[bearishgurl]

[quote=pri_dk]The public pension employees will get the full benefit, as required by law. Whose money will be used to make up the difference? (Hint: It’s not the sh!tcanned fund manager, who was probably chosen by a public employee in the first place.)

Now if someone in the private sector loses money in their 401K because their money was mismanaged, who is on the hook to make up the shortfall?

Keep trying, maybe you’ll get it eventually…[/quote]

Actually, pension fund managers are chosen by retirement boards, which are comprised by law of one active public safety employee, one active non-safety employee, two retired employees, two local business owners or local CEOs (or one of each) and one elected official (usually a county supervisor). There has to be a quorum and majority vote on any decision.

pri_dk, try not to come off sounding like a dk unless you know what you’re talking about ;=]

[bearishgurl]

[quote=pri_dk]The public pension employees will get the full benefit, as required by law. Whose money will be used to make up the difference? (Hint: It’s not the sh!tcanned fund manager, who was probably chosen by a public employee in the first place.)

Now if someone in the private sector loses money in their 401K because their money was mismanaged, who is on the hook to make up the shortfall?

Keep trying, maybe you’ll get it eventually…[/quote]

Actually, pension fund managers are chosen by retirement boards, which are comprised by law of one active public safety employee, one active non-safety employee, two retired employees, two local business owners or local CEOs (or one of each) and one elected official (usually a county supervisor). There has to be a quorum and majority vote on any decision.

pri_dk, try not to come off sounding like a dk unless you know what you’re talking about ;=]

[bearishgurl]

[quote=pri_dk]The public pension employees will get the full benefit, as required by law. Whose money will be used to make up the difference? (Hint: It’s not the sh!tcanned fund manager, who was probably chosen by a public employee in the first place.)

Now if someone in the private sector loses money in their 401K because their money was mismanaged, who is on the hook to make up the shortfall?

Keep trying, maybe you’ll get it eventually…[/quote]

Actually, pension fund managers are chosen by retirement boards, which are comprised by law of one active public safety employee, one active non-safety employee, two retired employees, two local business owners or local CEOs (or one of each) and one elected official (usually a county supervisor). There has to be a quorum and majority vote on any decision.

pri_dk, try not to come off sounding like a dk unless you know what you’re talking about ;=]

[bearishgurl]

[quote=Scarlett]Then I think a first step should be changing those rules. Somehow they remind me too much of the income-stated loans for houses…How about documenting all that?

I understand even if family helps them it may not be enough, but, then loan amount should be correspondingly less. I guess it is impossible to know how much the familly helps.

But anyhow loans for living expenses should really cover bare minimum – like for housing an average rent in student housing or half the rent (you get 1 roommate) of a 1 bdr place close to univ; for food – just the equivalent of 2 meal a day at the cafeteria. A small transportation allowance if not living on campus. Really, if he needs more, then the student can take odd jobs or tutoring. or help from family.

Actually the first thing the high-school students should be taught is the compound interest calculation and how much debt they would acquire in college and how long it takes to pay it off, and how long it takes to save for retirement (I know, who think about that at 18?) – so they are not completely duped and avoid college loans like the plague they are.[/quote]

I agree that financial literacy should be taught in HS.

These “Perkins” loans and others are made privately and some are backed by the Federal government thru “Sallie Mae.” The lender of government-backed loans doesn’t really CARE if the student is able to pay them back or not. They get paid by Sallie Mae right after making the loan and then service it. No one can predict ALL college living expenses in advance, especially if the school is located in a high-cost area. Gas fluctuates in price and a student could move 3-6 times in the course of their university stint. When one or more roommates move and the remaining roommates can’t readily find another one, they often separate and move if they are not bound to a lease. Cars break down and a student could end up in a hospital emergency room or have a dental emergency and incur a large co-payment to be deposited immediately with the provider, even if insured. A new roommate or a guest could eat or steal your student’s monthly stockpile of food. Campus “cafeteria” cards are very, very expensive and the student has to be there during certain times of the day to eat the meals. In UC/CSU, they currently average $350-$500 mo but are paid for by the quarter/semester whether they are used often … or not. If your student works, they can’t possibly show up for even half the meals in the cafeteria. The vast majority of “dorms” do not have private bedrooms and one bathroom is typically shared by 2-4 students (or 20+ students if the dorm is 50+ years old). Dorms cost about $650 – $900 mo at CA public universities. Students can share apartments and houses and buy food MUCH cheaper than this (yes, even in SF, SD, Berkeley, Santa Barbara, Orange Co and West LA) and have a lot more privacy.

The full cost of attending college full-time (esp in a high cost area) is often unknown to the student until they actually settle in and figure everything out. It is not uncommon for them to have to take a job when they weren’t planning on doing so. Such is life.

[bearishgurl]

[quote=Scarlett]Then I think a first step should be changing those rules. Somehow they remind me too much of the income-stated loans for houses…How about documenting all that?

I understand even if family helps them it may not be enough, but, then loan amount should be correspondingly less. I guess it is impossible to know how much the familly helps.

But anyhow loans for living expenses should really cover bare minimum – like for housing an average rent in student housing or half the rent (you get 1 roommate) of a 1 bdr place close to univ; for food – just the equivalent of 2 meal a day at the cafeteria. A small transportation allowance if not living on campus. Really, if he needs more, then the student can take odd jobs or tutoring. or help from family.

Actually the first thing the high-school students should be taught is the compound interest calculation and how much debt they would acquire in college and how long it takes to pay it off, and how long it takes to save for retirement (I know, who think about that at 18?) – so they are not completely duped and avoid college loans like the plague they are.[/quote]

I agree that financial literacy should be taught in HS.

These “Perkins” loans and others are made privately and some are backed by the Federal government thru “Sallie Mae.” The lender of government-backed loans doesn’t really CARE if the student is able to pay them back or not. They get paid by Sallie Mae right after making the loan and then service it. No one can predict ALL college living expenses in advance, especially if the school is located in a high-cost area. Gas fluctuates in price and a student could move 3-6 times in the course of their university stint. When one or more roommates move and the remaining roommates can’t readily find another one, they often separate and move if they are not bound to a lease. Cars break down and a student could end up in a hospital emergency room or have a dental emergency and incur a large co-payment to be deposited immediately with the provider, even if insured. A new roommate or a guest could eat or steal your student’s monthly stockpile of food. Campus “cafeteria” cards are very, very expensive and the student has to be there during certain times of the day to eat the meals. In UC/CSU, they currently average $350-$500 mo but are paid for by the quarter/semester whether they are used often … or not. If your student works, they can’t possibly show up for even half the meals in the cafeteria. The vast majority of “dorms” do not have private bedrooms and one bathroom is typically shared by 2-4 students (or 20+ students if the dorm is 50+ years old). Dorms cost about $650 – $900 mo at CA public universities. Students can share apartments and houses and buy food MUCH cheaper than this (yes, even in SF, SD, Berkeley, Santa Barbara, Orange Co and West LA) and have a lot more privacy.

The full cost of attending college full-time (esp in a high cost area) is often unknown to the student until they actually settle in and figure everything out. It is not uncommon for them to have to take a job when they weren’t planning on doing so. Such is life.

[bearishgurl]

[quote=Scarlett]Then I think a first step should be changing those rules. Somehow they remind me too much of the income-stated loans for houses…How about documenting all that?

I understand even if family helps them it may not be enough, but, then loan amount should be correspondingly less. I guess it is impossible to know how much the familly helps.

But anyhow loans for living expenses should really cover bare minimum – like for housing an average rent in student housing or half the rent (you get 1 roommate) of a 1 bdr place close to univ; for food – just the equivalent of 2 meal a day at the cafeteria. A small transportation allowance if not living on campus. Really, if he needs more, then the student can take odd jobs or tutoring. or help from family.

Actually the first thing the high-school students should be taught is the compound interest calculation and how much debt they would acquire in college and how long it takes to pay it off, and how long it takes to save for retirement (I know, who think about that at 18?) – so they are not completely duped and avoid college loans like the plague they are.[/quote]

I agree that financial literacy should be taught in HS.

These “Perkins” loans and others are made privately and some are backed by the Federal government thru “Sallie Mae.” The lender of government-backed loans doesn’t really CARE if the student is able to pay them back or not. They get paid by Sallie Mae right after making the loan and then service it. No one can predict ALL college living expenses in advance, especially if the school is located in a high-cost area. Gas fluctuates in price and a student could move 3-6 times in the course of their university stint. When one or more roommates move and the remaining roommates can’t readily find another one, they often separate and move if they are not bound to a lease. Cars break down and a student could end up in a hospital emergency room or have a dental emergency and incur a large co-payment to be deposited immediately with the provider, even if insured. A new roommate or a guest could eat or steal your student’s monthly stockpile of food. Campus “cafeteria” cards are very, very expensive and the student has to be there during certain times of the day to eat the meals. In UC/CSU, they currently average $350-$500 mo but are paid for by the quarter/semester whether they are used often … or not. If your student works, they can’t possibly show up for even half the meals in the cafeteria. The vast majority of “dorms” do not have private bedrooms and one bathroom is typically shared by 2-4 students (or 20+ students if the dorm is 50+ years old). Dorms cost about $650 – $900 mo at CA public universities. Students can share apartments and houses and buy food MUCH cheaper than this (yes, even in SF, SD, Berkeley, Santa Barbara, Orange Co and West LA) and have a lot more privacy.

The full cost of attending college full-time (esp in a high cost area) is often unknown to the student until they actually settle in and figure everything out. It is not uncommon for them to have to take a job when they weren’t planning on doing so. Such is life.

[bearishgurl]

[quote=Scarlett]Then I think a first step should be changing those rules. Somehow they remind me too much of the income-stated loans for houses…How about documenting all that?

I understand even if family helps them it may not be enough, but, then loan amount should be correspondingly less. I guess it is impossible to know how much the familly helps.

But anyhow loans for living expenses should really cover bare minimum – like for housing an average rent in student housing or half the rent (you get 1 roommate) of a 1 bdr place close to univ; for food – just the equivalent of 2 meal a day at the cafeteria. A small transportation allowance if not living on campus. Really, if he needs more, then the student can take odd jobs or tutoring. or help from family.

Actually the first thing the high-school students should be taught is the compound interest calculation and how much debt they would acquire in college and how long it takes to pay it off, and how long it takes to save for retirement (I know, who think about that at 18?) – so they are not completely duped and avoid college loans like the plague they are.[/quote]

I agree that financial literacy should be taught in HS.

These “Perkins” loans and others are made privately and some are backed by the Federal government thru “Sallie Mae.” The lender of government-backed loans doesn’t really CARE if the student is able to pay them back or not. They get paid by Sallie Mae right after making the loan and then service it. No one can predict ALL college living expenses in advance, especially if the school is located in a high-cost area. Gas fluctuates in price and a student could move 3-6 times in the course of their university stint. When one or more roommates move and the remaining roommates can’t readily find another one, they often separate and move if they are not bound to a lease. Cars break down and a student could end up in a hospital emergency room or have a dental emergency and incur a large co-payment to be deposited immediately with the provider, even if insured. A new roommate or a guest could eat or steal your student’s monthly stockpile of food. Campus “cafeteria” cards are very, very expensive and the student has to be there during certain times of the day to eat the meals. In UC/CSU, they currently average $350-$500 mo but are paid for by the quarter/semester whether they are used often … or not. If your student works, they can’t possibly show up for even half the meals in the cafeteria. The vast majority of “dorms” do not have private bedrooms and one bathroom is typically shared by 2-4 students (or 20+ students if the dorm is 50+ years old). Dorms cost about $650 – $900 mo at CA public universities. Students can share apartments and houses and buy food MUCH cheaper than this (yes, even in SF, SD, Berkeley, Santa Barbara, Orange Co and West LA) and have a lot more privacy.

The full cost of attending college full-time (esp in a high cost area) is often unknown to the student until they actually settle in and figure everything out. It is not uncommon for them to have to take a job when they weren’t planning on doing so. Such is life.

[bearishgurl]

[quote=Scarlett]Then I think a first step should be changing those rules. Somehow they remind me too much of the income-stated loans for houses…How about documenting all that?

I understand even if family helps them it may not be enough, but, then loan amount should be correspondingly less. I guess it is impossible to know how much the familly helps.

But anyhow loans for living expenses should really cover bare minimum – like for housing an average rent in student housing or half the rent (you get 1 roommate) of a 1 bdr place close to univ; for food – just the equivalent of 2 meal a day at the cafeteria. A small transportation allowance if not living on campus. Really, if he needs more, then the student can take odd jobs or tutoring. or help from family.

Actually the first thing the high-school students should be taught is the compound interest calculation and how much debt they would acquire in college and how long it takes to pay it off, and how long it takes to save for retirement (I know, who think about that at 18?) – so they are not completely duped and avoid college loans like the plague they are.[/quote]

I agree that financial literacy should be taught in HS.

These “Perkins” loans and others are made privately and some are backed by the Federal government thru “Sallie Mae.” The lender of government-backed loans doesn’t really CARE if the student is able to pay them back or not. They get paid by Sallie Mae right after making the loan and then service it. No one can predict ALL college living expenses in advance, especially if the school is located in a high-cost area. Gas fluctuates in price and a student could move 3-6 times in the course of their university stint. When one or more roommates move and the remaining roommates can’t readily find another one, they often separate and move if they are not bound to a lease. Cars break down and a student could end up in a hospital emergency room or have a dental emergency and incur a large co-payment to be deposited immediately with the provider, even if insured. A new roommate or a guest could eat or steal your student’s monthly stockpile of food. Campus “cafeteria” cards are very, very expensive and the student has to be there during certain times of the day to eat the meals. In UC/CSU, they currently average $350-$500 mo but are paid for by the quarter/semester whether they are used often … or not. If your student works, they can’t possibly show up for even half the meals in the cafeteria. The vast majority of “dorms” do not have private bedrooms and one bathroom is typically shared by 2-4 students (or 20+ students if the dorm is 50+ years old). Dorms cost about $650 – $900 mo at CA public universities. Students can share apartments and houses and buy food MUCH cheaper than this (yes, even in SF, SD, Berkeley, Santa Barbara, Orange Co and West LA) and have a lot more privacy.

The full cost of attending college full-time (esp in a high cost area) is often unknown to the student until they actually settle in and figure everything out. It is not uncommon for them to have to take a job when they weren’t planning on doing so. Such is life.

[bearishgurl]

There is another solution if your recent HS grad is qualified for and having difficulty getting accepted into CSU/UC as a freshman or is a junior who is unable to enter into the program of their choice in CSU/UC after community college. If you have willing relatives in another state, you can send your kid to live with them where they will have to get some kind of work (even min wage) immediately and start producing checkstubs and eventually W-2(s) to prove they have been a resident of that state for at least one year. Between you and your kid, you could compensate the host relative. It wouldn’t be a crime to take a year-plus off in the college-age years to work. They would absolutely HAVE to work to prove residency, though, AND claim themselves on their tax return(s). Most states are very strict on accepting young students as residents who possess recent out-of-state HS diplomas or Associate degrees. They ALL want the out-of-state tuition if they can get it. They will not accept “living with grandma” as being a resident. The kid could have just arrived last week.

[bearishgurl]

There is another solution if your recent HS grad is qualified for and having difficulty getting accepted into CSU/UC as a freshman or is a junior who is unable to enter into the program of their choice in CSU/UC after community college. If you have willing relatives in another state, you can send your kid to live with them where they will have to get some kind of work (even min wage) immediately and start producing checkstubs and eventually W-2(s) to prove they have been a resident of that state for at least one year. Between you and your kid, you could compensate the host relative. It wouldn’t be a crime to take a year-plus off in the college-age years to work. They would absolutely HAVE to work to prove residency, though, AND claim themselves on their tax return(s). Most states are very strict on accepting young students as residents who possess recent out-of-state HS diplomas or Associate degrees. They ALL want the out-of-state tuition if they can get it. They will not accept “living with grandma” as being a resident. The kid could have just arrived last week.

[bearishgurl]

There is another solution if your recent HS grad is qualified for and having difficulty getting accepted into CSU/UC as a freshman or is a junior who is unable to enter into the program of their choice in CSU/UC after community college. If you have willing relatives in another state, you can send your kid to live with them where they will have to get some kind of work (even min wage) immediately and start producing checkstubs and eventually W-2(s) to prove they have been a resident of that state for at least one year. Between you and your kid, you could compensate the host relative. It wouldn’t be a crime to take a year-plus off in the college-age years to work. They would absolutely HAVE to work to prove residency, though, AND claim themselves on their tax return(s). Most states are very strict on accepting young students as residents who possess recent out-of-state HS diplomas or Associate degrees. They ALL want the out-of-state tuition if they can get it. They will not accept “living with grandma” as being a resident. The kid could have just arrived last week.

[bearishgurl]

There is another solution if your recent HS grad is qualified for and having difficulty getting accepted into CSU/UC as a freshman or is a junior who is unable to enter into the program of their choice in CSU/UC after community college. If you have willing relatives in another state, you can send your kid to live with them where they will have to get some kind of work (even min wage) immediately and start producing checkstubs and eventually W-2(s) to prove they have been a resident of that state for at least one year. Between you and your kid, you could compensate the host relative. It wouldn’t be a crime to take a year-plus off in the college-age years to work. They would absolutely HAVE to work to prove residency, though, AND claim themselves on their tax return(s). Most states are very strict on accepting young students as residents who possess recent out-of-state HS diplomas or Associate degrees. They ALL want the out-of-state tuition if they can get it. They will not accept “living with grandma” as being a resident. The kid could have just arrived last week.

[bearishgurl]

There is another solution if your recent HS grad is qualified for and having difficulty getting accepted into CSU/UC as a freshman or is a junior who is unable to enter into the program of their choice in CSU/UC after community college. If you have willing relatives in another state, you can send your kid to live with them where they will have to get some kind of work (even min wage) immediately and start producing checkstubs and eventually W-2(s) to prove they have been a resident of that state for at least one year. Between you and your kid, you could compensate the host relative. It wouldn’t be a crime to take a year-plus off in the college-age years to work. They would absolutely HAVE to work to prove residency, though, AND claim themselves on their tax return(s). Most states are very strict on accepting young students as residents who possess recent out-of-state HS diplomas or Associate degrees. They ALL want the out-of-state tuition if they can get it. They will not accept “living with grandma” as being a resident. The kid could have just arrived last week.

[bearishgurl]

[quote=Scarlett]I don’t think many parents now close(r) to the retirement (in their 50s) would up and go just for the kid to get residency in a certain state. Jobs for “older” people are harder to find too. So that leaves the kids having to borrow a boatload of money to pay for an out-of-state and/or private college.

Coming back to California – if there will be many more in-state QUALIFIED applicants, wouldn’t that translate in more money paid to the universities => more money to hire/expand teachers/classes etc.?[/quote]

You are correct in that it is very difficult anywhere for a 50+ year old to obtain another job after leaving or losing one. I was thinking more along the lines of the parent(s) moving back to their home state to help in a family business, transferring to a new intallation thru the military or Federal Civil Service or corporate workers transfering to “headquarters” or a new regional office of their companies. These types of job transfers, if strategically planned in advance, aren’t that difficult to make happen.

There is already an overflow of qualified applicants for CA university billets and this DID NOT translate into more admissions or classes for students. In addition, the fees have been raised at least 10 times in the CSU system in the last eight or so years. It appears to me that the two systems are trying to eliminate more pension obligations so are letting go instructors before they vest. Meanwhile, the ones that are retiring are not being replaced. One business department head at SFSU told me that he had never been asked to lay off as many instructors as he had to in 2010 in his 30+ years in the system.

[bearishgurl]

[quote=Scarlett]I don’t think many parents now close(r) to the retirement (in their 50s) would up and go just for the kid to get residency in a certain state. Jobs for “older” people are harder to find too. So that leaves the kids having to borrow a boatload of money to pay for an out-of-state and/or private college.

Coming back to California – if there will be many more in-state QUALIFIED applicants, wouldn’t that translate in more money paid to the universities => more money to hire/expand teachers/classes etc.?[/quote]

You are correct in that it is very difficult anywhere for a 50+ year old to obtain another job after leaving or losing one. I was thinking more along the lines of the parent(s) moving back to their home state to help in a family business, transferring to a new intallation thru the military or Federal Civil Service or corporate workers transfering to “headquarters” or a new regional office of their companies. These types of job transfers, if strategically planned in advance, aren’t that difficult to make happen.

There is already an overflow of qualified applicants for CA university billets and this DID NOT translate into more admissions or classes for students. In addition, the fees have been raised at least 10 times in the CSU system in the last eight or so years. It appears to me that the two systems are trying to eliminate more pension obligations so are letting go instructors before they vest. Meanwhile, the ones that are retiring are not being replaced. One business department head at SFSU told me that he had never been asked to lay off as many instructors as he had to in 2010 in his 30+ years in the system.

[Author]

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