South of the Border

[earlyretirement]

[quote=deadzone]early, arguing with you guys is pointless because your brains are so cluttered with sensationalist fearmongouring stories you can’t think straight.

I never said their are no risks in Mexico. But you guys insist that it is significantly MORE dangerouse than before, and I argue that it is not. You guys have no evididence to prove that it is more dangerous.

Was Baja a “sketchy” place to visit 10 or 20 years ago? I would say yes. But you guys are arguing as if it was some utopian place a few years ago and now all of a suddent it is a war zone. The fact is it is neither. Baja was a crap hole 20 years ago and it still is.

But if you loved to visit Baja 10-20 years ago and all of a sudden you are too “scared” to go down there today, then you are an idiot.[/quote]

I don’t think it’s “arguing” per se. I think it’s ok to have different opinions on any given subject. The world would be a boring place if we all thought the same thing.

I think in this case it’s just a difference of opinion. You say it’s as safe as 10-20 years ago and many of us are saying we don’t believe it is. I don’t think anyone is “fear mongering”. And as I mentioned, I definitely am not saying that people shouldn’t visit Mexico or Baja.

But I will disagree with you that it’s as safe as it was 20 years ago. We can agree to disagree. That’s ok. As well, I don’t think people are saying it was some peaceful “utopia” 10-20 years ago with no problems. I think people are saying that the violence and petty crime has escalated there and they choose to avoid it now until they can get a clearer picture of things. I wouldn’t call these people idiots for choosing not to go over now.

[Anonymous]

[quote=desmond][quote=deadzone]I use Murder as an example because that is a crime that most certainly will be reported in the U.S. if it happens to an American tourist. You guys are all claiming that crime statistics are wortless since most crimes don’t get reported over there. That may be true (although you don’t really know that to be fact). Assuming that to be true, then murder is the only type of crime against Americans that we can hope to get accurately reported in the U.S.

Yet once again, nobody has provided evidence of a single American tourist murdered in Baja at any time.[/quote]

Remember that is must be a “white” person, browns don’t count. Right dz?[/quote]

Sure all colors count if they are actually tourists. Still can’t find an example can you?

[Anonymous]

early, I just find it sad that otherwise intelligent people have their opinions molded by groupthink, in this case due to the sensationalist media. In this forum, I expected more intelligent reasons for not wanting to cross the border. For example” “it is a 3rd world shit hole and I don’t speak Spanish” which has always been a good reason not to go.

But non-adventurous, paranoid people have always been averse to crossing the border or leaving their country in general. For people to say they used to like to cross and now are afraid, that is just baseless sissy bullshit, just like my paranoid red-neck step dad who won’t travel anywhere if he can’t bring along his gun, even though he has never been robbed, assaulted, mugged in his life.

[Anonymous]

[quote=deadzone][quote=desmond][quote=deadzone]I use Murder as an example because that is a crime that most certainly will be reported in the U.S. if it happens to an American tourist. You guys are all claiming that crime statistics are wortless since most crimes don’t get reported over there. That may be true (although you don’t really know that to be fact). Assuming that to be true, then murder is the only type of crime against Americans that we can hope to get accurately reported in the U.S.

Yet once again, nobody has provided evidence of a single American tourist murdered in Baja at any time.[/quote]

Remember that is must be a “white” person, browns don’t count. Right dz?[/quote]

Sure all colors count if they are actually tourists. Still can’t find an example can you?[/quote]

That said, I think it is safe to assume that few members of this forum are Mexican or Hispanic in general. So for the purpose of this discussion, the fact that murders of “non-hispanic” Americans in Mexico is virtually non-existant would suggest that it isn’t likely that anyone on this forum needs to fear for their lives if they cross the border.

[desmond]

[quote=deadzone][quote=deadzone][quote=desmond][quote=deadzone]I use Murder as an example because that is a crime that most certainly will be reported in the U.S. if it happens to an American tourist. You guys are all claiming that crime statistics are wortless since most crimes don’t get reported over there. That may be true (although you don’t really know that to be fact). Assuming that to be true, then murder is the only type of crime against Americans that we can hope to get accurately reported in the U.S.

Yet once again, nobody has provided evidence of a single American tourist murdered in Baja at any time.[/quote]

Remember that is must be a “white” person, browns don’t count. Right dz?[/quote]

Sure all colors count if they are actually tourists. Still can’t find an example can you?[/quote]

That said, I think it is safe to assume that few members of this forum are Mexican or Hispanic in general. So for the purpose of this discussion, the fact that murders of “non-hispanic” Americans in Mexico is virtually non-existant would suggest that it isn’t likely that anyone on this forum needs to fear for their lives if they cross the border.[/quote]
dz
Nobody is “paranoid” or “non-adventurous” or “idiotic” not going to Baja. Just like you said it is a “crap-hole”. I just can’t see myself dropping by Hussongs to party or bringing my old sleeping bag to camp on the beach at my age. I don’t want to drive to Ensenada to stay at the Rosarita Hotel and buy curios. The big resorts further south are fine. But TJ, Ensenada etc. is for a younger crowd or old retirees along the coast. Also, I have heard they are still using the same strippers at the small strip joints in Ensenada that I used to go to in the 80’s…

[Anonymous]

I agree with you desmond, but you are making my point. The reason you don’t want to go is lack of interest, which is valid. I only said the people who stopped going strictly due to fear of the “boogeyman” that are idiots. Although I have no first hand experience, I would bet 1000 pesos that the girls in the Ensenada strip clubs were not even born yet in the 80s.

[desmond]

[quote=deadzone]I agree with you desmond, but you are making my point. The reason you don’t want to go is lack of interest, which is valid. I only said the people who stopped going strictly due to fear of the “boogeyman” that are idiots. Although I have no first hand experience, I would bet 1000 pesos that the girls in the Ensenada strip clubs were not even born yet in the 80s.[/quote]
Let’s just hope they were at least born in the 90’s. This thread was for actually buying a place in Mexico, far different than just traveling down for a day or two.(In case you forgot) I can find lots of Americans living in Baja that have been killed.
http://www.sandiegoreader.com/weblogs/fulano_de_tal/2012/jan/15/more-north-american-deaths-in-mexico/

[Anonymous]

[quote=desmond][quote=deadzone]I agree with you desmond, but you are making my point. The reason you don’t want to go is lack of interest, which is valid. I only said the people who stopped going strictly due to fear of the “boogeyman” that are idiots. Although I have no first hand experience, I would bet 1000 pesos that the girls in the Ensenada strip clubs were not even born yet in the 80s.[/quote]
Let’s just hope they were at least born in the 90’s. This thread was for actually buying a place in Mexico, far different than just traveling down for a day or two.(In case you forgot) I can find lots of Americans living in Baja that have been killed.
http://www.sandiegoreader.com/weblogs/fulano_de_tal/2012/jan/15/more-north-american-deaths-in-mexico/%5B/quote%5D

There you go again, just desperate to convince yourself that life in Mexico is the wild west like the press wants you to belive. Well you can cherry pick a few reported incidents (although if SD REader is your only source, I would question the valididty of some of those). But in the scheme of things, it is estimated that over 1 million American expats live in Mexico. So statistically, the crime rate against Americans is extremely low.

Furthermore, do you belive foreigners are not robbed, kidnapped and murdered in the U.S? It happens all the time. I already told you about the Australian tourist nearly beaten to death in Ocean Beach, why don’t you comment on that? Don’t be such a narrow minded D-bag!

[Anonymous]

That sdreader column by the way is a perfect example of exactly what I was talking about regarding misleading, over-dramatsized, tabloid journalism. People like desmond (and most Amercicans) just aren’t smart enough to see through it and get the facts for themselves.

A quick fact check shows that the description of the Nicole Scherzinger episode was bullshit. In reality, the bullet proof car she was in was pulled over by uniformed policemen, not some “gang” and they were let go immediately. The story was totally blown out of proportion by the tabloids (really?). You are GULLIBLE!

[desmond]

[quote=deadzone]That sdreader column by the way is a perfect example of exactly what I was talking about regarding misleading, over-dramatsized, tabloid journalism. People like desmond (and most Amercicans) just aren’t smart enough to see through it and get the facts for themselves.

A quick fact check shows that the description of the Nicole Scherzinger episode was bullshit. In reality, the bullet proof car she was in was pulled over by uniformed policemen, not some “gang” and they were let go immediately. The story was totally blown out of proportion by the tabloids (really?). You are GULLIBLE![/quote]

Look, I really don’t care about Mexico. I’m not going, my family is not going. Low life old surfers can go because they have no family, friends, and drink to much. I am out……..

[Anonymous]

That’s fine if you don’t want to go, for whatever reasons. But if you are going to try to scare away others from crossing the border by propagating sensationalist stories which you have no real knowledge of, then I’m going to call you out on it.

That said, the only real reasons to cross the border are:
1. Get authentic mexican food
2. Get authentic mexican women

#3 used to be surfing but nowadays the breaks down there are crowded, and the best one within driving distance salsipuedes is no longer open.

The number one reason not to cross the border is the wait time to get back (unless you have sentry). Safety is not a big issue down there right now regardless of what you have “heard”.

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