OT: Last Leg of I-15 Finally Opens!!!

[svelte]

[quote=flu]

I have to say, especially in blue, this thing looks really sexy…

Meanwhile, folks, you should 15 gets patrolled really really well these days (ok, not as much as the 56 but close)….So if you’re planning to do speed runs on the 56 or 15, don’t…Unless you like tickets…[/quote]

Agree flu, looks great in blue. Notice that it is the high end Fusion models with upgraded wheels, etc, that look awesome. I saw a base model and it was pretty sad looking.

And it is interesting that on I-15 it is the carpool lanes where I see the most ppl pulled over. I think your advice is good.

Finally, tried the new carpool lanes today on their first day open…worked great! I think I may have paid through the nose for the privilege though, did I see the sign say over $3? I’m gonna check my FasTrak account tomorrow…

[sdrealtor]

I’m just under 6 ft and leg room isn’t even close to a question. Getting in can be a bit of a challenge when the old bones are aching but it’s not my every day car either. When I’m driving it’s blissful. With that said I’m sure the Porsche is amazing to drive also. Sit in the cars and take them for a ride. The tw siting it takes to get in is less of a concern when it’s not your daily ride. Go for the driving experience.

Btw, if you want to drive mine let me know. You ca n take it for. A nice ride without the whole test drive thing.

[paramount]

[quote=AN]I subscribe to C&D and it is pretty well known that they prefer BMW. If you read the comparison carefully, you’ll see the 328 is much slower but it win because it gets better fuel economy.[/quote]

I wouldn’t say it’s much slower – I’d bet the 328i has a higher top speed and DOES have better handling.

Sure, 0-60 the G37 is faster (straight line) – in the twists I’d bet that power advantage rapidly disappears.

While my car was in the shop (due bill’s, not a breakdown) I had a 328i and it would churp in 2nd gear.

A 328i is definitely not slow.

Anyway, back to the review (328i vs. G37):

The fuel economy was the only “performance” category the 328i won. But that’s not why it won.

It won for a number of reasons: handling, it’s near perfect balance and many other reasons.

But there is one very special thing that the 328i/335 and other BMW’s have that the G37 does not: the magic of Double-VANOS.

[paramount]

[quote=sdrealtor]I’m just under 6 ft and leg room isn’t even close to a question. Getting in can be a bit of a challenge when the old bones are aching but it’s not my every day car either. When I’m driving it’s blissful. With that said I’m sure the Porsche is amazing to drive also. Sit in the cars and take them for a ride. The tw siting it takes to get in is less of a concern when it’s not your daily ride. Go for the driving experience.

Btw, if you want to drive mine let me know. You ca n take it for. A nice ride without the whole test drive thing.[/quote]

I’m 6-1 (or I used to be) and it takes a bit of effort to get into and out of the 328, but once in there is plenty of room.

The 3 Series are very low to the ground which contributes to ingress/egress difficulties as pointed out in CD.

However, that low stance will help put a smile on your face, trust me on that.

[an]

[quote=paramount]I wouldn’t say it’s much slower – I’d bet the 328i has a higher top speed and DOES have better handling.

Sure, 0-60 the G37 is faster (straight line) – in the twists I’d bet that power advantage rapidly disappears.

While my car was in the shop (due bill’s, not a breakdown) I had a 328i and it would churp in 2nd gear.

A 328i is definitely not slow.

Anyway, back to the review (328i vs. G37):

The fuel economy was the only “performance” category the 328i won. But that’s not why it won.

It won for a number of reasons: handling, it’s near perfect balance and many other reasons.

But there is one very special thing that the 328i/335 and other BMW’s have that the G37 does not: the magic of Double-VANOS.[/quote]
Here’s the comparison you’re probably referring to:
http://www.caranddriver.com/comparisons/2009-infiniti-g37-vs-bmw-328i-audi-a4-and-acura-tl-comparison-tests
and here are the data from that comparo:
http://media.caranddriver.com/files/2009-infiniti-g37-vs-bmw-328i-audi-a4-and-acura-tlsportsedans-powertrain.pdf
http://media.caranddriver.com/files/2009-infiniti-g37-vs-bmw-328i-audi-a4-and-acura-tlsportsedans-chassis.pdf
http://media.caranddriver.com/files/2009-infiniti-g37-vs-bmw-328i-audi-a4-and-acura-tlsportsedans-vehicle.pdf

The G37 was over 1/2 a second faster than the 328i in the 1/4 miles and it continues to pull away. 0-120, it’s over 5 seconds faster. The 328i top speed is governed at 148MPH while the G37 top speed is governed at 156MPH. Considering how much faster the G37 got to 120MPH, I’m sure it’ll get to its governed top speed much quicker than the 328i too. It’s quieter at both idle and cruising but louder at full throttle. WRT the chassis, they both tie at .92G for road holding, the G37 was faster in the lane change. The 328i did stop faster by 1 foot from 70MPH. The G37 was also longer, wider, taller and more interior space. The only decisive win for the 328i was the fuel economy portion. So, your assertion that the G37 performance will lose ground in the twisty is baseless and the numbers doesn’t show it.

BTW, here’s a quick explanation of what Double-VANOS does:
[quote=Wikipidia]Double VANOS
The first double VANOS system appeared on the S50B32 engine in 1996. Later, BMW added “double” VANOS to its M52TU series of inline 6-cylinder engines, which changed the mechanism from fixed position operation to continuously variable, and added the same functionality to the exhaust camshaft, on a number of its cars. Double-VANOS (double-variable camshaft control) significantly improves torque and emissions since valve timing on both the intake and exhaust camshafts is adjusted to the power required from the engine as a function of gas pedal position and engine speed. On all BMW engines that use single VANOS, except S50B30, the timing of the intake cam is only changed at two distinct rpm points, while on the double-VANOS system, the timing of the intake and exhaust cams is continuously variable through a range of ~40 crankshaft degrees for the intake, and 25 degrees for the exhaust. The advantage of double-VANOS is that the system controls the flow of hot exhaust gases into the intake manifold individually for all operating conditions. This is referred to as “internal” exhaust gas re-circulation, allowing very fine dosage of the amount of exhaust gas recycled.[/quote]

So, it’s nothing more than a term to describe variable valve timing. Just so you know, MANY automakers have variable valve timing on both intake and exhaust. So, Double-VANOS isn’t anything magical. The G37 not only have variable valve timing like Double-VANOS called CVTCS (which stands for Continuously Variable Valve Timing Control System), it also have variable valve lift (think Valvetronic for BMW, VVTL for Toyota, and VTEC for Honda). AFAIK, the 328i doesn’t have Valvetronic but the 335i does. The variable valve lift technology in the G37 is called VVEL.

I do agree that the BMW is closest to 50/50 weight distribution. However, that didn’t help it in its handling numbers. Here’s a quote from the article about the 328i:
[quote=C&D]The 328i topped just one performance category, but it’s one that is increasing in social if not economic importance—fuel economy.[/quote]

Again, I think 335i>G37>328i. Performance wise, the 328 is no match, but it did get better MPG and according to C&D, it’s the one that’s increasing in social if not economic importance.

Here’s the final result:
http://media.caranddriver.com/files/2009-infiniti-g37-vs-bmw-328i-audi-a4-and-acura-tlsportsedans-final-results.pdf
As you can see, C&D rate the G37 and the 328i the same in the chassis department except for steering feel, which the 328i edge out by 1 point.

Here are what they say about the two cars and tell me which one has better performance and luxury:
[quote=328i]2009 BMW 328i

First place: Conspicuous consumption lite.

If Moses had brought down from the big guy himself, chiseled into stone, the chart for rating cars, maybe we’d have a different conclusion here. But he didn’t. So we calls ’em as we sees ’em. Yeah, this is subjective, but we think BMW has a special way with sports sedans.

This car is so seductive that it’s almost embarrassing to read through the comment book: “Love the look, the way the skin stretches tightly over the machinery.” Or: “This is one Crisco-smooth ride.” And: “Clutch and shifter are the same as always, perfect.” Then: “Best shifter and clutch on the planet” and “Great back-road partner” and “Laser-straight steering welcome on long straights” and finally, “Six-cylinder sounds top Beethoven’s best.”

You get the idea. But the subjective side had to push hard against nagging reality. This stripper of a 3-series raises some value issues. Yes, the $36,475 as-tested price is lowest of the quartet, but fake leather on the seats? (BMW calls it leatherette.) No power on those many sport-seat adjusters? No satellite radio?

Add to that a short list of significant annoyances: “The fact that the radio display blanks out when wearing polarized lenses is, frankly, stupid. What is this, 1983?”

The starting ritual raises questions, too. “Why must I insert the remote fob into its dock, then move my hand to the start button? Why is that better than a key?”

“Why are the HVAC controls down by my knees?” And: “BMW must be the last holdout against indicating the fuel-filler location on the gas gauge.”

The 328i topped just one performance category, but it’s one that is increasing in social if not economic importance—fuel economy. Although the Audi does significantly better by the EPA method—23 mpg combined versus 21—the BMW outscored all on our 350-mile test trip at 25 mpg compared with 23 for the Audi, 21 for the Acura, and 19 for the Infiniti.

As a passenger hauler, we judged the BMW to be a shade better than the Audi for two in back but not enough for a full point. It has superior kneeroom, but the rear wheels encroach on the backrest, forcing occupants toward the center of the seat. Forget adding a third adult (none of the others will accept a third, though for different reasons).

In the last meeting of this category in January 2008, we summed up this way: “What the 328i does better than its peers is combine the ingredients of the perfect sports sedan: driving dynamics and luxury.” The luxury component has weakened significantly since, leaving a margin that’s sliver thin.[/quote]
[quote=G37]2009 Infiniti G37 Sport

Second place: Conspicuous consumption lite.

In that narrow slice of marketing terrain where sports sedan overlaps muscle car is where you’ll find this mid-size Infiniti. Will it exercise the neck muscles? Have no doubts.

Will it satisfy your need for speed? Oh, yes, in megadoses.

When the votes were tallied, the BMW 328i came out on top again this time but by a very small margin: two points. At the track, the Infiniti shamed the Bimmer in every contest except for skidpad (a tie). In acceleration, the chase wasn’t even close, with the G37 ahead by a half-second at 60 mph—5.4 seconds versus 5.9—and leading by 6 mph at the quarter-mile. The G37’s gap was narrower but still significant in the lane change. In braking, its one-foot-out performance from 70 mph—159 feet versus the BMW’s 160—is almost certainly insignificant, but we’ll call that one for the G on the superior detailing of its calipers, finished in glowing satin metallic etched with a subtle Infiniti logo.

The G37 Sport, designated by a red “S” on the tail—plus a subtly reshaped fascia and sill treatments—gets a six-speed manual, shorter final-drive gearing with a viscous limited slip, quicker steering, and very large brakes: 14.0-inch discs in front, 13.8s in back, all vented. Inside, there’s a highly supportive sport seat with power adjusters to tailor thigh and torso bolsters.

All of our drivers were put off at first by the heavy, abrupt clutch feel, and the shift lever slipped into sixth gear only after a Google search. But by the second day of driving, the complaints were gone. This is a serious machine: planted, professional, poised. The steering always knows how to find straight-ahead, and the effort builds progressively as you turn. Unlike most of the others, the brakes are not overboosted. They have a linear feel, just right for holding the edge of the friction circle as you trail-brake into curves.

The cockpit supports vigorous motoring. There’s a rest for your left foot in exactly the right place. The tilting column moves the instrument cluster so the dials are always centered within the wheel. The buttons and rockers on the wheel are the easiest of all to use. Only the buttons for shuttling through the trip-computer screens are an awkward reach.

There were a few Darth Vader cracks about the all-black interior, but the rice-paper finish of the metal trim contrasts beautifully.[/quote]

[paramount]

I fully agree that a G37 is a very close 2nd to the 328i; but in no way believe that a G37 will out handle a 328i.

The problem in competing with a 3 series is that you just can’t throw horsepower and expect to beat BMW. It’s not about sheer power. For the price, the 3 series is damn near automotive perfection. Often imitated but never duplicated, you’ll never fall asleep at the wheel driving a 3 series

I’m not trying to start a fight, but the 3 Series – even the lowly 328 – has no peer. They are the best at what they do, period.

Check CD, Edmunds, MT…the list goes on and on, year after year – the 3 series (yes, even the 328) is the best in it’s category.

No other manufacturer makes an engine (in it’s category) that can compare to the “sublime” 3.o inline 6 cylinder. But of course the 3 series is so much more than the motor.

Check Wards list of the top ten engines – you will find the BMW 3.0 inline 6 there at the top nearly every year.

No, no – the G37 is very good, but the 328i/335i holds it’s rightful place on the Throne.

[paramount]

And btw, if you ever see a 328 blowing by you on the carpool lanes, it could just be me seeing you in my rear view mirror.

[an]

The g37 wasn’t a close second unless you put MPG high on your list. The numbers doesn’t lie. The G37 beat the 328i in all performance measures.

Infiniti didn’t just throw HP at BMW, they throw in handling and value. To say for the price, the 328 is near perfection sounds like fanboism. The $36k 328 doesn’t even have leather or power seat. Not to mention the lack of power. The g37 give you near 335 performance at 328 price.

Like I said, the 335 is better than the G37 but not the 328. Everyone know C&D loves BMW. Just read the review and not just the ranking. BMW rarely loses in a C&D comparing except for when it too decisive for them to play the numbers game.

335 engine is a huge difference than the 328. fyi, the g35 took the throne away from the 330 when it first came out. BMW only gain back the throne when the 335 came out. Again, even if you remove the MPG point difference, the g37 would have been the winner.

Also, the only time your 328 can blow past me is when I’m breaking. My 8 years old g35 is still faster than the 328 in both straight line and the twisty.

I’m not fighting, just pointing out the facts.

[sdrealtor]

It depends whose driving

[an]

[quote=sdrealtor]It depends whose driving[/quote]
Assuming both drivers are similar in skills.

Btw paramount, the g37 beat the 335 in 2008 on MT: http://www.motortrend.com/roadtests/coupes/112_0708_infiniti_g37_bmw_335/viewall.html

Here, the 335 win by 2 points: http://www.insideline.com/bmw/3-series/2007/comparison-test-2007-bmw-335i-vs-2008-infiniti-g37.html

Here’s a G37 beating out the 335 due to value. “Overall, I’d give the nod to the Infiniti G37 over the BMW 335 based on superior value. And unless you’re a die-hard BMW fan, the G37’s a no-brainer over the 328.”

Point is, the G37 and 335 are very close, 335 win in performance and the G37 win in value. It has been back and forth between G35 vs 330 and G37 vs 335 for awhile now and they both make each other better. But to compare the lowly 328 and to the G37 and say it’s the winner shows C&D’s bias. Win by two points because there was a 3 points differential in MPG. I love both BMW and Infiniti. If I want the best of the crop, I’d go with the 335i and if I want value, I’d go with the G37. The 328 offer neither best performance or value.

[sdrealtor]

Don’t buy a 335 for value. Buy it fun.

Was just kidding bout the driver comment

[sdrealtor]

Don’t buy a 335 for value. Buy it fun.

Was just kidding bout the driver comment

[temeculaguy]

We’re splitting hairs, the 3 and the G are always the two finalists in magazines for a reason, they are the best and the only 300hp reasonably priced offerings.

I checked the prices today and flu is right, the new 3 series is killing the resale value so a 2008 335 is now priced the same as a 2008 g37 coupe. A 328 is priced the same as a G sedan. It’s funny, but the pricing of the G coupe is 5k more used and the 335 is about 5k more than the 328. I’m a cheapskate, I’ll probably wait another 45 days till the new 3 hits the dealer lots and then just see what deal I can get. I do love the cls, the 6 series, the carrera, but the cheapskate in me makes me fear the repairs as those will be out of warranty, while the g or 3 at the same price will likely be cpo. The G has a nice touch screen, music hard drive, back up camera, no idrive and a host of amenities. The 3 is fairly spartan in the cabin, but from all I read and hear, is the drive and handling is sublime.

There is one more issue only for me, being in temecula, if I end up with a cpo or one still under warranty, the infiniti dealer is 30 miles away, there is a bmw dealer in town. That’s only a factor for me, but it is a factor.

The G’s hold their value better, so as a used car (maybe because of the new 3 model) the cost saving between 3 and G goes away after 3-4 years. A 2008 335 or a g coupe are the same price right now, both between 25 and 30k. Looks like it test drive time, thus far all am i going on is looks. The 3 just looks to small for my 6ft, 205 lb body, but based on what paramount and sd have said, I’m wrong about that.

[an]

[quote=sdrealtor]Don’t buy a 335 for value. Buy it fun.

Was just kidding bout the driver comment[/quote]
Yep, which is why if I have to pick between 335, G37, 328, I’d pick 335 > G37 > 328, due to their performance and fun factor.

On a side note, who here have taken their car(s) to the track (either autoX or real race track) and see what your car can really do while pushing it 9/10-10/10 of it’s capability. I used to and loved it. Will do it again when the kids are older.

[an]

TG, only you can say which one you like more. You can’t go wrong with either.

If you’re afraid of the repair bills, you might want to consider the fact that with a G37, you can bring your car to get it serviced at a Nissan dealer. You’ll save on the repair bill but you won’t get the pampered treatment. I can’t speak for BMW, but for Infiniti, you can buy your own parts and they’ll install it for you and only charge labor. I know Mercedes won’t do it, but I’m not sure about BMW. This will allow you to save some more $ on repair when the time comes. Buying parts online will always be cheaper.

[Author]

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