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bearishgurl
Participant[quote=Blogstar]Look at how comfortable we seem to be selling pipe dreams to our kids though.
Dreams of going to college(expensive and time consuming) and moving from friends and family and community for work that maybe pays a little better …but they might get a house, with the right future part time parent buying partner. That’s fine, but I bet it isn’t for a lot of kids(people) even if from “good” families. THe way you paint it BG, I hope almost everyone fails to launch , for their own sake.Some people need to have different priorities than all that, even if the end looking under achiever instead of a degreed cubicle rat. Heaven forbid , our kids look a little like underachieving artist types or “only a fireman” or something like that. I just tell mine that if you want to make your hobbies your priority , you might have to learn to live on little means, but you have to take care of yourself. There are no guarantees either way.[/quote]
Russ, I didn’t need to “sell” any “pipe dreams” to any of my kids. They’ve got eyes and ears. While in HS, they could easily see how well the twenty-something siblings of their HS friends who were still living at “home” were doing, while trying to pretend to be serious about attending CC taking 1-2 classes at a time into perpetuity and working at Roberto’s Taco Shack slash/ partying on the weekends with their HS homies who elected to stay behind at the family homestead after HS. Several of them were parents at the age of 19 and again at 21 and 23 years old …. unmarried, of course and still living with mom and/or dad.
I hope things work out for your kids if they elect not to attend college. If they stay in the homestead after HS, at the very least they should check into ROP programs at your nearby Cuyamaca College. All the CA CC’s are now ramping up ROP programs at the expense of class selection for prospective university transfer students. Some of those trades (HVAC for one) start at $30-$35 hr for a journeyman (new ROP graduate). Just a suggestion, FWIW ….
Participant[quote=FlyerInHi]BG, you’re opposed to any new development in San Diego so that your kids have to look for jobs elsewhere. That’s really smart. One day, you’ll retire out in the woods, and you think that your kids will make the trek to visit you every weekend?
You’re basking in self congratulation for owning a home, but San Diego is becoming so expensive that buyers need money from elsewhere or a trust fund to buy. Even if one has a good job, if you buy at the wrong time and suffer a layoff, you can lose your down payment in a forced sale due to relocation.
Bottom line, is that we need a large diversified, globally connected economy, and all the building and bright lights that come with it.
You’re lucky your kids are staying in california, but so many others have to relocate to Dallas, Phoenix, Orlando, etc…. Lots of young people will only have an average paying job. They can’t buy a normal $500k house and make it in Cali. So they will relocate. That’s fine if you believe that normal, but all the california natives who are “priced in”, their kids and grandkids will not be living near them.[/quote]
It doesn’t matter what I am opposed to, FIH. The horse sprinted through the open barn door ages ago. SD County is already developed to the max. My kid(s) who are working already make more than the “average” salary. If I should “move to the woods,” I will be 4-6 hours closer to them.
Yes, I do feel it is dicey to take out a large mortgage if any of the borrower(s) jobs are not secure. I didn’t experience that because, except for my last home purchase which I purchased on my own qualifications only, me and my “co-borrower” had very secure jobs to use when applying for the mortgages we took out over the years.
What is wrong with putting $150K – $300K down and just borrowing $300K or less? A working couple in “professional” fields can save this amount of money easily in 2-3 years by living frugally. This CAN BE DONE! One doesn’t have to have a large home, a newer home OR a perfect home for their first home.
Of course, this “savings budget” presupposes that the couple does NOT have any kids or student loans, rents a smallish unit in a cheaper area and drives paid-for vehicles while amassing their downpayment savings.
A millenial can certainly buy a smallish, older cosmetic fixer for their first home. That’s what my generation did. If this is good enough for the goose, its good enough for the gander.
The young college graduates who aren’t making a living wage today either majored in the wrong field in college and/or refuse to relocate out of a lower-paying area for a job, plain and simple.
As to your last (edited in) comment, I don’t mind that my kids have to relocate to make a living wage. This was all known to me that they would have to do this as early as 1990 (before the youngest was even born). It’s okay. I’m originally from the bay area and know my way around, lol. Their dad is a Native San Diegan with close relatives in San Jose and Castro Valley who have lived there since the early-mid ’60’s.
It’s all good :=)
Participantflu, if the checkstub you posted was YOUR old checkstub, it must have been from a job in the bay area. SD companies don’t pay like that … especially years ago.
Yeah, I agree about the low net pay. Even gov’mt lawyers were making that net pay (and lower) back when I worked with them ~15 years ago, mostly due to heavy deductions for dependent medical plans (spouses were very expensive) and their 457 plans. Especially the ones who were planning on “retiring” in <10 years.
Yes, I also brown-bagged my lunch every day for three decades as did most of my co-workers (including attorneys). Lunch (and dtn pkg) eat up a LOT of money every week while trying to support a family. We only got $60 month for a parking stipend on our paychecks when dtn parking cost $110 to $150 month around the year 2000. OR, you could apply the stipend to the cost of a monthly bus/trolley pass but I never did because I used ~3 lunches per week to conduct all my family's errands so I could ensure picking up my kid(s) from daycare/after-school care by 6:00 pm. (I routinely kept an ice chest in the trunk.) I'm sure the stipend is higher today for current workers but so is downtown parking and a monthly bus/trolley pass. So it's all relative.
ParticipantWhen it comes to housing, I think Asians just prefer “new” and “big” if they can get it. And having an existing Asian population (and infrastructure) already there and good colleges nearby doesn’t hurt.
I don’t think they care whether its on or near the ocean or not. Consider the inland heavily polluted and unzoned h@ll (mixed with comm’l and mfg) that they’re coming from. Anyplace looks and smells better than that … and having the oppty to purchase *new* housing is a bonus!
Participant[quote=flyer]Agree with everyone’s comments. As mentioned, many do very well after college, as our kids have, and as you’ve said your kids have. Most here would be in the top 20% or higher, so that doesn’t surprise me.
The main issue we’re seeing with kids who have been raised in San Diego, and CA in general, is that they have a difficult time finding the job they want in San Diego or CA, and don’t want to relocate.
That’s what I meant when I said many can’t get the jobs they want, where they want them. BG, you’re kids sound like they are doing great in the Bay Area, but quite a few we know don’t want to go up there due to the cost of living, weather, etc., so, again, they are limited by the choices they are willing to make.
Apparently, many parents are not telling their kids degrees do not come with guarantees, and I won’t even go into how disillusioned they are when they find out they can’t afford homes in the golden state–but we’ve been down that thread before.[/quote]
My youngest would prefer to stay in LA for work after college … preferably their current “stomping ground” which is Pasadena and points east/southeast to the county line. That’s not to say they wouldn’t take a job in an OC financial center mecca (16-25 miles from where they currently reside). The cost of living is far less in the SGV (the lesser-expensive cities) than it is anywhere in the bay-area counties.
I think Gen Y CAN afford a home, even in the bay area … if they have a prospective “buying partner” (preferably spouse), both prospective buyers are working FT in their respective fields and they save as much as possible every month for 2-3 years while they DON’T have any kids. Also, to be able to buy in close-in bay-area counties, many of them need to lower their housing expectations to a 3/2/2 older home. Of course, having a prospective “buying partner” with an outstanding student loan liability is a HUGE deterrent to being able to afford a home.
flyer, a Native San Diegan recent college graduate MUST be willing to relocate if they want to get a chance at making a living wage or better, or, some cases, work in their fields of major at all. If they’re still in their parents back bdrm (for “free” or nearly so) ~3 years after college graduation hanging with their HS homies on weekends and working in a local restaurant/retail, then their parents have been too soft on them, imho.
The millenial recent college grads are still young and can always return to SD County later for a new job after they have amassed a stockpile of cash somewhere else which is cheaper to live in … that is, if they still want to by then.
Participant[quote=FlyerInHi][quote=bearishgurl]I wonder how much longer new exurban TX “mcmansion subdivisions” will remain relatively cheap, now that the Chinese buyer is interested. Nearly all of them seem to be built around some kind of a manmade lake or pond, lol ….
There are a lot of good colleges in TX, as well and I’m sure that is attractive to the Chinese buyer.[/quote]
Feng shui principles highly favor water features.
Dallas and Houston are big. If I were starting from nothing, it’s go there. Pay cash for a 1 bedroom condo and then move on up.It’s a little redneck away from the big cities, but that’s the price for lots of land.[/quote]
Geographically, Dallas and Houston Metro areas are HUGE! The population in those areas are less than major CA cities because the density there is much lower. They’re still BIG cities, though, with sophisticated freeway systems. Their highways are in much better shape than Cali’s, as well.
ParticipantI wonder how much longer new exurban TX “mcmansion subdivisions” will remain relatively cheap, now that the Chinese buyer is interested. Nearly all of them seem to be built around some kind of a manmade lake or pond, lol ….
There are a lot of good colleges in TX, as well and I’m sure that is attractive to the Chinese buyer.
Participant[quote=njtosd]. . . Our oldest is approaching college and guess which one of them is having the most difficulty with that? . . . [/quote]
If you don’t mind sharing, nj, which colleges did your kid apply to?
Participant[quote=flu][quote=bearishgurl][quote=flu]Oh please… stop the blame game will you? Asian purchases account for 20-30% of new home purchases, and mostly at the higher end where most of you are not shopping.
Even in socal, the concentration of purchases are in the markets that are $1million+. If you want to blame foreign purchases maybe you should get your fvcking facts straight and blame canadians, since as a group, theyve are the largest foreign buyers even more than chibese. And their purchase price points are considerably lower, probably in the submarket where most of you would be looking.[/quote]
I saw that article yesterday. Chinese buyers are also scarfing up condos in CA coastal counties for all cash, as well. These properties aren’t in the $1M+ range. They buy them for their kids future use to go to college. IIRC, there is a couple in that article on the tour bus who brought their 8 year-old with them and stated they wanted it for him to use for college. In the meantime, they’ll lease it out.
I realize that US buyers with minor children really don’t want to raise their own kids in condos but in some (expensive) sub-markets, that’s all they can afford unless they want to add a lot of extra commute time to their workday.[/quote]
Look at the percentage of Canadian buyers. Even so who the fvck cares..some has money, its legal, buy. Its called capitalism.[/quote]
I understand. I believe you. I honestly don’t care because the type of properties the Chinese buyer is attracted to do not generally interest me. So the fact that they’re buying every listing they like in coastal counties which is not nailed down (and immediately contracting them with local property mgrs) doesn’t bother me in the least.
In the SGV, this started happening en masse in early 2009, except that it was Chinese, Taiwanese and Vietnamese buyers (all cash). This subset of mostly prospective small business owners (who already had relatives settled in the area clueing them in that a RE “free-for-all” was going on there at the time) didn’t buy new homes/condos (cuz there aren’t any there) and didn’t pay $1M for 95% of those properties.
Some of them bought 4-6 (distressed) units at once in ONE condo complex.
You’re right, flu. It’s capitalism at work and survival of the fittest.
ParticipantHere is the same article posted yesterday by FIH on the “Best Family Areas” thread. This one has a video link.
Participant[quote=flu]Oh please… stop the blame game will you? Asian purchases account for 20-30% of new home purchases, and mostly at the higher end where most of you are not shopping.
Even in socal, the concentration of purchases are in the markets that are $1million+. If you want to blame foreign purchases maybe you should get your fvcking facts straight and blame canadians, since as a group, theyve are the largest foreign buyers even more than chibese. And their purchase price points are considerably lower, probably in the submarket where most of you would be looking.[/quote]
I saw that article yesterday. Chinese buyers are also scarfing up condos in CA coastal counties for all cash, as well. These properties aren’t in the $1M+ range. They buy them for their kids future use to go to college. IIRC, there is a couple in that article on the tour bus who brought their 8 year-old with them and stated they wanted it for him to use for college. In the meantime, they’ll lease it out.
I realize that US buyers with minor children really don’t want to raise their own kids in condos but in some (expensive) sub-markets, that’s all they can afford unless they want to add a lot of extra commute time to their workday.
Participant[quote=The-Shoveler]IMO they are just forcing the issue too much.
Everyone is now being strongly advised to go to a 4 year college (primed from grade school on).
It used to not be that way and I expect there are a number who really would be better off not incurring the expense and time of college.
Before I think only those who were really inclined would go.[/quote]
Your last statement was true back in “my day.” However, one didn’t need a college degree to land a job which was good enough to get married, begin raising a family and qualify for a home loan back then. And we were happy to buy an older 3/2 SFR in an aging area where today’s millenials (at least in SD) are not.
In my youngest kids’ case, I will only be out $30K to $35K for their 4-5 years of college (all room and board expense). All their other expenses are taken care of by a state tuition-only waiver and a scholarship of $5850 to $7350 annually, depending on if they attend summer term or not. If they graduate with a BS or BS/MS with experience from internships and get study materials and assistance with studying for the CPA exam from the business dept, it will be totally worth it.
ParticipantA lot of college students seem to be too tatooed and have fallen down on their grooming and dress to present themselves correctly for an interview. That may be why some of your friends’ kids can’t find a job in their (professional) field. That and their refusal to leave their (comfy) parents’ home (inside the convenant?) to interview up in the likes of Sac, Fresno, or wherever an opening they’re qualified for presents itself.
Participant[quote=flyer]No question there are many people doing well without college as you described, FIH, and, as noted in the excerpt I mentioned below,
“One of the country’s most-sought-after employers, Google, has found that it is increasingly hiring people without college degrees because the signal of the credential is no longer as clear as it used to be that someone is job ready.
If colleges don’t provide the mix of academic and practical experiences that students need and students fail to take advantage of them, pretty soon we’ll see other employers looking for alternatives to the college degree as well.”
All of that is great, but, wrt to those who do attend college, it has been my experience having raised three kids who graduated from college, that around 100% of the kids who are planning for college, are in college, or have completed college, believe they will get exactly what they want when they graduate, and, from what we’ve seen, many seem to be completely amazed when it doesn’t work out that way. This has even been the case for many with advanced degrees.
Guess I shouldn’t be shocked, but I have to admit,
I was surprised to see these stats. Apparently, there is a huge disconnect somewhere between perception and reality for many when it comes to this issue.[/quote]flyer, my youngest is a college sophomore majoring in accounting and just received a perfectly decent current black suit from a sibling who bought it at a designer consignment shop in SF. I’m getting them a very nice leather designer accessory to go with that black suit for x-mas as they will be going out on interviews for internships (start-date next fall) in the first half of 2016. The school they attend is heavy on internships beginning in the junior year and utilizes a “learn by doing” philosophy in the classroom. Besides doing well in upper-division courses, part of that “learn by doing” is developing “presence” by looking, walking and talking the part, looking like you’re “worth it,” developing credible interview skills and getting early internship experience. Indoctrination into a Greek organization also helps a college student get a “leg up” on chances for valuable internships because of the work they do out in the community. In addition, this school has placement services and very well-connected longtime professors (as does Cal State Northridge and SFSU). At least four of the CSU’s (and maybe more) do NOT use TA’s to teach a class … only full professors.
A good friend’s 23-yo daughter is graduating with a dual-degree (BS & MS) in accounting in ten days from a state university and has already passed two out of four sections of the CPA exam. She secured a position at THE biggest accounting firm in the state back in June, with a reporting date of 1/11/16 and already has a 1 br apt lined up less than a mile from work. A lot of universities around the country are now offering the BS/MS option or BS/MBA option in their business schools to be completed in 5.5 or 6 years (utilizing summer term(s)) with ONE graduation ceremony. Business students who sign up for this option receive their 500-level (Master’s level classes) at the same tuition price as their undergrad classes and can take them simultaneously with undergrad classes. It’s a great option for serious business students who want to graduate with a career.
There IS value in graduating from a CA public university but it’s dependent on what the student makes of their time there. I have a neighbor who graduated 1.5 years ago from UCSD with a microbiology degree (who I helped get on Medi-Cal) and cannot find a job (doesn’t want to leave SD) and thus is working part time locally for $13 hr.
And, in business, personality, presence and connections have a lot to do with success, especially to get that first foot in the door starting out.
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