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scaredyclassic.
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April 3, 2011 at 7:54 PM #684171April 3, 2011 at 8:32 PM #683001
SD Realtor
ParticipantMore often then not the homebuyer measures affordability by monthly payment as opposed to home price, (at least in Cali due to relatively low property tax). Pretty much every buyer now usnderstands that the our future is cast in stone with regards to higher interest rates. So I do not believe anyone will be in for a rude surprise with regards to rates rising.
The speculation about price depreciation is quite valid BUT I do not believe they will correlate to the rate hikes. How proportional will they be? I could not guess but once you hit investor return levels you will see the bottoms set for pricing. Again, I do not know what this is as it varies with each area. Similarly those who do not have 6 figure nest eggs to drop into homes will simply not be able to buy. They will not be able to afford the homes even with large price drops. I do believe the price drops will be there and will be nice to see. For those who have prepared correctly, they will get rewarded. For those who have an affordable payment locked in, they will be happy with the payment but unhappy with the depreciated asset and depending on the amount of depreciation they may not be able to sell without a loss.
April 3, 2011 at 8:32 PM #683052ParticipantMore often then not the homebuyer measures affordability by monthly payment as opposed to home price, (at least in Cali due to relatively low property tax). Pretty much every buyer now usnderstands that the our future is cast in stone with regards to higher interest rates. So I do not believe anyone will be in for a rude surprise with regards to rates rising.
The speculation about price depreciation is quite valid BUT I do not believe they will correlate to the rate hikes. How proportional will they be? I could not guess but once you hit investor return levels you will see the bottoms set for pricing. Again, I do not know what this is as it varies with each area. Similarly those who do not have 6 figure nest eggs to drop into homes will simply not be able to buy. They will not be able to afford the homes even with large price drops. I do believe the price drops will be there and will be nice to see. For those who have prepared correctly, they will get rewarded. For those who have an affordable payment locked in, they will be happy with the payment but unhappy with the depreciated asset and depending on the amount of depreciation they may not be able to sell without a loss.
April 3, 2011 at 8:32 PM #683680ParticipantMore often then not the homebuyer measures affordability by monthly payment as opposed to home price, (at least in Cali due to relatively low property tax). Pretty much every buyer now usnderstands that the our future is cast in stone with regards to higher interest rates. So I do not believe anyone will be in for a rude surprise with regards to rates rising.
The speculation about price depreciation is quite valid BUT I do not believe they will correlate to the rate hikes. How proportional will they be? I could not guess but once you hit investor return levels you will see the bottoms set for pricing. Again, I do not know what this is as it varies with each area. Similarly those who do not have 6 figure nest eggs to drop into homes will simply not be able to buy. They will not be able to afford the homes even with large price drops. I do believe the price drops will be there and will be nice to see. For those who have prepared correctly, they will get rewarded. For those who have an affordable payment locked in, they will be happy with the payment but unhappy with the depreciated asset and depending on the amount of depreciation they may not be able to sell without a loss.
April 3, 2011 at 8:32 PM #683820ParticipantMore often then not the homebuyer measures affordability by monthly payment as opposed to home price, (at least in Cali due to relatively low property tax). Pretty much every buyer now usnderstands that the our future is cast in stone with regards to higher interest rates. So I do not believe anyone will be in for a rude surprise with regards to rates rising.
The speculation about price depreciation is quite valid BUT I do not believe they will correlate to the rate hikes. How proportional will they be? I could not guess but once you hit investor return levels you will see the bottoms set for pricing. Again, I do not know what this is as it varies with each area. Similarly those who do not have 6 figure nest eggs to drop into homes will simply not be able to buy. They will not be able to afford the homes even with large price drops. I do believe the price drops will be there and will be nice to see. For those who have prepared correctly, they will get rewarded. For those who have an affordable payment locked in, they will be happy with the payment but unhappy with the depreciated asset and depending on the amount of depreciation they may not be able to sell without a loss.
April 3, 2011 at 8:32 PM #684176ParticipantMore often then not the homebuyer measures affordability by monthly payment as opposed to home price, (at least in Cali due to relatively low property tax). Pretty much every buyer now usnderstands that the our future is cast in stone with regards to higher interest rates. So I do not believe anyone will be in for a rude surprise with regards to rates rising.
The speculation about price depreciation is quite valid BUT I do not believe they will correlate to the rate hikes. How proportional will they be? I could not guess but once you hit investor return levels you will see the bottoms set for pricing. Again, I do not know what this is as it varies with each area. Similarly those who do not have 6 figure nest eggs to drop into homes will simply not be able to buy. They will not be able to afford the homes even with large price drops. I do believe the price drops will be there and will be nice to see. For those who have prepared correctly, they will get rewarded. For those who have an affordable payment locked in, they will be happy with the payment but unhappy with the depreciated asset and depending on the amount of depreciation they may not be able to sell without a loss.
April 3, 2011 at 9:27 PM #683026SK in CV
Participant[quote=urbanrealtor][quote=SK in CV]
As to who forecloses…well it is the servicer. They get the ball rolling, nobody else. The servicers, on behalf of the beneficiary control that process.[/quote]
You are inaccurate about this.
The lenders (or lien holders or note holders or whatever) are the employers of the servicers and can veto their actions.
I am doing one with Aurora right now.
Aurora has misrepresented some of the components of this deal and the seller has had me contact the note holder (who is a major east coast financial firm).The financial firm has postponed the short sale and we are now dealing with them.
While I do not dispute that it is sometimes in the best interests of the servicer to foreclose, I think that they try very hard not to act in any way that appears to place their own interests above those of their lender.
Now that last thought is pure speculation but it is consistent with both observable behavior as well as models of lien holder and servicer incentive structures.[/quote]
Which is why I said “on behalf of the beneficiary”. What I have seen is that when the bene is a single entity, they’re much more likely to have input. When the bene is a REMIC (either private label or GSE) the likelihood that they’ll get involved in anything the servicer does is less likely. Not impossible, just less likely.
I have a recollection of there being some pretty significant complaints against Aurora in the past, and some litigation about how they were handling…now I can’t remember if it was short sales or mods. Litigants were attempting to get their class certified. Not sure what happened with it.
And yes, the servicers attempt to appear as if their clients recovery is most important. Even as they’re taking kickbacks from foreclosure attorneys :).
April 3, 2011 at 9:27 PM #683077Participant[quote=urbanrealtor][quote=SK in CV]
As to who forecloses…well it is the servicer. They get the ball rolling, nobody else. The servicers, on behalf of the beneficiary control that process.[/quote]
You are inaccurate about this.
The lenders (or lien holders or note holders or whatever) are the employers of the servicers and can veto their actions.
I am doing one with Aurora right now.
Aurora has misrepresented some of the components of this deal and the seller has had me contact the note holder (who is a major east coast financial firm).The financial firm has postponed the short sale and we are now dealing with them.
While I do not dispute that it is sometimes in the best interests of the servicer to foreclose, I think that they try very hard not to act in any way that appears to place their own interests above those of their lender.
Now that last thought is pure speculation but it is consistent with both observable behavior as well as models of lien holder and servicer incentive structures.[/quote]
Which is why I said “on behalf of the beneficiary”. What I have seen is that when the bene is a single entity, they’re much more likely to have input. When the bene is a REMIC (either private label or GSE) the likelihood that they’ll get involved in anything the servicer does is less likely. Not impossible, just less likely.
I have a recollection of there being some pretty significant complaints against Aurora in the past, and some litigation about how they were handling…now I can’t remember if it was short sales or mods. Litigants were attempting to get their class certified. Not sure what happened with it.
And yes, the servicers attempt to appear as if their clients recovery is most important. Even as they’re taking kickbacks from foreclosure attorneys :).
April 3, 2011 at 9:27 PM #683705Participant[quote=urbanrealtor][quote=SK in CV]
As to who forecloses…well it is the servicer. They get the ball rolling, nobody else. The servicers, on behalf of the beneficiary control that process.[/quote]
You are inaccurate about this.
The lenders (or lien holders or note holders or whatever) are the employers of the servicers and can veto their actions.
I am doing one with Aurora right now.
Aurora has misrepresented some of the components of this deal and the seller has had me contact the note holder (who is a major east coast financial firm).The financial firm has postponed the short sale and we are now dealing with them.
While I do not dispute that it is sometimes in the best interests of the servicer to foreclose, I think that they try very hard not to act in any way that appears to place their own interests above those of their lender.
Now that last thought is pure speculation but it is consistent with both observable behavior as well as models of lien holder and servicer incentive structures.[/quote]
Which is why I said “on behalf of the beneficiary”. What I have seen is that when the bene is a single entity, they’re much more likely to have input. When the bene is a REMIC (either private label or GSE) the likelihood that they’ll get involved in anything the servicer does is less likely. Not impossible, just less likely.
I have a recollection of there being some pretty significant complaints against Aurora in the past, and some litigation about how they were handling…now I can’t remember if it was short sales or mods. Litigants were attempting to get their class certified. Not sure what happened with it.
And yes, the servicers attempt to appear as if their clients recovery is most important. Even as they’re taking kickbacks from foreclosure attorneys :).
April 3, 2011 at 9:27 PM #683845Participant[quote=urbanrealtor][quote=SK in CV]
As to who forecloses…well it is the servicer. They get the ball rolling, nobody else. The servicers, on behalf of the beneficiary control that process.[/quote]
You are inaccurate about this.
The lenders (or lien holders or note holders or whatever) are the employers of the servicers and can veto their actions.
I am doing one with Aurora right now.
Aurora has misrepresented some of the components of this deal and the seller has had me contact the note holder (who is a major east coast financial firm).The financial firm has postponed the short sale and we are now dealing with them.
While I do not dispute that it is sometimes in the best interests of the servicer to foreclose, I think that they try very hard not to act in any way that appears to place their own interests above those of their lender.
Now that last thought is pure speculation but it is consistent with both observable behavior as well as models of lien holder and servicer incentive structures.[/quote]
Which is why I said “on behalf of the beneficiary”. What I have seen is that when the bene is a single entity, they’re much more likely to have input. When the bene is a REMIC (either private label or GSE) the likelihood that they’ll get involved in anything the servicer does is less likely. Not impossible, just less likely.
I have a recollection of there being some pretty significant complaints against Aurora in the past, and some litigation about how they were handling…now I can’t remember if it was short sales or mods. Litigants were attempting to get their class certified. Not sure what happened with it.
And yes, the servicers attempt to appear as if their clients recovery is most important. Even as they’re taking kickbacks from foreclosure attorneys :).
April 3, 2011 at 9:27 PM #684200Participant[quote=urbanrealtor][quote=SK in CV]
As to who forecloses…well it is the servicer. They get the ball rolling, nobody else. The servicers, on behalf of the beneficiary control that process.[/quote]
You are inaccurate about this.
The lenders (or lien holders or note holders or whatever) are the employers of the servicers and can veto their actions.
I am doing one with Aurora right now.
Aurora has misrepresented some of the components of this deal and the seller has had me contact the note holder (who is a major east coast financial firm).The financial firm has postponed the short sale and we are now dealing with them.
While I do not dispute that it is sometimes in the best interests of the servicer to foreclose, I think that they try very hard not to act in any way that appears to place their own interests above those of their lender.
Now that last thought is pure speculation but it is consistent with both observable behavior as well as models of lien holder and servicer incentive structures.[/quote]
Which is why I said “on behalf of the beneficiary”. What I have seen is that when the bene is a single entity, they’re much more likely to have input. When the bene is a REMIC (either private label or GSE) the likelihood that they’ll get involved in anything the servicer does is less likely. Not impossible, just less likely.
I have a recollection of there being some pretty significant complaints against Aurora in the past, and some litigation about how they were handling…now I can’t remember if it was short sales or mods. Litigants were attempting to get their class certified. Not sure what happened with it.
And yes, the servicers attempt to appear as if their clients recovery is most important. Even as they’re taking kickbacks from foreclosure attorneys :).
April 3, 2011 at 10:22 PM #683036Scarlett
Participant[quote=SD Realtor]More often then not the homebuyer measures affordability by monthly payment as opposed to home price, (…) I The speculation about price depreciation is quite valid BUT I do not believe they will correlate to the rate hikes. How proportional will they be? I could not guess but once you hit investor return levels you will see the bottoms set for pricing. Again, I do not know what this is as it varies with each area. Similarly those who do not have 6 figure nest eggs to drop into homes will simply not be able to buy. They will not be able to afford the homes even with large price drops. I do believe the price drops will be there and will be nice to see. For those who have prepared correctly, they will get rewarded. For those who have an affordable payment locked in, they will be happy with the payment but unhappy with the depreciated asset and depending on the amount of depreciation they may not be able to sell without a loss.[/quote]
I believe you will be proven correct. Question is, when?
The prices drops will probably not be enough to compensate for the rate hikes when you look strictly at monthly payments. I think if the hike is big enough, we will see again more of the hybrid ARMs (5-7+ yr fixed rate) so again that will not help prices drop.
While I agree with 20% downpayment percentage-wise, I still think that being six figure for downpayment is quite a big chunk of money for the first time buyers (or people who sold their previous house without any gain – and their number will keep increasing). Of course one can go only 10% down and pay the PMI…I say it’s too large (amount-wise) in the current economy to put in an asset that has proven, gasp!, that it can actually depreciate substantially in few years (instead of doubling every, what, ten years?).
You say investor return levels will signal the bottom for prices. What is the minimum rent multiplier that is currently used by the investors – in areas like RB, PQ, Scripps?
April 3, 2011 at 10:22 PM #683087Participant[quote=SD Realtor]More often then not the homebuyer measures affordability by monthly payment as opposed to home price, (…) I The speculation about price depreciation is quite valid BUT I do not believe they will correlate to the rate hikes. How proportional will they be? I could not guess but once you hit investor return levels you will see the bottoms set for pricing. Again, I do not know what this is as it varies with each area. Similarly those who do not have 6 figure nest eggs to drop into homes will simply not be able to buy. They will not be able to afford the homes even with large price drops. I do believe the price drops will be there and will be nice to see. For those who have prepared correctly, they will get rewarded. For those who have an affordable payment locked in, they will be happy with the payment but unhappy with the depreciated asset and depending on the amount of depreciation they may not be able to sell without a loss.[/quote]
I believe you will be proven correct. Question is, when?
The prices drops will probably not be enough to compensate for the rate hikes when you look strictly at monthly payments. I think if the hike is big enough, we will see again more of the hybrid ARMs (5-7+ yr fixed rate) so again that will not help prices drop.
While I agree with 20% downpayment percentage-wise, I still think that being six figure for downpayment is quite a big chunk of money for the first time buyers (or people who sold their previous house without any gain – and their number will keep increasing). Of course one can go only 10% down and pay the PMI…I say it’s too large (amount-wise) in the current economy to put in an asset that has proven, gasp!, that it can actually depreciate substantially in few years (instead of doubling every, what, ten years?).
You say investor return levels will signal the bottom for prices. What is the minimum rent multiplier that is currently used by the investors – in areas like RB, PQ, Scripps?
April 3, 2011 at 10:22 PM #683715Participant[quote=SD Realtor]More often then not the homebuyer measures affordability by monthly payment as opposed to home price, (…) I The speculation about price depreciation is quite valid BUT I do not believe they will correlate to the rate hikes. How proportional will they be? I could not guess but once you hit investor return levels you will see the bottoms set for pricing. Again, I do not know what this is as it varies with each area. Similarly those who do not have 6 figure nest eggs to drop into homes will simply not be able to buy. They will not be able to afford the homes even with large price drops. I do believe the price drops will be there and will be nice to see. For those who have prepared correctly, they will get rewarded. For those who have an affordable payment locked in, they will be happy with the payment but unhappy with the depreciated asset and depending on the amount of depreciation they may not be able to sell without a loss.[/quote]
I believe you will be proven correct. Question is, when?
The prices drops will probably not be enough to compensate for the rate hikes when you look strictly at monthly payments. I think if the hike is big enough, we will see again more of the hybrid ARMs (5-7+ yr fixed rate) so again that will not help prices drop.
While I agree with 20% downpayment percentage-wise, I still think that being six figure for downpayment is quite a big chunk of money for the first time buyers (or people who sold their previous house without any gain – and their number will keep increasing). Of course one can go only 10% down and pay the PMI…I say it’s too large (amount-wise) in the current economy to put in an asset that has proven, gasp!, that it can actually depreciate substantially in few years (instead of doubling every, what, ten years?).
You say investor return levels will signal the bottom for prices. What is the minimum rent multiplier that is currently used by the investors – in areas like RB, PQ, Scripps?
April 3, 2011 at 10:22 PM #683855Participant[quote=SD Realtor]More often then not the homebuyer measures affordability by monthly payment as opposed to home price, (…) I The speculation about price depreciation is quite valid BUT I do not believe they will correlate to the rate hikes. How proportional will they be? I could not guess but once you hit investor return levels you will see the bottoms set for pricing. Again, I do not know what this is as it varies with each area. Similarly those who do not have 6 figure nest eggs to drop into homes will simply not be able to buy. They will not be able to afford the homes even with large price drops. I do believe the price drops will be there and will be nice to see. For those who have prepared correctly, they will get rewarded. For those who have an affordable payment locked in, they will be happy with the payment but unhappy with the depreciated asset and depending on the amount of depreciation they may not be able to sell without a loss.[/quote]
I believe you will be proven correct. Question is, when?
The prices drops will probably not be enough to compensate for the rate hikes when you look strictly at monthly payments. I think if the hike is big enough, we will see again more of the hybrid ARMs (5-7+ yr fixed rate) so again that will not help prices drop.
While I agree with 20% downpayment percentage-wise, I still think that being six figure for downpayment is quite a big chunk of money for the first time buyers (or people who sold their previous house without any gain – and their number will keep increasing). Of course one can go only 10% down and pay the PMI…I say it’s too large (amount-wise) in the current economy to put in an asset that has proven, gasp!, that it can actually depreciate substantially in few years (instead of doubling every, what, ten years?).
You say investor return levels will signal the bottom for prices. What is the minimum rent multiplier that is currently used by the investors – in areas like RB, PQ, Scripps?
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