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[sdrealtor]

Talking about broken records. Or is that record broken? So you have poorly preforming gold that’s tracked inflation and the baseball cards you bought in the 70s. Your track record Is stunning Larry

[an]

[quote=deadzone]There is no way stock market crashes without taking RE market with it, and vice versa. Both bubbles were fueled by the same source.[/quote]
History says it’s very possible. Look at the DOW between 76-82 and see what RE price was between those 6 years. Same goes for 99-2003.

[Anonymous]

[quote=an][quote=deadzone]There is no way stock market crashes without taking RE market with it, and vice versa. Both bubbles were fueled by the same source.[/quote]
History says it’s very possible. Look at the DOW between 76-82 and see what RE price was between those 6 years. Same goes for 99-2003.[/quote]

We shall see. But again, those periods were not fueled by 10+ years of continual massive Fed money printing.

[Anonymous]

[quote=sdrealtor]Talking about broken records. Or is that record broken? So you have poorly preforming gold that’s tracked inflation and the baseball cards you bought in the 70s. Your track record Is stunning Larry[/quote]

Actually I bought most of my vintage cards in 2012/13, mid life crisis thing. So many of those cards have appreciated 4 to 5 times by this point.
Still feeling good about my gold.

[sdrealtor]

[quote=deadzone][quote=sdrealtor]Talking about broken records. Or is that record broken? So you have poorly preforming gold that’s tracked inflation and the baseball cards you bought in the 70s. Your track record Is stunning Larry[/quote]

Actually I bought most of my vintage cards in 2012/13, mid life crisis thing. So many of those cards have appreciated 4 to 5 times by this point.
Still feeling good about my gold.[/quote]

I paid a quarter for mine. A quarter per pack but I really bought them for the gum

Might be time to sell that Alcindor RC

[Coronita]

Gold is pretty. I like the bling bling.
I might melt mine to make jewelry… 🙂

[Anonymous]

[quote=sdrealtor][quote=deadzone][quote=sdrealtor]Talking about broken records. Or is that record broken? So you have poorly preforming gold that’s tracked inflation and the baseball cards you bought in the 70s. Your track record Is stunning Larry[/quote]

Actually I bought most of my vintage cards in 2012/13, mid life crisis thing. So many of those cards have appreciated 4 to 5 times by this point.
Still feeling good about my gold.[/quote]

I paid a quarter for mine. A quarter per pack but I really bought them for the gum

Might be time to sell that Alcindor RC[/quote]

Well if you aren’t attached to it, now would be the time to sell it. But that is a pretty sweet card and great nostalgia so of course you obviously shouldn’t and won’t. I am far too young to have collected in the 50s and 60s, but I love that era of cards.

[Anonymous]

[quote=Coronita]Gold is pretty. I like the bling bling.
I might melt mine to make jewelry… :)[/quote]

If you want gold jewelry I’m your guy. Will offer you the piggington discount (wholesale price)

[Coronita]

[quote=deadzone][quote=Coronita]Gold is pretty. I like the bling bling.
I might melt mine to make jewelry… :)[/quote]

If you want gold jewelry I’m your guy. Will offer you the piggington discount (wholesale price)[/quote]

I like 1 kilo gold bars. If only there was a way to easily tell if they were real or fake and not filled in the center with tungsten…

Most gold jewelry these days are worthless and only 14k gold… Years ago, 18k gold was more acceptable for jewelry…Gold jewelry from the far east (before the communist overran china) use to close to 24k. But 24k jewelry can’t really be worn. It’s too soft, easily damaged because it’s too soft. That was one of the reasons why 18k because popular for jewelry. You won’t find much left in 24k these days. Not interested in today’s 14k gold jewelry.

Come to think about it, I don’t wear any accessories. No, rings, no necklace, no watch. Nothing.

I think a gold plated gun would be cool.. Like one from Face Off.

[sdrealtor]

[quote=deadzone][quote=sdrealtor][quote=deadzone][quote=sdrealtor]Talking about broken records. Or is that record broken? So you have poorly preforming gold that’s tracked inflation and the baseball cards you bought in the 70s. Your track record Is stunning Larry[/quote]

Actually I bought most of my vintage cards in 2012/13, mid life crisis thing. So many of those cards have appreciated 4 to 5 times by this point.
Still feeling good about my gold.[/quote]

I paid a quarter for mine. A quarter per pack but I really bought them for the gum

Might be time to sell that Alcindor RC[/quote]

Well if you aren’t attached to it, now would be the time to sell it. But that is a pretty sweet card and great nostalgia so of course you obviously shouldn’t and won’t. I am far too young to have collected in the 50s and 60s, but I love that era of cards.[/quote]

I’m not attached to anything besides my kids, my home and my wine

[Anonymous]

Why do you say 14K gold jewelry is worthless? It is worth basically its equivalent weight in gold in proportion to 18K. Can you tell the difference looking at it?
Nowadays with the high price of gold, 10K jewelry is quite common.

[Coronita]

[quote=deadzone]Why do you say 14K gold jewelry is worthless? It is worth basically its equivalent weight in gold in proportion to 18K. Can you tell the difference looking at it?
Nowadays with the high price of gold, 10K jewelry is quite common.[/quote]

I’m not a jewelry expert, so I don’t claim to be…But, to me 14k or 10k gold isn’t worthless. It’s just worth less….a lot less…

I think most 14k jewelry are lousy “investment grade jewelry” because it’s meant to be affordable for the average person and meant to look pretty…But it’s marked up significantly above how much gold content is in it. If you want to resell it, it’s worth about how much gold content is in there, which is a lot less than most originally bought it for. Not in all cases, but in a lot of cases… When jewelry is bought back, often times it’s melted down for gold content only. At least that’s what one of my friends who owns a jewelry retail store that buys back gold jewelry says. The top dollars she pays is usually the old pieces that come from asia that are 18k and 24k…but again they are mostly melted down.

I think “investment grade” jewelry here in the west are not 10k or 14k gold, they are at least 18k and they are usually associated with a brand or celebrity or both to be worth more than the gold content. You won’t find many in that category that are 10k or 14k…And I think if you try to resell them, you’ll find out what I’m saying, probably.

That’s not to say one shouldn’t buy 14k gold pieces for a significant other. They are pretty, and there is a non-financial benefit of jewelry for significant other. But imho, calling it an good “investment” in most cases is a far stretch, especially if you are buying them from retail stores brand new. You might be able to arbitrage them if you buy something from someone, and that someone doesn’t know what it’s really worth, and you do. No different than going to garage sale and finding an painting that’s worth a lot that the seller didn’t know about. But again, I’m not a jewelry expert and don’t like that sort of wild speculation/gambling…

That’s why when it comes to gold, I just prefer the real thing…Bullion. because the markup from the gold content is as low as it’s going to get. Gold coins at times can be purchased at $10-15/ounce above spot prices and sold $10-15/ounce below spot prices. Actually for awhile, when one bought gold over a verified trusted gold dealer over eBay, you could actually get gold below spot because for awhile eBay included coin purchases as part of their eBay bucks rebate program…They did that until a lot of people like took advantage of that, and then they started to exclude bullion purchases…It was great because you bought gold $10-15 above spot, your ebay buck reward would rebate you back $100 per coin purchase up to 4 coins per quarter, and your Visa card would rebate you back 1% for purchases….

Some people collect rare coins, and those coins have value beyond the metal content. That works too. But, I don’t do that. I just prefer to keep it simple…

[Anonymous]

I see where you are coming from. Jewelry as a collectible would be more desirable and is quite rarer in more than 14K. And unless you own a retail jewelry store you can’t benefit from the large markups that you get from selling 10K and 14K pieces

But from a pure gold melted down value point of view, there is no difference in price (in theory). In other words, an 18K bar is worth the same proportional value 18/24 of the spot gold price as 14K (14/24). But since 18K bars are probably not very common, there may be a slight additional markup but it wouldn’t be much.

[Coronita]

[quote=deadzone]I see where you are coming from. Jewelry as a collectible would be more desirable and is quite rarer in more than 14K. And unless you own a retail jewelry store you can’t benefit from the large markups that you get from selling 10K and 14K pieces

But from a pure gold melted down value point of view, there is no difference in price (in theory). In other words, an 18K bar is worth the same proportional value 18/24 of the spot gold price as 14K (14/24). But since 18K bars are probably not very common, there may be a slight additional markup but it wouldn’t be much.[/quote]

In theory, yes… but in practice, from you, the retail buyer of jewelry…. how do know how much gold is really in the jewelry and that it’s actually 14k or 10k, and not less? Many retail jewelry pieces don’t actually state the total weight of the gold part, especially cosmetic/affordanble/non-investment grade jewelry. How do you properly evaluate of the total retail price you pay for a piece of jewelry, the percentage of it is for the gold content, and the rest just a markup for the aesthetics?

Because in many cases, the markup for the non-gold content is significantly more than the price of the gold content, and if the worth of the consumer grade jewelry selling back is only the gold’s meltdown value, you’re going to lose the value from the piece’s aesthetic. For example, if you buy a necklace with that has gold and other decorations on it, and they don’t give you a total weight of the gold content, you might end up spending say 50% for the gold content and 50% for everything else. Melt value might only be for the gold content, which is worth only 50% of the total price of the piece…so just to come out even (non-inflation adjusted), gold prices would have to double from the time you purchased the original piece. That’s not a good “investment”…

There’s a difference if there’s some collectors value for that jewelry. But most 10k or 14k jewelry is not collectible, since it’s meant for your average consumer as an affordable option.

Also, if you buy jewelry in bulk for “investment”, how do you test for the actual gold content? How do you really know it’s 14k versus say 12k or 10k? with 10k or 14k, weight tests aren’t that accurate by itself..Now, for a consumer jewelry that your spouse/significant other likes, it doesn’t really matter how true is the gold content is and its unlikely you’ll spend the time an money to get it checked out, since it probably isn’t a big deal. You spouse/significant other likes the piece and that’s all there is too it. But from a “investment” perspective, that’s a crappy proposition. Because you won’t really know what you are getting. That uncertainty is “investment risk”…
So from that perspective, I wouldn’t buy a consumer grade jewelry counting on it to appreciate or view it as an “investment” because all those factors. All that matters really is my significant other likes the piece, fake or untrue to the gold content or not.

There are reasons why if one is truly serious about gold bullion investing, one sticks with well know coins or gold bars. Because while it’s not impossible to make them fake,
1) value is pretty clear: 1 ounce of gold…
2) purity of well know coins are well known. Canadian maple leafs are 99.9% pure, whereas american eagles are 91.7% ..But total gold content is still the same…

3) there are a lot of test kits that while isn’t a guarantee, does reduce your changes of getting a fake coin, The fisch test kit is a pretty good test kit. And they are designed to work on the well known gold coins that our popular…

https://www.thefisch.com/

4) the amount of effort to make a fake gold coin that is almost indetectable using tungsten is not worth it versus doing this to a 1 kilo bar. So while it’s possible to make fake 1 ounce coins with tungsten, the effort for just 1 coin isn’t worth it. 1 kilo bars are different, because fakers drill out the center of the 1 kilo bar and fill it up with tungsten, and being the weight and characteristics are close, with a large 1 kilo bar, it’s far easier to fake…

https://globalbullionsuppliers.com/blogs/blog/are-there-gold-bars-filled-with-tungsten-at-major-banks#:~:text=In%20high%2Dend%20counterfeits%2C%20a,coins%20are%20still%20very%20common.

https://www.businessinsider.com/tungsten-filled-gold-bars-found-in-new-york-2012-9

5) If you’re buying 1 ounce bars from reputable places, they usually have some traceable serial number…For instance Valcambi gold bars…

https://www.jmbullion.com/1-oz-valcambi-gold-bar-new-w-assay/

Again, none of this matters as much if you’re spending like $1000-$10k on gold/jewelry/etc, because if things are fake or not up to spec or not properly evaluated, you’re at most out $1000-10k and probably doesn ot materially affect your overall financial situation. But if one is really taking up sizeable “investments” in gold where it makes a material impact on one’s financials (just like every other class of investment), it behooves one to make purchases without the tools to verify authenticity, because not checking for authenticity is a huge risk for your gold “investment”

[Coronita]

Forgot another important reason why consumer gold jewelry is, most of the time, a crappy investment….

6. Sales tax….Almost all consumer jewelry in CA is subject sales tax. That’s 7.75% in SD, and up to 8.25% in other counties. So right off the bat, if you you buy consumer jewelry as an “investment” you lose around 8% in your value if you were to sell it right back.

Gold bullion is NOT subject to sales tax if it’s $1500 or above….That’s why you should always buy at least 1 ounce of gold bullion per transaction. If you buy 1/3 ounce bars, for instance, that’s subject to state sales tax.

You probably already know this DZ if you are serious about precious metal investments, but in case you werent aware…

https://www.jmbullion.com/tax/california/

[quote]
California Gold & Silver Bullion / Collectible State Sales Taxes
Rules and Regulations for the State of California
The State of California requires the collection of use taxes on certain products sold by JM Bullion and delivered to a California address. These taxes must be collected on (1) nonmonetized bullion made from copper, platinum, or palladium; (2) monetized bullion, nonmonetized gold or silver bullion, or numismatic coins if the total amount of a single sales transaction is less than $1,500; (3) accessory items; and (4) processed items. All other products sold by JM Bullion are exempt from these taxes.

The following definitions apply to products on which taxes must be collected in California:

Nonmonetized Bullion. Bullion which has been smelted or refined and has a value dependent primarily upon its precious metal content and not upon its form.
Monetized Bullion. Coins or other forms of money manufactured of gold, silver, or other metal and heretofore, now, or hereafter used as a medium of exchange under the laws of California, the United States, or any foreign nation. The medium of exchange must have had a legal status equivalent to legal tender.
Numismatic Coins. Coins which have an external value above and beyond the base value of the underlying precious metal, due to the item’s rarity, condition, age, or other external factor.
Single Sales Transaction. Determined per invoice, and not on a line-item basis.
Accessory Items. Items such as holders, tubes, coin flips, and apparel.
Processed Items. Precious metals that have been processed by third parties into items that are valued on more than their precious metal content, such as statues or colorized coins.
Use taxes in California are calculated at checkout on the JM Bullion website based on (1) the taxability of products sold by JM Bullion in California set forth above, and (2) the specific tax rates established by the taxing jurisdiction of the delivery address in California.

JM Bullion began collecting use taxes in California on April 1, 2019. Our use tax license number in California is 257602304.

If you are a California-based reseller and wish to file a Reseller Certificate with JM Bullion, please download the California Reseller Certificate form here. Once you have filled out this form, either email it to [email protected]; or mail it to JM Bullion, Inc., 11700 Preston Road, Suite 660153, Dallas, TX 75230. Once we receive your completed Reseller Certificate, we will enter it into our system, and you will not be charged use taxes on future orders as long as your Reseller Certificate remains valid and in force.

PLEASE NOTE: THE ABOVE IS NOT A COMPREHENSIVE DESCRIPTION OF SALES TAX LAWS AND REQUIREMENTS IN THE STATE OF CALIFORNIA. IT IS ONLY INTENDED TO PROVIDE THE READER WITH A BRIEF OVERVIEW OF THOSE SALES TAX LAWS AND REQUIREMENTS CURRENTLY IN EFFECT IN THE STATE OF CALIFORNIA THAT RELATE TO THE READER’S TRANSACTIONS WITH JM BULLION. IF YOU WOULD LIKE TO RESEARCH THE SALES TAX LAWS AND REQUIREMENTS IN THE STATE OF CALIFORNIA, WE SUGGEST YOU VISIT THE CALIFORNIA TAX SERVICE CENTER LOCATED AT https://WWW.TAXES.CA.GOV/.
[/quote]

[Author]

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