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cabal
Participant[quote=Allan from Fallbrook] Cabal: If anything, the situation you describe above has only grown worse during the downturn. The parents of one of my players were hammered over the last few years (he was a mortgage broker and she was a Realtor) and their standard of living has plummeted. They seemed to tolerate each other before, but now it’s turned vile and she openly berates him publicly, which is painful and embarrassing to watch. He is a decent enough sort, and he almost acts like he deserves this treatment from her.
I know the kid is humiliated by this, but it’s not the exception, unfortunately. This entitlement mentality was very strong for a lot of folks and now that things have turned ugly, they’ve turned on each other. I don’t get the sense of shared sacrifice or determination (what my dad would call “grit” or “sand”) to weather the storm, what I get is middle-aged spoiled brats pissed off that the party has stopped.
Like I said in my earlier post, the sense of disconnection from reality is amazing and more than a little frightening. My grandma lived through the Great Depression and she was one tough lady, believe me. No bitching, no complaining; just a rock solid work ethic and the discipline to ride out the tough times.[/quote]
Allan – You are absolutely right as I’ve observed the exact same phenomena. This generations response to adversity is totally disparate from past generations – no honor. One has to wonder if the volatile combination of the excesses from recent bubbles, coupled with the aftermath of modern feminism played a significant role in perverting present day marital dynamics. While I agree with the ideals of modern feminism in principle, you can count me out if this is one of the emerging paradigms. The pendulum has swung too far to the other side and if reverting back to more traditional roles helps to reverse attitudes as others have noted, then I’m all for it. The question is as we continue on this current trajectory, what kind of societal train wreck awaits us in the not so distant future ? It’s not hard to envision the whole notion of marriage become obsolete, or prenups become standard operating procedure since our ever intruding government decided long ago to turn marriage into a legal and binding contract, apparently for the overall benefit of society. May have some merit 50 years, but is certainly less relevant today.
In retrospect, I should feel lucky to still be married after 21 years. My wife and I are frugal except with our children which we spoil without hesitation. However, she occasionally succumbs to the dark side and drag me the down the rabbit hole with her. Here’s a little anecdote for you. After a typical girls night out with her high maintenance girlfriends, one of them proudly and shamelessly flaunted her newly upgraded wedding ring. Needless to say, my wifes 1/2 carat ring looked like a grain of sand in comparison. Well our 20th anniversary was approaching so naturally she leveraged that and talked me into upgrading her ring. I agreed and we picked out a nice 2 carat rock. A few weeks later, the new ring shows up. To my surprise, in addition to the new rock, there was a whole bunch of other diamonds that wrapped around the band. Apparently her psycho friends convinced her the main diamond needed more accent diamonds for it to look right. She agreed and paid for the additional upgrade. I don’t care about the money because we can afford it, but I was pissed that she caved in to peer pressure. Oh well, at least she didn’t go out and trade in her perfectly good car for a Range Rover.
Participant[quote=Allan from Fallbrook] Cabal: If anything, the situation you describe above has only grown worse during the downturn. The parents of one of my players were hammered over the last few years (he was a mortgage broker and she was a Realtor) and their standard of living has plummeted. They seemed to tolerate each other before, but now it’s turned vile and she openly berates him publicly, which is painful and embarrassing to watch. He is a decent enough sort, and he almost acts like he deserves this treatment from her.
I know the kid is humiliated by this, but it’s not the exception, unfortunately. This entitlement mentality was very strong for a lot of folks and now that things have turned ugly, they’ve turned on each other. I don’t get the sense of shared sacrifice or determination (what my dad would call “grit” or “sand”) to weather the storm, what I get is middle-aged spoiled brats pissed off that the party has stopped.
Like I said in my earlier post, the sense of disconnection from reality is amazing and more than a little frightening. My grandma lived through the Great Depression and she was one tough lady, believe me. No bitching, no complaining; just a rock solid work ethic and the discipline to ride out the tough times.[/quote]
Allan – You are absolutely right as I’ve observed the exact same phenomena. This generations response to adversity is totally disparate from past generations – no honor. One has to wonder if the volatile combination of the excesses from recent bubbles, coupled with the aftermath of modern feminism played a significant role in perverting present day marital dynamics. While I agree with the ideals of modern feminism in principle, you can count me out if this is one of the emerging paradigms. The pendulum has swung too far to the other side and if reverting back to more traditional roles helps to reverse attitudes as others have noted, then I’m all for it. The question is as we continue on this current trajectory, what kind of societal train wreck awaits us in the not so distant future ? It’s not hard to envision the whole notion of marriage become obsolete, or prenups become standard operating procedure since our ever intruding government decided long ago to turn marriage into a legal and binding contract, apparently for the overall benefit of society. May have some merit 50 years, but is certainly less relevant today.
In retrospect, I should feel lucky to still be married after 21 years. My wife and I are frugal except with our children which we spoil without hesitation. However, she occasionally succumbs to the dark side and drag me the down the rabbit hole with her. Here’s a little anecdote for you. After a typical girls night out with her high maintenance girlfriends, one of them proudly and shamelessly flaunted her newly upgraded wedding ring. Needless to say, my wifes 1/2 carat ring looked like a grain of sand in comparison. Well our 20th anniversary was approaching so naturally she leveraged that and talked me into upgrading her ring. I agreed and we picked out a nice 2 carat rock. A few weeks later, the new ring shows up. To my surprise, in addition to the new rock, there was a whole bunch of other diamonds that wrapped around the band. Apparently her psycho friends convinced her the main diamond needed more accent diamonds for it to look right. She agreed and paid for the additional upgrade. I don’t care about the money because we can afford it, but I was pissed that she caved in to peer pressure. Oh well, at least she didn’t go out and trade in her perfectly good car for a Range Rover.
Participant[quote=Allan from Fallbrook] Cabal: If anything, the situation you describe above has only grown worse during the downturn. The parents of one of my players were hammered over the last few years (he was a mortgage broker and she was a Realtor) and their standard of living has plummeted. They seemed to tolerate each other before, but now it’s turned vile and she openly berates him publicly, which is painful and embarrassing to watch. He is a decent enough sort, and he almost acts like he deserves this treatment from her.
I know the kid is humiliated by this, but it’s not the exception, unfortunately. This entitlement mentality was very strong for a lot of folks and now that things have turned ugly, they’ve turned on each other. I don’t get the sense of shared sacrifice or determination (what my dad would call “grit” or “sand”) to weather the storm, what I get is middle-aged spoiled brats pissed off that the party has stopped.
Like I said in my earlier post, the sense of disconnection from reality is amazing and more than a little frightening. My grandma lived through the Great Depression and she was one tough lady, believe me. No bitching, no complaining; just a rock solid work ethic and the discipline to ride out the tough times.[/quote]
Allan – You are absolutely right as I’ve observed the exact same phenomena. This generations response to adversity is totally disparate from past generations – no honor. One has to wonder if the volatile combination of the excesses from recent bubbles, coupled with the aftermath of modern feminism played a significant role in perverting present day marital dynamics. While I agree with the ideals of modern feminism in principle, you can count me out if this is one of the emerging paradigms. The pendulum has swung too far to the other side and if reverting back to more traditional roles helps to reverse attitudes as others have noted, then I’m all for it. The question is as we continue on this current trajectory, what kind of societal train wreck awaits us in the not so distant future ? It’s not hard to envision the whole notion of marriage become obsolete, or prenups become standard operating procedure since our ever intruding government decided long ago to turn marriage into a legal and binding contract, apparently for the overall benefit of society. May have some merit 50 years, but is certainly less relevant today.
In retrospect, I should feel lucky to still be married after 21 years. My wife and I are frugal except with our children which we spoil without hesitation. However, she occasionally succumbs to the dark side and drag me the down the rabbit hole with her. Here’s a little anecdote for you. After a typical girls night out with her high maintenance girlfriends, one of them proudly and shamelessly flaunted her newly upgraded wedding ring. Needless to say, my wifes 1/2 carat ring looked like a grain of sand in comparison. Well our 20th anniversary was approaching so naturally she leveraged that and talked me into upgrading her ring. I agreed and we picked out a nice 2 carat rock. A few weeks later, the new ring shows up. To my surprise, in addition to the new rock, there was a whole bunch of other diamonds that wrapped around the band. Apparently her psycho friends convinced her the main diamond needed more accent diamonds for it to look right. She agreed and paid for the additional upgrade. I don’t care about the money because we can afford it, but I was pissed that she caved in to peer pressure. Oh well, at least she didn’t go out and trade in her perfectly good car for a Range Rover.
Participant[quote=Allan from Fallbrook] Cabal: If anything, the situation you describe above has only grown worse during the downturn. The parents of one of my players were hammered over the last few years (he was a mortgage broker and she was a Realtor) and their standard of living has plummeted. They seemed to tolerate each other before, but now it’s turned vile and she openly berates him publicly, which is painful and embarrassing to watch. He is a decent enough sort, and he almost acts like he deserves this treatment from her.
I know the kid is humiliated by this, but it’s not the exception, unfortunately. This entitlement mentality was very strong for a lot of folks and now that things have turned ugly, they’ve turned on each other. I don’t get the sense of shared sacrifice or determination (what my dad would call “grit” or “sand”) to weather the storm, what I get is middle-aged spoiled brats pissed off that the party has stopped.
Like I said in my earlier post, the sense of disconnection from reality is amazing and more than a little frightening. My grandma lived through the Great Depression and she was one tough lady, believe me. No bitching, no complaining; just a rock solid work ethic and the discipline to ride out the tough times.[/quote]
Allan – You are absolutely right as I’ve observed the exact same phenomena. This generations response to adversity is totally disparate from past generations – no honor. One has to wonder if the volatile combination of the excesses from recent bubbles, coupled with the aftermath of modern feminism played a significant role in perverting present day marital dynamics. While I agree with the ideals of modern feminism in principle, you can count me out if this is one of the emerging paradigms. The pendulum has swung too far to the other side and if reverting back to more traditional roles helps to reverse attitudes as others have noted, then I’m all for it. The question is as we continue on this current trajectory, what kind of societal train wreck awaits us in the not so distant future ? It’s not hard to envision the whole notion of marriage become obsolete, or prenups become standard operating procedure since our ever intruding government decided long ago to turn marriage into a legal and binding contract, apparently for the overall benefit of society. May have some merit 50 years, but is certainly less relevant today.
In retrospect, I should feel lucky to still be married after 21 years. My wife and I are frugal except with our children which we spoil without hesitation. However, she occasionally succumbs to the dark side and drag me the down the rabbit hole with her. Here’s a little anecdote for you. After a typical girls night out with her high maintenance girlfriends, one of them proudly and shamelessly flaunted her newly upgraded wedding ring. Needless to say, my wifes 1/2 carat ring looked like a grain of sand in comparison. Well our 20th anniversary was approaching so naturally she leveraged that and talked me into upgrading her ring. I agreed and we picked out a nice 2 carat rock. A few weeks later, the new ring shows up. To my surprise, in addition to the new rock, there was a whole bunch of other diamonds that wrapped around the band. Apparently her psycho friends convinced her the main diamond needed more accent diamonds for it to look right. She agreed and paid for the additional upgrade. I don’t care about the money because we can afford it, but I was pissed that she caved in to peer pressure. Oh well, at least she didn’t go out and trade in her perfectly good car for a Range Rover.
Participant[quote=Allan from Fallbrook] Cabal: If anything, the situation you describe above has only grown worse during the downturn. The parents of one of my players were hammered over the last few years (he was a mortgage broker and she was a Realtor) and their standard of living has plummeted. They seemed to tolerate each other before, but now it’s turned vile and she openly berates him publicly, which is painful and embarrassing to watch. He is a decent enough sort, and he almost acts like he deserves this treatment from her.
I know the kid is humiliated by this, but it’s not the exception, unfortunately. This entitlement mentality was very strong for a lot of folks and now that things have turned ugly, they’ve turned on each other. I don’t get the sense of shared sacrifice or determination (what my dad would call “grit” or “sand”) to weather the storm, what I get is middle-aged spoiled brats pissed off that the party has stopped.
Like I said in my earlier post, the sense of disconnection from reality is amazing and more than a little frightening. My grandma lived through the Great Depression and she was one tough lady, believe me. No bitching, no complaining; just a rock solid work ethic and the discipline to ride out the tough times.[/quote]
Allan – You are absolutely right as I’ve observed the exact same phenomena. This generations response to adversity is totally disparate from past generations – no honor. One has to wonder if the volatile combination of the excesses from recent bubbles, coupled with the aftermath of modern feminism played a significant role in perverting present day marital dynamics. While I agree with the ideals of modern feminism in principle, you can count me out if this is one of the emerging paradigms. The pendulum has swung too far to the other side and if reverting back to more traditional roles helps to reverse attitudes as others have noted, then I’m all for it. The question is as we continue on this current trajectory, what kind of societal train wreck awaits us in the not so distant future ? It’s not hard to envision the whole notion of marriage become obsolete, or prenups become standard operating procedure since our ever intruding government decided long ago to turn marriage into a legal and binding contract, apparently for the overall benefit of society. May have some merit 50 years, but is certainly less relevant today.
In retrospect, I should feel lucky to still be married after 21 years. My wife and I are frugal except with our children which we spoil without hesitation. However, she occasionally succumbs to the dark side and drag me the down the rabbit hole with her. Here’s a little anecdote for you. After a typical girls night out with her high maintenance girlfriends, one of them proudly and shamelessly flaunted her newly upgraded wedding ring. Needless to say, my wifes 1/2 carat ring looked like a grain of sand in comparison. Well our 20th anniversary was approaching so naturally she leveraged that and talked me into upgrading her ring. I agreed and we picked out a nice 2 carat rock. A few weeks later, the new ring shows up. To my surprise, in addition to the new rock, there was a whole bunch of other diamonds that wrapped around the band. Apparently her psycho friends convinced her the main diamond needed more accent diamonds for it to look right. She agreed and paid for the additional upgrade. I don’t care about the money because we can afford it, but I was pissed that she caved in to peer pressure. Oh well, at least she didn’t go out and trade in her perfectly good car for a Range Rover.
Participant[quote=TechyWorker]Quite interesting TG. Not currently divorced but do to badgering been doing “research” on match.com just wondering what’s out there, since I don’t really get out.
—–
So in the end I’ll probably keep mine despite the many shortcomings and general meanness and bitterness and get her some supplements, such as meds or a young lover. I’ve never internet dated, I was just curious about the market in general.
[/quote]I am intrigued by the resilience of both men and women to live in complete misery for extended periods of time with a spouse they’ve grown despise. I don’t understand this kind of psychology. I have several friends in horrible marriages, yet they choose to stick it out. Maybe they’re hoping the issues will somehow miraculously resolve themselves. Certainly stability of the kids and finances are huge factors, but when the relationship noticeably affects your health and personality, perhaps it’s time to seriously consider pulling the trigger. Maybe your situation isn’t as dire. I’m a firm believer that you must take care of yourself first before you can effectively take care of anyone else.
Over the years, I have literally watched one friend age at an accelerated rate, lose the spark in his eyes, and the once quick charming wit is long gone. Ironically, he is an assertive person and holds a high pressure upper management position with a large staff. He regularly making critical decisions with ease often with little data, yet he can’t make the decision to move on with his life even though he wants to. He makes 180k+/yr base and probably 300K/yr with bonus/stock options on a good year. Believe it or not, they live check to check supporting the McMansion and lifestyle. Not long ago, he ask her to consider getting a job or cut back on discretionary spending. Her answer was “No, if I have to get a job what do I need you for?” The arrogance and sense of entitlement is just unbelievable. This may be an extreme example, but in my experience, there are many women with similar attitudes, especially in mid-upper class north county society. The keeping up with Joneses mentality and competitive nature of these women is truly frightening. I can only conclude that irrational fear of losing everything can drive women to be this way.
I would love to see a map of bad marriages overlayed on SD County. I’d bet it would dwarf any NOD/foreclosure radar map. Leykis, where were you 20 years ago.
Participant[quote=TechyWorker]Quite interesting TG. Not currently divorced but do to badgering been doing “research” on match.com just wondering what’s out there, since I don’t really get out.
—–
So in the end I’ll probably keep mine despite the many shortcomings and general meanness and bitterness and get her some supplements, such as meds or a young lover. I’ve never internet dated, I was just curious about the market in general.
[/quote]I am intrigued by the resilience of both men and women to live in complete misery for extended periods of time with a spouse they’ve grown despise. I don’t understand this kind of psychology. I have several friends in horrible marriages, yet they choose to stick it out. Maybe they’re hoping the issues will somehow miraculously resolve themselves. Certainly stability of the kids and finances are huge factors, but when the relationship noticeably affects your health and personality, perhaps it’s time to seriously consider pulling the trigger. Maybe your situation isn’t as dire. I’m a firm believer that you must take care of yourself first before you can effectively take care of anyone else.
Over the years, I have literally watched one friend age at an accelerated rate, lose the spark in his eyes, and the once quick charming wit is long gone. Ironically, he is an assertive person and holds a high pressure upper management position with a large staff. He regularly making critical decisions with ease often with little data, yet he can’t make the decision to move on with his life even though he wants to. He makes 180k+/yr base and probably 300K/yr with bonus/stock options on a good year. Believe it or not, they live check to check supporting the McMansion and lifestyle. Not long ago, he ask her to consider getting a job or cut back on discretionary spending. Her answer was “No, if I have to get a job what do I need you for?” The arrogance and sense of entitlement is just unbelievable. This may be an extreme example, but in my experience, there are many women with similar attitudes, especially in mid-upper class north county society. The keeping up with Joneses mentality and competitive nature of these women is truly frightening. I can only conclude that irrational fear of losing everything can drive women to be this way.
I would love to see a map of bad marriages overlayed on SD County. I’d bet it would dwarf any NOD/foreclosure radar map. Leykis, where were you 20 years ago.
Participant[quote=TechyWorker]Quite interesting TG. Not currently divorced but do to badgering been doing “research” on match.com just wondering what’s out there, since I don’t really get out.
—–
So in the end I’ll probably keep mine despite the many shortcomings and general meanness and bitterness and get her some supplements, such as meds or a young lover. I’ve never internet dated, I was just curious about the market in general.
[/quote]I am intrigued by the resilience of both men and women to live in complete misery for extended periods of time with a spouse they’ve grown despise. I don’t understand this kind of psychology. I have several friends in horrible marriages, yet they choose to stick it out. Maybe they’re hoping the issues will somehow miraculously resolve themselves. Certainly stability of the kids and finances are huge factors, but when the relationship noticeably affects your health and personality, perhaps it’s time to seriously consider pulling the trigger. Maybe your situation isn’t as dire. I’m a firm believer that you must take care of yourself first before you can effectively take care of anyone else.
Over the years, I have literally watched one friend age at an accelerated rate, lose the spark in his eyes, and the once quick charming wit is long gone. Ironically, he is an assertive person and holds a high pressure upper management position with a large staff. He regularly making critical decisions with ease often with little data, yet he can’t make the decision to move on with his life even though he wants to. He makes 180k+/yr base and probably 300K/yr with bonus/stock options on a good year. Believe it or not, they live check to check supporting the McMansion and lifestyle. Not long ago, he ask her to consider getting a job or cut back on discretionary spending. Her answer was “No, if I have to get a job what do I need you for?” The arrogance and sense of entitlement is just unbelievable. This may be an extreme example, but in my experience, there are many women with similar attitudes, especially in mid-upper class north county society. The keeping up with Joneses mentality and competitive nature of these women is truly frightening. I can only conclude that irrational fear of losing everything can drive women to be this way.
I would love to see a map of bad marriages overlayed on SD County. I’d bet it would dwarf any NOD/foreclosure radar map. Leykis, where were you 20 years ago.
Participant[quote=TechyWorker]Quite interesting TG. Not currently divorced but do to badgering been doing “research” on match.com just wondering what’s out there, since I don’t really get out.
—–
So in the end I’ll probably keep mine despite the many shortcomings and general meanness and bitterness and get her some supplements, such as meds or a young lover. I’ve never internet dated, I was just curious about the market in general.
[/quote]I am intrigued by the resilience of both men and women to live in complete misery for extended periods of time with a spouse they’ve grown despise. I don’t understand this kind of psychology. I have several friends in horrible marriages, yet they choose to stick it out. Maybe they’re hoping the issues will somehow miraculously resolve themselves. Certainly stability of the kids and finances are huge factors, but when the relationship noticeably affects your health and personality, perhaps it’s time to seriously consider pulling the trigger. Maybe your situation isn’t as dire. I’m a firm believer that you must take care of yourself first before you can effectively take care of anyone else.
Over the years, I have literally watched one friend age at an accelerated rate, lose the spark in his eyes, and the once quick charming wit is long gone. Ironically, he is an assertive person and holds a high pressure upper management position with a large staff. He regularly making critical decisions with ease often with little data, yet he can’t make the decision to move on with his life even though he wants to. He makes 180k+/yr base and probably 300K/yr with bonus/stock options on a good year. Believe it or not, they live check to check supporting the McMansion and lifestyle. Not long ago, he ask her to consider getting a job or cut back on discretionary spending. Her answer was “No, if I have to get a job what do I need you for?” The arrogance and sense of entitlement is just unbelievable. This may be an extreme example, but in my experience, there are many women with similar attitudes, especially in mid-upper class north county society. The keeping up with Joneses mentality and competitive nature of these women is truly frightening. I can only conclude that irrational fear of losing everything can drive women to be this way.
I would love to see a map of bad marriages overlayed on SD County. I’d bet it would dwarf any NOD/foreclosure radar map. Leykis, where were you 20 years ago.
Participant[quote=TechyWorker]Quite interesting TG. Not currently divorced but do to badgering been doing “research” on match.com just wondering what’s out there, since I don’t really get out.
—–
So in the end I’ll probably keep mine despite the many shortcomings and general meanness and bitterness and get her some supplements, such as meds or a young lover. I’ve never internet dated, I was just curious about the market in general.
[/quote]I am intrigued by the resilience of both men and women to live in complete misery for extended periods of time with a spouse they’ve grown despise. I don’t understand this kind of psychology. I have several friends in horrible marriages, yet they choose to stick it out. Maybe they’re hoping the issues will somehow miraculously resolve themselves. Certainly stability of the kids and finances are huge factors, but when the relationship noticeably affects your health and personality, perhaps it’s time to seriously consider pulling the trigger. Maybe your situation isn’t as dire. I’m a firm believer that you must take care of yourself first before you can effectively take care of anyone else.
Over the years, I have literally watched one friend age at an accelerated rate, lose the spark in his eyes, and the once quick charming wit is long gone. Ironically, he is an assertive person and holds a high pressure upper management position with a large staff. He regularly making critical decisions with ease often with little data, yet he can’t make the decision to move on with his life even though he wants to. He makes 180k+/yr base and probably 300K/yr with bonus/stock options on a good year. Believe it or not, they live check to check supporting the McMansion and lifestyle. Not long ago, he ask her to consider getting a job or cut back on discretionary spending. Her answer was “No, if I have to get a job what do I need you for?” The arrogance and sense of entitlement is just unbelievable. This may be an extreme example, but in my experience, there are many women with similar attitudes, especially in mid-upper class north county society. The keeping up with Joneses mentality and competitive nature of these women is truly frightening. I can only conclude that irrational fear of losing everything can drive women to be this way.
I would love to see a map of bad marriages overlayed on SD County. I’d bet it would dwarf any NOD/foreclosure radar map. Leykis, where were you 20 years ago.
Participant[quote=HomeShopping]Cabal,
Pay closer attention the next time you visit your friend. Bel Etage/Savenna/Salviati have security cameras at their gates. I heard about the vandalism and need for cameras directly from a resident.
If you’re still confused, their HOA website has meeting minutes (page 3 from March 6, 2008):
“Board has reviewed need for cameras at gate entrances due to increased vandalism. Installation will begin at the Coyote entrance.”
http://www.beletage-savenna.com/show_file.php?id=16640&type_lib=22
I think the homes in those communities are nice. Just think that security is a problem.[/quote]
I was up that way about a month ago. Didn’t know the 2 developments installed cameras recently since I haven’t been in there in awhile. My friends house is in the 3rd development, which is apparently under a different HOA, and they have no security cameras. There are isolated cases of vandalism in every neighborhood, even CV and RSF. To claim security or vandalism is a problem in these high end neighborhoods is simply an exaggeration.
The Rising River, Palomino, and Tea Tree/Castello homes are 3 distinct classes of homes. Palomino is a typical 4S tract home with lots of sqft crammed into a small lot and close neighbors. Rising River is a wannabe mini-estate home with decent lots (1/3 acre) and incrementally better features and street presence. Comparable tracts are the Ivy Gates in south 4s or Mirasol in SantaLuz. Tea Tree(savenna) and castello (salviati) homes are actual estate homes on minimum ½ acre lots featuring estate attributes such as multi courtyards and xtra large rooms. These homes are just a half notch below the posada homes in SantaLuz in terms overall quality, value and prestige. A better comparison without location consideration would be the larger homes in Stonebridge or the Bouganvilla tract in CV, although the long single point entrance and power lines in stoneridge are hard to swallow.
Attempting an apples to apples comparison by assuming common 4500 sqft, I would price these 3 classes of homes as follows. 2000 & 2002 prices are unfinished as new, while peak prices include finished interiors and landscaping.
2000 2002 Peak
4S (largest model) 700K 775K 1.2M
Avaron (Avg model) 750K 850K 1.4M
Savenna(smallest model) 800K 900K 1.8MPrice stability of Avaron homes are the most questionable in bear markets imo as negative features are magnified. As previously posted, the main road in this development is used as a prime access point by the folks in Crosby. For me, this would be a deal breaker similar to having power lines in your backyard.
Participant[quote=HomeShopping]Cabal,
Pay closer attention the next time you visit your friend. Bel Etage/Savenna/Salviati have security cameras at their gates. I heard about the vandalism and need for cameras directly from a resident.
If you’re still confused, their HOA website has meeting minutes (page 3 from March 6, 2008):
“Board has reviewed need for cameras at gate entrances due to increased vandalism. Installation will begin at the Coyote entrance.”
http://www.beletage-savenna.com/show_file.php?id=16640&type_lib=22
I think the homes in those communities are nice. Just think that security is a problem.[/quote]
I was up that way about a month ago. Didn’t know the 2 developments installed cameras recently since I haven’t been in there in awhile. My friends house is in the 3rd development, which is apparently under a different HOA, and they have no security cameras. There are isolated cases of vandalism in every neighborhood, even CV and RSF. To claim security or vandalism is a problem in these high end neighborhoods is simply an exaggeration.
The Rising River, Palomino, and Tea Tree/Castello homes are 3 distinct classes of homes. Palomino is a typical 4S tract home with lots of sqft crammed into a small lot and close neighbors. Rising River is a wannabe mini-estate home with decent lots (1/3 acre) and incrementally better features and street presence. Comparable tracts are the Ivy Gates in south 4s or Mirasol in SantaLuz. Tea Tree(savenna) and castello (salviati) homes are actual estate homes on minimum ½ acre lots featuring estate attributes such as multi courtyards and xtra large rooms. These homes are just a half notch below the posada homes in SantaLuz in terms overall quality, value and prestige. A better comparison without location consideration would be the larger homes in Stonebridge or the Bouganvilla tract in CV, although the long single point entrance and power lines in stoneridge are hard to swallow.
Attempting an apples to apples comparison by assuming common 4500 sqft, I would price these 3 classes of homes as follows. 2000 & 2002 prices are unfinished as new, while peak prices include finished interiors and landscaping.
2000 2002 Peak
4S (largest model) 700K 775K 1.2M
Avaron (Avg model) 750K 850K 1.4M
Savenna(smallest model) 800K 900K 1.8MPrice stability of Avaron homes are the most questionable in bear markets imo as negative features are magnified. As previously posted, the main road in this development is used as a prime access point by the folks in Crosby. For me, this would be a deal breaker similar to having power lines in your backyard.
Participant[quote=HomeShopping]Cabal,
Pay closer attention the next time you visit your friend. Bel Etage/Savenna/Salviati have security cameras at their gates. I heard about the vandalism and need for cameras directly from a resident.
If you’re still confused, their HOA website has meeting minutes (page 3 from March 6, 2008):
“Board has reviewed need for cameras at gate entrances due to increased vandalism. Installation will begin at the Coyote entrance.”
http://www.beletage-savenna.com/show_file.php?id=16640&type_lib=22
I think the homes in those communities are nice. Just think that security is a problem.[/quote]
I was up that way about a month ago. Didn’t know the 2 developments installed cameras recently since I haven’t been in there in awhile. My friends house is in the 3rd development, which is apparently under a different HOA, and they have no security cameras. There are isolated cases of vandalism in every neighborhood, even CV and RSF. To claim security or vandalism is a problem in these high end neighborhoods is simply an exaggeration.
The Rising River, Palomino, and Tea Tree/Castello homes are 3 distinct classes of homes. Palomino is a typical 4S tract home with lots of sqft crammed into a small lot and close neighbors. Rising River is a wannabe mini-estate home with decent lots (1/3 acre) and incrementally better features and street presence. Comparable tracts are the Ivy Gates in south 4s or Mirasol in SantaLuz. Tea Tree(savenna) and castello (salviati) homes are actual estate homes on minimum ½ acre lots featuring estate attributes such as multi courtyards and xtra large rooms. These homes are just a half notch below the posada homes in SantaLuz in terms overall quality, value and prestige. A better comparison without location consideration would be the larger homes in Stonebridge or the Bouganvilla tract in CV, although the long single point entrance and power lines in stoneridge are hard to swallow.
Attempting an apples to apples comparison by assuming common 4500 sqft, I would price these 3 classes of homes as follows. 2000 & 2002 prices are unfinished as new, while peak prices include finished interiors and landscaping.
2000 2002 Peak
4S (largest model) 700K 775K 1.2M
Avaron (Avg model) 750K 850K 1.4M
Savenna(smallest model) 800K 900K 1.8MPrice stability of Avaron homes are the most questionable in bear markets imo as negative features are magnified. As previously posted, the main road in this development is used as a prime access point by the folks in Crosby. For me, this would be a deal breaker similar to having power lines in your backyard.
Participant[quote=HomeShopping]Cabal,
Pay closer attention the next time you visit your friend. Bel Etage/Savenna/Salviati have security cameras at their gates. I heard about the vandalism and need for cameras directly from a resident.
If you’re still confused, their HOA website has meeting minutes (page 3 from March 6, 2008):
“Board has reviewed need for cameras at gate entrances due to increased vandalism. Installation will begin at the Coyote entrance.”
http://www.beletage-savenna.com/show_file.php?id=16640&type_lib=22
I think the homes in those communities are nice. Just think that security is a problem.[/quote]
I was up that way about a month ago. Didn’t know the 2 developments installed cameras recently since I haven’t been in there in awhile. My friends house is in the 3rd development, which is apparently under a different HOA, and they have no security cameras. There are isolated cases of vandalism in every neighborhood, even CV and RSF. To claim security or vandalism is a problem in these high end neighborhoods is simply an exaggeration.
The Rising River, Palomino, and Tea Tree/Castello homes are 3 distinct classes of homes. Palomino is a typical 4S tract home with lots of sqft crammed into a small lot and close neighbors. Rising River is a wannabe mini-estate home with decent lots (1/3 acre) and incrementally better features and street presence. Comparable tracts are the Ivy Gates in south 4s or Mirasol in SantaLuz. Tea Tree(savenna) and castello (salviati) homes are actual estate homes on minimum ½ acre lots featuring estate attributes such as multi courtyards and xtra large rooms. These homes are just a half notch below the posada homes in SantaLuz in terms overall quality, value and prestige. A better comparison without location consideration would be the larger homes in Stonebridge or the Bouganvilla tract in CV, although the long single point entrance and power lines in stoneridge are hard to swallow.
Attempting an apples to apples comparison by assuming common 4500 sqft, I would price these 3 classes of homes as follows. 2000 & 2002 prices are unfinished as new, while peak prices include finished interiors and landscaping.
2000 2002 Peak
4S (largest model) 700K 775K 1.2M
Avaron (Avg model) 750K 850K 1.4M
Savenna(smallest model) 800K 900K 1.8MPrice stability of Avaron homes are the most questionable in bear markets imo as negative features are magnified. As previously posted, the main road in this development is used as a prime access point by the folks in Crosby. For me, this would be a deal breaker similar to having power lines in your backyard.
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