route, 3 have ultimately become CEO’s of SMB company. As you progress, you’ll learn contracts law a bit anyway.

Don’t recommend learning Chinese unless you are really, really in love with it & committed to working very hard and very long hours for a long time with large sacrifices. Chinese is very hard to learn and it’s not just language – there is culture, way of thinking, living and many years of developing contacts and trusting relationships before you will even come close to an even field with others who were born & brought up 1/2 & 1/2. Northern Asia is much different from doing business in NA, SA or EMEA, and “China” has many different regions each with different languages, cultures, etc which are all in turn much different from JP & KR. You need to really want to “go native” and jump in for a few decades, or forget it. It ain’t like a gringo living in SA for a bunch of yrs, learning language, culture and making contacts and then off you go doing business. It’s harder/takes longer.

[4826monongahela]

Stay in sales, you can move up to run a sales dept if you want then become CEO, esp if you like start-ups. Nothing limiting a very strong sales rep. You’ll probably make more $. If you’re very good at sales, you’ll likely make more than avereage corporate lawyer. Several folks I’ve worked with and learned from have gone this route, 3 have ultimately become CEO’s of SMB company. As you progress, you’ll learn contracts law a bit anyway.

Don’t recommend learning Chinese unless you are really, really in love with it & committed to working very hard and very long hours for a long time with large sacrifices. Chinese is very hard to learn and it’s not just language – there is culture, way of thinking, living and many years of developing contacts and trusting relationships before you will even come close to an even field with others who were born & brought up 1/2 & 1/2. Northern Asia is much different from doing business in NA, SA or EMEA, and “China” has many different regions each with different languages, cultures, etc which are all in turn much different from JP & KR. You need to really want to “go native” and jump in for a few decades, or forget it. It ain’t like a gringo living in SA for a bunch of yrs, learning language, culture and making contacts and then off you go doing business. It’s harder/takes longer.

[Borat]

Learn Mandarin and become an international business consultant for Chinese companies in the US or vice versa. Unlimited upside potential there, no hard math or science classes — just unbelievably hard language classes. The smartest move anyone your age could make. You could also do Spanish or Portugese and specialize in Latin American business but I think Chinese is the way to go long term, especially since you are so young. Good luck to you.

[Borat]

Learn Mandarin and become an international business consultant for Chinese companies in the US or vice versa. Unlimited upside potential there, no hard math or science classes — just unbelievably hard language classes. The smartest move anyone your age could make. You could also do Spanish or Portugese and specialize in Latin American business but I think Chinese is the way to go long term, especially since you are so young. Good luck to you.

[Borat]

Learn Mandarin and become an international business consultant for Chinese companies in the US or vice versa. Unlimited upside potential there, no hard math or science classes — just unbelievably hard language classes. The smartest move anyone your age could make. You could also do Spanish or Portugese and specialize in Latin American business but I think Chinese is the way to go long term, especially since you are so young. Good luck to you.

[Borat]

Learn Mandarin and become an international business consultant for Chinese companies in the US or vice versa. Unlimited upside potential there, no hard math or science classes — just unbelievably hard language classes. The smartest move anyone your age could make. You could also do Spanish or Portugese and specialize in Latin American business but I think Chinese is the way to go long term, especially since you are so young. Good luck to you.

[sd-maybe]

Soliticing career advice on a housing bubble blog is an interesting approach, but who here knows what you want to do and what interests you more than you? If law interests you then go after that with a single minded focus. With a family to support it sounds like you don’t have the luxury of bouncing around to different things to see if you like it.

[sd-maybe]

Soliticing career advice on a housing bubble blog is an interesting approach, but who here knows what you want to do and what interests you more than you? If law interests you then go after that with a single minded focus. With a family to support it sounds like you don’t have the luxury of bouncing around to different things to see if you like it.

[sd-maybe]

Soliticing career advice on a housing bubble blog is an interesting approach, but who here knows what you want to do and what interests you more than you? If law interests you then go after that with a single minded focus. With a family to support it sounds like you don’t have the luxury of bouncing around to different things to see if you like it.

[sd-maybe]

Soliticing career advice on a housing bubble blog is an interesting approach, but who here knows what you want to do and what interests you more than you? If law interests you then go after that with a single minded focus. With a family to support it sounds like you don’t have the luxury of bouncing around to different things to see if you like it.

[sd-maybe]

Soliticing career advice on a housing bubble blog is an interesting approach, but who here knows what you want to do and what interests you more than you? If law interests you then go after that with a single minded focus. With a family to support it sounds like you don’t have the luxury of bouncing around to different things to see if you like it.

[XBoxBoy]

The one thing that I wish more people had told me when I was looking for a career was, “Go into what you’re good at.” If you pick a career that matches your skills, chances are high that you will excel in that arena, which will make you more valuable and surprise, surprise, you’ll end up enjoying it tremendously.

When I went through college I majored in music, and while I had some professional success, I had a lot more frustration than anything else. But I was always good at math and logic. Gradually I drifted from writing music and doing sound effects to programming video games. What I realized with time was that I was dang good at the programming, and found myself having more and more success doing that. This success was a lot better than the constant frustration of the music gig. Not only was it better financially, but it was more enjoyable, because success is way more fun than beating your head against the wall.

So, whatever you pick, pick something you will excel at! That can be hard to determine. But try to think about the tasks you’ve had at school and work so far. What were your successes? What were your failures? What skills did you use that caused you to succeed. You’ve already identified that math is not a strength, so definitely do NOT go into anything that requires much math. But what are your strengths? You have good grades, so there must have been a reason for those. There must have been some good skills somewhere that lead to good grades. What were they? What career would give you the chance to develop those skills and excel?

As to law school. I can only saw that I’ve met lots of ex-lawyers who are doing other things, and lots of lawyers who wish they were doing other things. Way more than I’ve met of people in other fields. But I’ve also met a couple of lawyers that like their jobs. In all those case they are lawyers who are really successful and well respected for their legal abilities. So, maybe if you think you would be a really super good lawyer, then law school would be a good idea. But don’t go to law school just because you don’t know what else to do.

Hope this helps,

XBoxBoy

[bsrsharma]

XboxBoy,

Would you mind giving an email to contact you regarding music education/career?

Thanks,
[email protected]

[bsrsharma]

XboxBoy,

Would you mind giving an email to contact you regarding music education/career?

Thanks,
[email protected]

[bsrsharma]

XboxBoy,

Would you mind giving an email to contact you regarding music education/career?

Thanks,
[email protected]

[bsrsharma]

XboxBoy,

Would you mind giving an email to contact you regarding music education/career?

Thanks,
[email protected]

[bsrsharma]

XboxBoy,

Would you mind giving an email to contact you regarding music education/career?

Thanks,
[email protected]

[XBoxBoy]

The one thing that I wish more people had told me when I was looking for a career was, “Go into what you’re good at.” If you pick a career that matches your skills, chances are high that you will excel in that arena, which will make you more valuable and surprise, surprise, you’ll end up enjoying it tremendously.

When I went through college I majored in music, and while I had some professional success, I had a lot more frustration than anything else. But I was always good at math and logic. Gradually I drifted from writing music and doing sound effects to programming video games. What I realized with time was that I was dang good at the programming, and found myself having more and more success doing that. This success was a lot better than the constant frustration of the music gig. Not only was it better financially, but it was more enjoyable, because success is way more fun than beating your head against the wall.

So, whatever you pick, pick something you will excel at! That can be hard to determine. But try to think about the tasks you’ve had at school and work so far. What were your successes? What were your failures? What skills did you use that caused you to succeed. You’ve already identified that math is not a strength, so definitely do NOT go into anything that requires much math. But what are your strengths? You have good grades, so there must have been a reason for those. There must have been some good skills somewhere that lead to good grades. What were they? What career would give you the chance to develop those skills and excel?

As to law school. I can only saw that I’ve met lots of ex-lawyers who are doing other things, and lots of lawyers who wish they were doing other things. Way more than I’ve met of people in other fields. But I’ve also met a couple of lawyers that like their jobs. In all those case they are lawyers who are really successful and well respected for their legal abilities. So, maybe if you think you would be a really super good lawyer, then law school would be a good idea. But don’t go to law school just because you don’t know what else to do.

Hope this helps,

XBoxBoy

[XBoxBoy]

The one thing that I wish more people had told me when I was looking for a career was, “Go into what you’re good at.” If you pick a career that matches your skills, chances are high that you will excel in that arena, which will make you more valuable and surprise, surprise, you’ll end up enjoying it tremendously.

When I went through college I majored in music, and while I had some professional success, I had a lot more frustration than anything else. But I was always good at math and logic. Gradually I drifted from writing music and doing sound effects to programming video games. What I realized with time was that I was dang good at the programming, and found myself having more and more success doing that. This success was a lot better than the constant frustration of the music gig. Not only was it better financially, but it was more enjoyable, because success is way more fun than beating your head against the wall.

So, whatever you pick, pick something you will excel at! That can be hard to determine. But try to think about the tasks you’ve had at school and work so far. What were your successes? What were your failures? What skills did you use that caused you to succeed. You’ve already identified that math is not a strength, so definitely do NOT go into anything that requires much math. But what are your strengths? You have good grades, so there must have been a reason for those. There must have been some good skills somewhere that lead to good grades. What were they? What career would give you the chance to develop those skills and excel?

As to law school. I can only saw that I’ve met lots of ex-lawyers who are doing other things, and lots of lawyers who wish they were doing other things. Way more than I’ve met of people in other fields. But I’ve also met a couple of lawyers that like their jobs. In all those case they are lawyers who are really successful and well respected for their legal abilities. So, maybe if you think you would be a really super good lawyer, then law school would be a good idea. But don’t go to law school just because you don’t know what else to do.

Hope this helps,

XBoxBoy

[XBoxBoy]

The one thing that I wish more people had told me when I was looking for a career was, “Go into what you’re good at.” If you pick a career that matches your skills, chances are high that you will excel in that arena, which will make you more valuable and surprise, surprise, you’ll end up enjoying it tremendously.

When I went through college I majored in music, and while I had some professional success, I had a lot more frustration than anything else. But I was always good at math and logic. Gradually I drifted from writing music and doing sound effects to programming video games. What I realized with time was that I was dang good at the programming, and found myself having more and more success doing that. This success was a lot better than the constant frustration of the music gig. Not only was it better financially, but it was more enjoyable, because success is way more fun than beating your head against the wall.

So, whatever you pick, pick something you will excel at! That can be hard to determine. But try to think about the tasks you’ve had at school and work so far. What were your successes? What were your failures? What skills did you use that caused you to succeed. You’ve already identified that math is not a strength, so definitely do NOT go into anything that requires much math. But what are your strengths? You have good grades, so there must have been a reason for those. There must have been some good skills somewhere that lead to good grades. What were they? What career would give you the chance to develop those skills and excel?

As to law school. I can only saw that I’ve met lots of ex-lawyers who are doing other things, and lots of lawyers who wish they were doing other things. Way more than I’ve met of people in other fields. But I’ve also met a couple of lawyers that like their jobs. In all those case they are lawyers who are really successful and well respected for their legal abilities. So, maybe if you think you would be a really super good lawyer, then law school would be a good idea. But don’t go to law school just because you don’t know what else to do.

Hope this helps,

XBoxBoy

[XBoxBoy]

The one thing that I wish more people had told me when I was looking for a career was, “Go into what you’re good at.” If you pick a career that matches your skills, chances are high that you will excel in that arena, which will make you more valuable and surprise, surprise, you’ll end up enjoying it tremendously.

When I went through college I majored in music, and while I had some professional success, I had a lot more frustration than anything else. But I was always good at math and logic. Gradually I drifted from writing music and doing sound effects to programming video games. What I realized with time was that I was dang good at the programming, and found myself having more and more success doing that. This success was a lot better than the constant frustration of the music gig. Not only was it better financially, but it was more enjoyable, because success is way more fun than beating your head against the wall.

So, whatever you pick, pick something you will excel at! That can be hard to determine. But try to think about the tasks you’ve had at school and work so far. What were your successes? What were your failures? What skills did you use that caused you to succeed. You’ve already identified that math is not a strength, so definitely do NOT go into anything that requires much math. But what are your strengths? You have good grades, so there must have been a reason for those. There must have been some good skills somewhere that lead to good grades. What were they? What career would give you the chance to develop those skills and excel?

As to law school. I can only saw that I’ve met lots of ex-lawyers who are doing other things, and lots of lawyers who wish they were doing other things. Way more than I’ve met of people in other fields. But I’ve also met a couple of lawyers that like their jobs. In all those case they are lawyers who are really successful and well respected for their legal abilities. So, maybe if you think you would be a really super good lawyer, then law school would be a good idea. But don’t go to law school just because you don’t know what else to do.

Hope this helps,

XBoxBoy

[Coronita]

Borat- Too late. Too many people…

 

Original poster. You really have to ask yourself. Why do you want to be a lawyer?… If it's a money thing. Think again. There are many careers that school/background doesn't make a huge difference (engineering might be one where say a UCLA or USCD won't make a huge difference). Talking to friends, it's completely different for lawyers. Top pay, school does matter. And a few lawyer friends from sh!tty law schools don't quite do quite as well as some of the geek types (could also be in their line of work). Also, I hope you like to read…a lot…

Patent law was something that I was interested in. But after thinking about things, I wouldn't like to be reading about what everyone else did. But that's just me.

That's why when I look at other careers, engineering isn't that bad. Yes, it's average pay, but you really don't have that sort of pecking order you do in other professions. The pay disparity between lawyers from different schools and finance people from different MBA's is astounding.

You think (no offense to USD/SDSU MBA holders) those folks would be able to get jobs on Wall Street pulling in 7 figures? If it were the case, it would be more the exception than the rule.

 

 

[img_assist|nid=5962|title=selfportrait|desc=|link=node|align=left|width=100|height=80]

—– Sour grapes for everyone!

[bjensen]

sdjdguy –

Thanks for the advice… I would not consider SD Law, but that’s ok, because I am up in Orange County anyway. I would like to eventually end up in SD though.

A question though, if I get into a top 20 and don’t graduate in the top quartile, is there still hope? Or will I be relegated to $20.00 per hour doc review?

I just want to make sure I can make it post-graduation.

I wasn’t going to consider anything less than top 25, do you think that is too deep today with the glut of third tier grads?

Finally, what do you think of UCLA or Hastings for placement in California?

If I didn’t go either of those places, it would probably be East Coast for me since the LSAT I would need for Stanford or Berkeley isn’t something I am counting on till I take the test!

Thanks!

[Anonymous]

Bjensen,

Sure, glad to help. To answer a couple of your questions. No, you would not be relegated to $20/hour doc review if you don’t graduate from a top 20 school in the first quartile. Some of the other posters were correct in emphasizing the importance of the region where you plan to work. For example, some USD grads in the top of their class can get jobs in top firms, whereas a USD degree would not be worth much in, say, Florida. In general, the better the school, the better your chances; and the lower-ranked the school, the more pressure you will face to rank near the top of your class. And keep in mind, what I (and presumably others) are focusing on are your prospects for landing a top-paying job at a first-rate firm directly out of law school. Starting salaries at the top CA and national firms are now $160,000. By way of comparison, a decent mid-size local SD firm might pay you maybe half that ($80K to $100K tops) as a new graduate, assuming you can even get a job. And trust me, it is highly competitive. There is also a tremendous “San Diego discount,” as many firms here pay a good 20% (or more) less than those in LA, SF, and other comparable cities. As for specific schools, you’d be much better off at UCLA than Hastings, though the latter is a great school and well-recognized in California. When you consider that schools just below the top 25 include places like Fordham, Illinois, and Washington & Lee, I would try to stay in the top 20 if possible. A top-20 school like Duke, Georgetown, Texas, or Michigan is a much safer bet–especially considering that your debt load for a top school will be no less than a second-tier one. Best of luck.

[Anonymous]

Bjensen,

Sure, glad to help. To answer a couple of your questions. No, you would not be relegated to $20/hour doc review if you don’t graduate from a top 20 school in the first quartile. Some of the other posters were correct in emphasizing the importance of the region where you plan to work. For example, some USD grads in the top of their class can get jobs in top firms, whereas a USD degree would not be worth much in, say, Florida. In general, the better the school, the better your chances; and the lower-ranked the school, the more pressure you will face to rank near the top of your class. And keep in mind, what I (and presumably others) are focusing on are your prospects for landing a top-paying job at a first-rate firm directly out of law school. Starting salaries at the top CA and national firms are now $160,000. By way of comparison, a decent mid-size local SD firm might pay you maybe half that ($80K to $100K tops) as a new graduate, assuming you can even get a job. And trust me, it is highly competitive. There is also a tremendous “San Diego discount,” as many firms here pay a good 20% (or more) less than those in LA, SF, and other comparable cities. As for specific schools, you’d be much better off at UCLA than Hastings, though the latter is a great school and well-recognized in California. When you consider that schools just below the top 25 include places like Fordham, Illinois, and Washington & Lee, I would try to stay in the top 20 if possible. A top-20 school like Duke, Georgetown, Texas, or Michigan is a much safer bet–especially considering that your debt load for a top school will be no less than a second-tier one. Best of luck.

[Anonymous]

Bjensen,

Sure, glad to help. To answer a couple of your questions. No, you would not be relegated to $20/hour doc review if you don’t graduate from a top 20 school in the first quartile. Some of the other posters were correct in emphasizing the importance of the region where you plan to work. For example, some USD grads in the top of their class can get jobs in top firms, whereas a USD degree would not be worth much in, say, Florida. In general, the better the school, the better your chances; and the lower-ranked the school, the more pressure you will face to rank near the top of your class. And keep in mind, what I (and presumably others) are focusing on are your prospects for landing a top-paying job at a first-rate firm directly out of law school. Starting salaries at the top CA and national firms are now $160,000. By way of comparison, a decent mid-size local SD firm might pay you maybe half that ($80K to $100K tops) as a new graduate, assuming you can even get a job. And trust me, it is highly competitive. There is also a tremendous “San Diego discount,” as many firms here pay a good 20% (or more) less than those in LA, SF, and other comparable cities. As for specific schools, you’d be much better off at UCLA than Hastings, though the latter is a great school and well-recognized in California. When you consider that schools just below the top 25 include places like Fordham, Illinois, and Washington & Lee, I would try to stay in the top 20 if possible. A top-20 school like Duke, Georgetown, Texas, or Michigan is a much safer bet–especially considering that your debt load for a top school will be no less than a second-tier one. Best of luck.

[Anonymous]

Bjensen,

Sure, glad to help. To answer a couple of your questions. No, you would not be relegated to $20/hour doc review if you don’t graduate from a top 20 school in the first quartile. Some of the other posters were correct in emphasizing the importance of the region where you plan to work. For example, some USD grads in the top of their class can get jobs in top firms, whereas a USD degree would not be worth much in, say, Florida. In general, the better the school, the better your chances; and the lower-ranked the school, the more pressure you will face to rank near the top of your class. And keep in mind, what I (and presumably others) are focusing on are your prospects for landing a top-paying job at a first-rate firm directly out of law school. Starting salaries at the top CA and national firms are now $160,000. By way of comparison, a decent mid-size local SD firm might pay you maybe half that ($80K to $100K tops) as a new graduate, assuming you can even get a job. And trust me, it is highly competitive. There is also a tremendous “San Diego discount,” as many firms here pay a good 20% (or more) less than those in LA, SF, and other comparable cities. As for specific schools, you’d be much better off at UCLA than Hastings, though the latter is a great school and well-recognized in California. When you consider that schools just below the top 25 include places like Fordham, Illinois, and Washington & Lee, I would try to stay in the top 20 if possible. A top-20 school like Duke, Georgetown, Texas, or Michigan is a much safer bet–especially considering that your debt load for a top school will be no less than a second-tier one. Best of luck.

[Anonymous]

Bjensen,

Sure, glad to help. To answer a couple of your questions. No, you would not be relegated to $20/hour doc review if you don’t graduate from a top 20 school in the first quartile. Some of the other posters were correct in emphasizing the importance of the region where you plan to work. For example, some USD grads in the top of their class can get jobs in top firms, whereas a USD degree would not be worth much in, say, Florida. In general, the better the school, the better your chances; and the lower-ranked the school, the more pressure you will face to rank near the top of your class. And keep in mind, what I (and presumably others) are focusing on are your prospects for landing a top-paying job at a first-rate firm directly out of law school. Starting salaries at the top CA and national firms are now $160,000. By way of comparison, a decent mid-size local SD firm might pay you maybe half that ($80K to $100K tops) as a new graduate, assuming you can even get a job. And trust me, it is highly competitive. There is also a tremendous “San Diego discount,” as many firms here pay a good 20% (or more) less than those in LA, SF, and other comparable cities. As for specific schools, you’d be much better off at UCLA than Hastings, though the latter is a great school and well-recognized in California. When you consider that schools just below the top 25 include places like Fordham, Illinois, and Washington & Lee, I would try to stay in the top 20 if possible. A top-20 school like Duke, Georgetown, Texas, or Michigan is a much safer bet–especially considering that your debt load for a top school will be no less than a second-tier one. Best of luck.

[bjensen]

sdjdguy –

Thanks for the advice… I would not consider SD Law, but that’s ok, because I am up in Orange County anyway. I would like to eventually end up in SD though.

A question though, if I get into a top 20 and don’t graduate in the top quartile, is there still hope? Or will I be relegated to $20.00 per hour doc review?

I just want to make sure I can make it post-graduation.

I wasn’t going to consider anything less than top 25, do you think that is too deep today with the glut of third tier grads?

Finally, what do you think of UCLA or Hastings for placement in California?

If I didn’t go either of those places, it would probably be East Coast for me since the LSAT I would need for Stanford or Berkeley isn’t something I am counting on till I take the test!

Thanks!

[bjensen]

sdjdguy –

Thanks for the advice… I would not consider SD Law, but that’s ok, because I am up in Orange County anyway. I would like to eventually end up in SD though.

A question though, if I get into a top 20 and don’t graduate in the top quartile, is there still hope? Or will I be relegated to $20.00 per hour doc review?

I just want to make sure I can make it post-graduation.

I wasn’t going to consider anything less than top 25, do you think that is too deep today with the glut of third tier grads?

Finally, what do you think of UCLA or Hastings for placement in California?

If I didn’t go either of those places, it would probably be East Coast for me since the LSAT I would need for Stanford or Berkeley isn’t something I am counting on till I take the test!

Thanks!

[bjensen]

sdjdguy –

Thanks for the advice… I would not consider SD Law, but that’s ok, because I am up in Orange County anyway. I would like to eventually end up in SD though.

A question though, if I get into a top 20 and don’t graduate in the top quartile, is there still hope? Or will I be relegated to $20.00 per hour doc review?

I just want to make sure I can make it post-graduation.

I wasn’t going to consider anything less than top 25, do you think that is too deep today with the glut of third tier grads?

Finally, what do you think of UCLA or Hastings for placement in California?

If I didn’t go either of those places, it would probably be East Coast for me since the LSAT I would need for Stanford or Berkeley isn’t something I am counting on till I take the test!

Thanks!

[bjensen]

sdjdguy –

Thanks for the advice… I would not consider SD Law, but that’s ok, because I am up in Orange County anyway. I would like to eventually end up in SD though.

A question though, if I get into a top 20 and don’t graduate in the top quartile, is there still hope? Or will I be relegated to $20.00 per hour doc review?

I just want to make sure I can make it post-graduation.

I wasn’t going to consider anything less than top 25, do you think that is too deep today with the glut of third tier grads?

Finally, what do you think of UCLA or Hastings for placement in California?

If I didn’t go either of those places, it would probably be East Coast for me since the LSAT I would need for Stanford or Berkeley isn’t something I am counting on till I take the test!

Thanks!

[bjensen]

–

[Anonymous]

bjensen, I could have written your original post since I am in the exact same situation as you, only a few years older with a few more children. Also, my scores have landed me into a few schools ranked 50-75, and waitlisted this year at three in the 25-50 range.

Rankings are an interesting matter that we could discuss for hours, but at the end of the discussion I think we would both agree that they matter alot. I have been looking into this law school thing for three years now and have consistantly heard that if you attend one of the top say 10 schools in the nation you are going to be golden pretty much wherever you rank in your class. I’m sure the opportunities are better for those who rank higher, but apparently even if you are the bottom ranked guy at Michigan or Duke you can go out there and make 125k+ a year at a big firm.

Once you get beyond the top 10, I don’t think it is as straight forward. For example, if you were to attend Washington University in St. Louis, or the University of Iowa, I don’t know if you would actually be at that much more of an advantage in SoCal compared to those who attended USD in San Diego and finished in the top 25%, or even those inn the top 50% who were able to network their way to a job locally. This all assumes you aren’t in IP law or some other in-demand specialty. For IP law, I have actually heard it doesn’t matter where you go, but again I’m sure that IP graduates from the top schools place much better.

At a certain point, probably somewhere past the top 10-15 schools, I have heard people recommend that you take into account the region where you want to work. U of Illinois is ranked 25 now, so if you want to end up in Chicago or Des Moines it might be a good bet. But if you hope to practice in Colorado, I have to think you will have better opportunities if you go to #36 ranked Colorado, or even #70 or so ranked Denver.

All of this brings me to the most important point of all, and one that I am currently considering. Do you really, really want to be a lawyer? Are you good at, and will you enjoy the activities that lawyers engage in? To help you answer this, I recommend that you read this book linked below. It is the best book ever written on this topic. If your answer to this question is a resounding ‘yes’, then you will not be as concerned about whether it will be worth it if you rank in the bottom 50% at a top 20 school etc, etc. If you attend a top 100 school and do well you will find opportunities in the region where you go to school. Most of the 125k-150k a year jobs you hear about are in biglaw, in big cities, and include hellish billable hours and a lifestyle you may not even desire…

[Anonymous]

bjensen, I could have written your original post since I am in the exact same situation as you, only a few years older with a few more children. Also, my scores have landed me into a few schools ranked 50-75, and waitlisted this year at three in the 25-50 range.

Rankings are an interesting matter that we could discuss for hours, but at the end of the discussion I think we would both agree that they matter alot. I have been looking into this law school thing for three years now and have consistantly heard that if you attend one of the top say 10 schools in the nation you are going to be golden pretty much wherever you rank in your class. I’m sure the opportunities are better for those who rank higher, but apparently even if you are the bottom ranked guy at Michigan or Duke you can go out there and make 125k+ a year at a big firm.

Once you get beyond the top 10, I don’t think it is as straight forward. For example, if you were to attend Washington University in St. Louis, or the University of Iowa, I don’t know if you would actually be at that much more of an advantage in SoCal compared to those who attended USD in San Diego and finished in the top 25%, or even those inn the top 50% who were able to network their way to a job locally. This all assumes you aren’t in IP law or some other in-demand specialty. For IP law, I have actually heard it doesn’t matter where you go, but again I’m sure that IP graduates from the top schools place much better.

At a certain point, probably somewhere past the top 10-15 schools, I have heard people recommend that you take into account the region where you want to work. U of Illinois is ranked 25 now, so if you want to end up in Chicago or Des Moines it might be a good bet. But if you hope to practice in Colorado, I have to think you will have better opportunities if you go to #36 ranked Colorado, or even #70 or so ranked Denver.

All of this brings me to the most important point of all, and one that I am currently considering. Do you really, really want to be a lawyer? Are you good at, and will you enjoy the activities that lawyers engage in? To help you answer this, I recommend that you read this book linked below. It is the best book ever written on this topic. If your answer to this question is a resounding ‘yes’, then you will not be as concerned about whether it will be worth it if you rank in the bottom 50% at a top 20 school etc, etc. If you attend a top 100 school and do well you will find opportunities in the region where you go to school. Most of the 125k-150k a year jobs you hear about are in biglaw, in big cities, and include hellish billable hours and a lifestyle you may not even desire…

[Anonymous]

bjensen, I could have written your original post since I am in the exact same situation as you, only a few years older with a few more children. Also, my scores have landed me into a few schools ranked 50-75, and waitlisted this year at three in the 25-50 range.

Rankings are an interesting matter that we could discuss for hours, but at the end of the discussion I think we would both agree that they matter alot. I have been looking into this law school thing for three years now and have consistantly heard that if you attend one of the top say 10 schools in the nation you are going to be golden pretty much wherever you rank in your class. I’m sure the opportunities are better for those who rank higher, but apparently even if you are the bottom ranked guy at Michigan or Duke you can go out there and make 125k+ a year at a big firm.

Once you get beyond the top 10, I don’t think it is as straight forward. For example, if you were to attend Washington University in St. Louis, or the University of Iowa, I don’t know if you would actually be at that much more of an advantage in SoCal compared to those who attended USD in San Diego and finished in the top 25%, or even those inn the top 50% who were able to network their way to a job locally. This all assumes you aren’t in IP law or some other in-demand specialty. For IP law, I have actually heard it doesn’t matter where you go, but again I’m sure that IP graduates from the top schools place much better.

At a certain point, probably somewhere past the top 10-15 schools, I have heard people recommend that you take into account the region where you want to work. U of Illinois is ranked 25 now, so if you want to end up in Chicago or Des Moines it might be a good bet. But if you hope to practice in Colorado, I have to think you will have better opportunities if you go to #36 ranked Colorado, or even #70 or so ranked Denver.

All of this brings me to the most important point of all, and one that I am currently considering. Do you really, really want to be a lawyer? Are you good at, and will you enjoy the activities that lawyers engage in? To help you answer this, I recommend that you read this book linked below. It is the best book ever written on this topic. If your answer to this question is a resounding ‘yes’, then you will not be as concerned about whether it will be worth it if you rank in the bottom 50% at a top 20 school etc, etc. If you attend a top 100 school and do well you will find opportunities in the region where you go to school. Most of the 125k-150k a year jobs you hear about are in biglaw, in big cities, and include hellish billable hours and a lifestyle you may not even desire…

[Anonymous]

bjensen, I could have written your original post since I am in the exact same situation as you, only a few years older with a few more children. Also, my scores have landed me into a few schools ranked 50-75, and waitlisted this year at three in the 25-50 range.

Rankings are an interesting matter that we could discuss for hours, but at the end of the discussion I think we would both agree that they matter alot. I have been looking into this law school thing for three years now and have consistantly heard that if you attend one of the top say 10 schools in the nation you are going to be golden pretty much wherever you rank in your class. I’m sure the opportunities are better for those who rank higher, but apparently even if you are the bottom ranked guy at Michigan or Duke you can go out there and make 125k+ a year at a big firm.

Once you get beyond the top 10, I don’t think it is as straight forward. For example, if you were to attend Washington University in St. Louis, or the University of Iowa, I don’t know if you would actually be at that much more of an advantage in SoCal compared to those who attended USD in San Diego and finished in the top 25%, or even those inn the top 50% who were able to network their way to a job locally. This all assumes you aren’t in IP law or some other in-demand specialty. For IP law, I have actually heard it doesn’t matter where you go, but again I’m sure that IP graduates from the top schools place much better.

At a certain point, probably somewhere past the top 10-15 schools, I have heard people recommend that you take into account the region where you want to work. U of Illinois is ranked 25 now, so if you want to end up in Chicago or Des Moines it might be a good bet. But if you hope to practice in Colorado, I have to think you will have better opportunities if you go to #36 ranked Colorado, or even #70 or so ranked Denver.

All of this brings me to the most important point of all, and one that I am currently considering. Do you really, really want to be a lawyer? Are you good at, and will you enjoy the activities that lawyers engage in? To help you answer this, I recommend that you read this book linked below. It is the best book ever written on this topic. If your answer to this question is a resounding ‘yes’, then you will not be as concerned about whether it will be worth it if you rank in the bottom 50% at a top 20 school etc, etc. If you attend a top 100 school and do well you will find opportunities in the region where you go to school. Most of the 125k-150k a year jobs you hear about are in biglaw, in big cities, and include hellish billable hours and a lifestyle you may not even desire…

[Anonymous]

bjensen, I could have written your original post since I am in the exact same situation as you, only a few years older with a few more children. Also, my scores have landed me into a few schools ranked 50-75, and waitlisted this year at three in the 25-50 range.

Rankings are an interesting matter that we could discuss for hours, but at the end of the discussion I think we would both agree that they matter alot. I have been looking into this law school thing for three years now and have consistantly heard that if you attend one of the top say 10 schools in the nation you are going to be golden pretty much wherever you rank in your class. I’m sure the opportunities are better for those who rank higher, but apparently even if you are the bottom ranked guy at Michigan or Duke you can go out there and make 125k+ a year at a big firm.

Once you get beyond the top 10, I don’t think it is as straight forward. For example, if you were to attend Washington University in St. Louis, or the University of Iowa, I don’t know if you would actually be at that much more of an advantage in SoCal compared to those who attended USD in San Diego and finished in the top 25%, or even those inn the top 50% who were able to network their way to a job locally. This all assumes you aren’t in IP law or some other in-demand specialty. For IP law, I have actually heard it doesn’t matter where you go, but again I’m sure that IP graduates from the top schools place much better.

At a certain point, probably somewhere past the top 10-15 schools, I have heard people recommend that you take into account the region where you want to work. U of Illinois is ranked 25 now, so if you want to end up in Chicago or Des Moines it might be a good bet. But if you hope to practice in Colorado, I have to think you will have better opportunities if you go to #36 ranked Colorado, or even #70 or so ranked Denver.

All of this brings me to the most important point of all, and one that I am currently considering. Do you really, really want to be a lawyer? Are you good at, and will you enjoy the activities that lawyers engage in? To help you answer this, I recommend that you read this book linked below. It is the best book ever written on this topic. If your answer to this question is a resounding ‘yes’, then you will not be as concerned about whether it will be worth it if you rank in the bottom 50% at a top 20 school etc, etc. If you attend a top 100 school and do well you will find opportunities in the region where you go to school. Most of the 125k-150k a year jobs you hear about are in biglaw, in big cities, and include hellish billable hours and a lifestyle you may not even desire…

[Bugs]

As it happens I learned conversational Mandarin way back when. Lived overseas for a few years and all that. There are two things you need to recognize about your idea of doing business in China:

There are lots of ethnic Chinese who are already fluent in both English and one or two dialects of Chinese, having grown up with both. Many of them consider their other occupational training to be the big thing, that’s how strong they are academically. Unless your other skills are truly great, adding the language isn’t going to make you that competitive.

Manadrin isn’t a latin-based language, and it is among the most difficult for English speakers to learn. It’s supposedly harder than Japanese or Russian. After 5 years of study you’ll still be behind the curve on vocabulary and you’ll only have rudimentary reading and writing skills.

Doing business overseas means travelling a lot, and we’re not talking about taking the red-eye out to the east coast. Unless you want to live out of a suitcase or relocate you may find that international business travel gets old fast.

If you’re talking about job skills make sure you’re considering the lifestyles that go with your target occupation. Once you do that you’ll soon see that after a certain point the money isn’t the thing.

If the money is the thing then its usually better to own a small business than to be the employee or manager of of a big one.

YMMV.

[bjensen]

Yeah, I did the international travel thing to Brazil. I enjoyed it at first….

Money isn’t the only thing… it’s more like I have too many careers I would like to pursue and too little time to live!

Being a lawyer is one of them.

I also really want to be a part of a (some) startup(s) at some point in my career. If I do pursue a law degree I think I would fit well as general counsel. Right now I would only fit as the sales guy; an opportunity that I have turned down repeatedly. I just don’t have the desire to be the sales guy for my entire career. I also have some relationships with the investment capital/angel investment communities and the atmosphere.

Thanks for the advice!

[bjensen]

Yeah, I did the international travel thing to Brazil. I enjoyed it at first….

Money isn’t the only thing… it’s more like I have too many careers I would like to pursue and too little time to live!

Being a lawyer is one of them.

I also really want to be a part of a (some) startup(s) at some point in my career. If I do pursue a law degree I think I would fit well as general counsel. Right now I would only fit as the sales guy; an opportunity that I have turned down repeatedly. I just don’t have the desire to be the sales guy for my entire career. I also have some relationships with the investment capital/angel investment communities and the atmosphere.

Thanks for the advice!

[bjensen]

Yeah, I did the international travel thing to Brazil. I enjoyed it at first….

Money isn’t the only thing… it’s more like I have too many careers I would like to pursue and too little time to live!

Being a lawyer is one of them.

I also really want to be a part of a (some) startup(s) at some point in my career. If I do pursue a law degree I think I would fit well as general counsel. Right now I would only fit as the sales guy; an opportunity that I have turned down repeatedly. I just don’t have the desire to be the sales guy for my entire career. I also have some relationships with the investment capital/angel investment communities and the atmosphere.

Thanks for the advice!

[bjensen]

Yeah, I did the international travel thing to Brazil. I enjoyed it at first….

Money isn’t the only thing… it’s more like I have too many careers I would like to pursue and too little time to live!

Being a lawyer is one of them.

I also really want to be a part of a (some) startup(s) at some point in my career. If I do pursue a law degree I think I would fit well as general counsel. Right now I would only fit as the sales guy; an opportunity that I have turned down repeatedly. I just don’t have the desire to be the sales guy for my entire career. I also have some relationships with the investment capital/angel investment communities and the atmosphere.

Thanks for the advice!

[bjensen]

Yeah, I did the international travel thing to Brazil. I enjoyed it at first….

Money isn’t the only thing… it’s more like I have too many careers I would like to pursue and too little time to live!

Being a lawyer is one of them.

I also really want to be a part of a (some) startup(s) at some point in my career. If I do pursue a law degree I think I would fit well as general counsel. Right now I would only fit as the sales guy; an opportunity that I have turned down repeatedly. I just don’t have the desire to be the sales guy for my entire career. I also have some relationships with the investment capital/angel investment communities and the atmosphere.

Thanks for the advice!

[Anonymous]

I currently have an import/export business working with business in both the U.S. and Asia.

Beyond what Bugs said about working international business, a few more things to keep in mind.

1. Cultural differences between Asians and Americans can be a big deal. We are not talking about stupid social faux pas. We are talking about differences in business ethics, values, approaches and incentives.

2. Work hours. Basically, I work in the day and in the evening. I work Friday nights (since a lot of Asian business work their Sat.) and Sunday nights (Asian’s monday morning). I work during U.S. holidays (because they don’t have the same holiday). I also work during Asian holidays (because business in U.S. doesn’t close on Asian holidays.)

Just something else to keep in mind.

[Anonymous]

bjensen – as it turns out, in addition to the other things we have in common, I am also a ‘sales guy’ !

[nostradamus]

Hi sdjdguy,

You’re right, I was being tongue in cheek and kind of an armchair quarterback. Despite my complaints about his salary and amount of work, my lawyer really is a good guy and did a great job for me (recovered an embezzled $300k from my father’s estate and recovered $60k in legal fees). Although lawsuits are never pleasant, if it weren’t for him it would have been even worse. Right after my case, he won a $25M suit.

[bjensen]

Juice,

Do you think that any firms would be more interested if you have sales experience, since you would have more of a chance at being a rainmaker someday?

Also, what kind of sales are you in? I’m in IT/Telecom.

[beanmaestro]

bjensen-

Being an overeducated engineer, I have a different enough background than you that I’m talking out my ass, but a couple thoughts:

– Being competitive in law school will be awfully hard unless your family is willing to full support you on the home front. Your competition may well have a lot fewer distractions than you.
– Even if you get a $100-150k job after you graduate, consider what it costs. My lawyer friends work 20 more hours a week than I do, and have $100k more loans than I do. They’re welcome to a higher salary.
– Sales is a fine jumping off point to start a more ambitious job, especially at a start-up. You might consider the next such offer, and talk to the principals about your desire to do more than sales. In many of the startups I’ve seen, the initial sales guy becomes the CFO pretty fast. Any small company benefits from someone who can wear many hats.
– If you do go to law school, tailor your education to enhance something you’re already good at, maybe sales. Generic lawyers ARE a dime a dozen, don’t be generic.
– Learn math at some point, just to prove to yourself that you can do it. If hormone-addled teenagers can do it, it can’t be that hard.

[beanmaestro]

bjensen-

Being an overeducated engineer, I have a different enough background than you that I’m talking out my ass, but a couple thoughts:

– Being competitive in law school will be awfully hard unless your family is willing to full support you on the home front. Your competition may well have a lot fewer distractions than you.
– Even if you get a $100-150k job after you graduate, consider what it costs. My lawyer friends work 20 more hours a week than I do, and have $100k more loans than I do. They’re welcome to a higher salary.
– Sales is a fine jumping off point to start a more ambitious job, especially at a start-up. You might consider the next such offer, and talk to the principals about your desire to do more than sales. In many of the startups I’ve seen, the initial sales guy becomes the CFO pretty fast. Any small company benefits from someone who can wear many hats.
– If you do go to law school, tailor your education to enhance something you’re already good at, maybe sales. Generic lawyers ARE a dime a dozen, don’t be generic.
– Learn math at some point, just to prove to yourself that you can do it. If hormone-addled teenagers can do it, it can’t be that hard.

[beanmaestro]

bjensen-

Being an overeducated engineer, I have a different enough background than you that I’m talking out my ass, but a couple thoughts:

– Being competitive in law school will be awfully hard unless your family is willing to full support you on the home front. Your competition may well have a lot fewer distractions than you.
– Even if you get a $100-150k job after you graduate, consider what it costs. My lawyer friends work 20 more hours a week than I do, and have $100k more loans than I do. They’re welcome to a higher salary.
– Sales is a fine jumping off point to start a more ambitious job, especially at a start-up. You might consider the next such offer, and talk to the principals about your desire to do more than sales. In many of the startups I’ve seen, the initial sales guy becomes the CFO pretty fast. Any small company benefits from someone who can wear many hats.
– If you do go to law school, tailor your education to enhance something you’re already good at, maybe sales. Generic lawyers ARE a dime a dozen, don’t be generic.
– Learn math at some point, just to prove to yourself that you can do it. If hormone-addled teenagers can do it, it can’t be that hard.

[beanmaestro]

bjensen-

Being an overeducated engineer, I have a different enough background than you that I’m talking out my ass, but a couple thoughts:

– Being competitive in law school will be awfully hard unless your family is willing to full support you on the home front. Your competition may well have a lot fewer distractions than you.
– Even if you get a $100-150k job after you graduate, consider what it costs. My lawyer friends work 20 more hours a week than I do, and have $100k more loans than I do. They’re welcome to a higher salary.
– Sales is a fine jumping off point to start a more ambitious job, especially at a start-up. You might consider the next such offer, and talk to the principals about your desire to do more than sales. In many of the startups I’ve seen, the initial sales guy becomes the CFO pretty fast. Any small company benefits from someone who can wear many hats.
– If you do go to law school, tailor your education to enhance something you’re already good at, maybe sales. Generic lawyers ARE a dime a dozen, don’t be generic.
– Learn math at some point, just to prove to yourself that you can do it. If hormone-addled teenagers can do it, it can’t be that hard.

[beanmaestro]

bjensen-

Being an overeducated engineer, I have a different enough background than you that I’m talking out my ass, but a couple thoughts:

– Being competitive in law school will be awfully hard unless your family is willing to full support you on the home front. Your competition may well have a lot fewer distractions than you.
– Even if you get a $100-150k job after you graduate, consider what it costs. My lawyer friends work 20 more hours a week than I do, and have $100k more loans than I do. They’re welcome to a higher salary.
– Sales is a fine jumping off point to start a more ambitious job, especially at a start-up. You might consider the next such offer, and talk to the principals about your desire to do more than sales. In many of the startups I’ve seen, the initial sales guy becomes the CFO pretty fast. Any small company benefits from someone who can wear many hats.
– If you do go to law school, tailor your education to enhance something you’re already good at, maybe sales. Generic lawyers ARE a dime a dozen, don’t be generic.
– Learn math at some point, just to prove to yourself that you can do it. If hormone-addled teenagers can do it, it can’t be that hard.

[bjensen]

Juice,

Do you think that any firms would be more interested if you have sales experience, since you would have more of a chance at being a rainmaker someday?

Also, what kind of sales are you in? I’m in IT/Telecom.

[bjensen]

Juice,

Do you think that any firms would be more interested if you have sales experience, since you would have more of a chance at being a rainmaker someday?

Also, what kind of sales are you in? I’m in IT/Telecom.

[bjensen]

Juice,

Do you think that any firms would be more interested if you have sales experience, since you would have more of a chance at being a rainmaker someday?

Also, what kind of sales are you in? I’m in IT/Telecom.

[bjensen]

Juice,

Do you think that any firms would be more interested if you have sales experience, since you would have more of a chance at being a rainmaker someday?

Also, what kind of sales are you in? I’m in IT/Telecom.

[nostradamus]

Hi sdjdguy,

You’re right, I was being tongue in cheek and kind of an armchair quarterback. Despite my complaints about his salary and amount of work, my lawyer really is a good guy and did a great job for me (recovered an embezzled $300k from my father’s estate and recovered $60k in legal fees). Although lawsuits are never pleasant, if it weren’t for him it would have been even worse. Right after my case, he won a $25M suit.

[nostradamus]

Hi sdjdguy,

You’re right, I was being tongue in cheek and kind of an armchair quarterback. Despite my complaints about his salary and amount of work, my lawyer really is a good guy and did a great job for me (recovered an embezzled $300k from my father’s estate and recovered $60k in legal fees). Although lawsuits are never pleasant, if it weren’t for him it would have been even worse. Right after my case, he won a $25M suit.

[nostradamus]

Hi sdjdguy,

You’re right, I was being tongue in cheek and kind of an armchair quarterback. Despite my complaints about his salary and amount of work, my lawyer really is a good guy and did a great job for me (recovered an embezzled $300k from my father’s estate and recovered $60k in legal fees). Although lawsuits are never pleasant, if it weren’t for him it would have been even worse. Right after my case, he won a $25M suit.

[nostradamus]

Hi sdjdguy,

You’re right, I was being tongue in cheek and kind of an armchair quarterback. Despite my complaints about his salary and amount of work, my lawyer really is a good guy and did a great job for me (recovered an embezzled $300k from my father’s estate and recovered $60k in legal fees). Although lawsuits are never pleasant, if it weren’t for him it would have been even worse. Right after my case, he won a $25M suit.

[Anonymous]

bjensen – as it turns out, in addition to the other things we have in common, I am also a ‘sales guy’ !

[Anonymous]

bjensen – as it turns out, in addition to the other things we have in common, I am also a ‘sales guy’ !

[Anonymous]

bjensen – as it turns out, in addition to the other things we have in common, I am also a ‘sales guy’ !

[Anonymous]

bjensen – as it turns out, in addition to the other things we have in common, I am also a ‘sales guy’ !

[Anonymous]

I currently have an import/export business working with business in both the U.S. and Asia.

Beyond what Bugs said about working international business, a few more things to keep in mind.

1. Cultural differences between Asians and Americans can be a big deal. We are not talking about stupid social faux pas. We are talking about differences in business ethics, values, approaches and incentives.

2. Work hours. Basically, I work in the day and in the evening. I work Friday nights (since a lot of Asian business work their Sat.) and Sunday nights (Asian’s monday morning). I work during U.S. holidays (because they don’t have the same holiday). I also work during Asian holidays (because business in U.S. doesn’t close on Asian holidays.)

Just something else to keep in mind.

[Anonymous]

I currently have an import/export business working with business in both the U.S. and Asia.

Beyond what Bugs said about working international business, a few more things to keep in mind.

1. Cultural differences between Asians and Americans can be a big deal. We are not talking about stupid social faux pas. We are talking about differences in business ethics, values, approaches and incentives.

2. Work hours. Basically, I work in the day and in the evening. I work Friday nights (since a lot of Asian business work their Sat.) and Sunday nights (Asian’s monday morning). I work during U.S. holidays (because they don’t have the same holiday). I also work during Asian holidays (because business in U.S. doesn’t close on Asian holidays.)

Just something else to keep in mind.

[Anonymous]

I currently have an import/export business working with business in both the U.S. and Asia.

Beyond what Bugs said about working international business, a few more things to keep in mind.

1. Cultural differences between Asians and Americans can be a big deal. We are not talking about stupid social faux pas. We are talking about differences in business ethics, values, approaches and incentives.

2. Work hours. Basically, I work in the day and in the evening. I work Friday nights (since a lot of Asian business work their Sat.) and Sunday nights (Asian’s monday morning). I work during U.S. holidays (because they don’t have the same holiday). I also work during Asian holidays (because business in U.S. doesn’t close on Asian holidays.)

Just something else to keep in mind.

[Anonymous]

I currently have an import/export business working with business in both the U.S. and Asia.

Beyond what Bugs said about working international business, a few more things to keep in mind.

1. Cultural differences between Asians and Americans can be a big deal. We are not talking about stupid social faux pas. We are talking about differences in business ethics, values, approaches and incentives.

2. Work hours. Basically, I work in the day and in the evening. I work Friday nights (since a lot of Asian business work their Sat.) and Sunday nights (Asian’s monday morning). I work during U.S. holidays (because they don’t have the same holiday). I also work during Asian holidays (because business in U.S. doesn’t close on Asian holidays.)

Just something else to keep in mind.

[heavyd]

My 2c worth, which echoes what others have said:

1) I don’t get a sense from the job seeker’s comments that he is actually interested in the law; if you’re not interested in the law itself, putting in the required hours in law school and as a young associate will be excruciating, even if you end up with a reasonably fat salary and a measure of job stability.

2) I studied 3 years of Mandarin Chinese at a very good school and have lived and worked in China, HK, and Taiwan for a combined 7-8 years. Speaking Chinese well got me in the door at a couple of jobs, but once I was in the door it ultimately had little to do with my job. As someone else here pointed out, there are millions upon millions of ethnic Chinese on either side of the Pacific who speak Chinese fluently and English quite well.

3) I ended up in finance and like it reasonably well. But as a group the people I see with the most $$ and the best attitudes towards work are entrepreneurs and small business owners. As someone else here mentioned, figure out what it is you are good at, and what you like to do, and at least give some thought to making a living that way. That might end up being a much more attractive option than spending 3 years and $100K+ on law school.

D

[bjensen]

heavyd —

I am extremely interested in the law. I took a variety of law classes undergrad and was even pre-law for some time. Heck, I keep up with business law like most guys follow sports. Other than snow skiing I really couldn’t care less.

My desire has always been to go, but I have always feared not being able to support my myself and family, under a heavy debt load. It seems to be what makes many young lawyers unhappy. If I do it, I am going to DO it. No looking back and wondering if I made the right decision. I did that with sales.

While I am very good at what I do, I am miserable. 99% of the work is brainless. 1% of it is great. I love to present and close a big deal, but sorting through the chaff is pure drudgery. Once I have someone with a pulse and the authority to pull the trigger I love to turn it on. I have no illusions that doc review will be pure stimulation, but I don’t think it will be 95% of my day if I can help it… and even if it was, I get into that sort of stuff anyway.

Sorry to give the impression that it was a fleeting thought. At this point I really want to be an attorney, but am looking at it logically before I make a 100k education purchase.

My attempt here was to get a very pragmatic view of of the legal market because there is so much contradictory information out there. My desire has always been there, I just wanted to know if anyone here held the opinion that the legal sky was falling.

I figured there would no better place than among the piggs to get well thought out advice.

I have definitely gotten it! Thanks everyone.

[NotCranky]

I have followed this entire thread and it has made me curious if you can not go into this in a more measured way?
Is that just not a viable option? Is it better to take a big hit to your life and get it over with?
What if you take 5 or 6 years while you continue to make a decent living and end up with less debt and meanwhile enjoy higher quality family life? Maybe you can’t do that at a school to your liking?

If you haven’t bought a home yet maybe you could even do that when they are at the cheapest point while you go to school. Look at building your estate and living life as a whole and not just your job. I knew of a young man who did this at the bottom of the last cycle while he was killing pre-med at UCSD. Needless to say he is set.
26 is very young and most people hit their stride around 35 no matter how hard they try.

[bjensen]

Rustico,

I don’t claim to be an expert, but from what I hear there are very few part time law options that are decently ranked.

From what I am told, full time programs limit students to 20 hours per week, and most require no work your first year.

Loyola has a part time program, but they have a reputation of being a pretty good law school surrounded by a lot of really great law schools. Unless in the top of your class your job prospects are pretty slim, or so I hear.

Georgetown has a part time program, and they are in the top 14. I would consider doing that without a doubt. The only thing I have heard, but is completely hearsay, is that the PT grads aren’t taken as seriously as the full time grads by the law firms. I don’t know if it’s true or not…

Anyway, I wish there were more options for a measured approach. If anyone has any ideas, please let me know.

Thanks

[bjensen]

Rustico,

I don’t claim to be an expert, but from what I hear there are very few part time law options that are decently ranked.

From what I am told, full time programs limit students to 20 hours per week, and most require no work your first year.

Loyola has a part time program, but they have a reputation of being a pretty good law school surrounded by a lot of really great law schools. Unless in the top of your class your job prospects are pretty slim, or so I hear.

Georgetown has a part time program, and they are in the top 14. I would consider doing that without a doubt. The only thing I have heard, but is completely hearsay, is that the PT grads aren’t taken as seriously as the full time grads by the law firms. I don’t know if it’s true or not…

Anyway, I wish there were more options for a measured approach. If anyone has any ideas, please let me know.

Thanks

[bjensen]

Rustico,

I don’t claim to be an expert, but from what I hear there are very few part time law options that are decently ranked.

From what I am told, full time programs limit students to 20 hours per week, and most require no work your first year.

Loyola has a part time program, but they have a reputation of being a pretty good law school surrounded by a lot of really great law schools. Unless in the top of your class your job prospects are pretty slim, or so I hear.

Georgetown has a part time program, and they are in the top 14. I would consider doing that without a doubt. The only thing I have heard, but is completely hearsay, is that the PT grads aren’t taken as seriously as the full time grads by the law firms. I don’t know if it’s true or not…

Anyway, I wish there were more options for a measured approach. If anyone has any ideas, please let me know.

Thanks

[bjensen]

Rustico,

I don’t claim to be an expert, but from what I hear there are very few part time law options that are decently ranked.

From what I am told, full time programs limit students to 20 hours per week, and most require no work your first year.

Loyola has a part time program, but they have a reputation of being a pretty good law school surrounded by a lot of really great law schools. Unless in the top of your class your job prospects are pretty slim, or so I hear.

Georgetown has a part time program, and they are in the top 14. I would consider doing that without a doubt. The only thing I have heard, but is completely hearsay, is that the PT grads aren’t taken as seriously as the full time grads by the law firms. I don’t know if it’s true or not…

Anyway, I wish there were more options for a measured approach. If anyone has any ideas, please let me know.

Thanks

[bjensen]

Rustico,

I don’t claim to be an expert, but from what I hear there are very few part time law options that are decently ranked.

From what I am told, full time programs limit students to 20 hours per week, and most require no work your first year.

Loyola has a part time program, but they have a reputation of being a pretty good law school surrounded by a lot of really great law schools. Unless in the top of your class your job prospects are pretty slim, or so I hear.

Georgetown has a part time program, and they are in the top 14. I would consider doing that without a doubt. The only thing I have heard, but is completely hearsay, is that the PT grads aren’t taken as seriously as the full time grads by the law firms. I don’t know if it’s true or not…

Anyway, I wish there were more options for a measured approach. If anyone has any ideas, please let me know.

Thanks

[NotCranky]

I have followed this entire thread and it has made me curious if you can not go into this in a more measured way?
Is that just not a viable option? Is it better to take a big hit to your life and get it over with?
What if you take 5 or 6 years while you continue to make a decent living and end up with less debt and meanwhile enjoy higher quality family life? Maybe you can’t do that at a school to your liking?

If you haven’t bought a home yet maybe you could even do that when they are at the cheapest point while you go to school. Look at building your estate and living life as a whole and not just your job. I knew of a young man who did this at the bottom of the last cycle while he was killing pre-med at UCSD. Needless to say he is set.
26 is very young and most people hit their stride around 35 no matter how hard they try.

[NotCranky]

I have followed this entire thread and it has made me curious if you can not go into this in a more measured way?
Is that just not a viable option? Is it better to take a big hit to your life and get it over with?
What if you take 5 or 6 years while you continue to make a decent living and end up with less debt and meanwhile enjoy higher quality family life? Maybe you can’t do that at a school to your liking?

If you haven’t bought a home yet maybe you could even do that when they are at the cheapest point while you go to school. Look at building your estate and living life as a whole and not just your job. I knew of a young man who did this at the bottom of the last cycle while he was killing pre-med at UCSD. Needless to say he is set.
26 is very young and most people hit their stride around 35 no matter how hard they try.

[NotCranky]

I have followed this entire thread and it has made me curious if you can not go into this in a more measured way?
Is that just not a viable option? Is it better to take a big hit to your life and get it over with?
What if you take 5 or 6 years while you continue to make a decent living and end up with less debt and meanwhile enjoy higher quality family life? Maybe you can’t do that at a school to your liking?

If you haven’t bought a home yet maybe you could even do that when they are at the cheapest point while you go to school. Look at building your estate and living life as a whole and not just your job. I knew of a young man who did this at the bottom of the last cycle while he was killing pre-med at UCSD. Needless to say he is set.
26 is very young and most people hit their stride around 35 no matter how hard they try.

[NotCranky]

I have followed this entire thread and it has made me curious if you can not go into this in a more measured way?
Is that just not a viable option? Is it better to take a big hit to your life and get it over with?
What if you take 5 or 6 years while you continue to make a decent living and end up with less debt and meanwhile enjoy higher quality family life? Maybe you can’t do that at a school to your liking?

If you haven’t bought a home yet maybe you could even do that when they are at the cheapest point while you go to school. Look at building your estate and living life as a whole and not just your job. I knew of a young man who did this at the bottom of the last cycle while he was killing pre-med at UCSD. Needless to say he is set.
26 is very young and most people hit their stride around 35 no matter how hard they try.

[bjensen]

heavyd —

I am extremely interested in the law. I took a variety of law classes undergrad and was even pre-law for some time. Heck, I keep up with business law like most guys follow sports. Other than snow skiing I really couldn’t care less.

My desire has always been to go, but I have always feared not being able to support my myself and family, under a heavy debt load. It seems to be what makes many young lawyers unhappy. If I do it, I am going to DO it. No looking back and wondering if I made the right decision. I did that with sales.

While I am very good at what I do, I am miserable. 99% of the work is brainless. 1% of it is great. I love to present and close a big deal, but sorting through the chaff is pure drudgery. Once I have someone with a pulse and the authority to pull the trigger I love to turn it on. I have no illusions that doc review will be pure stimulation, but I don’t think it will be 95% of my day if I can help it… and even if it was, I get into that sort of stuff anyway.

Sorry to give the impression that it was a fleeting thought. At this point I really want to be an attorney, but am looking at it logically before I make a 100k education purchase.

My attempt here was to get a very pragmatic view of of the legal market because there is so much contradictory information out there. My desire has always been there, I just wanted to know if anyone here held the opinion that the legal sky was falling.

I figured there would no better place than among the piggs to get well thought out advice.

I have definitely gotten it! Thanks everyone.

[bjensen]

heavyd —

I am extremely interested in the law. I took a variety of law classes undergrad and was even pre-law for some time. Heck, I keep up with business law like most guys follow sports. Other than snow skiing I really couldn’t care less.

My desire has always been to go, but I have always feared not being able to support my myself and family, under a heavy debt load. It seems to be what makes many young lawyers unhappy. If I do it, I am going to DO it. No looking back and wondering if I made the right decision. I did that with sales.

While I am very good at what I do, I am miserable. 99% of the work is brainless. 1% of it is great. I love to present and close a big deal, but sorting through the chaff is pure drudgery. Once I have someone with a pulse and the authority to pull the trigger I love to turn it on. I have no illusions that doc review will be pure stimulation, but I don’t think it will be 95% of my day if I can help it… and even if it was, I get into that sort of stuff anyway.

Sorry to give the impression that it was a fleeting thought. At this point I really want to be an attorney, but am looking at it logically before I make a 100k education purchase.

My attempt here was to get a very pragmatic view of of the legal market because there is so much contradictory information out there. My desire has always been there, I just wanted to know if anyone here held the opinion that the legal sky was falling.

I figured there would no better place than among the piggs to get well thought out advice.

I have definitely gotten it! Thanks everyone.

[bjensen]

heavyd —

I am extremely interested in the law. I took a variety of law classes undergrad and was even pre-law for some time. Heck, I keep up with business law like most guys follow sports. Other than snow skiing I really couldn’t care less.

My desire has always been to go, but I have always feared not being able to support my myself and family, under a heavy debt load. It seems to be what makes many young lawyers unhappy. If I do it, I am going to DO it. No looking back and wondering if I made the right decision. I did that with sales.

While I am very good at what I do, I am miserable. 99% of the work is brainless. 1% of it is great. I love to present and close a big deal, but sorting through the chaff is pure drudgery. Once I have someone with a pulse and the authority to pull the trigger I love to turn it on. I have no illusions that doc review will be pure stimulation, but I don’t think it will be 95% of my day if I can help it… and even if it was, I get into that sort of stuff anyway.

Sorry to give the impression that it was a fleeting thought. At this point I really want to be an attorney, but am looking at it logically before I make a 100k education purchase.

My attempt here was to get a very pragmatic view of of the legal market because there is so much contradictory information out there. My desire has always been there, I just wanted to know if anyone here held the opinion that the legal sky was falling.

I figured there would no better place than among the piggs to get well thought out advice.

I have definitely gotten it! Thanks everyone.

[bjensen]

heavyd —

I am extremely interested in the law. I took a variety of law classes undergrad and was even pre-law for some time. Heck, I keep up with business law like most guys follow sports. Other than snow skiing I really couldn’t care less.

My desire has always been to go, but I have always feared not being able to support my myself and family, under a heavy debt load. It seems to be what makes many young lawyers unhappy. If I do it, I am going to DO it. No looking back and wondering if I made the right decision. I did that with sales.

While I am very good at what I do, I am miserable. 99% of the work is brainless. 1% of it is great. I love to present and close a big deal, but sorting through the chaff is pure drudgery. Once I have someone with a pulse and the authority to pull the trigger I love to turn it on. I have no illusions that doc review will be pure stimulation, but I don’t think it will be 95% of my day if I can help it… and even if it was, I get into that sort of stuff anyway.

Sorry to give the impression that it was a fleeting thought. At this point I really want to be an attorney, but am looking at it logically before I make a 100k education purchase.

My attempt here was to get a very pragmatic view of of the legal market because there is so much contradictory information out there. My desire has always been there, I just wanted to know if anyone here held the opinion that the legal sky was falling.

I figured there would no better place than among the piggs to get well thought out advice.

I have definitely gotten it! Thanks everyone.

[heavyd]

My 2c worth, which echoes what others have said:

1) I don’t get a sense from the job seeker’s comments that he is actually interested in the law; if you’re not interested in the law itself, putting in the required hours in law school and as a young associate will be excruciating, even if you end up with a reasonably fat salary and a measure of job stability.

2) I studied 3 years of Mandarin Chinese at a very good school and have lived and worked in China, HK, and Taiwan for a combined 7-8 years. Speaking Chinese well got me in the door at a couple of jobs, but once I was in the door it ultimately had little to do with my job. As someone else here pointed out, there are millions upon millions of ethnic Chinese on either side of the Pacific who speak Chinese fluently and English quite well.

3) I ended up in finance and like it reasonably well. But as a group the people I see with the most $$ and the best attitudes towards work are entrepreneurs and small business owners. As someone else here mentioned, figure out what it is you are good at, and what you like to do, and at least give some thought to making a living that way. That might end up being a much more attractive option than spending 3 years and $100K+ on law school.

D

[heavyd]

My 2c worth, which echoes what others have said:

1) I don’t get a sense from the job seeker’s comments that he is actually interested in the law; if you’re not interested in the law itself, putting in the required hours in law school and as a young associate will be excruciating, even if you end up with a reasonably fat salary and a measure of job stability.

2) I studied 3 years of Mandarin Chinese at a very good school and have lived and worked in China, HK, and Taiwan for a combined 7-8 years. Speaking Chinese well got me in the door at a couple of jobs, but once I was in the door it ultimately had little to do with my job. As someone else here pointed out, there are millions upon millions of ethnic Chinese on either side of the Pacific who speak Chinese fluently and English quite well.

3) I ended up in finance and like it reasonably well. But as a group the people I see with the most $$ and the best attitudes towards work are entrepreneurs and small business owners. As someone else here mentioned, figure out what it is you are good at, and what you like to do, and at least give some thought to making a living that way. That might end up being a much more attractive option than spending 3 years and $100K+ on law school.

D

[heavyd]

My 2c worth, which echoes what others have said:

1) I don’t get a sense from the job seeker’s comments that he is actually interested in the law; if you’re not interested in the law itself, putting in the required hours in law school and as a young associate will be excruciating, even if you end up with a reasonably fat salary and a measure of job stability.

2) I studied 3 years of Mandarin Chinese at a very good school and have lived and worked in China, HK, and Taiwan for a combined 7-8 years. Speaking Chinese well got me in the door at a couple of jobs, but once I was in the door it ultimately had little to do with my job. As someone else here pointed out, there are millions upon millions of ethnic Chinese on either side of the Pacific who speak Chinese fluently and English quite well.

3) I ended up in finance and like it reasonably well. But as a group the people I see with the most $$ and the best attitudes towards work are entrepreneurs and small business owners. As someone else here mentioned, figure out what it is you are good at, and what you like to do, and at least give some thought to making a living that way. That might end up being a much more attractive option than spending 3 years and $100K+ on law school.

D

[heavyd]

My 2c worth, which echoes what others have said:

1) I don’t get a sense from the job seeker’s comments that he is actually interested in the law; if you’re not interested in the law itself, putting in the required hours in law school and as a young associate will be excruciating, even if you end up with a reasonably fat salary and a measure of job stability.

2) I studied 3 years of Mandarin Chinese at a very good school and have lived and worked in China, HK, and Taiwan for a combined 7-8 years. Speaking Chinese well got me in the door at a couple of jobs, but once I was in the door it ultimately had little to do with my job. As someone else here pointed out, there are millions upon millions of ethnic Chinese on either side of the Pacific who speak Chinese fluently and English quite well.

3) I ended up in finance and like it reasonably well. But as a group the people I see with the most $$ and the best attitudes towards work are entrepreneurs and small business owners. As someone else here mentioned, figure out what it is you are good at, and what you like to do, and at least give some thought to making a living that way. That might end up being a much more attractive option than spending 3 years and $100K+ on law school.

D

[Bugs]

As it happens I learned conversational Mandarin way back when. Lived overseas for a few years and all that. There are two things you need to recognize about your idea of doing business in China:

There are lots of ethnic Chinese who are already fluent in both English and one or two dialects of Chinese, having grown up with both. Many of them consider their other occupational training to be the big thing, that’s how strong they are academically. Unless your other skills are truly great, adding the language isn’t going to make you that competitive.

Manadrin isn’t a latin-based language, and it is among the most difficult for English speakers to learn. It’s supposedly harder than Japanese or Russian. After 5 years of study you’ll still be behind the curve on vocabulary and you’ll only have rudimentary reading and writing skills.

Doing business overseas means travelling a lot, and we’re not talking about taking the red-eye out to the east coast. Unless you want to live out of a suitcase or relocate you may find that international business travel gets old fast.

If you’re talking about job skills make sure you’re considering the lifestyles that go with your target occupation. Once you do that you’ll soon see that after a certain point the money isn’t the thing.

If the money is the thing then its usually better to own a small business than to be the employee or manager of of a big one.

YMMV.

[Bugs]

As it happens I learned conversational Mandarin way back when. Lived overseas for a few years and all that. There are two things you need to recognize about your idea of doing business in China:

There are lots of ethnic Chinese who are already fluent in both English and one or two dialects of Chinese, having grown up with both. Many of them consider their other occupational training to be the big thing, that’s how strong they are academically. Unless your other skills are truly great, adding the language isn’t going to make you that competitive.

Manadrin isn’t a latin-based language, and it is among the most difficult for English speakers to learn. It’s supposedly harder than Japanese or Russian. After 5 years of study you’ll still be behind the curve on vocabulary and you’ll only have rudimentary reading and writing skills.

Doing business overseas means travelling a lot, and we’re not talking about taking the red-eye out to the east coast. Unless you want to live out of a suitcase or relocate you may find that international business travel gets old fast.

If you’re talking about job skills make sure you’re considering the lifestyles that go with your target occupation. Once you do that you’ll soon see that after a certain point the money isn’t the thing.

If the money is the thing then its usually better to own a small business than to be the employee or manager of of a big one.

YMMV.

[Bugs]

As it happens I learned conversational Mandarin way back when. Lived overseas for a few years and all that. There are two things you need to recognize about your idea of doing business in China:

There are lots of ethnic Chinese who are already fluent in both English and one or two dialects of Chinese, having grown up with both. Many of them consider their other occupational training to be the big thing, that’s how strong they are academically. Unless your other skills are truly great, adding the language isn’t going to make you that competitive.

Manadrin isn’t a latin-based language, and it is among the most difficult for English speakers to learn. It’s supposedly harder than Japanese or Russian. After 5 years of study you’ll still be behind the curve on vocabulary and you’ll only have rudimentary reading and writing skills.

Doing business overseas means travelling a lot, and we’re not talking about taking the red-eye out to the east coast. Unless you want to live out of a suitcase or relocate you may find that international business travel gets old fast.

If you’re talking about job skills make sure you’re considering the lifestyles that go with your target occupation. Once you do that you’ll soon see that after a certain point the money isn’t the thing.

If the money is the thing then its usually better to own a small business than to be the employee or manager of of a big one.

YMMV.

[Bugs]

As it happens I learned conversational Mandarin way back when. Lived overseas for a few years and all that. There are two things you need to recognize about your idea of doing business in China:

There are lots of ethnic Chinese who are already fluent in both English and one or two dialects of Chinese, having grown up with both. Many of them consider their other occupational training to be the big thing, that’s how strong they are academically. Unless your other skills are truly great, adding the language isn’t going to make you that competitive.

Manadrin isn’t a latin-based language, and it is among the most difficult for English speakers to learn. It’s supposedly harder than Japanese or Russian. After 5 years of study you’ll still be behind the curve on vocabulary and you’ll only have rudimentary reading and writing skills.

Doing business overseas means travelling a lot, and we’re not talking about taking the red-eye out to the east coast. Unless you want to live out of a suitcase or relocate you may find that international business travel gets old fast.

If you’re talking about job skills make sure you’re considering the lifestyles that go with your target occupation. Once you do that you’ll soon see that after a certain point the money isn’t the thing.

If the money is the thing then its usually better to own a small business than to be the employee or manager of of a big one.

YMMV.

[bjensen]

–

[bjensen]

–

[bjensen]

–

[bjensen]

–

[Coronita]

Borat- Too late. Too many people…

 

Original poster. You really have to ask yourself. Why do you want to be a lawyer?… If it's a money thing. Think again. There are many careers that school/background doesn't make a huge difference (engineering might be one where say a UCLA or USCD won't make a huge difference). Talking to friends, it's completely different for lawyers. Top pay, school does matter. And a few lawyer friends from sh!tty law schools don't quite do quite as well as some of the geek types (could also be in their line of work). Also, I hope you like to read…a lot…

Patent law was something that I was interested in. But after thinking about things, I wouldn't like to be reading about what everyone else did. But that's just me.

That's why when I look at other careers, engineering isn't that bad. Yes, it's average pay, but you really don't have that sort of pecking order you do in other professions. The pay disparity between lawyers from different schools and finance people from different MBA's is astounding.

You think (no offense to USD/SDSU MBA holders) those folks would be able to get jobs on Wall Street pulling in 7 figures? If it were the case, it would be more the exception than the rule.

 

 

[img_assist|nid=5962|title=selfportrait|desc=|link=node|align=left|width=100|height=80]

—– Sour grapes for everyone!

[Coronita]

Borat- Too late. Too many people…

 

Original poster. You really have to ask yourself. Why do you want to be a lawyer?… If it's a money thing. Think again. There are many careers that school/background doesn't make a huge difference (engineering might be one where say a UCLA or USCD won't make a huge difference). Talking to friends, it's completely different for lawyers. Top pay, school does matter. And a few lawyer friends from sh!tty law schools don't quite do quite as well as some of the geek types (could also be in their line of work). Also, I hope you like to read…a lot…

Patent law was something that I was interested in. But after thinking about things, I wouldn't like to be reading about what everyone else did. But that's just me.

That's why when I look at other careers, engineering isn't that bad. Yes, it's average pay, but you really don't have that sort of pecking order you do in other professions. The pay disparity between lawyers from different schools and finance people from different MBA's is astounding.

You think (no offense to USD/SDSU MBA holders) those folks would be able to get jobs on Wall Street pulling in 7 figures? If it were the case, it would be more the exception than the rule.

 

 

[img_assist|nid=5962|title=selfportrait|desc=|link=node|align=left|width=100|height=80]

—– Sour grapes for everyone!

[Coronita]

Borat- Too late. Too many people…

 

Original poster. You really have to ask yourself. Why do you want to be a lawyer?… If it's a money thing. Think again. There are many careers that school/background doesn't make a huge difference (engineering might be one where say a UCLA or USCD won't make a huge difference). Talking to friends, it's completely different for lawyers. Top pay, school does matter. And a few lawyer friends from sh!tty law schools don't quite do quite as well as some of the geek types (could also be in their line of work). Also, I hope you like to read…a lot…

Patent law was something that I was interested in. But after thinking about things, I wouldn't like to be reading about what everyone else did. But that's just me.

That's why when I look at other careers, engineering isn't that bad. Yes, it's average pay, but you really don't have that sort of pecking order you do in other professions. The pay disparity between lawyers from different schools and finance people from different MBA's is astounding.

You think (no offense to USD/SDSU MBA holders) those folks would be able to get jobs on Wall Street pulling in 7 figures? If it were the case, it would be more the exception than the rule.

 

 

[img_assist|nid=5962|title=selfportrait|desc=|link=node|align=left|width=100|height=80]

—– Sour grapes for everyone!

[Coronita]

Borat- Too late. Too many people…

 

Original poster. You really have to ask yourself. Why do you want to be a lawyer?… If it's a money thing. Think again. There are many careers that school/background doesn't make a huge difference (engineering might be one where say a UCLA or USCD won't make a huge difference). Talking to friends, it's completely different for lawyers. Top pay, school does matter. And a few lawyer friends from sh!tty law schools don't quite do quite as well as some of the geek types (could also be in their line of work). Also, I hope you like to read…a lot…

Patent law was something that I was interested in. But after thinking about things, I wouldn't like to be reading about what everyone else did. But that's just me.

That's why when I look at other careers, engineering isn't that bad. Yes, it's average pay, but you really don't have that sort of pecking order you do in other professions. The pay disparity between lawyers from different schools and finance people from different MBA's is astounding.

You think (no offense to USD/SDSU MBA holders) those folks would be able to get jobs on Wall Street pulling in 7 figures? If it were the case, it would be more the exception than the rule.

 

 

[img_assist|nid=5962|title=selfportrait|desc=|link=node|align=left|width=100|height=80]

—– Sour grapes for everyone!

[PCinSD]

Here’s my 2 cents based on what I’ve experienced:

I’m a solo practitioner. I went to law school after 9 years in the Navy. You can make a very good living as an attorney regardless of the school you attend. I chose to go to law school because I wanted/needed a marketable skill that would pay the bills. That, and I knew I had an aptitude for it. I went to Cal Western (downtown) in 1997. I wasn’t thrilled with the school, but that’s just me. It was simply a means to an end – passing the bar exam. If you have high enough undergrad grades and a high LSAT score, any of the 3 local schools may give you a scholarship. Cal Western offered me more than USD, so I went with them. Cal Western also allows you to go full time, straight through. You can knock it out in 2 years. They have a good reputation locally. However, if I had to do it over again I’d go with USD.

The advantage of going to school in the town you want to work is that you make connections in the legal community while in school. You can work as a law clerk and also as an intern. This could result in a job for you when you graduate. You also make friends while at school – most of whom end up practicing in the same city. They can potentially become a great source of future referrals and/or jobs.

As far as firms go, I’ve never worked for a firm and never will. I know people who do. They work an insane amount of hours to make someone else wealthy. With a wife and a child your time is probably worth more. I nearly starved for the first few years of practicing. Things finally turned around for me a couple of years ago. The key is getting clients. Your sales background may be of help there. If you have the clients, you can make more money working less hours than you could with a firm. For example, if you bill 40 hours a month at an hourly rate of $250, there’s $120,000/yr. That’s why firms have such high billable hour requirements. Keep in mind that billable hours and hours worked are not the same. You don’t always get to bill for everything you do.

I had the luxury of spending the time and money on law school because I’m single. You might not. If you go full time, you probably won’t work (other than as a law clerk) and won’t generate any income for your family. It will be stressful. Not everybody is lucky enough to have a job that is profitable and tons of fun. I enjoy some parts of being a lawyer more than others. Either way, I know that I will always be able to make a living because I have a law license.

Best of luck to you,

pabloesqobar

[Anonymous]

I expect that my sales background will be an asset, especially if I use my law degree for business related ventures. I have a friend who graduated from William and Mary a few years ago and his first job out of school was selling legal software! He said the pay was too good to pass up, and he had a sales background. I am considering focusing on real estate law, possibly getting a joint degree in law/real estate development and aiming for a more entrepreneural career.

[Anonymous]

I expect that my sales background will be an asset, especially if I use my law degree for business related ventures. I have a friend who graduated from William and Mary a few years ago and his first job out of school was selling legal software! He said the pay was too good to pass up, and he had a sales background. I am considering focusing on real estate law, possibly getting a joint degree in law/real estate development and aiming for a more entrepreneural career.

[Anonymous]

I expect that my sales background will be an asset, especially if I use my law degree for business related ventures. I have a friend who graduated from William and Mary a few years ago and his first job out of school was selling legal software! He said the pay was too good to pass up, and he had a sales background. I am considering focusing on real estate law, possibly getting a joint degree in law/real estate development and aiming for a more entrepreneural career.

[Anonymous]

I expect that my sales background will be an asset, especially if I use my law degree for business related ventures. I have a friend who graduated from William and Mary a few years ago and his first job out of school was selling legal software! He said the pay was too good to pass up, and he had a sales background. I am considering focusing on real estate law, possibly getting a joint degree in law/real estate development and aiming for a more entrepreneural career.

[Anonymous]

I expect that my sales background will be an asset, especially if I use my law degree for business related ventures. I have a friend who graduated from William and Mary a few years ago and his first job out of school was selling legal software! He said the pay was too good to pass up, and he had a sales background. I am considering focusing on real estate law, possibly getting a joint degree in law/real estate development and aiming for a more entrepreneural career.

[bjensen]

pabloesobar–

I would proabably only consider BIGLAW for a few years to help pay down my debt, but then I think I would like to take some of my client base and woo them away to a boutique firm with a few other disillusioned associates that don’t like to bill 2400 hours. I am aware that you can’t bill everything… what would you figure your hours billed to hours worked ratio really is?

On the home front, my wife has experience at Goldman Sachs and can find a finance job while I am in school. So that is a blessing.

Of course then I have to figure out what to do with the runt…

sdjdguy —

Do you mind sharing where your school fell in the rankings… and what size practice you are in?

Thanks everyone!

[bjensen]

Wow juice… this is kindof creepy.

I also want to leverage a law degree for entreprenurial purposes.

Do you have a brother you don’t know about? I’m from Idaho, and I don’t think my dad was ever the milk man around these parts! 🙂

[Anonymous]

I do have a half brother I have never met, but he would be from the Midwest!

[Anonymous]

I do have a half brother I have never met, but he would be from the Midwest!

[Anonymous]

I do have a half brother I have never met, but he would be from the Midwest!

[Anonymous]

I do have a half brother I have never met, but he would be from the Midwest!

[Anonymous]

I do have a half brother I have never met, but he would be from the Midwest!

[bjensen]

Wow juice… this is kindof creepy.

I also want to leverage a law degree for entreprenurial purposes.

Do you have a brother you don’t know about? I’m from Idaho, and I don’t think my dad was ever the milk man around these parts! 🙂

[bjensen]

Wow juice… this is kindof creepy.

I also want to leverage a law degree for entreprenurial purposes.

Do you have a brother you don’t know about? I’m from Idaho, and I don’t think my dad was ever the milk man around these parts! 🙂

[bjensen]

Wow juice… this is kindof creepy.

I also want to leverage a law degree for entreprenurial purposes.

Do you have a brother you don’t know about? I’m from Idaho, and I don’t think my dad was ever the milk man around these parts! 🙂

[bjensen]

Wow juice… this is kindof creepy.

I also want to leverage a law degree for entreprenurial purposes.

Do you have a brother you don’t know about? I’m from Idaho, and I don’t think my dad was ever the milk man around these parts! 🙂

[Anonymous]

Sure. My law school usually ranks at around #15 depending on whose survey you are reading. I’m in a firm with around 100 lawyers locally and several hundred nationally. FYI, very few firms would expect you to bill 2400 hours as an associate. If you bill 2100 (or even 2000 depending on the firm), and do excellent work, that’s usually plenty of hours to advance within the firm. You can typically bill 80%-90% of your hours. So if you are in the office for 10 hours, you should be able to bill at least 8-9 hours of that (with the rest consisting of your lunch break, time goofing off, doing administrative tasks, attending meetings, etc.). If you are assigned to write a law review article for a partner to sign his/her name to, that’s non-billable and you would not get credit for it (so you might have to do that over a weekend, for example). If you treat law school like a job, i.e., work at it consistently during working hours, you should be able to manage even with a wife and child. I was single, but I had several friends with families who took it seriously and did extremely well in law school.

[Anonymous]

Sure. My law school usually ranks at around #15 depending on whose survey you are reading. I’m in a firm with around 100 lawyers locally and several hundred nationally. FYI, very few firms would expect you to bill 2400 hours as an associate. If you bill 2100 (or even 2000 depending on the firm), and do excellent work, that’s usually plenty of hours to advance within the firm. You can typically bill 80%-90% of your hours. So if you are in the office for 10 hours, you should be able to bill at least 8-9 hours of that (with the rest consisting of your lunch break, time goofing off, doing administrative tasks, attending meetings, etc.). If you are assigned to write a law review article for a partner to sign his/her name to, that’s non-billable and you would not get credit for it (so you might have to do that over a weekend, for example). If you treat law school like a job, i.e., work at it consistently during working hours, you should be able to manage even with a wife and child. I was single, but I had several friends with families who took it seriously and did extremely well in law school.

[Anonymous]

Sure. My law school usually ranks at around #15 depending on whose survey you are reading. I’m in a firm with around 100 lawyers locally and several hundred nationally. FYI, very few firms would expect you to bill 2400 hours as an associate. If you bill 2100 (or even 2000 depending on the firm), and do excellent work, that’s usually plenty of hours to advance within the firm. You can typically bill 80%-90% of your hours. So if you are in the office for 10 hours, you should be able to bill at least 8-9 hours of that (with the rest consisting of your lunch break, time goofing off, doing administrative tasks, attending meetings, etc.). If you are assigned to write a law review article for a partner to sign his/her name to, that’s non-billable and you would not get credit for it (so you might have to do that over a weekend, for example). If you treat law school like a job, i.e., work at it consistently during working hours, you should be able to manage even with a wife and child. I was single, but I had several friends with families who took it seriously and did extremely well in law school.

[Anonymous]

Sure. My law school usually ranks at around #15 depending on whose survey you are reading. I’m in a firm with around 100 lawyers locally and several hundred nationally. FYI, very few firms would expect you to bill 2400 hours as an associate. If you bill 2100 (or even 2000 depending on the firm), and do excellent work, that’s usually plenty of hours to advance within the firm. You can typically bill 80%-90% of your hours. So if you are in the office for 10 hours, you should be able to bill at least 8-9 hours of that (with the rest consisting of your lunch break, time goofing off, doing administrative tasks, attending meetings, etc.). If you are assigned to write a law review article for a partner to sign his/her name to, that’s non-billable and you would not get credit for it (so you might have to do that over a weekend, for example). If you treat law school like a job, i.e., work at it consistently during working hours, you should be able to manage even with a wife and child. I was single, but I had several friends with families who took it seriously and did extremely well in law school.

[Anonymous]

Sure. My law school usually ranks at around #15 depending on whose survey you are reading. I’m in a firm with around 100 lawyers locally and several hundred nationally. FYI, very few firms would expect you to bill 2400 hours as an associate. If you bill 2100 (or even 2000 depending on the firm), and do excellent work, that’s usually plenty of hours to advance within the firm. You can typically bill 80%-90% of your hours. So if you are in the office for 10 hours, you should be able to bill at least 8-9 hours of that (with the rest consisting of your lunch break, time goofing off, doing administrative tasks, attending meetings, etc.). If you are assigned to write a law review article for a partner to sign his/her name to, that’s non-billable and you would not get credit for it (so you might have to do that over a weekend, for example). If you treat law school like a job, i.e., work at it consistently during working hours, you should be able to manage even with a wife and child. I was single, but I had several friends with families who took it seriously and did extremely well in law school.

[bjensen]

pabloesobar–

I would proabably only consider BIGLAW for a few years to help pay down my debt, but then I think I would like to take some of my client base and woo them away to a boutique firm with a few other disillusioned associates that don’t like to bill 2400 hours. I am aware that you can’t bill everything… what would you figure your hours billed to hours worked ratio really is?

On the home front, my wife has experience at Goldman Sachs and can find a finance job while I am in school. So that is a blessing.

Of course then I have to figure out what to do with the runt…

sdjdguy —

Do you mind sharing where your school fell in the rankings… and what size practice you are in?

Thanks everyone!

[bjensen]

pabloesobar–

I would proabably only consider BIGLAW for a few years to help pay down my debt, but then I think I would like to take some of my client base and woo them away to a boutique firm with a few other disillusioned associates that don’t like to bill 2400 hours. I am aware that you can’t bill everything… what would you figure your hours billed to hours worked ratio really is?

On the home front, my wife has experience at Goldman Sachs and can find a finance job while I am in school. So that is a blessing.

Of course then I have to figure out what to do with the runt…

sdjdguy —

Do you mind sharing where your school fell in the rankings… and what size practice you are in?

Thanks everyone!

[bjensen]

pabloesobar–

I would proabably only consider BIGLAW for a few years to help pay down my debt, but then I think I would like to take some of my client base and woo them away to a boutique firm with a few other disillusioned associates that don’t like to bill 2400 hours. I am aware that you can’t bill everything… what would you figure your hours billed to hours worked ratio really is?

On the home front, my wife has experience at Goldman Sachs and can find a finance job while I am in school. So that is a blessing.

Of course then I have to figure out what to do with the runt…

sdjdguy —

Do you mind sharing where your school fell in the rankings… and what size practice you are in?

Thanks everyone!

[bjensen]

pabloesobar–

I would proabably only consider BIGLAW for a few years to help pay down my debt, but then I think I would like to take some of my client base and woo them away to a boutique firm with a few other disillusioned associates that don’t like to bill 2400 hours. I am aware that you can’t bill everything… what would you figure your hours billed to hours worked ratio really is?

On the home front, my wife has experience at Goldman Sachs and can find a finance job while I am in school. So that is a blessing.

Of course then I have to figure out what to do with the runt…

sdjdguy —

Do you mind sharing where your school fell in the rankings… and what size practice you are in?

Thanks everyone!

[PCinSD]

Here’s my 2 cents based on what I’ve experienced:

I’m a solo practitioner. I went to law school after 9 years in the Navy. You can make a very good living as an attorney regardless of the school you attend. I chose to go to law school because I wanted/needed a marketable skill that would pay the bills. That, and I knew I had an aptitude for it. I went to Cal Western (downtown) in 1997. I wasn’t thrilled with the school, but that’s just me. It was simply a means to an end – passing the bar exam. If you have high enough undergrad grades and a high LSAT score, any of the 3 local schools may give you a scholarship. Cal Western offered me more than USD, so I went with them. Cal Western also allows you to go full time, straight through. You can knock it out in 2 years. They have a good reputation locally. However, if I had to do it over again I’d go with USD.

The advantage of going to school in the town you want to work is that you make connections in the legal community while in school. You can work as a law clerk and also as an intern. This could result in a job for you when you graduate. You also make friends while at school – most of whom end up practicing in the same city. They can potentially become a great source of future referrals and/or jobs.

As far as firms go, I’ve never worked for a firm and never will. I know people who do. They work an insane amount of hours to make someone else wealthy. With a wife and a child your time is probably worth more. I nearly starved for the first few years of practicing. Things finally turned around for me a couple of years ago. The key is getting clients. Your sales background may be of help there. If you have the clients, you can make more money working less hours than you could with a firm. For example, if you bill 40 hours a month at an hourly rate of $250, there’s $120,000/yr. That’s why firms have such high billable hour requirements. Keep in mind that billable hours and hours worked are not the same. You don’t always get to bill for everything you do.

I had the luxury of spending the time and money on law school because I’m single. You might not. If you go full time, you probably won’t work (other than as a law clerk) and won’t generate any income for your family. It will be stressful. Not everybody is lucky enough to have a job that is profitable and tons of fun. I enjoy some parts of being a lawyer more than others. Either way, I know that I will always be able to make a living because I have a law license.

Best of luck to you,

pabloesqobar

[PCinSD]

Here’s my 2 cents based on what I’ve experienced:

I’m a solo practitioner. I went to law school after 9 years in the Navy. You can make a very good living as an attorney regardless of the school you attend. I chose to go to law school because I wanted/needed a marketable skill that would pay the bills. That, and I knew I had an aptitude for it. I went to Cal Western (downtown) in 1997. I wasn’t thrilled with the school, but that’s just me. It was simply a means to an end – passing the bar exam. If you have high enough undergrad grades and a high LSAT score, any of the 3 local schools may give you a scholarship. Cal Western offered me more than USD, so I went with them. Cal Western also allows you to go full time, straight through. You can knock it out in 2 years. They have a good reputation locally. However, if I had to do it over again I’d go with USD.

The advantage of going to school in the town you want to work is that you make connections in the legal community while in school. You can work as a law clerk and also as an intern. This could result in a job for you when you graduate. You also make friends while at school – most of whom end up practicing in the same city. They can potentially become a great source of future referrals and/or jobs.

As far as firms go, I’ve never worked for a firm and never will. I know people who do. They work an insane amount of hours to make someone else wealthy. With a wife and a child your time is probably worth more. I nearly starved for the first few years of practicing. Things finally turned around for me a couple of years ago. The key is getting clients. Your sales background may be of help there. If you have the clients, you can make more money working less hours than you could with a firm. For example, if you bill 40 hours a month at an hourly rate of $250, there’s $120,000/yr. That’s why firms have such high billable hour requirements. Keep in mind that billable hours and hours worked are not the same. You don’t always get to bill for everything you do.

I had the luxury of spending the time and money on law school because I’m single. You might not. If you go full time, you probably won’t work (other than as a law clerk) and won’t generate any income for your family. It will be stressful. Not everybody is lucky enough to have a job that is profitable and tons of fun. I enjoy some parts of being a lawyer more than others. Either way, I know that I will always be able to make a living because I have a law license.

Best of luck to you,

pabloesqobar

[PCinSD]

Here’s my 2 cents based on what I’ve experienced:

I’m a solo practitioner. I went to law school after 9 years in the Navy. You can make a very good living as an attorney regardless of the school you attend. I chose to go to law school because I wanted/needed a marketable skill that would pay the bills. That, and I knew I had an aptitude for it. I went to Cal Western (downtown) in 1997. I wasn’t thrilled with the school, but that’s just me. It was simply a means to an end – passing the bar exam. If you have high enough undergrad grades and a high LSAT score, any of the 3 local schools may give you a scholarship. Cal Western offered me more than USD, so I went with them. Cal Western also allows you to go full time, straight through. You can knock it out in 2 years. They have a good reputation locally. However, if I had to do it over again I’d go with USD.

The advantage of going to school in the town you want to work is that you make connections in the legal community while in school. You can work as a law clerk and also as an intern. This could result in a job for you when you graduate. You also make friends while at school – most of whom end up practicing in the same city. They can potentially become a great source of future referrals and/or jobs.

As far as firms go, I’ve never worked for a firm and never will. I know people who do. They work an insane amount of hours to make someone else wealthy. With a wife and a child your time is probably worth more. I nearly starved for the first few years of practicing. Things finally turned around for me a couple of years ago. The key is getting clients. Your sales background may be of help there. If you have the clients, you can make more money working less hours than you could with a firm. For example, if you bill 40 hours a month at an hourly rate of $250, there’s $120,000/yr. That’s why firms have such high billable hour requirements. Keep in mind that billable hours and hours worked are not the same. You don’t always get to bill for everything you do.

I had the luxury of spending the time and money on law school because I’m single. You might not. If you go full time, you probably won’t work (other than as a law clerk) and won’t generate any income for your family. It will be stressful. Not everybody is lucky enough to have a job that is profitable and tons of fun. I enjoy some parts of being a lawyer more than others. Either way, I know that I will always be able to make a living because I have a law license.

Best of luck to you,

pabloesqobar

[PCinSD]

Here’s my 2 cents based on what I’ve experienced:

I’m a solo practitioner. I went to law school after 9 years in the Navy. You can make a very good living as an attorney regardless of the school you attend. I chose to go to law school because I wanted/needed a marketable skill that would pay the bills. That, and I knew I had an aptitude for it. I went to Cal Western (downtown) in 1997. I wasn’t thrilled with the school, but that’s just me. It was simply a means to an end – passing the bar exam. If you have high enough undergrad grades and a high LSAT score, any of the 3 local schools may give you a scholarship. Cal Western offered me more than USD, so I went with them. Cal Western also allows you to go full time, straight through. You can knock it out in 2 years. They have a good reputation locally. However, if I had to do it over again I’d go with USD.

The advantage of going to school in the town you want to work is that you make connections in the legal community while in school. You can work as a law clerk and also as an intern. This could result in a job for you when you graduate. You also make friends while at school – most of whom end up practicing in the same city. They can potentially become a great source of future referrals and/or jobs.

As far as firms go, I’ve never worked for a firm and never will. I know people who do. They work an insane amount of hours to make someone else wealthy. With a wife and a child your time is probably worth more. I nearly starved for the first few years of practicing. Things finally turned around for me a couple of years ago. The key is getting clients. Your sales background may be of help there. If you have the clients, you can make more money working less hours than you could with a firm. For example, if you bill 40 hours a month at an hourly rate of $250, there’s $120,000/yr. That’s why firms have such high billable hour requirements. Keep in mind that billable hours and hours worked are not the same. You don’t always get to bill for everything you do.

I had the luxury of spending the time and money on law school because I’m single. You might not. If you go full time, you probably won’t work (other than as a law clerk) and won’t generate any income for your family. It will be stressful. Not everybody is lucky enough to have a job that is profitable and tons of fun. I enjoy some parts of being a lawyer more than others. Either way, I know that I will always be able to make a living because I have a law license.

Best of luck to you,

pabloesqobar

[jficquette]

bjensen,

You might want to consider seeing an Industrial Psychologist who can evaluate what you would be the happiest doing.

It will cost a few hundred dollars but at least you will find out where your comfort level is using an objective test and an inteview.

This web site should give you some leads on who to go to here in SoCal.

http://www.cpapsych.org/displaycommon.cfm?an=1&subarticlenbr=4

This site gives a Myers-Briggs profile which you may find somewhat helpful.

http://www.humanmetrics.com/cgi-win/JTypes2.asp

John

[scaredyclassic]

is there really a glut of lawyers? I don’t know. I went to law school over 15 years ago and I remember everyone saying there were way too many lawyers back then. i think people always say there’s too many lawyers. i’ve always made a living doing different kinds of legal work. i think most people who want to make a living at it make a living at it.

I think it’s pretty damn interesting generally and I am truly, profoundly grateful to have this profession to practice.

I have no regrets about going to a fancy top 20 law school, incurring 100k in debt (seemed like a lot back int he early 90’s and committing to a life in the law. I love uncertainty, conflict, public speaking, risk, complications, quirky arguments and trying to persuade people, and a lot fo normal people might find these job attributes wearing.

Indeed, lawyers do seem in general to weary of the profession generally. however, you see a lot of old coots who keep at it, and seem to live for it. I dont know that a wife and kid would make you “non-competitive” in school. A lot of performance on law school exams was hard work coupled with at least an equal amount of raw skill at doing law tests. you’ll see when you get into it, but you can work your butt off 7 days a week studying and if you’re not good at law exams, you will not do well. C

onversely, you could do the basic work in the class, not kill yourself, and if you ahve a natural fluency with legal analysis and writing, you can kick ass on law exams. it’s just life. Some people play basketbal well, some do law school well. Hard work helps and is necessary, but pasta certain amount, you are just spining your wheels. a smart guy will not be held back by a wife and a kid.

I actually did take a fancy Johnson-O’Connor aptitude test, several days of expensive aptitude testing, in high school to figure out what i was suited for. They said I should be a lawyer. i ignored their advice and waited till i was 30 to go to law school. They were right.

Drink Heavily.

[bjensen]

Unfortunately, unless I change religions, drinking heavily is out of the question! 🙂

I am glad to hear from an attorney that there is a question in his mind about the oft heard glut of lawyers.

It seems like the generally accepted paradigm.

I have been daydreaming about law for the last 8 years but have ignored the urge to go to school because I have been told by people like Loyola2L on the blogs and the WSJ that there is no future in it.

Like I said, I’m just glad to hear a practitioner question validity of the claim.

I seem to think of my wife and baby as good motivation to excel in school. While some kids are 22,out partying, and not real sure why they ever went to law school, I will be trying my best to get ahead. I just hope the wife will be as supportive as she says she will be being a “single mom.”

[bjensen]

Unfortunately, unless I change religions, drinking heavily is out of the question! 🙂

I am glad to hear from an attorney that there is a question in his mind about the oft heard glut of lawyers.

It seems like the generally accepted paradigm.

I have been daydreaming about law for the last 8 years but have ignored the urge to go to school because I have been told by people like Loyola2L on the blogs and the WSJ that there is no future in it.

Like I said, I’m just glad to hear a practitioner question validity of the claim.

I seem to think of my wife and baby as good motivation to excel in school. While some kids are 22,out partying, and not real sure why they ever went to law school, I will be trying my best to get ahead. I just hope the wife will be as supportive as she says she will be being a “single mom.”

[bjensen]

Unfortunately, unless I change religions, drinking heavily is out of the question! 🙂

I am glad to hear from an attorney that there is a question in his mind about the oft heard glut of lawyers.

It seems like the generally accepted paradigm.

I have been daydreaming about law for the last 8 years but have ignored the urge to go to school because I have been told by people like Loyola2L on the blogs and the WSJ that there is no future in it.

Like I said, I’m just glad to hear a practitioner question validity of the claim.

I seem to think of my wife and baby as good motivation to excel in school. While some kids are 22,out partying, and not real sure why they ever went to law school, I will be trying my best to get ahead. I just hope the wife will be as supportive as she says she will be being a “single mom.”

[bjensen]

Unfortunately, unless I change religions, drinking heavily is out of the question! 🙂

I am glad to hear from an attorney that there is a question in his mind about the oft heard glut of lawyers.

It seems like the generally accepted paradigm.

I have been daydreaming about law for the last 8 years but have ignored the urge to go to school because I have been told by people like Loyola2L on the blogs and the WSJ that there is no future in it.

Like I said, I’m just glad to hear a practitioner question validity of the claim.

I seem to think of my wife and baby as good motivation to excel in school. While some kids are 22,out partying, and not real sure why they ever went to law school, I will be trying my best to get ahead. I just hope the wife will be as supportive as she says she will be being a “single mom.”

[bjensen]

Unfortunately, unless I change religions, drinking heavily is out of the question! 🙂

I am glad to hear from an attorney that there is a question in his mind about the oft heard glut of lawyers.

It seems like the generally accepted paradigm.

I have been daydreaming about law for the last 8 years but have ignored the urge to go to school because I have been told by people like Loyola2L on the blogs and the WSJ that there is no future in it.

Like I said, I’m just glad to hear a practitioner question validity of the claim.

I seem to think of my wife and baby as good motivation to excel in school. While some kids are 22,out partying, and not real sure why they ever went to law school, I will be trying my best to get ahead. I just hope the wife will be as supportive as she says she will be being a “single mom.”

[scaredyclassic]

is there really a glut of lawyers? I don’t know. I went to law school over 15 years ago and I remember everyone saying there were way too many lawyers back then. i think people always say there’s too many lawyers. i’ve always made a living doing different kinds of legal work. i think most people who want to make a living at it make a living at it.

I think it’s pretty damn interesting generally and I am truly, profoundly grateful to have this profession to practice.

I have no regrets about going to a fancy top 20 law school, incurring 100k in debt (seemed like a lot back int he early 90’s and committing to a life in the law. I love uncertainty, conflict, public speaking, risk, complications, quirky arguments and trying to persuade people, and a lot fo normal people might find these job attributes wearing.

Indeed, lawyers do seem in general to weary of the profession generally. however, you see a lot of old coots who keep at it, and seem to live for it. I dont know that a wife and kid would make you “non-competitive” in school. A lot of performance on law school exams was hard work coupled with at least an equal amount of raw skill at doing law tests. you’ll see when you get into it, but you can work your butt off 7 days a week studying and if you’re not good at law exams, you will not do well. C

onversely, you could do the basic work in the class, not kill yourself, and if you ahve a natural fluency with legal analysis and writing, you can kick ass on law exams. it’s just life. Some people play basketbal well, some do law school well. Hard work helps and is necessary, but pasta certain amount, you are just spining your wheels. a smart guy will not be held back by a wife and a kid.

I actually did take a fancy Johnson-O’Connor aptitude test, several days of expensive aptitude testing, in high school to figure out what i was suited for. They said I should be a lawyer. i ignored their advice and waited till i was 30 to go to law school. They were right.

Drink Heavily.

[scaredyclassic]

is there really a glut of lawyers? I don’t know. I went to law school over 15 years ago and I remember everyone saying there were way too many lawyers back then. i think people always say there’s too many lawyers. i’ve always made a living doing different kinds of legal work. i think most people who want to make a living at it make a living at it.

I think it’s pretty damn interesting generally and I am truly, profoundly grateful to have this profession to practice.

I have no regrets about going to a fancy top 20 law school, incurring 100k in debt (seemed like a lot back int he early 90’s and committing to a life in the law. I love uncertainty, conflict, public speaking, risk, complications, quirky arguments and trying to persuade people, and a lot fo normal people might find these job attributes wearing.

Indeed, lawyers do seem in general to weary of the profession generally. however, you see a lot of old coots who keep at it, and seem to live for it. I dont know that a wife and kid would make you “non-competitive” in school. A lot of performance on law school exams was hard work coupled with at least an equal amount of raw skill at doing law tests. you’ll see when you get into it, but you can work your butt off 7 days a week studying and if you’re not good at law exams, you will not do well. C

onversely, you could do the basic work in the class, not kill yourself, and if you ahve a natural fluency with legal analysis and writing, you can kick ass on law exams. it’s just life. Some people play basketbal well, some do law school well. Hard work helps and is necessary, but pasta certain amount, you are just spining your wheels. a smart guy will not be held back by a wife and a kid.

I actually did take a fancy Johnson-O’Connor aptitude test, several days of expensive aptitude testing, in high school to figure out what i was suited for. They said I should be a lawyer. i ignored their advice and waited till i was 30 to go to law school. They were right.

Drink Heavily.

[scaredyclassic]

is there really a glut of lawyers? I don’t know. I went to law school over 15 years ago and I remember everyone saying there were way too many lawyers back then. i think people always say there’s too many lawyers. i’ve always made a living doing different kinds of legal work. i think most people who want to make a living at it make a living at it.

I think it’s pretty damn interesting generally and I am truly, profoundly grateful to have this profession to practice.

I have no regrets about going to a fancy top 20 law school, incurring 100k in debt (seemed like a lot back int he early 90’s and committing to a life in the law. I love uncertainty, conflict, public speaking, risk, complications, quirky arguments and trying to persuade people, and a lot fo normal people might find these job attributes wearing.

Indeed, lawyers do seem in general to weary of the profession generally. however, you see a lot of old coots who keep at it, and seem to live for it. I dont know that a wife and kid would make you “non-competitive” in school. A lot of performance on law school exams was hard work coupled with at least an equal amount of raw skill at doing law tests. you’ll see when you get into it, but you can work your butt off 7 days a week studying and if you’re not good at law exams, you will not do well. C

onversely, you could do the basic work in the class, not kill yourself, and if you ahve a natural fluency with legal analysis and writing, you can kick ass on law exams. it’s just life. Some people play basketbal well, some do law school well. Hard work helps and is necessary, but pasta certain amount, you are just spining your wheels. a smart guy will not be held back by a wife and a kid.

I actually did take a fancy Johnson-O’Connor aptitude test, several days of expensive aptitude testing, in high school to figure out what i was suited for. They said I should be a lawyer. i ignored their advice and waited till i was 30 to go to law school. They were right.

Drink Heavily.

[scaredyclassic]

is there really a glut of lawyers? I don’t know. I went to law school over 15 years ago and I remember everyone saying there were way too many lawyers back then. i think people always say there’s too many lawyers. i’ve always made a living doing different kinds of legal work. i think most people who want to make a living at it make a living at it.

I think it’s pretty damn interesting generally and I am truly, profoundly grateful to have this profession to practice.

I have no regrets about going to a fancy top 20 law school, incurring 100k in debt (seemed like a lot back int he early 90’s and committing to a life in the law. I love uncertainty, conflict, public speaking, risk, complications, quirky arguments and trying to persuade people, and a lot fo normal people might find these job attributes wearing.

Indeed, lawyers do seem in general to weary of the profession generally. however, you see a lot of old coots who keep at it, and seem to live for it. I dont know that a wife and kid would make you “non-competitive” in school. A lot of performance on law school exams was hard work coupled with at least an equal amount of raw skill at doing law tests. you’ll see when you get into it, but you can work your butt off 7 days a week studying and if you’re not good at law exams, you will not do well. C

onversely, you could do the basic work in the class, not kill yourself, and if you ahve a natural fluency with legal analysis and writing, you can kick ass on law exams. it’s just life. Some people play basketbal well, some do law school well. Hard work helps and is necessary, but pasta certain amount, you are just spining your wheels. a smart guy will not be held back by a wife and a kid.

I actually did take a fancy Johnson-O’Connor aptitude test, several days of expensive aptitude testing, in high school to figure out what i was suited for. They said I should be a lawyer. i ignored their advice and waited till i was 30 to go to law school. They were right.

Drink Heavily.

[jficquette]

bjensen,

You might want to consider seeing an Industrial Psychologist who can evaluate what you would be the happiest doing.

It will cost a few hundred dollars but at least you will find out where your comfort level is using an objective test and an inteview.

This web site should give you some leads on who to go to here in SoCal.

http://www.cpapsych.org/displaycommon.cfm?an=1&subarticlenbr=4

This site gives a Myers-Briggs profile which you may find somewhat helpful.

http://www.humanmetrics.com/cgi-win/JTypes2.asp

John

[jficquette]

bjensen,

You might want to consider seeing an Industrial Psychologist who can evaluate what you would be the happiest doing.

It will cost a few hundred dollars but at least you will find out where your comfort level is using an objective test and an inteview.

This web site should give you some leads on who to go to here in SoCal.

http://www.cpapsych.org/displaycommon.cfm?an=1&subarticlenbr=4

This site gives a Myers-Briggs profile which you may find somewhat helpful.

http://www.humanmetrics.com/cgi-win/JTypes2.asp

John

[jficquette]

bjensen,

You might want to consider seeing an Industrial Psychologist who can evaluate what you would be the happiest doing.

It will cost a few hundred dollars but at least you will find out where your comfort level is using an objective test and an inteview.

This web site should give you some leads on who to go to here in SoCal.

http://www.cpapsych.org/displaycommon.cfm?an=1&subarticlenbr=4

This site gives a Myers-Briggs profile which you may find somewhat helpful.

http://www.humanmetrics.com/cgi-win/JTypes2.asp

John

[jficquette]

bjensen,

You might want to consider seeing an Industrial Psychologist who can evaluate what you would be the happiest doing.

It will cost a few hundred dollars but at least you will find out where your comfort level is using an objective test and an inteview.

This web site should give you some leads on who to go to here in SoCal.

http://www.cpapsych.org/displaycommon.cfm?an=1&subarticlenbr=4

This site gives a Myers-Briggs profile which you may find somewhat helpful.

http://www.humanmetrics.com/cgi-win/JTypes2.asp

John

[Author]

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