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January 23, 2013 at 1:11 PM in reply to: Over 21% of homeowners in SD County have paid off houses #758359January 23, 2013 at 1:01 PM in reply to: Over 21% of homeowners in SD County have paid off houses #758355
bearishgurl
Participant[quote=craptcha] . . . So, did you earn your pension by hand-carrying documents or by pretending that you respect your supervisor?[/quote]
Well, there was a little more to the positions than that … but … BOTH ;=D
January 23, 2013 at 12:59 PM in reply to: Over 21% of homeowners in SD County have paid off houses #758353Participant[quote=flu]…You see BG. Here’s the rub.. You really can’t make an argument that I have soo much free time and am overpaid..When you’re on the same blog, posting at the same time, can you ? And plus, I’m exempt. I’m paid to get my job done, whether it’s 1 hr or 14 hrs in one day. If you’re hourly or bill hourly, that’s an entire different story :)[/quote]
Why flu, I never claimed you were “overpaid.” It’s not for me to decide. But what we CAN agree on is that we both currently get paid to get a job done whether it takes one hour or 14 hours.
Except that I am doing it from home.
I’m not averse to working in an office again … part time. But in my profession, I would be paid hourly and thus would not be able to get all those “extra” things done “on the clock” that you seem to be able to . . .
Carry on . . . 🙂
January 23, 2013 at 12:45 PM in reply to: Over 21% of homeowners in SD County have paid off houses #758348Participant[quote=zzz]BG, reality check, but most people don’t have those perks, free, subsidized or otherwise. And yes, I had to dress up in suits every day for years and years and still do for biz meetings. And yes I know people who were sent home because their top was too low. I and many other colleagues had to put up with sexist remarks, sexual harrassment, 15 hour days, long hours at client meetings or in the office. No I didn’t work from home, meetings, pretending to like higher ups, living on planes and extensive travel, had to lift heavy boxes to unpack or pack up booths at trade shows. No its not a descriptor of youth, its called work BG…and you know what, I had it better than most because I got paid well to put up with this. But a lot of people actually don’t get paid well to work in much less desirable environments. And no, most people I know don’t wear flip flops to work, nor do they work from home. Lots of people have to drive or commute 30 mins or 2 hours each way. I have friends who work in underserved neighborhoods and get peed and shit on by kids they counsel, hit or bitten by kids, and have to leave their work escorted by security guards because people get shot in the neighborhood all the time.[/quote]
Yes, zzz, we can both agree that …. “…a lot of people actually don’t get paid well to work in much less desirable environments.”
I see from your post that you have been a “road warrior” at least part of your “career.”
I have another couple of questions of you, zzz. Do you have children? And if so, if they are (or when they were) pre-school age, is or was there someone at your home to “mind the store?” Or were your children in FT daycare from infancy?
I am well aware of what CPS and County social workers do. Yes, everything you say about those jobs are true and there is much more.
HOWEVER . . . again, these people MAJOR in social work and nursing in college all the while KNOWING exactly what the job entails.
btw, you must know that County CPS workers and social workers will receive defined benefit pensions when they retire.
Do you think they “deserve” them?
January 23, 2013 at 12:31 PM in reply to: Over 21% of homeowners in SD County have paid off houses #758344Participant[quote=flu]meh.. it’s just a blog… 🙂
I’m just kicking time. Because I’m in between software builds… I can’t really trade right now on the equity markets (prices are too high…even so, I am sort of..Watch flu get his ass kicked)…I’ve already looked at sdlookup 92130 and 92126 for today’s inventory…for the sixth time…(still the same, although AN did point out to me a 1/1 that was already ridiculously priced, just went even more ridiculously higher), already checked craigslist for new miata parts (none)…And I’m waiting for my damn escrow papers to get done…..
Man, my to be lender is really anal.. I signed one paper slightly different from the rest, and the lender requires me to resign it, and am going to dispatch a courier to do it….[/quote]
This is just another “on-the-clock” description of a “day in the life of highly-paid Pigg, `flu’.”
Thank you for making my point so eloquently ;=]
January 23, 2013 at 12:20 PM in reply to: Over 21% of homeowners in SD County have paid off houses #758340Participant[quote=zzz][quote=bearishgurl].
I have to laugh at the Piggs’ (primarly Gen Y on this forum who have worked less than a decade and already want to “retire,” lol) opinions on why I don’t deserve my small pension. These “workers” are obviously either “working from home” or sitting in the office with their feet up on the desk in private offices with jeans, a t-shirt and flip flops on with a laptop/tablet on their lap, music playing in headphones and Piggington on their taskbar. 🙂 They no doubt have access to free parking, company coffee carts, company gyms, company jogging trails and wide-screens in their company cafeteria serving healthy food, etc. These workers really have no idea what most boomers did all day to earn their pay. Not a clue.I would compare my “career” (which earned me a small pension) to serving in the military (except for no deployments and 8-5 pm only) :=0
Basically, it was all about proper “face time” and getting ALL your work done before 5:00 pm.[/quote]
BG, I’m sorry, but your list of why you’re entitled to a pension is laughable. The work you did, the expectations at work, um this is life and no it hasn’t changed that much. There are people my age or younger who have to deal with far worse, work much longer hours, in shitty neighborhoods and with little to no perks to speak of. Hardly anyone I know outside of silicon valley or NYC has free gym, free lunch, free anything at work. And if they do, its because they work 15hrs days. No they don’t put in “face time” as you said, they are actually productive.
You really need to get in touch with what’s going on in the world. And stop being so entitled.[/quote]
zzz, I never said those “perks” at your company were “free” (exc maybe the parking, widescreen and “jogging trail”). I said they were “available” to you.
Let me ask you, zzz. Would you rather have a job where you had to “dress up” and have 8 hours of completely accountable “face time” per day (plus commute time) or work at home (for “15hrs days” as you say, lol)
What if you were a parent of infant(s), toddler(s) or small children (maybe your are)?
And I won’t even post the zip codes that I lived in while working in my “cushy” gubment positions. There is no need to here. Why?
Because you wouldn’t even drive thru them, let alone live in them.
Your post describes the badge of youth. Everyone’s got (or had) the same problem.
January 23, 2013 at 12:07 PM in reply to: Over 21% of homeowners in SD County have paid off houses #758332Participant[quote=AN][quote=bearishgurl]Yes, AN. I am WELL AWARE of what nurses do. HOWEVER, the FT ones got paid and get paid more than twice as much as I did/do.
People who major in nursing want to do this kind of work, no?
From your prior posts, I understand your spouse is a nurse and that she only worked one day a week (or something like that). A part, part-time nurse gig can’t possibly be as stressful as having to show up at a hospital 4-5 days per week on time for an 8-12 hr shift on your feet.[/quote]So, because you want to be a RN, somehow, all of that $hit is OK? So, are you saying you don’t want to do your kind of work?
It has nothing to do with me or my wife. I’m talking about general here. Your diatribe some like whining about things that’s hardly difficult when compare to other professions. I bet 1 day as a nurse is harder on your body than a week at your job. I have much respect for all nurses out there and the kind of $hit they have to deal with, literally.[/quote]
Obviously, people who major in nursing already KNOW what they will be getting into. Why should they complain about the working conditions when they went into the profession with their eyes wide open?
I’m not “whining.” I’m simply stating that workers today have so much better working conditions than workers in decades past. In every way, shape and form …. including many “worker-friendly laws” that boomers didn’t have.
There’s nothing anyone can do about that. Even though these same jobs are much more automated today, 50% of Gen Y’s hired don’t even stay long enough to vest. If they don’t have student loans to pay off, many generally hate it and leave just before or after passing their initial probationary period.
That has been my “anecdotal” experience with hearing about and talking with friends’ and neighbors’ children.
Nurses today (even part-timers) at both Sharp Healthcare and ScrippsHealth can avail themselves of a funds-matching retirement plan (emp contributes 40% and org contributes 60%, I believe).
These are GREAT PLANS!
I’ve been incarcerated in the hospital for a few short visits and have also visited several relatives in ICU for several days at a time. In observing and talking to nurses, the job seemed to me to be prestigious and rewarding to them, especially for those who have many years tenure 🙂
January 23, 2013 at 11:45 AM in reply to: Over 21% of homeowners in SD County have paid off houses #758320Participant[quote=craptcha]BG, you said nothing about the actual work you performed. Are you being compensated for working with psychotic bosses in poorly managed organization?[/quote]
This is how the court and justice system worked at that time. The clerks for the court and for both the “People” and the “Defendants” worked one day ahead of the court schedule. Everything had to be proved to the judge – on paper and on time.
Those papers had to be found and produced, no matter WHERE they were located.
Without working “in the system” for 2-3 years and having excellent training, one would have no idea how to find them, let alone be able to properly “produce them.”
The “computers” we had were CRTs on a crude Burroughs mainframe which did not give us all the info we needed but was a start.
In one of the duties we had, we were on your own to produce up to 400 files per day (avg 365) beginning at 8:00 am (with pt-time, intermittent help). If you couldn’t finish the job by 3:30, you had to tell your entire floor thru a megaphone which ones were missing and enlist aid from anyone available to give it.
If you sat in a felony courtroom in a large CA county and watched the proceedings for a few hours, it all looks perfunctory and smooth.
You have NO IDEA how much work from how many people goes into that ONE calendar.
Not really psychotic … or “poorly managed.” We just did the very best we could with what we had to work with. I think we did a “bang up” job!
The difference between craptcha (a Gen Y?) and a boomer is that the Gen Y thinks a supervisor is “psychotic” when they want face time and want to know what their subordinates are constantly doing. Perhaps this isn’t so important when this stuff can now be done in a cubicle with intranet and and pdf files. But it was VERY important when humans had to physically and properly produce everything and hand-carry it into a courtroom.
January 23, 2013 at 11:27 AM in reply to: Over 21% of homeowners in SD County have paid off houses #758317Participant[quote=AN]BG, do you have to clean up $hit? Do you have to deal with people with AIDS, TB, TDAP, etc? Do yo have your customer throw stuff at you, call you name, hit on you, etc? Do you have to lift 300lb+ people? Do you have to help those 300lb+ to the bathroom and wipe their butt? I can go on, but that’s what nurses have to deal with today. Not to mention that they have clock in and out just like you. But they also get written up if they work too late or take lunch too late or come in late, etc.[/quote]
Yes, AN. I am WELL AWARE of what nurses do. HOWEVER, the FT ones got paid and get paid more than twice as much as I did/do.
People who major in nursing want to do this kind of work, no?
From your prior posts, I understand your spouse is a nurse and that she only worked one day a week (or something like that). A part, part-time nurse gig can’t possibly be as stressful as having to show up at a hospital 4-5 days per week on time for an 8-12 hr shift on your feet.
January 23, 2013 at 11:08 AM in reply to: Over 21% of homeowners in SD County have paid off houses #758311Participant[quote=cvmom][quote=earlyretirement]BG,
I’d LOVE LOVE LOVE a pension like that. It sounds like you’re one of the lucky ones.[/quote]
+1[/quote]
cvmom, you would have had to have been me (in the era I earned it) in order to be eligible for it.
I had to return to work after maternity leaves within ten weeks of initially starting it (and this is only because I had leave saved to pay for the additional four weeks over the six wks that SDI covered at 62%). Many didn’t.
Working conditions:
Until 1990, walk several blocks to/from car thru a solid two blocks of tatoo parlors, liquor stores, bars and a “peep show” among numerous homeless persons and Hell’s Angels, etc, etc. Got off work at 5:00 pm and the last quarter of the year it got dark at ~4:30 pm.
Why? Those were the closest and only commercial pay pkg lots available. We rec’d $50 month on our checks to pay for them and they cost $85 to $130 mo.
Until 1990, wore skirts, dresses, dress shoes and hose nearly every day.
Why? A strict dress code was required for women in my classification. (we changed into sneakers to walk to/from our cars).
Be docked in increments of 1/10 of an hour (6 min) if arrived late in the morning or late from lunch reporting to supervisor. (It was up to discretion of supervisor whether they would accept annual leave min/hrs in lieu of docking, but if they did, an employees leave could be siphoned off such that they would never have enough hours to get a vacation.)
PC at one’s desk? What’s that?? Only after 1990 (amber/blk screens until 2000). Internet access? After 1999, had access to “intranet” only, which was proprietary and limited to gov biz departmental websites only.
After 2000, we rec’d limited internet with a far-reaching filter locking most sites. Each PC came with a keylogger installed in its hard drives, with another installed keylogger on the dept’s network.
After 2000, there were at least two persons employed at each dept who had no other duties but to keep track of employees’ keystrokes and what they were doing on the intranet/internet.
Employees were sent home for a hem down, torn clothing, too-tight clothing, appearing too sick (they had run out of sick leave), barefoot sandals, clothing with writing on it, poor hygiene, failure to wear hose/socks, etc.
You better give the impression of liking and respecting your supervisor or your life could be made hell really fast . . .
Employees were routinely written up for “disrespect” and “insubordination.”
Until 1990, no cubicles. Desks were out in the open or pushed into another employee’s desk. Must check in with supervisor to take break/lunch.
Routinely handled 20-50 lb boxes and files lifting many of them off high shelves (with ladders) and moving in/out of baskets. When some older files were pulled off top shelves, this disturbed ceiling tiles containing asbestos, which caused white dust to fall on you.
Got bleary eyed routinely going thru years and years of microfilm to find and print old documents needed by tomorrow.
After 1990, had cubicle with cardboard clock on the outside with signs “break” and “lunch.” The employee put up a “break” or “lunch” sign and moved the hands of the clock indicating when they would be back. And they better not be overstaying their breaks/lunch as someone else was waiting to go when they came back.
Sat at long tables seating 12 eating brown-bag lunches for at least a decade. Frig provided. Snacks came from machine two floors down. Coffee was provided but was regular coffee with sugar/powdered creamer (no latte, Starbucks, etc).
B/W TV was available in lunchroom to watch soaps. It only got three channels.
I could go on but you get the drift.
I have to laugh at the Piggs’ (primarly Gen Y on this forum who have worked less than a decade and already want to “retire,” lol) opinions on why I don’t deserve my small pension. These “workers” are obviously either “working from home” or sitting in the office with their feet up on the desk in private offices with jeans, a t-shirt and flip flops on with a laptop/tablet on their lap, music playing in headphones and Piggington on their taskbar. 🙂 They no doubt have access to free parking, company coffee carts, company gyms, company jogging trails and wide-screens in their company cafeteria serving healthy food, etc. These workers really have no idea what most boomers did all day to earn their pay. Not a clue.
I would compare my “career” (which earned me a small pension) to serving in the military (except for no deployments and 8-5 pm only) :=0
Basically, it was all about proper “face time” and getting ALL your work done before 5:00 pm.
Oh, and cvmom, my kids were in FT daycare since infancy. They were picked up every day between 5:35 and 6:00 pm.
ParticipantI saw the video in Sports Authority. It looks so cool 🙂
January 22, 2013 at 6:07 PM in reply to: Over 21% of homeowners in SD County have paid off houses #758277ParticipantIt’s just not all as “gloom and doom” as some of you are saying here. If I even had 1/10th of the “financial savvy” that some of you here display, I would be much better off in my retirement years.
You need to keep in mind that most boomers and beyond didn’t have nearly the expense of raising a family as Gen X and Y do/did.
It didn’t cost them as much because they didn’t raise their kids in the same or similar “style” that younger-generation parents have become “accustomed to.”
Part of the reason for this is that the choices just weren’t there for most young boomer-parents. Vast choices in baby/child accessories, housing, cable/internet, private schools, pre-k/kinder/ Montessori, *new* public schools (with accompanying MR tax), cell phones, laptops, tablets, etc, etc.
Another reason is I think more boomer women stayed in the workforce for decades at 1-2 jobs. They weren’t allowed (before 1993) to take off more than ten weeks (usually just six weeks) for maternity leave or they would lose their jobs. New dads weren’t allowed to take off for maternity leave. Boomer women worked because they had to (because fewer of their spouses were college graduates and thus, “professionals”).
I see FAR MORE Gen X/Y SAHM’s in their 20’s thru 40’s than I EVER saw of us boomers. It seems most of the younger posters on this forum state they have a one-income family, even if the SAH parent has a college degree or an advanced degree. And the job market has been poor in recent years.
Besides many boomers having access to defined benefit pensions, combine that with the vast majority of boomer parents in dual-income households who worked longer in years, worked more hours (got more overtime) and worked steadier and more consistently than generations following (this is NOT gender-specific). Most lived within their means their entire lives (save medical emergencies, etc).
IMHO, even after the effects of the stock market crash of 2000 and 2008 on boomers’ retirement funds. the above are just a few reasons why we are/will be able to retire on much less than younger generations think they will need.
January 22, 2013 at 5:31 PM in reply to: Over 21% of homeowners in SD County have paid off houses #758273ParticipantI am surrounded by boomers and beyond who are living simple lives and are seemingly not in danger of going under, EVER. The vast majority own paid-off residences. Many own 15-30 year-old vehicles but have longtime friends and/or family members who own service garages. They have military and ALL KINDS of other public and private pensions and thus have money to travel to see grandkids and for pleasure (within the US).
Re: MY pension is not in danger of being cut because I do not have an “enhanced” pension (which was offered to existing employees after my tenure). The formulas are such in the enhanced program as to give these employees 2-3 times my monthly pension for the same highest-year salary and same years of service as I have. Much more is/was withdrawn out of these employees’ paychecks for their pension contribution than was mine but their monthly pension amounts are/will be MUCH greater, out of proportion to their contributions.
This was a grave mistake which was made by your elected officials at the time.
The pensioners in these later tiers will be the ones to suffer cuts, if any have to be made and/or their healthcare allowances (currently added to monthly pension checks, but NOT guaranteed) will be revoked …. The earlier tiers with much lower-paid pensioners will NOT be affected, nor will their healthcare allowances.
There are much fewer pensioners in my retirement tier who even use the health plans offered by the retirement assn as their primary carrier as most are eligible for Medicare. Many use the (much cheaper) plans offered by the Assn for Medicare Parts B and D.
January 22, 2013 at 5:03 PM in reply to: Over 21% of homeowners in SD County have paid off houses #758269Participantflu, re your last post, I understand where you’re coming from. I’ve had several close relatives who leaned towards a being “penny-pinching type” and died before being able to really enjoy life.
All had plenty of money to “retire on” but none made it that far.
One of them enjoyed the same “Cadillac” healthplan as the US Presidential Cabinet members.
Didn’t matter.
You can’t take it with you.
And thanks for bringing up the issue of the big insurers being able to negotiate “retail” medical fees for every visit and procedure down to a “deeply discounted” price (still expensive in anyone’s book). This is s-o-o-o-o important and is the primary reason to take out a policy or healthplan with only the most reputable, recognized health insurers in the US.
Luckily, Obamacare got rid of my $1M lifetime cap on my health plan and it is now either $5M or unlimited, I believe. Of course, after the rates are adjusted downwards by the big carriers, an insured individual today could feasibly die at least 3x (after lengthy treatment and/or hospital stays before each death) for $5M, lol :=0
January 22, 2013 at 4:43 PM in reply to: Over 21% of homeowners in SD County have paid off houses #758263ParticipantI’m failing to see why boomers need these high numbers in savings, stocks, etc to survive … especially ones with pensions who are just a few years from SS (assuming it pays out the retiree’s entire life).
I think a boomer with pension(s) can prudently “retire” on <=$1M, that is, IF they don't try to retire before at least age ~57 (preferably 59.5). A very experienced former worker can ALWAYS do something to make a little money ... even working from home (at least I can). LOTS of current "retirees" have their hand in a pot somewhere. Today's crop of boomers don't even own rocking chairs! I couldn't spend $5M if I tried. WTH do I need/want that costs that much ... even over the course of 20+ years? Of course, this statement assumes food (ESP fresh produce) will NOT triple or quadruple in price in my lifetime. I went to a "weightlifting-type" aerobic fitness class for the first time this past week and this large room was FULL of 60-somethings. And the majority of them were fit as a fiddle (both male and female). Just let me purchase a modest "vintage" 1950's house with hardwood floors (currently $175K to $350K) within 2 mi of a major ski resort (ex: S. Lake Tahoe) and a season lift pass (purchased the prior summer for half-price). I just learned from one of my fitness instructors (going on 70) that Snow Valley up in Big Bear Lake offers FREE sking to skiers over 70. He and his spouse just came back from two days on the slopes where he stated to the class that he planned to ski more often after he turned 70 :=] As a "retiree," even if I had a little 15-hr week paying "gig" shuffling court papers or the like, life really doesn't get any better than that and certainly doesn’t cost anywhere NEAR $5M . . . or even $2M, for that matter. There’s a LOT of biz functions I could perform as an “independent contractor.”
Not everyone has a desire to travel the world. I know several boomers who “inherited” RVs and boats in pretty good condition. For many, that is enough “entertainment” (along with owning a road-worthy vehicle).
Perhaps some Piggs are stating that “millions” or “$5M” is needed for a couple to retire. If that is the case, they often have two or more pensions between themselves, so no … I don’t think they need $5M.
I think taking a lot of risk to try to accumulate that much is unrealistic and overkill, unless one is presently young enough (~20-30-ish) and has time to recover from investment mistakes.
The above presupposes the retirees did NOT overextend themselves throughout life on RE loans and other forms of consumer credit, are retiring with a paid-off residence OR will sell their residence and buy a retirement residence with their sales proceeds and have pension allowances which greatly assist with healthcare premiums OR qualify medically for a low-cost HDHP.
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