Better watch out for those crazy veterans, way OT

[afx114]

Who said anything about repealing the 2nd Amendment? It seems to me that the right, as always, continues to stroke the fears of its constituents by constructing straw men to scare them into line. We’ve seen it time and again. “The gays are going to ruin your marriage.” “The Mexicans are going to take over the country.” “The lefty commies are going to take your guns.”

Are any of these really true? I’ve never quite understood how the supposed tough guy bravado of the right is always so quickly dissolved into a whimpering ball of fear. Really, you’re afraid of gay Mexican communists? That’s so tough.

No sane person disputes the right to bear arms. The question is: which type of arms fall under the 2nd Amendment?. Where does one draw the line? Should the average citizen be allowed to have a pistol or shotgun? Most people would say sure. An M16? Well, maybe. How about some RPGs or maybe mortars? Most people will probably be opposed to that. Does the average citizen have the right to bear nuclear weapons? 99.99% would say no.

We need to move this discussion away from the simpleton black & white “guns vs no guns” pissing match towards a national dialogue on what type of weaponry falls under the 2nd Amendment. Sure there will be extremists on both sides, but the smart move is to find somewhere in the middle where we can all agree. I am certainly not an expert on this subject, so I enjoy hearing different points of view from both sides. We just need to stay away from the extreme positions and try to have an educated discussion.

[Allan from Fallbrook]

Afx: Make it simple. Owning guns is analogous to owning cars. Does someone need a Ferrari Enzo? Nope. Hard to make that argument, especially given that an Enzo can go 180mph and the max speed limit is generally 70mph. Should we then outlaw Ferrari Enzos? Nope.

Why? Because if someone owns an Enzo and behaves responsibly, it’s a non-issue.

I’m personally not big on owning fully automatic weapons, but some people are. If they own them and behave responsibly, end of story.

Where I have a problem is the government’s use of hysterical MSM stories about the evils of guns to “create” a mandate for restricting gun ownership. If someone wants an M-16 and uses it responsibly, then it’s none of the government’s business. Period.

You don’t see the government outlawing cars because drunk drivers kill people whilst behind the wheel, do you? Nope. They hold the individual drunk drivers accountable for their actions and punish them accordingly. Similarly, if someone uses a gun in the commission of a crime, punish the gun owner accordingly. Don’t bootstrap that crime up into a “mandate” for taking guns away from the rest of us.

Speaking of mortars: I knew a guy when I was a kid who had painstakingly restored a French 75mm field gun. He would bring it out on Saturdays to this open field and folks would bring out old appliances, like refrigerators, and he would blow them up for a small donation. It was very cool. He did this for years, before zoning and old age finally put him out of business, and there was never a single accident or injury. Go figure.

[Allan from Fallbrook]

Afx: Make it simple. Owning guns is analogous to owning cars. Does someone need a Ferrari Enzo? Nope. Hard to make that argument, especially given that an Enzo can go 180mph and the max speed limit is generally 70mph. Should we then outlaw Ferrari Enzos? Nope.

Why? Because if someone owns an Enzo and behaves responsibly, it’s a non-issue.

I’m personally not big on owning fully automatic weapons, but some people are. If they own them and behave responsibly, end of story.

Where I have a problem is the government’s use of hysterical MSM stories about the evils of guns to “create” a mandate for restricting gun ownership. If someone wants an M-16 and uses it responsibly, then it’s none of the government’s business. Period.

You don’t see the government outlawing cars because drunk drivers kill people whilst behind the wheel, do you? Nope. They hold the individual drunk drivers accountable for their actions and punish them accordingly. Similarly, if someone uses a gun in the commission of a crime, punish the gun owner accordingly. Don’t bootstrap that crime up into a “mandate” for taking guns away from the rest of us.

Speaking of mortars: I knew a guy when I was a kid who had painstakingly restored a French 75mm field gun. He would bring it out on Saturdays to this open field and folks would bring out old appliances, like refrigerators, and he would blow them up for a small donation. It was very cool. He did this for years, before zoning and old age finally put him out of business, and there was never a single accident or injury. Go figure.

[Allan from Fallbrook]

Afx: Make it simple. Owning guns is analogous to owning cars. Does someone need a Ferrari Enzo? Nope. Hard to make that argument, especially given that an Enzo can go 180mph and the max speed limit is generally 70mph. Should we then outlaw Ferrari Enzos? Nope.

Why? Because if someone owns an Enzo and behaves responsibly, it’s a non-issue.

I’m personally not big on owning fully automatic weapons, but some people are. If they own them and behave responsibly, end of story.

Where I have a problem is the government’s use of hysterical MSM stories about the evils of guns to “create” a mandate for restricting gun ownership. If someone wants an M-16 and uses it responsibly, then it’s none of the government’s business. Period.

You don’t see the government outlawing cars because drunk drivers kill people whilst behind the wheel, do you? Nope. They hold the individual drunk drivers accountable for their actions and punish them accordingly. Similarly, if someone uses a gun in the commission of a crime, punish the gun owner accordingly. Don’t bootstrap that crime up into a “mandate” for taking guns away from the rest of us.

Speaking of mortars: I knew a guy when I was a kid who had painstakingly restored a French 75mm field gun. He would bring it out on Saturdays to this open field and folks would bring out old appliances, like refrigerators, and he would blow them up for a small donation. It was very cool. He did this for years, before zoning and old age finally put him out of business, and there was never a single accident or injury. Go figure.

[Allan from Fallbrook]

Afx: Make it simple. Owning guns is analogous to owning cars. Does someone need a Ferrari Enzo? Nope. Hard to make that argument, especially given that an Enzo can go 180mph and the max speed limit is generally 70mph. Should we then outlaw Ferrari Enzos? Nope.

Why? Because if someone owns an Enzo and behaves responsibly, it’s a non-issue.

I’m personally not big on owning fully automatic weapons, but some people are. If they own them and behave responsibly, end of story.

Where I have a problem is the government’s use of hysterical MSM stories about the evils of guns to “create” a mandate for restricting gun ownership. If someone wants an M-16 and uses it responsibly, then it’s none of the government’s business. Period.

You don’t see the government outlawing cars because drunk drivers kill people whilst behind the wheel, do you? Nope. They hold the individual drunk drivers accountable for their actions and punish them accordingly. Similarly, if someone uses a gun in the commission of a crime, punish the gun owner accordingly. Don’t bootstrap that crime up into a “mandate” for taking guns away from the rest of us.

Speaking of mortars: I knew a guy when I was a kid who had painstakingly restored a French 75mm field gun. He would bring it out on Saturdays to this open field and folks would bring out old appliances, like refrigerators, and he would blow them up for a small donation. It was very cool. He did this for years, before zoning and old age finally put him out of business, and there was never a single accident or injury. Go figure.

[Allan from Fallbrook]

Afx: Make it simple. Owning guns is analogous to owning cars. Does someone need a Ferrari Enzo? Nope. Hard to make that argument, especially given that an Enzo can go 180mph and the max speed limit is generally 70mph. Should we then outlaw Ferrari Enzos? Nope.

Why? Because if someone owns an Enzo and behaves responsibly, it’s a non-issue.

I’m personally not big on owning fully automatic weapons, but some people are. If they own them and behave responsibly, end of story.

Where I have a problem is the government’s use of hysterical MSM stories about the evils of guns to “create” a mandate for restricting gun ownership. If someone wants an M-16 and uses it responsibly, then it’s none of the government’s business. Period.

You don’t see the government outlawing cars because drunk drivers kill people whilst behind the wheel, do you? Nope. They hold the individual drunk drivers accountable for their actions and punish them accordingly. Similarly, if someone uses a gun in the commission of a crime, punish the gun owner accordingly. Don’t bootstrap that crime up into a “mandate” for taking guns away from the rest of us.

Speaking of mortars: I knew a guy when I was a kid who had painstakingly restored a French 75mm field gun. He would bring it out on Saturdays to this open field and folks would bring out old appliances, like refrigerators, and he would blow them up for a small donation. It was very cool. He did this for years, before zoning and old age finally put him out of business, and there was never a single accident or injury. Go figure.

[Zeitgeist]

Allan, thank you for your service. Question for the libs on Piggington:

“The Black Panther Party Patrols the Streets
In order to help end police brutality, the party advocated carrying guns for self-defense. At the time, under California law it was legal to carry guns if not concealed. The Panthers also took on various responsibilities in the community. Wearing black leather jackets, blue shirts, black pants, and black berets, they patrolled the neighborhoods carrying weapons, recorders, law books, and taught black history, counseled welfare recipients, and protested rent evictions.”

http://afroamhistory.about.com/od/blackpanthers/a/blackpanthers_2.htm
So how about these guys. Can they support the 2nd Amendment? In other words, are you afraid of them or just the right wingers scaredy?

[Zeitgeist]

Allan, thank you for your service. Question for the libs on Piggington:

“The Black Panther Party Patrols the Streets
In order to help end police brutality, the party advocated carrying guns for self-defense. At the time, under California law it was legal to carry guns if not concealed. The Panthers also took on various responsibilities in the community. Wearing black leather jackets, blue shirts, black pants, and black berets, they patrolled the neighborhoods carrying weapons, recorders, law books, and taught black history, counseled welfare recipients, and protested rent evictions.”

http://afroamhistory.about.com/od/blackpanthers/a/blackpanthers_2.htm
So how about these guys. Can they support the 2nd Amendment? In other words, are you afraid of them or just the right wingers scaredy?

[Zeitgeist]

Allan, thank you for your service. Question for the libs on Piggington:

“The Black Panther Party Patrols the Streets
In order to help end police brutality, the party advocated carrying guns for self-defense. At the time, under California law it was legal to carry guns if not concealed. The Panthers also took on various responsibilities in the community. Wearing black leather jackets, blue shirts, black pants, and black berets, they patrolled the neighborhoods carrying weapons, recorders, law books, and taught black history, counseled welfare recipients, and protested rent evictions.”

http://afroamhistory.about.com/od/blackpanthers/a/blackpanthers_2.htm
So how about these guys. Can they support the 2nd Amendment? In other words, are you afraid of them or just the right wingers scaredy?

[Zeitgeist]

Allan, thank you for your service. Question for the libs on Piggington:

“The Black Panther Party Patrols the Streets
In order to help end police brutality, the party advocated carrying guns for self-defense. At the time, under California law it was legal to carry guns if not concealed. The Panthers also took on various responsibilities in the community. Wearing black leather jackets, blue shirts, black pants, and black berets, they patrolled the neighborhoods carrying weapons, recorders, law books, and taught black history, counseled welfare recipients, and protested rent evictions.”

http://afroamhistory.about.com/od/blackpanthers/a/blackpanthers_2.htm
So how about these guys. Can they support the 2nd Amendment? In other words, are you afraid of them or just the right wingers scaredy?

[Zeitgeist]

Allan, thank you for your service. Question for the libs on Piggington:

“The Black Panther Party Patrols the Streets
In order to help end police brutality, the party advocated carrying guns for self-defense. At the time, under California law it was legal to carry guns if not concealed. The Panthers also took on various responsibilities in the community. Wearing black leather jackets, blue shirts, black pants, and black berets, they patrolled the neighborhoods carrying weapons, recorders, law books, and taught black history, counseled welfare recipients, and protested rent evictions.”

http://afroamhistory.about.com/od/blackpanthers/a/blackpanthers_2.htm
So how about these guys. Can they support the 2nd Amendment? In other words, are you afraid of them or just the right wingers scaredy?

[Allan from Fallbrook]

Zeitgeist: http://www.slate.com/id/2171745/

Story by Chris Hitchens on Your Black Muslim Baker fiasco in Oakland. Note utter silence from Rep. Barbara Lee and Oakland Mayor Ron Dellums on this particular subject.

If it’s one of the Left’s little favorites, nothing will be said or done, even when it involves guns and murder (along with kidnapping and extortion).

Rep. Barbara Lee is one of California’s leading Leftist hypocrites, in that she constantly decries gun violence, but turns a conveniently blind eye to gun violence perpetrated by Leftist “poster children” like YBMB (or the Panthers, another famous Bay Area “institution”).

Leftists like Robert Scheer and Tom Hayden were agog with the Panthers back in the day, but forgot to mention the fact that the Panthers were a murderous organization, especially when it came to police and authority figures.

It’s an absolute double standard and it dates back to the 1960s and 1970s, when Leftists lamented US policy, but were total apologists for the Soviet Union, Castro and Pol Pot. Noam Chomsky, that literary light of the left, who excoriated the US for its policies in Central America (and rightfully so), but was curiously silent about the North Vietnamese Communists (after 1975), the Khmers Rouge and Fidel’s repression of Cuban dissidents and intellectuals.

[Allan from Fallbrook]

Zeitgeist: http://www.slate.com/id/2171745/

Story by Chris Hitchens on Your Black Muslim Baker fiasco in Oakland. Note utter silence from Rep. Barbara Lee and Oakland Mayor Ron Dellums on this particular subject.

If it’s one of the Left’s little favorites, nothing will be said or done, even when it involves guns and murder (along with kidnapping and extortion).

Rep. Barbara Lee is one of California’s leading Leftist hypocrites, in that she constantly decries gun violence, but turns a conveniently blind eye to gun violence perpetrated by Leftist “poster children” like YBMB (or the Panthers, another famous Bay Area “institution”).

Leftists like Robert Scheer and Tom Hayden were agog with the Panthers back in the day, but forgot to mention the fact that the Panthers were a murderous organization, especially when it came to police and authority figures.

It’s an absolute double standard and it dates back to the 1960s and 1970s, when Leftists lamented US policy, but were total apologists for the Soviet Union, Castro and Pol Pot. Noam Chomsky, that literary light of the left, who excoriated the US for its policies in Central America (and rightfully so), but was curiously silent about the North Vietnamese Communists (after 1975), the Khmers Rouge and Fidel’s repression of Cuban dissidents and intellectuals.

[Allan from Fallbrook]

Zeitgeist: http://www.slate.com/id/2171745/

Story by Chris Hitchens on Your Black Muslim Baker fiasco in Oakland. Note utter silence from Rep. Barbara Lee and Oakland Mayor Ron Dellums on this particular subject.

If it’s one of the Left’s little favorites, nothing will be said or done, even when it involves guns and murder (along with kidnapping and extortion).

Rep. Barbara Lee is one of California’s leading Leftist hypocrites, in that she constantly decries gun violence, but turns a conveniently blind eye to gun violence perpetrated by Leftist “poster children” like YBMB (or the Panthers, another famous Bay Area “institution”).

Leftists like Robert Scheer and Tom Hayden were agog with the Panthers back in the day, but forgot to mention the fact that the Panthers were a murderous organization, especially when it came to police and authority figures.

It’s an absolute double standard and it dates back to the 1960s and 1970s, when Leftists lamented US policy, but were total apologists for the Soviet Union, Castro and Pol Pot. Noam Chomsky, that literary light of the left, who excoriated the US for its policies in Central America (and rightfully so), but was curiously silent about the North Vietnamese Communists (after 1975), the Khmers Rouge and Fidel’s repression of Cuban dissidents and intellectuals.

[Allan from Fallbrook]

Zeitgeist: http://www.slate.com/id/2171745/

Story by Chris Hitchens on Your Black Muslim Baker fiasco in Oakland. Note utter silence from Rep. Barbara Lee and Oakland Mayor Ron Dellums on this particular subject.

If it’s one of the Left’s little favorites, nothing will be said or done, even when it involves guns and murder (along with kidnapping and extortion).

Rep. Barbara Lee is one of California’s leading Leftist hypocrites, in that she constantly decries gun violence, but turns a conveniently blind eye to gun violence perpetrated by Leftist “poster children” like YBMB (or the Panthers, another famous Bay Area “institution”).

Leftists like Robert Scheer and Tom Hayden were agog with the Panthers back in the day, but forgot to mention the fact that the Panthers were a murderous organization, especially when it came to police and authority figures.

It’s an absolute double standard and it dates back to the 1960s and 1970s, when Leftists lamented US policy, but were total apologists for the Soviet Union, Castro and Pol Pot. Noam Chomsky, that literary light of the left, who excoriated the US for its policies in Central America (and rightfully so), but was curiously silent about the North Vietnamese Communists (after 1975), the Khmers Rouge and Fidel’s repression of Cuban dissidents and intellectuals.

[Author]

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