[barnaby33]

Just keep in mind that up valley Napa is a really small sample size. The town of Napa isn’t very big either. It is interesting to hear that someone (though the source isn’t named) feels prices are heading back to 1999. Maybe the bubble in house prices in Napa started early? A lot of tech boom money flowed up there.

Josh

[barnaby33]

Just keep in mind that up valley Napa is a really small sample size. The town of Napa isn’t very big either. It is interesting to hear that someone (though the source isn’t named) feels prices are heading back to 1999. Maybe the bubble in house prices in Napa started early? A lot of tech boom money flowed up there.

Josh

[barnaby33]

Just keep in mind that up valley Napa is a really small sample size. The town of Napa isn’t very big either. It is interesting to hear that someone (though the source isn’t named) feels prices are heading back to 1999. Maybe the bubble in house prices in Napa started early? A lot of tech boom money flowed up there.

Josh

[barnaby33]

I’ll bite, how are my two statements mutually exclusive? Deposits are insured by the FDIC and taxpayers. The CDS book upon which the bank has either sold or bought insurance to have “money good” assets is not. If Citi were to go through bankruptcy, yes there would be a sale of assets, fire sale I don’t know about, since I doubt any Citi bk could be quick. So if citi has X billion in deposits those are going to get paid back to investors. If however they have XXX billion in outstanding CDS liability (bought or sold) why are we on the hook for that? If so what you are saying is that the taxpayer is on the hook for all that leverage as opposed to the stock and then bond holders.

Josh

[barnaby33]

I’ll bite, how are my two statements mutually exclusive? Deposits are insured by the FDIC and taxpayers. The CDS book upon which the bank has either sold or bought insurance to have “money good” assets is not. If Citi were to go through bankruptcy, yes there would be a sale of assets, fire sale I don’t know about, since I doubt any Citi bk could be quick. So if citi has X billion in deposits those are going to get paid back to investors. If however they have XXX billion in outstanding CDS liability (bought or sold) why are we on the hook for that? If so what you are saying is that the taxpayer is on the hook for all that leverage as opposed to the stock and then bond holders.

Josh

[barnaby33]

I’ll bite, how are my two statements mutually exclusive? Deposits are insured by the FDIC and taxpayers. The CDS book upon which the bank has either sold or bought insurance to have “money good” assets is not. If Citi were to go through bankruptcy, yes there would be a sale of assets, fire sale I don’t know about, since I doubt any Citi bk could be quick. So if citi has X billion in deposits those are going to get paid back to investors. If however they have XXX billion in outstanding CDS liability (bought or sold) why are we on the hook for that? If so what you are saying is that the taxpayer is on the hook for all that leverage as opposed to the stock and then bond holders.

Josh

[barnaby33]

I’ll bite, how are my two statements mutually exclusive? Deposits are insured by the FDIC and taxpayers. The CDS book upon which the bank has either sold or bought insurance to have “money good” assets is not. If Citi were to go through bankruptcy, yes there would be a sale of assets, fire sale I don’t know about, since I doubt any Citi bk could be quick. So if citi has X billion in deposits those are going to get paid back to investors. If however they have XXX billion in outstanding CDS liability (bought or sold) why are we on the hook for that? If so what you are saying is that the taxpayer is on the hook for all that leverage as opposed to the stock and then bond holders.

Josh

[barnaby33]

I’ll bite, how are my two statements mutually exclusive? Deposits are insured by the FDIC and taxpayers. The CDS book upon which the bank has either sold or bought insurance to have “money good” assets is not. If Citi were to go through bankruptcy, yes there would be a sale of assets, fire sale I don’t know about, since I doubt any Citi bk could be quick. So if citi has X billion in deposits those are going to get paid back to investors. If however they have XXX billion in outstanding CDS liability (bought or sold) why are we on the hook for that? If so what you are saying is that the taxpayer is on the hook for all that leverage as opposed to the stock and then bond holders.

Josh

[barnaby33]

That is generally embarassing to the challengers.

Ah Chris thanks for parachuting in from on high and sharing with us your proverbial wisdom. I truly feel for you buddy. It must be downright scary to be forced to write such gems as

I do not like being in agreement with so many amateurs who think we are going way lower.

I can only imagine the sturm und drung you must suffer to so successfully ascend from the lofty hights to wallow with us commoners.

As to daveljs comments, I don’t happen to agree with his line of thinking but he is technically correct in that no matter which path we choose its going to be expensive. The problem is we can pretty accurately know what it will cost to make depositors whole, but the stealth bailouts with no transparency have no practical upper limit. Leaving out the moral and fairness issues, we still as taxpayers don’t have any idea how big the CDS books of these banks are, or how many banks the Fed is going to bailout. We do know that regulations don’t seem to apply to the largest banks and that there is a blank check written on all Americans accounts to bail them out.

So since I haven’t seen anything from our political leadership that shows they actually understand the problems, and are willing to confront them (Like defang the CDS monster). I’ll just go on assuming that the money is being poured down the rat hole to bailout politically well connected institutions, without a real plan to de-zombiefy them.

Josh

[barnaby33]

That is generally embarassing to the challengers.

Ah Chris thanks for parachuting in from on high and sharing with us your proverbial wisdom. I truly feel for you buddy. It must be downright scary to be forced to write such gems as

I do not like being in agreement with so many amateurs who think we are going way lower.

I can only imagine the sturm und drung you must suffer to so successfully ascend from the lofty hights to wallow with us commoners.

As to daveljs comments, I don’t happen to agree with his line of thinking but he is technically correct in that no matter which path we choose its going to be expensive. The problem is we can pretty accurately know what it will cost to make depositors whole, but the stealth bailouts with no transparency have no practical upper limit. Leaving out the moral and fairness issues, we still as taxpayers don’t have any idea how big the CDS books of these banks are, or how many banks the Fed is going to bailout. We do know that regulations don’t seem to apply to the largest banks and that there is a blank check written on all Americans accounts to bail them out.

So since I haven’t seen anything from our political leadership that shows they actually understand the problems, and are willing to confront them (Like defang the CDS monster). I’ll just go on assuming that the money is being poured down the rat hole to bailout politically well connected institutions, without a real plan to de-zombiefy them.

Josh

[barnaby33]

That is generally embarassing to the challengers.

Ah Chris thanks for parachuting in from on high and sharing with us your proverbial wisdom. I truly feel for you buddy. It must be downright scary to be forced to write such gems as

I do not like being in agreement with so many amateurs who think we are going way lower.

I can only imagine the sturm und drung you must suffer to so successfully ascend from the lofty hights to wallow with us commoners.

As to daveljs comments, I don’t happen to agree with his line of thinking but he is technically correct in that no matter which path we choose its going to be expensive. The problem is we can pretty accurately know what it will cost to make depositors whole, but the stealth bailouts with no transparency have no practical upper limit. Leaving out the moral and fairness issues, we still as taxpayers don’t have any idea how big the CDS books of these banks are, or how many banks the Fed is going to bailout. We do know that regulations don’t seem to apply to the largest banks and that there is a blank check written on all Americans accounts to bail them out.

So since I haven’t seen anything from our political leadership that shows they actually understand the problems, and are willing to confront them (Like defang the CDS monster). I’ll just go on assuming that the money is being poured down the rat hole to bailout politically well connected institutions, without a real plan to de-zombiefy them.

Josh

[barnaby33]

That is generally embarassing to the challengers.

Ah Chris thanks for parachuting in from on high and sharing with us your proverbial wisdom. I truly feel for you buddy. It must be downright scary to be forced to write such gems as

I do not like being in agreement with so many amateurs who think we are going way lower.

I can only imagine the sturm und drung you must suffer to so successfully ascend from the lofty hights to wallow with us commoners.

As to daveljs comments, I don’t happen to agree with his line of thinking but he is technically correct in that no matter which path we choose its going to be expensive. The problem is we can pretty accurately know what it will cost to make depositors whole, but the stealth bailouts with no transparency have no practical upper limit. Leaving out the moral and fairness issues, we still as taxpayers don’t have any idea how big the CDS books of these banks are, or how many banks the Fed is going to bailout. We do know that regulations don’t seem to apply to the largest banks and that there is a blank check written on all Americans accounts to bail them out.

So since I haven’t seen anything from our political leadership that shows they actually understand the problems, and are willing to confront them (Like defang the CDS monster). I’ll just go on assuming that the money is being poured down the rat hole to bailout politically well connected institutions, without a real plan to de-zombiefy them.

Josh

[barnaby33]

That is generally embarassing to the challengers.

Ah Chris thanks for parachuting in from on high and sharing with us your proverbial wisdom. I truly feel for you buddy. It must be downright scary to be forced to write such gems as

I do not like being in agreement with so many amateurs who think we are going way lower.

I can only imagine the sturm und drung you must suffer to so successfully ascend from the lofty hights to wallow with us commoners.

As to daveljs comments, I don’t happen to agree with his line of thinking but he is technically correct in that no matter which path we choose its going to be expensive. The problem is we can pretty accurately know what it will cost to make depositors whole, but the stealth bailouts with no transparency have no practical upper limit. Leaving out the moral and fairness issues, we still as taxpayers don’t have any idea how big the CDS books of these banks are, or how many banks the Fed is going to bailout. We do know that regulations don’t seem to apply to the largest banks and that there is a blank check written on all Americans accounts to bail them out.

So since I haven’t seen anything from our political leadership that shows they actually understand the problems, and are willing to confront them (Like defang the CDS monster). I’ll just go on assuming that the money is being poured down the rat hole to bailout politically well connected institutions, without a real plan to de-zombiefy them.

Josh

[barnaby33]

The danger of these institutions, and why they should be taken under by the govt is not that they “couldn’t” become profitable. The danger is the institutional greed and stupidity that created this mess isn’t going to be dissipated unless the companies that engage in this kind of behavior go out of business.

It isn’t the job of govt to coddle the banks, well apparently it is the job because that’s whats happening.

I may be solvent someday, but if I stop making my mortgage payments today, they take my house away. The difference with the banks (citi bofa wells etc) is they are politically well connected.

Our elected leadership doesn’t even bother to lay out the case of WHY allowing these banks to either go bankrupt, or be taken under poses a systemic risk. They just tell us that this is necessary and pour TRILLIONS down the rat hole. There is no free lunch davelj. Whats left of the middle class is getting royally buttfucked to bail out people who made some of the worst choices imaginable.

These institutions have become poisonous in many respects. They have committed huge amounts of fraud. They have distorted markets, played a huge role in blowing a massive bubble and probably are not able to stand on their own. Citi for certain, several other large money center banks most likely.
Josh

[barnaby33]

The danger of these institutions, and why they should be taken under by the govt is not that they “couldn’t” become profitable. The danger is the institutional greed and stupidity that created this mess isn’t going to be dissipated unless the companies that engage in this kind of behavior go out of business.

It isn’t the job of govt to coddle the banks, well apparently it is the job because that’s whats happening.

I may be solvent someday, but if I stop making my mortgage payments today, they take my house away. The difference with the banks (citi bofa wells etc) is they are politically well connected.

Our elected leadership doesn’t even bother to lay out the case of WHY allowing these banks to either go bankrupt, or be taken under poses a systemic risk. They just tell us that this is necessary and pour TRILLIONS down the rat hole. There is no free lunch davelj. Whats left of the middle class is getting royally buttfucked to bail out people who made some of the worst choices imaginable.

These institutions have become poisonous in many respects. They have committed huge amounts of fraud. They have distorted markets, played a huge role in blowing a massive bubble and probably are not able to stand on their own. Citi for certain, several other large money center banks most likely.
Josh

[Author]

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