[eavesdropper]

[quote=CA renter]IMHO, there is a very simple solution to the “adult kids living at home (and not paying for it) syndrome: charge rent, and refuse to do any of their chores for them.

Maybe my parents were messed-up, but we were required to pay rent/utililties as soon as we were able to get our work permits. It was a small amount, about $100-$150/mo, but we also bought our own food, clothing, cars, gas, insurance, etc. If we didn’t pay rent, we paid the utility bills. If we ever borrowed money from our parents, we had to pay it back **with interest.** We were doing our own laundry when we were around 10 years old (washing, folding, putting away), and were expected to clean up after ourselves, as well as do general household cleaning, for as long as I can remember. Heck, my own kids (9,8, and 5) are expected to put their own laundry away, clean up their own messes, and help change their bedding, etc.

Oddly enough, I never resented my parents for any of this. It gave me a tremendous sense of independence and the feeling that I could always take care of myself (however true or untrue it might have been at the time). I believe that the stage is set from a very early age, and that parents who expect their kids to fully participate in the household community will generally have kids who are competent and able to take care of themselves when they are adults.

Do these indulgent parents actually think they are doing their kids a favor by never expecting them to contribute anything to their own care?[/quote]

CAR, many of them are trying to buy their kids’ love. What they don’t realize is that, as far as the kids are concerned, there isn’t anything to be grateful for. Because the kids are never made to do anything for themselves, they grow up with a fully-developed sense of entitlement. They truly believe that it’s their parents’ obligation to pay for everything indefinitely. I don’t blame the kids ( a very loose term, since many are well into their 30s). If a sense of self-responsibility is not instilled in a child, exactly what is going to make them decide that they have to get up at 6 in the morning to go to work at a boring low-paying job (which, for most of them, is 99.9% of available employment)?

Many of the sentiments in your post echo those of a post I left yesterday, CAR. You and I had very similar experiences growing up, and while it wasn’t always an easy or pleasant existence, I reached the age of 18 fully prepared to go out and make my way in the world. I knew how to do most things for myself, and I was able to figure out how to handle unfamiliar situations and problems when I encountered them. More important: I was not only able, but *willing* to tackle obstacles, and not simply crumple up into a pile of sniveling self-pity.

My husband and I, who are extremely well-suited to each other and who have a very loving and close relationship, have almost reached the point of separation over his unwillingness to parent his 15-year-old. He was quite good about it until she reached her teens, and then, suddenly, virtually total abdication from responsibility!! He deludes himself into thinking that everything is wonderful, accomplishing this by not asking questions about the child’s after-school whereabouts or social plans, avoiding conversations about school, neglecting to attend parent-teacher meetings (the stepmother – me – attends them), and pointedly ignoring broken rules and curfews. He and her mother (equally clueless) are engaged in this fantasy that their child will be going off to college in a couple years where she will excel in some major that will result in multiple high-paying job offers that will enable her to move into a gorgeous high-end home immediately following graduation. Of course, this requires that they suspend all belief in the reality that she’s unable to spell, punctuate, and write a cohesive sentence, still cannot perform basic multiplication and division without a calculator, and is entirely bewildered by anything concerning fractions (including the basic definition). I’m finding it increasingly difficult to maintain respect (previously at a very high level) for my husband since his extreme reluctance to exert parental responsibilities not only implies that he can’t stand up to his teenage child, but will also result in lifetime handicaps for her. To me, that is just like withholding food from your child.

CAR, I fully agree with your opinion that childhood participation in and contributions to the household community will result in more competent and self-sufficient adults. And I will go further, and venture that this competence and self-sufficiency results in much better mental health in these individuals, in both childhood and adult years. Life is scary, from the moment you are born to the day you die. Imagine how much more frightening it is if you don’t feel like you have the skills to handle even a minor setback.

[eavesdropper]

[quote=CA renter]IMHO, there is a very simple solution to the “adult kids living at home (and not paying for it) syndrome: charge rent, and refuse to do any of their chores for them.

Maybe my parents were messed-up, but we were required to pay rent/utililties as soon as we were able to get our work permits. It was a small amount, about $100-$150/mo, but we also bought our own food, clothing, cars, gas, insurance, etc. If we didn’t pay rent, we paid the utility bills. If we ever borrowed money from our parents, we had to pay it back **with interest.** We were doing our own laundry when we were around 10 years old (washing, folding, putting away), and were expected to clean up after ourselves, as well as do general household cleaning, for as long as I can remember. Heck, my own kids (9,8, and 5) are expected to put their own laundry away, clean up their own messes, and help change their bedding, etc.

Oddly enough, I never resented my parents for any of this. It gave me a tremendous sense of independence and the feeling that I could always take care of myself (however true or untrue it might have been at the time). I believe that the stage is set from a very early age, and that parents who expect their kids to fully participate in the household community will generally have kids who are competent and able to take care of themselves when they are adults.

Do these indulgent parents actually think they are doing their kids a favor by never expecting them to contribute anything to their own care?[/quote]

CAR, many of them are trying to buy their kids’ love. What they don’t realize is that, as far as the kids are concerned, there isn’t anything to be grateful for. Because the kids are never made to do anything for themselves, they grow up with a fully-developed sense of entitlement. They truly believe that it’s their parents’ obligation to pay for everything indefinitely. I don’t blame the kids ( a very loose term, since many are well into their 30s). If a sense of self-responsibility is not instilled in a child, exactly what is going to make them decide that they have to get up at 6 in the morning to go to work at a boring low-paying job (which, for most of them, is 99.9% of available employment)?

Many of the sentiments in your post echo those of a post I left yesterday, CAR. You and I had very similar experiences growing up, and while it wasn’t always an easy or pleasant existence, I reached the age of 18 fully prepared to go out and make my way in the world. I knew how to do most things for myself, and I was able to figure out how to handle unfamiliar situations and problems when I encountered them. More important: I was not only able, but *willing* to tackle obstacles, and not simply crumple up into a pile of sniveling self-pity.

My husband and I, who are extremely well-suited to each other and who have a very loving and close relationship, have almost reached the point of separation over his unwillingness to parent his 15-year-old. He was quite good about it until she reached her teens, and then, suddenly, virtually total abdication from responsibility!! He deludes himself into thinking that everything is wonderful, accomplishing this by not asking questions about the child’s after-school whereabouts or social plans, avoiding conversations about school, neglecting to attend parent-teacher meetings (the stepmother – me – attends them), and pointedly ignoring broken rules and curfews. He and her mother (equally clueless) are engaged in this fantasy that their child will be going off to college in a couple years where she will excel in some major that will result in multiple high-paying job offers that will enable her to move into a gorgeous high-end home immediately following graduation. Of course, this requires that they suspend all belief in the reality that she’s unable to spell, punctuate, and write a cohesive sentence, still cannot perform basic multiplication and division without a calculator, and is entirely bewildered by anything concerning fractions (including the basic definition). I’m finding it increasingly difficult to maintain respect (previously at a very high level) for my husband since his extreme reluctance to exert parental responsibilities not only implies that he can’t stand up to his teenage child, but will also result in lifetime handicaps for her. To me, that is just like withholding food from your child.

CAR, I fully agree with your opinion that childhood participation in and contributions to the household community will result in more competent and self-sufficient adults. And I will go further, and venture that this competence and self-sufficiency results in much better mental health in these individuals, in both childhood and adult years. Life is scary, from the moment you are born to the day you die. Imagine how much more frightening it is if you don’t feel like you have the skills to handle even a minor setback.

[eavesdropper]

[quote=ninaprincess]I have been in the US half of my life but one thing I still don’t understand it that many American parents kick their children out of the house. Initially I heard people talking about it and I thought they were joking. I brought this up because I just read an article in yahoo about a 23 yr old homeless girl who was kicked out of the parents’ house.

My parents hated that we moved out of the house. They won’t take my money when I stayed with them. My mom would do wash my clothes and clean my room eventhough I told her not too. This is the same case for all of my cousins.[/quote]

ninaprincess, I am not personally acquainted with you family’s situation, but if it works for you, more power to you. Possibly your cultural background is one in which multiple generations of families live together, and all contribute to a productive and mutually beneficial loving family relationship, in which case, the current stories of family strife might appear odd to you.

In the case of American families, this has not been the custom for generations; certainly, not since World War II. What’s happening here now is not like it was back then, nor is it anything like what I described in my first paragraph. Adult children are moving back in with their parents, or never moving out in the first place. While economic conditions can be blamed for some of this phenomenon, quite often it’s because individuals have not been equipped by their parents with the skills they require to live an independent life, or have decided that, despite a good education and training, they simply do not wish to work at a job.

Keep in mind that these adult children would not be able to do this on their own. In reality, their parents enable their lifestyle by permitting their residence in the family home, and requiring nothing in the way of contributions to the family unit. The adult “children” insist that, because they are over 18, they are adults, they are independent and no one can tell them what to do. I’m not sure what their definition of independence is, but when you, yourself, are not able to pay for a roof over your head, a bed to sleep in, or food for your belly (not to mention your car payments, gas, and insurance, clothing, cell phone, entertainment, etc.), you are DEPENDENT upon another to pay for them.

Again, I am not personally familiar with your situation. However, there are many parents of adult children who continue to perform basic housekeeping duties for their children. Many of them admit that they keep hoping that their children will exhibit some evidence of personal responsibility and insist on doing the tasks themselves. Some mothers have an extremely difficult time separating themselves from their prior roles as mothers of small children, and continue to do these things in an attempt to keep their adult children dependent upon them (incidentally, not a sign of sterling mental health).

There are lots of adult “children” out there being dishonest with themselves about their parents’ actions, and misinterpreting them intentionally because they benefit from them. If they truly cannot wrest dirty laundry from their caring mother’s hands, or keep her from waiting on them, they should make sure that THEY do something positive for her, and for the family unit. If a parent won’t take money for room or board, steal a utility bill and pay it. Buy the parents a supermarket gift certificate. Go pick up some garden plants and mulch that you know they are planning on getting, or replace a small (or large) appliance on its last legs. Pick up some replacement cartridges for their printer. Parents may refuse to accept rent money from their adult children and continue to insist on performing personal tasks for them. That does not excuse them from their own responsibilities as an adult member of the household and the family unit. They need to contribute to a level that is equivalent to what they are taking from the family.

[eavesdropper]

[quote=ninaprincess]I have been in the US half of my life but one thing I still don’t understand it that many American parents kick their children out of the house. Initially I heard people talking about it and I thought they were joking. I brought this up because I just read an article in yahoo about a 23 yr old homeless girl who was kicked out of the parents’ house.

My parents hated that we moved out of the house. They won’t take my money when I stayed with them. My mom would do wash my clothes and clean my room eventhough I told her not too. This is the same case for all of my cousins.[/quote]

ninaprincess, I am not personally acquainted with you family’s situation, but if it works for you, more power to you. Possibly your cultural background is one in which multiple generations of families live together, and all contribute to a productive and mutually beneficial loving family relationship, in which case, the current stories of family strife might appear odd to you.

In the case of American families, this has not been the custom for generations; certainly, not since World War II. What’s happening here now is not like it was back then, nor is it anything like what I described in my first paragraph. Adult children are moving back in with their parents, or never moving out in the first place. While economic conditions can be blamed for some of this phenomenon, quite often it’s because individuals have not been equipped by their parents with the skills they require to live an independent life, or have decided that, despite a good education and training, they simply do not wish to work at a job.

Keep in mind that these adult children would not be able to do this on their own. In reality, their parents enable their lifestyle by permitting their residence in the family home, and requiring nothing in the way of contributions to the family unit. The adult “children” insist that, because they are over 18, they are adults, they are independent and no one can tell them what to do. I’m not sure what their definition of independence is, but when you, yourself, are not able to pay for a roof over your head, a bed to sleep in, or food for your belly (not to mention your car payments, gas, and insurance, clothing, cell phone, entertainment, etc.), you are DEPENDENT upon another to pay for them.

Again, I am not personally familiar with your situation. However, there are many parents of adult children who continue to perform basic housekeeping duties for their children. Many of them admit that they keep hoping that their children will exhibit some evidence of personal responsibility and insist on doing the tasks themselves. Some mothers have an extremely difficult time separating themselves from their prior roles as mothers of small children, and continue to do these things in an attempt to keep their adult children dependent upon them (incidentally, not a sign of sterling mental health).

There are lots of adult “children” out there being dishonest with themselves about their parents’ actions, and misinterpreting them intentionally because they benefit from them. If they truly cannot wrest dirty laundry from their caring mother’s hands, or keep her from waiting on them, they should make sure that THEY do something positive for her, and for the family unit. If a parent won’t take money for room or board, steal a utility bill and pay it. Buy the parents a supermarket gift certificate. Go pick up some garden plants and mulch that you know they are planning on getting, or replace a small (or large) appliance on its last legs. Pick up some replacement cartridges for their printer. Parents may refuse to accept rent money from their adult children and continue to insist on performing personal tasks for them. That does not excuse them from their own responsibilities as an adult member of the household and the family unit. They need to contribute to a level that is equivalent to what they are taking from the family.

[eavesdropper]

[quote=ninaprincess]I have been in the US half of my life but one thing I still don’t understand it that many American parents kick their children out of the house. Initially I heard people talking about it and I thought they were joking. I brought this up because I just read an article in yahoo about a 23 yr old homeless girl who was kicked out of the parents’ house.

My parents hated that we moved out of the house. They won’t take my money when I stayed with them. My mom would do wash my clothes and clean my room eventhough I told her not too. This is the same case for all of my cousins.[/quote]

ninaprincess, I am not personally acquainted with you family’s situation, but if it works for you, more power to you. Possibly your cultural background is one in which multiple generations of families live together, and all contribute to a productive and mutually beneficial loving family relationship, in which case, the current stories of family strife might appear odd to you.

In the case of American families, this has not been the custom for generations; certainly, not since World War II. What’s happening here now is not like it was back then, nor is it anything like what I described in my first paragraph. Adult children are moving back in with their parents, or never moving out in the first place. While economic conditions can be blamed for some of this phenomenon, quite often it’s because individuals have not been equipped by their parents with the skills they require to live an independent life, or have decided that, despite a good education and training, they simply do not wish to work at a job.

Keep in mind that these adult children would not be able to do this on their own. In reality, their parents enable their lifestyle by permitting their residence in the family home, and requiring nothing in the way of contributions to the family unit. The adult “children” insist that, because they are over 18, they are adults, they are independent and no one can tell them what to do. I’m not sure what their definition of independence is, but when you, yourself, are not able to pay for a roof over your head, a bed to sleep in, or food for your belly (not to mention your car payments, gas, and insurance, clothing, cell phone, entertainment, etc.), you are DEPENDENT upon another to pay for them.

Again, I am not personally familiar with your situation. However, there are many parents of adult children who continue to perform basic housekeeping duties for their children. Many of them admit that they keep hoping that their children will exhibit some evidence of personal responsibility and insist on doing the tasks themselves. Some mothers have an extremely difficult time separating themselves from their prior roles as mothers of small children, and continue to do these things in an attempt to keep their adult children dependent upon them (incidentally, not a sign of sterling mental health).

There are lots of adult “children” out there being dishonest with themselves about their parents’ actions, and misinterpreting them intentionally because they benefit from them. If they truly cannot wrest dirty laundry from their caring mother’s hands, or keep her from waiting on them, they should make sure that THEY do something positive for her, and for the family unit. If a parent won’t take money for room or board, steal a utility bill and pay it. Buy the parents a supermarket gift certificate. Go pick up some garden plants and mulch that you know they are planning on getting, or replace a small (or large) appliance on its last legs. Pick up some replacement cartridges for their printer. Parents may refuse to accept rent money from their adult children and continue to insist on performing personal tasks for them. That does not excuse them from their own responsibilities as an adult member of the household and the family unit. They need to contribute to a level that is equivalent to what they are taking from the family.

[eavesdropper]

[quote=ninaprincess]I have been in the US half of my life but one thing I still don’t understand it that many American parents kick their children out of the house. Initially I heard people talking about it and I thought they were joking. I brought this up because I just read an article in yahoo about a 23 yr old homeless girl who was kicked out of the parents’ house.

My parents hated that we moved out of the house. They won’t take my money when I stayed with them. My mom would do wash my clothes and clean my room eventhough I told her not too. This is the same case for all of my cousins.[/quote]

ninaprincess, I am not personally acquainted with you family’s situation, but if it works for you, more power to you. Possibly your cultural background is one in which multiple generations of families live together, and all contribute to a productive and mutually beneficial loving family relationship, in which case, the current stories of family strife might appear odd to you.

In the case of American families, this has not been the custom for generations; certainly, not since World War II. What’s happening here now is not like it was back then, nor is it anything like what I described in my first paragraph. Adult children are moving back in with their parents, or never moving out in the first place. While economic conditions can be blamed for some of this phenomenon, quite often it’s because individuals have not been equipped by their parents with the skills they require to live an independent life, or have decided that, despite a good education and training, they simply do not wish to work at a job.

Keep in mind that these adult children would not be able to do this on their own. In reality, their parents enable their lifestyle by permitting their residence in the family home, and requiring nothing in the way of contributions to the family unit. The adult “children” insist that, because they are over 18, they are adults, they are independent and no one can tell them what to do. I’m not sure what their definition of independence is, but when you, yourself, are not able to pay for a roof over your head, a bed to sleep in, or food for your belly (not to mention your car payments, gas, and insurance, clothing, cell phone, entertainment, etc.), you are DEPENDENT upon another to pay for them.

Again, I am not personally familiar with your situation. However, there are many parents of adult children who continue to perform basic housekeeping duties for their children. Many of them admit that they keep hoping that their children will exhibit some evidence of personal responsibility and insist on doing the tasks themselves. Some mothers have an extremely difficult time separating themselves from their prior roles as mothers of small children, and continue to do these things in an attempt to keep their adult children dependent upon them (incidentally, not a sign of sterling mental health).

There are lots of adult “children” out there being dishonest with themselves about their parents’ actions, and misinterpreting them intentionally because they benefit from them. If they truly cannot wrest dirty laundry from their caring mother’s hands, or keep her from waiting on them, they should make sure that THEY do something positive for her, and for the family unit. If a parent won’t take money for room or board, steal a utility bill and pay it. Buy the parents a supermarket gift certificate. Go pick up some garden plants and mulch that you know they are planning on getting, or replace a small (or large) appliance on its last legs. Pick up some replacement cartridges for their printer. Parents may refuse to accept rent money from their adult children and continue to insist on performing personal tasks for them. That does not excuse them from their own responsibilities as an adult member of the household and the family unit. They need to contribute to a level that is equivalent to what they are taking from the family.

[eavesdropper]

[quote=ninaprincess]I have been in the US half of my life but one thing I still don’t understand it that many American parents kick their children out of the house. Initially I heard people talking about it and I thought they were joking. I brought this up because I just read an article in yahoo about a 23 yr old homeless girl who was kicked out of the parents’ house.

My parents hated that we moved out of the house. They won’t take my money when I stayed with them. My mom would do wash my clothes and clean my room eventhough I told her not too. This is the same case for all of my cousins.[/quote]

ninaprincess, I am not personally acquainted with you family’s situation, but if it works for you, more power to you. Possibly your cultural background is one in which multiple generations of families live together, and all contribute to a productive and mutually beneficial loving family relationship, in which case, the current stories of family strife might appear odd to you.

In the case of American families, this has not been the custom for generations; certainly, not since World War II. What’s happening here now is not like it was back then, nor is it anything like what I described in my first paragraph. Adult children are moving back in with their parents, or never moving out in the first place. While economic conditions can be blamed for some of this phenomenon, quite often it’s because individuals have not been equipped by their parents with the skills they require to live an independent life, or have decided that, despite a good education and training, they simply do not wish to work at a job.

Keep in mind that these adult children would not be able to do this on their own. In reality, their parents enable their lifestyle by permitting their residence in the family home, and requiring nothing in the way of contributions to the family unit. The adult “children” insist that, because they are over 18, they are adults, they are independent and no one can tell them what to do. I’m not sure what their definition of independence is, but when you, yourself, are not able to pay for a roof over your head, a bed to sleep in, or food for your belly (not to mention your car payments, gas, and insurance, clothing, cell phone, entertainment, etc.), you are DEPENDENT upon another to pay for them.

Again, I am not personally familiar with your situation. However, there are many parents of adult children who continue to perform basic housekeeping duties for their children. Many of them admit that they keep hoping that their children will exhibit some evidence of personal responsibility and insist on doing the tasks themselves. Some mothers have an extremely difficult time separating themselves from their prior roles as mothers of small children, and continue to do these things in an attempt to keep their adult children dependent upon them (incidentally, not a sign of sterling mental health).

There are lots of adult “children” out there being dishonest with themselves about their parents’ actions, and misinterpreting them intentionally because they benefit from them. If they truly cannot wrest dirty laundry from their caring mother’s hands, or keep her from waiting on them, they should make sure that THEY do something positive for her, and for the family unit. If a parent won’t take money for room or board, steal a utility bill and pay it. Buy the parents a supermarket gift certificate. Go pick up some garden plants and mulch that you know they are planning on getting, or replace a small (or large) appliance on its last legs. Pick up some replacement cartridges for their printer. Parents may refuse to accept rent money from their adult children and continue to insist on performing personal tasks for them. That does not excuse them from their own responsibilities as an adult member of the household and the family unit. They need to contribute to a level that is equivalent to what they are taking from the family.

[eavesdropper]

UCGal & BG, definitely relate to your comments about getting your own place as soon as you were able. That was where I was at in the mid-70s. In fact, I remember, at age 12, doing interior design sketches for the “dream apartment” into which I was going to move as soon as I was legally able (you don’t have accurate ideas about the cost of rent when you’re 12, which is why “financially-able” didn’t trump emancipation on my list of barriers to freedom).

I grew up in a very loving home with two parents who kept a close watch on our activities and applied discipline (fairly) as needed. However, they made it clear that we were expected to go out the day after high school graduation and get a paying job, from which we would commence paying room and board immediately. For the females among us who chose to go to college, there would be no financial assistance from the parents, but we would not be charged R&B so long as we were attending school on a full-time basis (this was not the generous offer that it initially appeared to be: between full-time employment and full-time education, I was never home long enough to eat, only to shower and change clothes). I didn’t feel singled-out or persecuted: most of the parents in our working-class suburb had the same policy. Our Depression-era parents pounded a strong work ethic into us, and there weren’t many of us who were confident enough to settle into life as a deadbeat.

Even if some of us remained at home, our parents retained control over our lives that, for most, proved unbearable. Rules were loosened after high school, but still very much in place. I was not able to spend nights (elsewhere) with a boyfriend or a fiance. I wasn’t allowed to ride (my own) motorcycle. I was (still) not permitted to “talk back” to my parents. I didn’t like it, but I totally understood it, and I still do to this day: it was my parents’ house and they could set any rules they damn well pleased. Astoundingly enough (said tongue-in-cheek), those “rules” were an incredible motivating force. I COULD live life on my own terms – just so long as I could PAY for it.

Hell, I don’t blame kids for staying with their parents these days!! Why not?! Most parents place no limitations on their adult children. Parents give their kids free rein in a nicely-furnished home, wash their clothes, cook their food (to order), pick up constantly after them (and whatever “friends” come to visit or stay), give them spending money and cover their credit card bills; pay for their cars and insurance, cell phones and electronic devices, clothes and cosmetics; and bail them out of financial and legal difficulties. And they do all this despite the fact that their kids treat them with a total lack of respect, telling them to shut up and get out, and hurling abusive invective peppered liberally with foul language.

Why don’t adult kids move out on their own or make an effort to establish independent lives? Are people serious when they ask that question??? But, for the many parents out there who are unhappy in their situation of having to take care of their adult children, I have the answer to one very important question you all seem to have. It’s NO. As in “No, there is no magical moment in your child’s lifespan at which time he (or she) will decide for themselves that they have to show some self-responsibility and make it on their own”. Allow me to establish, firmly and definitively, there is no such spontaneous moment. If you continue to enable them to remain the lazy, immature, totally self-involved, abusive, truly unlikeable brats that you raised……NO, they will never move. Permit me to further state that the problem is what YOU are doing, not what your child is doing.

Be honest. Admit that you sometimes get pissed off looking at your kids sitting there on your couch, beautiful and trim and healthy in their 20s. That you’re resentful at their greed and slothfulness and their ingratitude, and angry that you’re doing their laundry and picking up after them on the weekends, which is the only time YOU have off from your full-time job.

Now think about what it will be like fifteen years down the road. You’ll be in your 60s, and unable to retire from a job that you hate. Because they’ll still be sitting there on your couch. Only by this time your darlings will be in their late 30s or early 40s, and flanked on one side by their three out-of-control bratty kids, and their third spouse (“between jobs”) on the other. They’ll weigh twice as much, and have Type II diabetes, a bad back, and no health insurance. They’ll still be rude and disrespectful, hurling demands and insults at you just as they did in their 20s, but it now has 15 years of resentment layered in.

Not like any AARP commercial I’ve ever seen……

[eavesdropper]

UCGal & BG, definitely relate to your comments about getting your own place as soon as you were able. That was where I was at in the mid-70s. In fact, I remember, at age 12, doing interior design sketches for the “dream apartment” into which I was going to move as soon as I was legally able (you don’t have accurate ideas about the cost of rent when you’re 12, which is why “financially-able” didn’t trump emancipation on my list of barriers to freedom).

I grew up in a very loving home with two parents who kept a close watch on our activities and applied discipline (fairly) as needed. However, they made it clear that we were expected to go out the day after high school graduation and get a paying job, from which we would commence paying room and board immediately. For the females among us who chose to go to college, there would be no financial assistance from the parents, but we would not be charged R&B so long as we were attending school on a full-time basis (this was not the generous offer that it initially appeared to be: between full-time employment and full-time education, I was never home long enough to eat, only to shower and change clothes). I didn’t feel singled-out or persecuted: most of the parents in our working-class suburb had the same policy. Our Depression-era parents pounded a strong work ethic into us, and there weren’t many of us who were confident enough to settle into life as a deadbeat.

Even if some of us remained at home, our parents retained control over our lives that, for most, proved unbearable. Rules were loosened after high school, but still very much in place. I was not able to spend nights (elsewhere) with a boyfriend or a fiance. I wasn’t allowed to ride (my own) motorcycle. I was (still) not permitted to “talk back” to my parents. I didn’t like it, but I totally understood it, and I still do to this day: it was my parents’ house and they could set any rules they damn well pleased. Astoundingly enough (said tongue-in-cheek), those “rules” were an incredible motivating force. I COULD live life on my own terms – just so long as I could PAY for it.

Hell, I don’t blame kids for staying with their parents these days!! Why not?! Most parents place no limitations on their adult children. Parents give their kids free rein in a nicely-furnished home, wash their clothes, cook their food (to order), pick up constantly after them (and whatever “friends” come to visit or stay), give them spending money and cover their credit card bills; pay for their cars and insurance, cell phones and electronic devices, clothes and cosmetics; and bail them out of financial and legal difficulties. And they do all this despite the fact that their kids treat them with a total lack of respect, telling them to shut up and get out, and hurling abusive invective peppered liberally with foul language.

Why don’t adult kids move out on their own or make an effort to establish independent lives? Are people serious when they ask that question??? But, for the many parents out there who are unhappy in their situation of having to take care of their adult children, I have the answer to one very important question you all seem to have. It’s NO. As in “No, there is no magical moment in your child’s lifespan at which time he (or she) will decide for themselves that they have to show some self-responsibility and make it on their own”. Allow me to establish, firmly and definitively, there is no such spontaneous moment. If you continue to enable them to remain the lazy, immature, totally self-involved, abusive, truly unlikeable brats that you raised……NO, they will never move. Permit me to further state that the problem is what YOU are doing, not what your child is doing.

Be honest. Admit that you sometimes get pissed off looking at your kids sitting there on your couch, beautiful and trim and healthy in their 20s. That you’re resentful at their greed and slothfulness and their ingratitude, and angry that you’re doing their laundry and picking up after them on the weekends, which is the only time YOU have off from your full-time job.

Now think about what it will be like fifteen years down the road. You’ll be in your 60s, and unable to retire from a job that you hate. Because they’ll still be sitting there on your couch. Only by this time your darlings will be in their late 30s or early 40s, and flanked on one side by their three out-of-control bratty kids, and their third spouse (“between jobs”) on the other. They’ll weigh twice as much, and have Type II diabetes, a bad back, and no health insurance. They’ll still be rude and disrespectful, hurling demands and insults at you just as they did in their 20s, but it now has 15 years of resentment layered in.

Not like any AARP commercial I’ve ever seen……

[eavesdropper]

UCGal & BG, definitely relate to your comments about getting your own place as soon as you were able. That was where I was at in the mid-70s. In fact, I remember, at age 12, doing interior design sketches for the “dream apartment” into which I was going to move as soon as I was legally able (you don’t have accurate ideas about the cost of rent when you’re 12, which is why “financially-able” didn’t trump emancipation on my list of barriers to freedom).

I grew up in a very loving home with two parents who kept a close watch on our activities and applied discipline (fairly) as needed. However, they made it clear that we were expected to go out the day after high school graduation and get a paying job, from which we would commence paying room and board immediately. For the females among us who chose to go to college, there would be no financial assistance from the parents, but we would not be charged R&B so long as we were attending school on a full-time basis (this was not the generous offer that it initially appeared to be: between full-time employment and full-time education, I was never home long enough to eat, only to shower and change clothes). I didn’t feel singled-out or persecuted: most of the parents in our working-class suburb had the same policy. Our Depression-era parents pounded a strong work ethic into us, and there weren’t many of us who were confident enough to settle into life as a deadbeat.

Even if some of us remained at home, our parents retained control over our lives that, for most, proved unbearable. Rules were loosened after high school, but still very much in place. I was not able to spend nights (elsewhere) with a boyfriend or a fiance. I wasn’t allowed to ride (my own) motorcycle. I was (still) not permitted to “talk back” to my parents. I didn’t like it, but I totally understood it, and I still do to this day: it was my parents’ house and they could set any rules they damn well pleased. Astoundingly enough (said tongue-in-cheek), those “rules” were an incredible motivating force. I COULD live life on my own terms – just so long as I could PAY for it.

Hell, I don’t blame kids for staying with their parents these days!! Why not?! Most parents place no limitations on their adult children. Parents give their kids free rein in a nicely-furnished home, wash their clothes, cook their food (to order), pick up constantly after them (and whatever “friends” come to visit or stay), give them spending money and cover their credit card bills; pay for their cars and insurance, cell phones and electronic devices, clothes and cosmetics; and bail them out of financial and legal difficulties. And they do all this despite the fact that their kids treat them with a total lack of respect, telling them to shut up and get out, and hurling abusive invective peppered liberally with foul language.

Why don’t adult kids move out on their own or make an effort to establish independent lives? Are people serious when they ask that question??? But, for the many parents out there who are unhappy in their situation of having to take care of their adult children, I have the answer to one very important question you all seem to have. It’s NO. As in “No, there is no magical moment in your child’s lifespan at which time he (or she) will decide for themselves that they have to show some self-responsibility and make it on their own”. Allow me to establish, firmly and definitively, there is no such spontaneous moment. If you continue to enable them to remain the lazy, immature, totally self-involved, abusive, truly unlikeable brats that you raised……NO, they will never move. Permit me to further state that the problem is what YOU are doing, not what your child is doing.

Be honest. Admit that you sometimes get pissed off looking at your kids sitting there on your couch, beautiful and trim and healthy in their 20s. That you’re resentful at their greed and slothfulness and their ingratitude, and angry that you’re doing their laundry and picking up after them on the weekends, which is the only time YOU have off from your full-time job.

Now think about what it will be like fifteen years down the road. You’ll be in your 60s, and unable to retire from a job that you hate. Because they’ll still be sitting there on your couch. Only by this time your darlings will be in their late 30s or early 40s, and flanked on one side by their three out-of-control bratty kids, and their third spouse (“between jobs”) on the other. They’ll weigh twice as much, and have Type II diabetes, a bad back, and no health insurance. They’ll still be rude and disrespectful, hurling demands and insults at you just as they did in their 20s, but it now has 15 years of resentment layered in.

Not like any AARP commercial I’ve ever seen……

[eavesdropper]

UCGal & BG, definitely relate to your comments about getting your own place as soon as you were able. That was where I was at in the mid-70s. In fact, I remember, at age 12, doing interior design sketches for the “dream apartment” into which I was going to move as soon as I was legally able (you don’t have accurate ideas about the cost of rent when you’re 12, which is why “financially-able” didn’t trump emancipation on my list of barriers to freedom).

I grew up in a very loving home with two parents who kept a close watch on our activities and applied discipline (fairly) as needed. However, they made it clear that we were expected to go out the day after high school graduation and get a paying job, from which we would commence paying room and board immediately. For the females among us who chose to go to college, there would be no financial assistance from the parents, but we would not be charged R&B so long as we were attending school on a full-time basis (this was not the generous offer that it initially appeared to be: between full-time employment and full-time education, I was never home long enough to eat, only to shower and change clothes). I didn’t feel singled-out or persecuted: most of the parents in our working-class suburb had the same policy. Our Depression-era parents pounded a strong work ethic into us, and there weren’t many of us who were confident enough to settle into life as a deadbeat.

Even if some of us remained at home, our parents retained control over our lives that, for most, proved unbearable. Rules were loosened after high school, but still very much in place. I was not able to spend nights (elsewhere) with a boyfriend or a fiance. I wasn’t allowed to ride (my own) motorcycle. I was (still) not permitted to “talk back” to my parents. I didn’t like it, but I totally understood it, and I still do to this day: it was my parents’ house and they could set any rules they damn well pleased. Astoundingly enough (said tongue-in-cheek), those “rules” were an incredible motivating force. I COULD live life on my own terms – just so long as I could PAY for it.

Hell, I don’t blame kids for staying with their parents these days!! Why not?! Most parents place no limitations on their adult children. Parents give their kids free rein in a nicely-furnished home, wash their clothes, cook their food (to order), pick up constantly after them (and whatever “friends” come to visit or stay), give them spending money and cover their credit card bills; pay for their cars and insurance, cell phones and electronic devices, clothes and cosmetics; and bail them out of financial and legal difficulties. And they do all this despite the fact that their kids treat them with a total lack of respect, telling them to shut up and get out, and hurling abusive invective peppered liberally with foul language.

Why don’t adult kids move out on their own or make an effort to establish independent lives? Are people serious when they ask that question??? But, for the many parents out there who are unhappy in their situation of having to take care of their adult children, I have the answer to one very important question you all seem to have. It’s NO. As in “No, there is no magical moment in your child’s lifespan at which time he (or she) will decide for themselves that they have to show some self-responsibility and make it on their own”. Allow me to establish, firmly and definitively, there is no such spontaneous moment. If you continue to enable them to remain the lazy, immature, totally self-involved, abusive, truly unlikeable brats that you raised……NO, they will never move. Permit me to further state that the problem is what YOU are doing, not what your child is doing.

Be honest. Admit that you sometimes get pissed off looking at your kids sitting there on your couch, beautiful and trim and healthy in their 20s. That you’re resentful at their greed and slothfulness and their ingratitude, and angry that you’re doing their laundry and picking up after them on the weekends, which is the only time YOU have off from your full-time job.

Now think about what it will be like fifteen years down the road. You’ll be in your 60s, and unable to retire from a job that you hate. Because they’ll still be sitting there on your couch. Only by this time your darlings will be in their late 30s or early 40s, and flanked on one side by their three out-of-control bratty kids, and their third spouse (“between jobs”) on the other. They’ll weigh twice as much, and have Type II diabetes, a bad back, and no health insurance. They’ll still be rude and disrespectful, hurling demands and insults at you just as they did in their 20s, but it now has 15 years of resentment layered in.

Not like any AARP commercial I’ve ever seen……

[eavesdropper]

UCGal & BG, definitely relate to your comments about getting your own place as soon as you were able. That was where I was at in the mid-70s. In fact, I remember, at age 12, doing interior design sketches for the “dream apartment” into which I was going to move as soon as I was legally able (you don’t have accurate ideas about the cost of rent when you’re 12, which is why “financially-able” didn’t trump emancipation on my list of barriers to freedom).

I grew up in a very loving home with two parents who kept a close watch on our activities and applied discipline (fairly) as needed. However, they made it clear that we were expected to go out the day after high school graduation and get a paying job, from which we would commence paying room and board immediately. For the females among us who chose to go to college, there would be no financial assistance from the parents, but we would not be charged R&B so long as we were attending school on a full-time basis (this was not the generous offer that it initially appeared to be: between full-time employment and full-time education, I was never home long enough to eat, only to shower and change clothes). I didn’t feel singled-out or persecuted: most of the parents in our working-class suburb had the same policy. Our Depression-era parents pounded a strong work ethic into us, and there weren’t many of us who were confident enough to settle into life as a deadbeat.

Even if some of us remained at home, our parents retained control over our lives that, for most, proved unbearable. Rules were loosened after high school, but still very much in place. I was not able to spend nights (elsewhere) with a boyfriend or a fiance. I wasn’t allowed to ride (my own) motorcycle. I was (still) not permitted to “talk back” to my parents. I didn’t like it, but I totally understood it, and I still do to this day: it was my parents’ house and they could set any rules they damn well pleased. Astoundingly enough (said tongue-in-cheek), those “rules” were an incredible motivating force. I COULD live life on my own terms – just so long as I could PAY for it.

Hell, I don’t blame kids for staying with their parents these days!! Why not?! Most parents place no limitations on their adult children. Parents give their kids free rein in a nicely-furnished home, wash their clothes, cook their food (to order), pick up constantly after them (and whatever “friends” come to visit or stay), give them spending money and cover their credit card bills; pay for their cars and insurance, cell phones and electronic devices, clothes and cosmetics; and bail them out of financial and legal difficulties. And they do all this despite the fact that their kids treat them with a total lack of respect, telling them to shut up and get out, and hurling abusive invective peppered liberally with foul language.

Why don’t adult kids move out on their own or make an effort to establish independent lives? Are people serious when they ask that question??? But, for the many parents out there who are unhappy in their situation of having to take care of their adult children, I have the answer to one very important question you all seem to have. It’s NO. As in “No, there is no magical moment in your child’s lifespan at which time he (or she) will decide for themselves that they have to show some self-responsibility and make it on their own”. Allow me to establish, firmly and definitively, there is no such spontaneous moment. If you continue to enable them to remain the lazy, immature, totally self-involved, abusive, truly unlikeable brats that you raised……NO, they will never move. Permit me to further state that the problem is what YOU are doing, not what your child is doing.

Be honest. Admit that you sometimes get pissed off looking at your kids sitting there on your couch, beautiful and trim and healthy in their 20s. That you’re resentful at their greed and slothfulness and their ingratitude, and angry that you’re doing their laundry and picking up after them on the weekends, which is the only time YOU have off from your full-time job.

Now think about what it will be like fifteen years down the road. You’ll be in your 60s, and unable to retire from a job that you hate. Because they’ll still be sitting there on your couch. Only by this time your darlings will be in their late 30s or early 40s, and flanked on one side by their three out-of-control bratty kids, and their third spouse (“between jobs”) on the other. They’ll weigh twice as much, and have Type II diabetes, a bad back, and no health insurance. They’ll still be rude and disrespectful, hurling demands and insults at you just as they did in their 20s, but it now has 15 years of resentment layered in.

Not like any AARP commercial I’ve ever seen……

[eavesdropper]

[quote=bearishgurl][quote=walterwhite]Speaking ofjimmy Carter I had an urge to buy a Carter era 1978 honda civic.[/quote]

scaredy, I hope you’re using that for a moped around your property and not letting your kids take it on the road. I saw an entire family of four perish in front of my eyes in one of those after being broadsided by a Ford F-150 pickup when they were making an (unwise) left turn. Those cars were “tin cans” in that era.[/quote]

Right you are, BG. I had a ’79 Civic – it was my first brand-new car, and I loved it. But I hit the right rear bumper of a similar-era full-size Ford Bronco – a real behemoth – with the left front of my car. He was stopped, and I was moving at 10 to 15 mph, and it still crumpled up my quarter panel like an accordion. Not a dent on his.

Didn’t stop him from suing for $100 grand for “grievous injuries” to his head, neck, back, legs, abdomen, blah, blah, plus serious mental distress. In fact, that lawsuit took its place on the docket beside 3 others he had going at the same time, and countless others he had “settled” in the prior five years. Poor guy just had the *worst* luck when he was out driving…..But I digress….

I’m not sure that there are many compact, or even mid-size, sedans or hatchbacks that would fare well after being t-boned by the full-size pickups that are so prevalent in suburbs and cities these days. I am an extremely defensive driver when out in mine. But, also being a motorcyclist, I am well-acquainted with boneheads who make ill-advised left turns in front of me at the last-minute. The ability to perceive depth and distance is one of those handy driving skills that seem to have been swapped for facility at dialing voicemail or texting.

[eavesdropper]

[quote=bearishgurl][quote=walterwhite]Speaking ofjimmy Carter I had an urge to buy a Carter era 1978 honda civic.[/quote]

scaredy, I hope you’re using that for a moped around your property and not letting your kids take it on the road. I saw an entire family of four perish in front of my eyes in one of those after being broadsided by a Ford F-150 pickup when they were making an (unwise) left turn. Those cars were “tin cans” in that era.[/quote]

Right you are, BG. I had a ’79 Civic – it was my first brand-new car, and I loved it. But I hit the right rear bumper of a similar-era full-size Ford Bronco – a real behemoth – with the left front of my car. He was stopped, and I was moving at 10 to 15 mph, and it still crumpled up my quarter panel like an accordion. Not a dent on his.

Didn’t stop him from suing for $100 grand for “grievous injuries” to his head, neck, back, legs, abdomen, blah, blah, plus serious mental distress. In fact, that lawsuit took its place on the docket beside 3 others he had going at the same time, and countless others he had “settled” in the prior five years. Poor guy just had the *worst* luck when he was out driving…..But I digress….

I’m not sure that there are many compact, or even mid-size, sedans or hatchbacks that would fare well after being t-boned by the full-size pickups that are so prevalent in suburbs and cities these days. I am an extremely defensive driver when out in mine. But, also being a motorcyclist, I am well-acquainted with boneheads who make ill-advised left turns in front of me at the last-minute. The ability to perceive depth and distance is one of those handy driving skills that seem to have been swapped for facility at dialing voicemail or texting.

[eavesdropper]

[quote=bearishgurl][quote=walterwhite]Speaking ofjimmy Carter I had an urge to buy a Carter era 1978 honda civic.[/quote]

scaredy, I hope you’re using that for a moped around your property and not letting your kids take it on the road. I saw an entire family of four perish in front of my eyes in one of those after being broadsided by a Ford F-150 pickup when they were making an (unwise) left turn. Those cars were “tin cans” in that era.[/quote]

Right you are, BG. I had a ’79 Civic – it was my first brand-new car, and I loved it. But I hit the right rear bumper of a similar-era full-size Ford Bronco – a real behemoth – with the left front of my car. He was stopped, and I was moving at 10 to 15 mph, and it still crumpled up my quarter panel like an accordion. Not a dent on his.

Didn’t stop him from suing for $100 grand for “grievous injuries” to his head, neck, back, legs, abdomen, blah, blah, plus serious mental distress. In fact, that lawsuit took its place on the docket beside 3 others he had going at the same time, and countless others he had “settled” in the prior five years. Poor guy just had the *worst* luck when he was out driving…..But I digress….

I’m not sure that there are many compact, or even mid-size, sedans or hatchbacks that would fare well after being t-boned by the full-size pickups that are so prevalent in suburbs and cities these days. I am an extremely defensive driver when out in mine. But, also being a motorcyclist, I am well-acquainted with boneheads who make ill-advised left turns in front of me at the last-minute. The ability to perceive depth and distance is one of those handy driving skills that seem to have been swapped for facility at dialing voicemail or texting.

[Author]

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