[ucodegen]

Since you’ve already asked your dad’s nursing home, what’s their patient to RN ratio?

It was 6 to 8.. (day was probably 6, night was 8). It was a more ‘critical care’ nursing home. I didn’t make sure that I was clear on ‘RN’ vs ‘LVN’ on the question. I also know they had a staffed pharmacy with pharmacologist and pharm tech as well as staff doctors.. no surgeons though.

Scripps has always been a non-profit organization, since its first inception many many years ago. I wonder what’s the # for VA hospital. That might tell you what’s the real market rate. profit vs non-profit vs VA.

That would be interesting.. I used to work at a VA hospital, but not in that category. I was working as an engineer with R&D people in anaesthesiology.

I assume family doctors get paid a lot less then surgeons too.

That is my impression, but these charges are generally not billed as the ‘room’..

[ucodegen]

Since you’ve already asked your dad’s nursing home, what’s their patient to RN ratio?

It was 6 to 8.. (day was probably 6, night was 8). It was a more ‘critical care’ nursing home. I didn’t make sure that I was clear on ‘RN’ vs ‘LVN’ on the question. I also know they had a staffed pharmacy with pharmacologist and pharm tech as well as staff doctors.. no surgeons though.

Scripps has always been a non-profit organization, since its first inception many many years ago. I wonder what’s the # for VA hospital. That might tell you what’s the real market rate. profit vs non-profit vs VA.

That would be interesting.. I used to work at a VA hospital, but not in that category. I was working as an engineer with R&D people in anaesthesiology.

I assume family doctors get paid a lot less then surgeons too.

That is my impression, but these charges are generally not billed as the ‘room’..

[ucodegen]

Since you’ve already asked your dad’s nursing home, what’s their patient to RN ratio?

It was 6 to 8.. (day was probably 6, night was 8). It was a more ‘critical care’ nursing home. I didn’t make sure that I was clear on ‘RN’ vs ‘LVN’ on the question. I also know they had a staffed pharmacy with pharmacologist and pharm tech as well as staff doctors.. no surgeons though.

Scripps has always been a non-profit organization, since its first inception many many years ago. I wonder what’s the # for VA hospital. That might tell you what’s the real market rate. profit vs non-profit vs VA.

That would be interesting.. I used to work at a VA hospital, but not in that category. I was working as an engineer with R&D people in anaesthesiology.

I assume family doctors get paid a lot less then surgeons too.

That is my impression, but these charges are generally not billed as the ‘room’..

[ucodegen]

I looked up average patient to RN ratio for a nursing home and it’s 30 to 1. That’s almost 10x more than the hospital.

Please cite source.. I got my info from asking the nursing home where my father was.

The fact that non-profit and for-profit hospital charge similar fees means either non-profit are hiding their cash somewhere

I suspect the former because their charges are way in excess of what their costs seem to be. It can also be that being owned by a non-profit brands them as a non profit even though they are turning a profit. Somehow.. for not being profitable, they can find a lot of money to build even bigger hospitals. In addition, hospital room charges are way in excess of what hospital room costs are in Universal Health Care countries. Japan charges $10/day (too low).. it was recently on KPBS. Some of the difference may be to changing how support people (RN, LVN) are charged.. that is why I want to see the charge structure because the numbers don’t add up right.

[ucodegen]

I looked up average patient to RN ratio for a nursing home and it’s 30 to 1. That’s almost 10x more than the hospital.

Please cite source.. I got my info from asking the nursing home where my father was.

The fact that non-profit and for-profit hospital charge similar fees means either non-profit are hiding their cash somewhere

I suspect the former because their charges are way in excess of what their costs seem to be. It can also be that being owned by a non-profit brands them as a non profit even though they are turning a profit. Somehow.. for not being profitable, they can find a lot of money to build even bigger hospitals. In addition, hospital room charges are way in excess of what hospital room costs are in Universal Health Care countries. Japan charges $10/day (too low).. it was recently on KPBS. Some of the difference may be to changing how support people (RN, LVN) are charged.. that is why I want to see the charge structure because the numbers don’t add up right.

[ucodegen]

I looked up average patient to RN ratio for a nursing home and it’s 30 to 1. That’s almost 10x more than the hospital.

Please cite source.. I got my info from asking the nursing home where my father was.

The fact that non-profit and for-profit hospital charge similar fees means either non-profit are hiding their cash somewhere

I suspect the former because their charges are way in excess of what their costs seem to be. It can also be that being owned by a non-profit brands them as a non profit even though they are turning a profit. Somehow.. for not being profitable, they can find a lot of money to build even bigger hospitals. In addition, hospital room charges are way in excess of what hospital room costs are in Universal Health Care countries. Japan charges $10/day (too low).. it was recently on KPBS. Some of the difference may be to changing how support people (RN, LVN) are charged.. that is why I want to see the charge structure because the numbers don’t add up right.

[ucodegen]

I looked up average patient to RN ratio for a nursing home and it’s 30 to 1. That’s almost 10x more than the hospital.

Please cite source.. I got my info from asking the nursing home where my father was.

The fact that non-profit and for-profit hospital charge similar fees means either non-profit are hiding their cash somewhere

I suspect the former because their charges are way in excess of what their costs seem to be. It can also be that being owned by a non-profit brands them as a non profit even though they are turning a profit. Somehow.. for not being profitable, they can find a lot of money to build even bigger hospitals. In addition, hospital room charges are way in excess of what hospital room costs are in Universal Health Care countries. Japan charges $10/day (too low).. it was recently on KPBS. Some of the difference may be to changing how support people (RN, LVN) are charged.. that is why I want to see the charge structure because the numbers don’t add up right.

[ucodegen]

I looked up average patient to RN ratio for a nursing home and it’s 30 to 1. That’s almost 10x more than the hospital.

Please cite source.. I got my info from asking the nursing home where my father was.

The fact that non-profit and for-profit hospital charge similar fees means either non-profit are hiding their cash somewhere

I suspect the former because their charges are way in excess of what their costs seem to be. It can also be that being owned by a non-profit brands them as a non profit even though they are turning a profit. Somehow.. for not being profitable, they can find a lot of money to build even bigger hospitals. In addition, hospital room charges are way in excess of what hospital room costs are in Universal Health Care countries. Japan charges $10/day (too low).. it was recently on KPBS. Some of the difference may be to changing how support people (RN, LVN) are charged.. that is why I want to see the charge structure because the numbers don’t add up right.

[ucodegen]

I still think it would be better to fire Congress and then start with subtle changes to the current system like allowing interstate competition and getting rid of the anti-trust exemption.

I think the best way is a progressive series of legislations.. This way you don’t make a big, hard to correct mistake.
1) remove anti-trust exemption
2) allow interstate competition
3) allow people to carry their insurance after job loss at their current payout rate(from the same provider) – but they also have to pay the company contrib part after the job loss.
4) Treat health savings accounts like a 401K.. unspent money can be rolled over to the next year.
5) Insurer can’t cancel a policy once a person has a systemic illness while covered. All of the payments the person made up to then was to cover such an event.
… just a start.

[ucodegen]

I still think it would be better to fire Congress and then start with subtle changes to the current system like allowing interstate competition and getting rid of the anti-trust exemption.

I think the best way is a progressive series of legislations.. This way you don’t make a big, hard to correct mistake.
1) remove anti-trust exemption
2) allow interstate competition
3) allow people to carry their insurance after job loss at their current payout rate(from the same provider) – but they also have to pay the company contrib part after the job loss.
4) Treat health savings accounts like a 401K.. unspent money can be rolled over to the next year.
5) Insurer can’t cancel a policy once a person has a systemic illness while covered. All of the payments the person made up to then was to cover such an event.
… just a start.

[ucodegen]

I still think it would be better to fire Congress and then start with subtle changes to the current system like allowing interstate competition and getting rid of the anti-trust exemption.

I think the best way is a progressive series of legislations.. This way you don’t make a big, hard to correct mistake.
1) remove anti-trust exemption
2) allow interstate competition
3) allow people to carry their insurance after job loss at their current payout rate(from the same provider) – but they also have to pay the company contrib part after the job loss.
4) Treat health savings accounts like a 401K.. unspent money can be rolled over to the next year.
5) Insurer can’t cancel a policy once a person has a systemic illness while covered. All of the payments the person made up to then was to cover such an event.
… just a start.

[ucodegen]

I still think it would be better to fire Congress and then start with subtle changes to the current system like allowing interstate competition and getting rid of the anti-trust exemption.

I think the best way is a progressive series of legislations.. This way you don’t make a big, hard to correct mistake.
1) remove anti-trust exemption
2) allow interstate competition
3) allow people to carry their insurance after job loss at their current payout rate(from the same provider) – but they also have to pay the company contrib part after the job loss.
4) Treat health savings accounts like a 401K.. unspent money can be rolled over to the next year.
5) Insurer can’t cancel a policy once a person has a systemic illness while covered. All of the payments the person made up to then was to cover such an event.
… just a start.

[ucodegen]

I still think it would be better to fire Congress and then start with subtle changes to the current system like allowing interstate competition and getting rid of the anti-trust exemption.

I think the best way is a progressive series of legislations.. This way you don’t make a big, hard to correct mistake.
1) remove anti-trust exemption
2) allow interstate competition
3) allow people to carry their insurance after job loss at their current payout rate(from the same provider) – but they also have to pay the company contrib part after the job loss.
4) Treat health savings accounts like a 401K.. unspent money can be rolled over to the next year.
5) Insurer can’t cancel a policy once a person has a systemic illness while covered. All of the payments the person made up to then was to cover such an event.
… just a start.

[ucodegen]

ucodegen, hospital also pays doctors, pharmacists, pharm tech, various other techs, equipments that nursing homes don’t have, team of lawyers. Those might contribute to the cost differences.

Nursing homes have doctors, pharmacists, pharm techs and various other techs.. they also have lawyers.. though admittedly, not as many as a hospital.

One pharmacist can handle the prescriptions for way more than 4 patients, likewise pharm techs and various other techs. I suspect that the hospital lawyers are actually a law firm on consignment. If I double the number of nurses I should get close.. but I don’t. There is definitely something up. When you look at the room cost of a non-profit vs for-profit.. they are basically the same. It doesn’t make sense.

[ucodegen]

ucodegen, hospital also pays doctors, pharmacists, pharm tech, various other techs, equipments that nursing homes don’t have, team of lawyers. Those might contribute to the cost differences.

Nursing homes have doctors, pharmacists, pharm techs and various other techs.. they also have lawyers.. though admittedly, not as many as a hospital.

One pharmacist can handle the prescriptions for way more than 4 patients, likewise pharm techs and various other techs. I suspect that the hospital lawyers are actually a law firm on consignment. If I double the number of nurses I should get close.. but I don’t. There is definitely something up. When you look at the room cost of a non-profit vs for-profit.. they are basically the same. It doesn’t make sense.

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