Home › Forums › Financial Markets/Economics › What are the real unemployment numbers?
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Werewolf.
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December 7, 2008 at 10:15 PM #313207December 7, 2008 at 11:17 PM #312748
barnaby33Participantsocratt, it seems you are making a tempest in a teapot. Its not important that the govt lies (it does that constantly.) Its only important that they lie consistently, which is what people like econprof are getting at.
The unemployment number is a good relative fear gauge. One could argue that the birth/death and other hedonic adjustments are the govt attempting to lie, but if so that is only at the margin. Whats important isn’t the lie itself, but the consistency of its telling. Were you concerned when unemployment was at its lowest point ever pre dot com crash? 3% of the work force was still unemployed? If not why so concerned now at 7+ percent? Its the relative change that worries you I’m betting.
Either way, we’re fucked. Have a nice day!
Josh
December 7, 2008 at 11:17 PM #313105barnaby33Participantsocratt, it seems you are making a tempest in a teapot. Its not important that the govt lies (it does that constantly.) Its only important that they lie consistently, which is what people like econprof are getting at.
The unemployment number is a good relative fear gauge. One could argue that the birth/death and other hedonic adjustments are the govt attempting to lie, but if so that is only at the margin. Whats important isn’t the lie itself, but the consistency of its telling. Were you concerned when unemployment was at its lowest point ever pre dot com crash? 3% of the work force was still unemployed? If not why so concerned now at 7+ percent? Its the relative change that worries you I’m betting.
Either way, we’re fucked. Have a nice day!
Josh
December 7, 2008 at 11:17 PM #313136barnaby33Participantsocratt, it seems you are making a tempest in a teapot. Its not important that the govt lies (it does that constantly.) Its only important that they lie consistently, which is what people like econprof are getting at.
The unemployment number is a good relative fear gauge. One could argue that the birth/death and other hedonic adjustments are the govt attempting to lie, but if so that is only at the margin. Whats important isn’t the lie itself, but the consistency of its telling. Were you concerned when unemployment was at its lowest point ever pre dot com crash? 3% of the work force was still unemployed? If not why so concerned now at 7+ percent? Its the relative change that worries you I’m betting.
Either way, we’re fucked. Have a nice day!
Josh
December 7, 2008 at 11:17 PM #313159barnaby33Participantsocratt, it seems you are making a tempest in a teapot. Its not important that the govt lies (it does that constantly.) Its only important that they lie consistently, which is what people like econprof are getting at.
The unemployment number is a good relative fear gauge. One could argue that the birth/death and other hedonic adjustments are the govt attempting to lie, but if so that is only at the margin. Whats important isn’t the lie itself, but the consistency of its telling. Were you concerned when unemployment was at its lowest point ever pre dot com crash? 3% of the work force was still unemployed? If not why so concerned now at 7+ percent? Its the relative change that worries you I’m betting.
Either way, we’re fucked. Have a nice day!
Josh
December 7, 2008 at 11:17 PM #313227barnaby33Participantsocratt, it seems you are making a tempest in a teapot. Its not important that the govt lies (it does that constantly.) Its only important that they lie consistently, which is what people like econprof are getting at.
The unemployment number is a good relative fear gauge. One could argue that the birth/death and other hedonic adjustments are the govt attempting to lie, but if so that is only at the margin. Whats important isn’t the lie itself, but the consistency of its telling. Were you concerned when unemployment was at its lowest point ever pre dot com crash? 3% of the work force was still unemployed? If not why so concerned now at 7+ percent? Its the relative change that worries you I’m betting.
Either way, we’re fucked. Have a nice day!
Josh
December 8, 2008 at 1:06 PM #312923socrattt
ParticipantBarnaby, I appreciate the eloquent post. I am not trying to prove anyone right or wrong, I am just making a point and discussing where I think the numbers are currently at. Of course the government consistently hides information hence the definition of propaganda which happens in every country.
This country is in a bad position, but those who work hard and smart will thrive in this climate. I enjoy having to be creative when markets are going the other way. Unfortunately the majority of this country is standing in a virtual line waiting for a government handout.
Eventually the greed and ignorance will be minimized and those who couldn’t afford the big house, big car, big ego will be feel the greatest pain!
December 8, 2008 at 1:06 PM #313279ParticipantBarnaby, I appreciate the eloquent post. I am not trying to prove anyone right or wrong, I am just making a point and discussing where I think the numbers are currently at. Of course the government consistently hides information hence the definition of propaganda which happens in every country.
This country is in a bad position, but those who work hard and smart will thrive in this climate. I enjoy having to be creative when markets are going the other way. Unfortunately the majority of this country is standing in a virtual line waiting for a government handout.
Eventually the greed and ignorance will be minimized and those who couldn’t afford the big house, big car, big ego will be feel the greatest pain!
December 8, 2008 at 1:06 PM #313311ParticipantBarnaby, I appreciate the eloquent post. I am not trying to prove anyone right or wrong, I am just making a point and discussing where I think the numbers are currently at. Of course the government consistently hides information hence the definition of propaganda which happens in every country.
This country is in a bad position, but those who work hard and smart will thrive in this climate. I enjoy having to be creative when markets are going the other way. Unfortunately the majority of this country is standing in a virtual line waiting for a government handout.
Eventually the greed and ignorance will be minimized and those who couldn’t afford the big house, big car, big ego will be feel the greatest pain!
December 8, 2008 at 1:06 PM #313333ParticipantBarnaby, I appreciate the eloquent post. I am not trying to prove anyone right or wrong, I am just making a point and discussing where I think the numbers are currently at. Of course the government consistently hides information hence the definition of propaganda which happens in every country.
This country is in a bad position, but those who work hard and smart will thrive in this climate. I enjoy having to be creative when markets are going the other way. Unfortunately the majority of this country is standing in a virtual line waiting for a government handout.
Eventually the greed and ignorance will be minimized and those who couldn’t afford the big house, big car, big ego will be feel the greatest pain!
December 8, 2008 at 1:06 PM #313402ParticipantBarnaby, I appreciate the eloquent post. I am not trying to prove anyone right or wrong, I am just making a point and discussing where I think the numbers are currently at. Of course the government consistently hides information hence the definition of propaganda which happens in every country.
This country is in a bad position, but those who work hard and smart will thrive in this climate. I enjoy having to be creative when markets are going the other way. Unfortunately the majority of this country is standing in a virtual line waiting for a government handout.
Eventually the greed and ignorance will be minimized and those who couldn’t afford the big house, big car, big ego will be feel the greatest pain!
January 10, 2009 at 8:01 AM #326683Anonymous
GuestI think the numbers are incredible. I can also point out another flaw in the system. I am a single mother of two. I have been declared disabled by doctors. However the government still counts me as employable because I am not eligible for disability (the doctors cannot come up with a firm diagnoses). Because of my disability I am unable to work or unable to work very much. I also do not qualify for unemployment benefits, because I can’t work very much, I did not make enough at my last 3 jobs to qualify.
My disability forces me to collect food stamps to feed my children. And because of the welfare reform act and the rules of employment I am unable to collect TANF to pay my bills, and buy my children clothes. In case any of you are wondering the welfare reform acts rules of participation are that if you collect TANF you must participate in work related activities or volunteer 30 hrs. a week, the amount of TANF you receive is based on your family size for my two children and myself the TANF benefits payout would be $364.00 a month (food stamps for the same household size is $464.00 a month). And I would be required to participate in work, finding work and/or volunteer hours for 30 hrs. a week to receive that. Which wouldn’t be enough to pay any bills anyway. There are quite a lot of people in this country going through the same thing I am. They are probably not helping your equations any…January 10, 2009 at 8:01 AM #327021GuestI think the numbers are incredible. I can also point out another flaw in the system. I am a single mother of two. I have been declared disabled by doctors. However the government still counts me as employable because I am not eligible for disability (the doctors cannot come up with a firm diagnoses). Because of my disability I am unable to work or unable to work very much. I also do not qualify for unemployment benefits, because I can’t work very much, I did not make enough at my last 3 jobs to qualify.
My disability forces me to collect food stamps to feed my children. And because of the welfare reform act and the rules of employment I am unable to collect TANF to pay my bills, and buy my children clothes. In case any of you are wondering the welfare reform acts rules of participation are that if you collect TANF you must participate in work related activities or volunteer 30 hrs. a week, the amount of TANF you receive is based on your family size for my two children and myself the TANF benefits payout would be $364.00 a month (food stamps for the same household size is $464.00 a month). And I would be required to participate in work, finding work and/or volunteer hours for 30 hrs. a week to receive that. Which wouldn’t be enough to pay any bills anyway. There are quite a lot of people in this country going through the same thing I am. They are probably not helping your equations any…January 10, 2009 at 8:01 AM #327093GuestI think the numbers are incredible. I can also point out another flaw in the system. I am a single mother of two. I have been declared disabled by doctors. However the government still counts me as employable because I am not eligible for disability (the doctors cannot come up with a firm diagnoses). Because of my disability I am unable to work or unable to work very much. I also do not qualify for unemployment benefits, because I can’t work very much, I did not make enough at my last 3 jobs to qualify.
My disability forces me to collect food stamps to feed my children. And because of the welfare reform act and the rules of employment I am unable to collect TANF to pay my bills, and buy my children clothes. In case any of you are wondering the welfare reform acts rules of participation are that if you collect TANF you must participate in work related activities or volunteer 30 hrs. a week, the amount of TANF you receive is based on your family size for my two children and myself the TANF benefits payout would be $364.00 a month (food stamps for the same household size is $464.00 a month). And I would be required to participate in work, finding work and/or volunteer hours for 30 hrs. a week to receive that. Which wouldn’t be enough to pay any bills anyway. There are quite a lot of people in this country going through the same thing I am. They are probably not helping your equations any…January 10, 2009 at 8:01 AM #327112GuestI think the numbers are incredible. I can also point out another flaw in the system. I am a single mother of two. I have been declared disabled by doctors. However the government still counts me as employable because I am not eligible for disability (the doctors cannot come up with a firm diagnoses). Because of my disability I am unable to work or unable to work very much. I also do not qualify for unemployment benefits, because I can’t work very much, I did not make enough at my last 3 jobs to qualify.
My disability forces me to collect food stamps to feed my children. And because of the welfare reform act and the rules of employment I am unable to collect TANF to pay my bills, and buy my children clothes. In case any of you are wondering the welfare reform acts rules of participation are that if you collect TANF you must participate in work related activities or volunteer 30 hrs. a week, the amount of TANF you receive is based on your family size for my two children and myself the TANF benefits payout would be $364.00 a month (food stamps for the same household size is $464.00 a month). And I would be required to participate in work, finding work and/or volunteer hours for 30 hrs. a week to receive that. Which wouldn’t be enough to pay any bills anyway. There are quite a lot of people in this country going through the same thing I am. They are probably not helping your equations any… -
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