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michael
ParticipantOK, let’s get this right. The two hedge fund managers are being arrested on an entirely different case. Don’t bunch up the smarter criminal with the dumb criminals (although both got caught).
The hedge fund guys are basically smart guys fooling smart guys…
Former Bear Stearns Cos. hedge fund managers Ralph Cioffi and Matthew Tannin were indicted for mail fraud and conspiracy in the first prosecution stemming from a federal investigation of last year’s mortgage-market collapse.
The two men were charged with misleading investors about the health of two Bear Stearns hedge funds whose implosion ignited the subprime mortgage crisis. Cioffi was also charged with insider trading in the indictment, which cites a series of e-mails between the two men. They both face as much as 20 years in prison if convicted of conspiracy, and Cioffi faces an additional 20-year term if found guilty of insider trading.
http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601087&sid=as3ef9aE2W_8&refer=home
The 400 plus were dumb guys fooling even dumber guys
Federal prosecutors have charged more than 400 people across the U.S. in a crackdown against mortgage fraud, as the government stepped up efforts to address the subprime loan crisis
http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=newsarchive&sid=a7tFou.vUbrc
Two totally different levels…
ParticipantOK, let’s get this right. The two hedge fund managers are being arrested on an entirely different case. Don’t bunch up the smarter criminal with the dumb criminals (although both got caught).
The hedge fund guys are basically smart guys fooling smart guys…
Former Bear Stearns Cos. hedge fund managers Ralph Cioffi and Matthew Tannin were indicted for mail fraud and conspiracy in the first prosecution stemming from a federal investigation of last year’s mortgage-market collapse.
The two men were charged with misleading investors about the health of two Bear Stearns hedge funds whose implosion ignited the subprime mortgage crisis. Cioffi was also charged with insider trading in the indictment, which cites a series of e-mails between the two men. They both face as much as 20 years in prison if convicted of conspiracy, and Cioffi faces an additional 20-year term if found guilty of insider trading.
http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601087&sid=as3ef9aE2W_8&refer=home
The 400 plus were dumb guys fooling even dumber guys
Federal prosecutors have charged more than 400 people across the U.S. in a crackdown against mortgage fraud, as the government stepped up efforts to address the subprime loan crisis
http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=newsarchive&sid=a7tFou.vUbrc
Two totally different levels…
ParticipantOK, let’s get this right. The two hedge fund managers are being arrested on an entirely different case. Don’t bunch up the smarter criminal with the dumb criminals (although both got caught).
The hedge fund guys are basically smart guys fooling smart guys…
Former Bear Stearns Cos. hedge fund managers Ralph Cioffi and Matthew Tannin were indicted for mail fraud and conspiracy in the first prosecution stemming from a federal investigation of last year’s mortgage-market collapse.
The two men were charged with misleading investors about the health of two Bear Stearns hedge funds whose implosion ignited the subprime mortgage crisis. Cioffi was also charged with insider trading in the indictment, which cites a series of e-mails between the two men. They both face as much as 20 years in prison if convicted of conspiracy, and Cioffi faces an additional 20-year term if found guilty of insider trading.
http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601087&sid=as3ef9aE2W_8&refer=home
The 400 plus were dumb guys fooling even dumber guys
Federal prosecutors have charged more than 400 people across the U.S. in a crackdown against mortgage fraud, as the government stepped up efforts to address the subprime loan crisis
http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=newsarchive&sid=a7tFou.vUbrc
Two totally different levels…
ParticipantOK, let’s get this right. The two hedge fund managers are being arrested on an entirely different case. Don’t bunch up the smarter criminal with the dumb criminals (although both got caught).
The hedge fund guys are basically smart guys fooling smart guys…
Former Bear Stearns Cos. hedge fund managers Ralph Cioffi and Matthew Tannin were indicted for mail fraud and conspiracy in the first prosecution stemming from a federal investigation of last year’s mortgage-market collapse.
The two men were charged with misleading investors about the health of two Bear Stearns hedge funds whose implosion ignited the subprime mortgage crisis. Cioffi was also charged with insider trading in the indictment, which cites a series of e-mails between the two men. They both face as much as 20 years in prison if convicted of conspiracy, and Cioffi faces an additional 20-year term if found guilty of insider trading.
http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601087&sid=as3ef9aE2W_8&refer=home
The 400 plus were dumb guys fooling even dumber guys
Federal prosecutors have charged more than 400 people across the U.S. in a crackdown against mortgage fraud, as the government stepped up efforts to address the subprime loan crisis
http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=newsarchive&sid=a7tFou.vUbrc
Two totally different levels…
ParticipantHLS
The events of the last 12 months have changed things, at least in the short term.
As you know, credit spreads are an indicator of investor sentiment over risk. Spreads on BBB or lower corporates (high yield, junk bonds) have widened dramatically in the last year. During March, even investment grade corporates were sold off in the flight to quality trade (selling all types of credit risk and buying US treasuries).
The 10 year treasury yield touched 3.3% for a little while earlier this year. Investors are slowly starting to buy relatively cheap corporate paper again and selling their risk free treasuries (risk free from a default / credit sense although not free from purchasing power risk).
A similar dynamic occurs in the Mortgage Back Security space. If we look at spreads between the 10 year treasury and 30 year mortgages, I believe you can historically expect about a 180 bps spread. So basically, you would add 1.8% to the 10 year treasury yield. Today that would be roughly 4.25% + 2oo bps = 6.25%.
When the 10 year treasury was yielding 3.3% I don’t believe 30 year mortgages hit 5.3%. During that time, investors were still spooked at demanded a higher spread to compensate them for the risk.
I would still use the 10 year as a reliable indicator for 30 year mortages along with current credit market conditions.
ParticipantHLS
The events of the last 12 months have changed things, at least in the short term.
As you know, credit spreads are an indicator of investor sentiment over risk. Spreads on BBB or lower corporates (high yield, junk bonds) have widened dramatically in the last year. During March, even investment grade corporates were sold off in the flight to quality trade (selling all types of credit risk and buying US treasuries).
The 10 year treasury yield touched 3.3% for a little while earlier this year. Investors are slowly starting to buy relatively cheap corporate paper again and selling their risk free treasuries (risk free from a default / credit sense although not free from purchasing power risk).
A similar dynamic occurs in the Mortgage Back Security space. If we look at spreads between the 10 year treasury and 30 year mortgages, I believe you can historically expect about a 180 bps spread. So basically, you would add 1.8% to the 10 year treasury yield. Today that would be roughly 4.25% + 2oo bps = 6.25%.
When the 10 year treasury was yielding 3.3% I don’t believe 30 year mortgages hit 5.3%. During that time, investors were still spooked at demanded a higher spread to compensate them for the risk.
I would still use the 10 year as a reliable indicator for 30 year mortages along with current credit market conditions.
ParticipantHLS
The events of the last 12 months have changed things, at least in the short term.
As you know, credit spreads are an indicator of investor sentiment over risk. Spreads on BBB or lower corporates (high yield, junk bonds) have widened dramatically in the last year. During March, even investment grade corporates were sold off in the flight to quality trade (selling all types of credit risk and buying US treasuries).
The 10 year treasury yield touched 3.3% for a little while earlier this year. Investors are slowly starting to buy relatively cheap corporate paper again and selling their risk free treasuries (risk free from a default / credit sense although not free from purchasing power risk).
A similar dynamic occurs in the Mortgage Back Security space. If we look at spreads between the 10 year treasury and 30 year mortgages, I believe you can historically expect about a 180 bps spread. So basically, you would add 1.8% to the 10 year treasury yield. Today that would be roughly 4.25% + 2oo bps = 6.25%.
When the 10 year treasury was yielding 3.3% I don’t believe 30 year mortgages hit 5.3%. During that time, investors were still spooked at demanded a higher spread to compensate them for the risk.
I would still use the 10 year as a reliable indicator for 30 year mortages along with current credit market conditions.
ParticipantHLS
The events of the last 12 months have changed things, at least in the short term.
As you know, credit spreads are an indicator of investor sentiment over risk. Spreads on BBB or lower corporates (high yield, junk bonds) have widened dramatically in the last year. During March, even investment grade corporates were sold off in the flight to quality trade (selling all types of credit risk and buying US treasuries).
The 10 year treasury yield touched 3.3% for a little while earlier this year. Investors are slowly starting to buy relatively cheap corporate paper again and selling their risk free treasuries (risk free from a default / credit sense although not free from purchasing power risk).
A similar dynamic occurs in the Mortgage Back Security space. If we look at spreads between the 10 year treasury and 30 year mortgages, I believe you can historically expect about a 180 bps spread. So basically, you would add 1.8% to the 10 year treasury yield. Today that would be roughly 4.25% + 2oo bps = 6.25%.
When the 10 year treasury was yielding 3.3% I don’t believe 30 year mortgages hit 5.3%. During that time, investors were still spooked at demanded a higher spread to compensate them for the risk.
I would still use the 10 year as a reliable indicator for 30 year mortages along with current credit market conditions.
ParticipantHLS
The events of the last 12 months have changed things, at least in the short term.
As you know, credit spreads are an indicator of investor sentiment over risk. Spreads on BBB or lower corporates (high yield, junk bonds) have widened dramatically in the last year. During March, even investment grade corporates were sold off in the flight to quality trade (selling all types of credit risk and buying US treasuries).
The 10 year treasury yield touched 3.3% for a little while earlier this year. Investors are slowly starting to buy relatively cheap corporate paper again and selling their risk free treasuries (risk free from a default / credit sense although not free from purchasing power risk).
A similar dynamic occurs in the Mortgage Back Security space. If we look at spreads between the 10 year treasury and 30 year mortgages, I believe you can historically expect about a 180 bps spread. So basically, you would add 1.8% to the 10 year treasury yield. Today that would be roughly 4.25% + 2oo bps = 6.25%.
When the 10 year treasury was yielding 3.3% I don’t believe 30 year mortgages hit 5.3%. During that time, investors were still spooked at demanded a higher spread to compensate them for the risk.
I would still use the 10 year as a reliable indicator for 30 year mortages along with current credit market conditions.
ParticipantJohnson (and Tim Raines) ran one of the most corrupt quasi-government institutions – Fannie Mae. They cooked the books to report fictitous earnings in order to earn fat bonuses.
When Enron commits fraud – Democrats (and the media) pull out the “corporate greed” card. When their pet projects, Fannie and Freddie, commit accounting fraud (billions of dollars) not a peep from any.
Woodrow, you’re already sounding like the defeated Gore/Lieberman supporters of 2000 or Kerry/Edwards supporters of 2004. I suggest you don’t get your hopes up this time around… ya’ll picked the wrong guy yet again.
ParticipantJohnson (and Tim Raines) ran one of the most corrupt quasi-government institutions – Fannie Mae. They cooked the books to report fictitous earnings in order to earn fat bonuses.
When Enron commits fraud – Democrats (and the media) pull out the “corporate greed” card. When their pet projects, Fannie and Freddie, commit accounting fraud (billions of dollars) not a peep from any.
Woodrow, you’re already sounding like the defeated Gore/Lieberman supporters of 2000 or Kerry/Edwards supporters of 2004. I suggest you don’t get your hopes up this time around… ya’ll picked the wrong guy yet again.
ParticipantJohnson (and Tim Raines) ran one of the most corrupt quasi-government institutions – Fannie Mae. They cooked the books to report fictitous earnings in order to earn fat bonuses.
When Enron commits fraud – Democrats (and the media) pull out the “corporate greed” card. When their pet projects, Fannie and Freddie, commit accounting fraud (billions of dollars) not a peep from any.
Woodrow, you’re already sounding like the defeated Gore/Lieberman supporters of 2000 or Kerry/Edwards supporters of 2004. I suggest you don’t get your hopes up this time around… ya’ll picked the wrong guy yet again.
ParticipantJohnson (and Tim Raines) ran one of the most corrupt quasi-government institutions – Fannie Mae. They cooked the books to report fictitous earnings in order to earn fat bonuses.
When Enron commits fraud – Democrats (and the media) pull out the “corporate greed” card. When their pet projects, Fannie and Freddie, commit accounting fraud (billions of dollars) not a peep from any.
Woodrow, you’re already sounding like the defeated Gore/Lieberman supporters of 2000 or Kerry/Edwards supporters of 2004. I suggest you don’t get your hopes up this time around… ya’ll picked the wrong guy yet again.
ParticipantJohnson (and Tim Raines) ran one of the most corrupt quasi-government institutions – Fannie Mae. They cooked the books to report fictitous earnings in order to earn fat bonuses.
When Enron commits fraud – Democrats (and the media) pull out the “corporate greed” card. When their pet projects, Fannie and Freddie, commit accounting fraud (billions of dollars) not a peep from any.
Woodrow, you’re already sounding like the defeated Gore/Lieberman supporters of 2000 or Kerry/Edwards supporters of 2004. I suggest you don’t get your hopes up this time around… ya’ll picked the wrong guy yet again.
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