OT: Public pay & benefits

[GH]

Most jobs are VERY dangerous – Stress etc. The most dangerous jobs are fisherman, so these guys should be paid millions of dollars a year by the dangerous jobs deserve more logic, loggers, pilots, farmers and ranchers – pay the illegals hundreds of thousands before even thinking about firemen or police. roofers then iron and steel workers, refuse workers, material collectors, machinery installation workers, drivers and sales workers, truck drivers and construction workers. ALL of these jobs ARE more dangerous than police or firefighter jobs, yet I don’t see you promoting vast pay increases for them?

My understanding is that convenience store clerks have a higher mortality rate on the job than police or firemen.

Don’t believe me?

I would challenge ANY government moron to get a better paying job in the private sector, and don’t keep on with that “risking their lives” garbage, because they are not even in the top ten.

The majority of firefighters in the US are volunteer and do the job because they WANT to. It is time to get real about public salaries and pensions and bring them into line with the current economic reality. WE CANNOT AFFORD THEM! We need to get rid of the whole lot and replace them with a system we CAN afford.

[GH]

[quote=jpinpb] Their money is “invested” in their pension.[/quote]

Last time I checked they had invested their money collectively and poorly. Why should I be held accountable for their poor investment strategies. Attempts to keep a higher rate of return through risky investments are NOT my problem. Public workers whose retirements were poorly invested should seek damages from those responsible for managing their portfolio, not the general public who is facing unprecedented problems as it stands.

Current retirement budgets are predicated on an 8% annual return on investment. A return which is NOT feasible given current economic conditions. Give me ONE good reason these morons should not take their medicine like the rest of us had to, except they can simply beat the money out of us and use force if necessary to force us to pay?

[GH]

[quote=jpinpb] Their money is “invested” in their pension.[/quote]

Last time I checked they had invested their money collectively and poorly. Why should I be held accountable for their poor investment strategies. Attempts to keep a higher rate of return through risky investments are NOT my problem. Public workers whose retirements were poorly invested should seek damages from those responsible for managing their portfolio, not the general public who is facing unprecedented problems as it stands.

Current retirement budgets are predicated on an 8% annual return on investment. A return which is NOT feasible given current economic conditions. Give me ONE good reason these morons should not take their medicine like the rest of us had to, except they can simply beat the money out of us and use force if necessary to force us to pay?

[GH]

[quote=jpinpb] Their money is “invested” in their pension.[/quote]

Last time I checked they had invested their money collectively and poorly. Why should I be held accountable for their poor investment strategies. Attempts to keep a higher rate of return through risky investments are NOT my problem. Public workers whose retirements were poorly invested should seek damages from those responsible for managing their portfolio, not the general public who is facing unprecedented problems as it stands.

Current retirement budgets are predicated on an 8% annual return on investment. A return which is NOT feasible given current economic conditions. Give me ONE good reason these morons should not take their medicine like the rest of us had to, except they can simply beat the money out of us and use force if necessary to force us to pay?

[GH]

[quote=jpinpb] Their money is “invested” in their pension.[/quote]

Last time I checked they had invested their money collectively and poorly. Why should I be held accountable for their poor investment strategies. Attempts to keep a higher rate of return through risky investments are NOT my problem. Public workers whose retirements were poorly invested should seek damages from those responsible for managing their portfolio, not the general public who is facing unprecedented problems as it stands.

Current retirement budgets are predicated on an 8% annual return on investment. A return which is NOT feasible given current economic conditions. Give me ONE good reason these morons should not take their medicine like the rest of us had to, except they can simply beat the money out of us and use force if necessary to force us to pay?

[GH]

[quote=jpinpb] Their money is “invested” in their pension.[/quote]

Last time I checked they had invested their money collectively and poorly. Why should I be held accountable for their poor investment strategies. Attempts to keep a higher rate of return through risky investments are NOT my problem. Public workers whose retirements were poorly invested should seek damages from those responsible for managing their portfolio, not the general public who is facing unprecedented problems as it stands.

Current retirement budgets are predicated on an 8% annual return on investment. A return which is NOT feasible given current economic conditions. Give me ONE good reason these morons should not take their medicine like the rest of us had to, except they can simply beat the money out of us and use force if necessary to force us to pay?

[sdrealtor]

JP
The point is those are the terms we all work work under in the private sector. When times are good there is more money and when times arent belt tightening needs to follow. The private sector is much better at that than the public sector. We are not blaming the worker bees but feel they need to share in the pain like everyone else. Their powerful unions prevent a free market.

Also, I just cant resist the “vast amounts of money” statement. Having not worked in RE you have no idea how vast those amounts actually are. Even in the bubble era, a small percentage (well under 20%) of realtors generated 6 figures in net commissions. They also shouldered self employment taxes, paying for 100% of their own benefits and 100% of their business expenses.

I’m not complaining because i am doing this by choice because it allows me to live my life on my own terms. I’m not doing this because its great money, I’m doing it because it allows me to participate in everything my children do. Despite working 60 to 100 hour work weeks and producing at a level that puts me among the top 5% of agent s in SD County, I can safely say that my net compensation is well below that of the typical net earnings I see on the tax returns of fireman and cops. This isnt to say I should be paid more than them but rather you great overestimate the amount of money people make in this business.

[sdrealtor]

JP
The point is those are the terms we all work work under in the private sector. When times are good there is more money and when times arent belt tightening needs to follow. The private sector is much better at that than the public sector. We are not blaming the worker bees but feel they need to share in the pain like everyone else. Their powerful unions prevent a free market.

Also, I just cant resist the “vast amounts of money” statement. Having not worked in RE you have no idea how vast those amounts actually are. Even in the bubble era, a small percentage (well under 20%) of realtors generated 6 figures in net commissions. They also shouldered self employment taxes, paying for 100% of their own benefits and 100% of their business expenses.

I’m not complaining because i am doing this by choice because it allows me to live my life on my own terms. I’m not doing this because its great money, I’m doing it because it allows me to participate in everything my children do. Despite working 60 to 100 hour work weeks and producing at a level that puts me among the top 5% of agent s in SD County, I can safely say that my net compensation is well below that of the typical net earnings I see on the tax returns of fireman and cops. This isnt to say I should be paid more than them but rather you great overestimate the amount of money people make in this business.

[sdrealtor]

JP
The point is those are the terms we all work work under in the private sector. When times are good there is more money and when times arent belt tightening needs to follow. The private sector is much better at that than the public sector. We are not blaming the worker bees but feel they need to share in the pain like everyone else. Their powerful unions prevent a free market.

Also, I just cant resist the “vast amounts of money” statement. Having not worked in RE you have no idea how vast those amounts actually are. Even in the bubble era, a small percentage (well under 20%) of realtors generated 6 figures in net commissions. They also shouldered self employment taxes, paying for 100% of their own benefits and 100% of their business expenses.

I’m not complaining because i am doing this by choice because it allows me to live my life on my own terms. I’m not doing this because its great money, I’m doing it because it allows me to participate in everything my children do. Despite working 60 to 100 hour work weeks and producing at a level that puts me among the top 5% of agent s in SD County, I can safely say that my net compensation is well below that of the typical net earnings I see on the tax returns of fireman and cops. This isnt to say I should be paid more than them but rather you great overestimate the amount of money people make in this business.

[sdrealtor]

JP
The point is those are the terms we all work work under in the private sector. When times are good there is more money and when times arent belt tightening needs to follow. The private sector is much better at that than the public sector. We are not blaming the worker bees but feel they need to share in the pain like everyone else. Their powerful unions prevent a free market.

Also, I just cant resist the “vast amounts of money” statement. Having not worked in RE you have no idea how vast those amounts actually are. Even in the bubble era, a small percentage (well under 20%) of realtors generated 6 figures in net commissions. They also shouldered self employment taxes, paying for 100% of their own benefits and 100% of their business expenses.

I’m not complaining because i am doing this by choice because it allows me to live my life on my own terms. I’m not doing this because its great money, I’m doing it because it allows me to participate in everything my children do. Despite working 60 to 100 hour work weeks and producing at a level that puts me among the top 5% of agent s in SD County, I can safely say that my net compensation is well below that of the typical net earnings I see on the tax returns of fireman and cops. This isnt to say I should be paid more than them but rather you great overestimate the amount of money people make in this business.

[sdrealtor]

JP
The point is those are the terms we all work work under in the private sector. When times are good there is more money and when times arent belt tightening needs to follow. The private sector is much better at that than the public sector. We are not blaming the worker bees but feel they need to share in the pain like everyone else. Their powerful unions prevent a free market.

Also, I just cant resist the “vast amounts of money” statement. Having not worked in RE you have no idea how vast those amounts actually are. Even in the bubble era, a small percentage (well under 20%) of realtors generated 6 figures in net commissions. They also shouldered self employment taxes, paying for 100% of their own benefits and 100% of their business expenses.

I’m not complaining because i am doing this by choice because it allows me to live my life on my own terms. I’m not doing this because its great money, I’m doing it because it allows me to participate in everything my children do. Despite working 60 to 100 hour work weeks and producing at a level that puts me among the top 5% of agent s in SD County, I can safely say that my net compensation is well below that of the typical net earnings I see on the tax returns of fireman and cops. This isnt to say I should be paid more than them but rather you great overestimate the amount of money people make in this business.

[CA renter]

[quote=sdrealtor][quote=CA renter][quote=Ricechex][quote=faterikcartman]And just another word to the wise: every time your presented with a question to vote for a tax increase to pay for so-called essential services like police and fire you’re being hoodwinked. They couch the question like that so they don’t have to cut spending for other things which you wouldn’t vote for if you were presented the choice.

/quote]

Now, this is quite true. Take a look at Prop J. There is some propaganda. Extra taxes to “retain” math and science teachers. Did you know the entire district bought EVERY 3rd, 6th, and 9th grader a netbook? This from a district that is so short of funds? I would much rather RETAIN the teachers/smaller classroom size, than spend oodles of money on netbooks. The students can bring home the netbooks with them too. I wonder who the district contracted with for that one? Which private company made LOTS of money on those netbooks? I don’t remember voting on that one do you?

No need to blame the teachers either, they had nothing to do with it. When we blame the public servants, (firefighters, police, teachers, etc) it is essentially blaming the grunts that actually DO the job. It is the corruption at the top that is really the problem.[/quote]

Fantastic, and very accurate post![/quote]

I dont see anyone blaming the grunts aorund here, we are blaming the system. Frankly it doesnt matter where the problem lies, what is important is that its a problem.

FWIW, there is only one or two nitwits posting about the “cops and donuts” or “sitting in the firehouse” nonsense. Most of us dont beleive that so lets keep on point here. We arent blaming the public servants and we think they do a good job. We just think they are overcompensated.

As for the transparancy issue, from your earlier post can I infer that you are all for making all compensation to public servants publically available also. Would you agree with that?[/quote]

Um, yeah…it already is.

[CA renter]

[quote=sdrealtor][quote=CA renter][quote=Ricechex][quote=faterikcartman]And just another word to the wise: every time your presented with a question to vote for a tax increase to pay for so-called essential services like police and fire you’re being hoodwinked. They couch the question like that so they don’t have to cut spending for other things which you wouldn’t vote for if you were presented the choice.

/quote]

Now, this is quite true. Take a look at Prop J. There is some propaganda. Extra taxes to “retain” math and science teachers. Did you know the entire district bought EVERY 3rd, 6th, and 9th grader a netbook? This from a district that is so short of funds? I would much rather RETAIN the teachers/smaller classroom size, than spend oodles of money on netbooks. The students can bring home the netbooks with them too. I wonder who the district contracted with for that one? Which private company made LOTS of money on those netbooks? I don’t remember voting on that one do you?

No need to blame the teachers either, they had nothing to do with it. When we blame the public servants, (firefighters, police, teachers, etc) it is essentially blaming the grunts that actually DO the job. It is the corruption at the top that is really the problem.[/quote]

Fantastic, and very accurate post![/quote]

I dont see anyone blaming the grunts aorund here, we are blaming the system. Frankly it doesnt matter where the problem lies, what is important is that its a problem.

FWIW, there is only one or two nitwits posting about the “cops and donuts” or “sitting in the firehouse” nonsense. Most of us dont beleive that so lets keep on point here. We arent blaming the public servants and we think they do a good job. We just think they are overcompensated.

As for the transparancy issue, from your earlier post can I infer that you are all for making all compensation to public servants publically available also. Would you agree with that?[/quote]

Um, yeah…it already is.

[CA renter]

[quote=sdrealtor][quote=CA renter][quote=Ricechex][quote=faterikcartman]And just another word to the wise: every time your presented with a question to vote for a tax increase to pay for so-called essential services like police and fire you’re being hoodwinked. They couch the question like that so they don’t have to cut spending for other things which you wouldn’t vote for if you were presented the choice.

/quote]

Now, this is quite true. Take a look at Prop J. There is some propaganda. Extra taxes to “retain” math and science teachers. Did you know the entire district bought EVERY 3rd, 6th, and 9th grader a netbook? This from a district that is so short of funds? I would much rather RETAIN the teachers/smaller classroom size, than spend oodles of money on netbooks. The students can bring home the netbooks with them too. I wonder who the district contracted with for that one? Which private company made LOTS of money on those netbooks? I don’t remember voting on that one do you?

No need to blame the teachers either, they had nothing to do with it. When we blame the public servants, (firefighters, police, teachers, etc) it is essentially blaming the grunts that actually DO the job. It is the corruption at the top that is really the problem.[/quote]

Fantastic, and very accurate post![/quote]

I dont see anyone blaming the grunts aorund here, we are blaming the system. Frankly it doesnt matter where the problem lies, what is important is that its a problem.

FWIW, there is only one or two nitwits posting about the “cops and donuts” or “sitting in the firehouse” nonsense. Most of us dont beleive that so lets keep on point here. We arent blaming the public servants and we think they do a good job. We just think they are overcompensated.

As for the transparancy issue, from your earlier post can I infer that you are all for making all compensation to public servants publically available also. Would you agree with that?[/quote]

Um, yeah…it already is.

[CA renter]

[quote=sdrealtor][quote=CA renter][quote=Ricechex][quote=faterikcartman]And just another word to the wise: every time your presented with a question to vote for a tax increase to pay for so-called essential services like police and fire you’re being hoodwinked. They couch the question like that so they don’t have to cut spending for other things which you wouldn’t vote for if you were presented the choice.

/quote]

Now, this is quite true. Take a look at Prop J. There is some propaganda. Extra taxes to “retain” math and science teachers. Did you know the entire district bought EVERY 3rd, 6th, and 9th grader a netbook? This from a district that is so short of funds? I would much rather RETAIN the teachers/smaller classroom size, than spend oodles of money on netbooks. The students can bring home the netbooks with them too. I wonder who the district contracted with for that one? Which private company made LOTS of money on those netbooks? I don’t remember voting on that one do you?

No need to blame the teachers either, they had nothing to do with it. When we blame the public servants, (firefighters, police, teachers, etc) it is essentially blaming the grunts that actually DO the job. It is the corruption at the top that is really the problem.[/quote]

Fantastic, and very accurate post![/quote]

I dont see anyone blaming the grunts aorund here, we are blaming the system. Frankly it doesnt matter where the problem lies, what is important is that its a problem.

FWIW, there is only one or two nitwits posting about the “cops and donuts” or “sitting in the firehouse” nonsense. Most of us dont beleive that so lets keep on point here. We arent blaming the public servants and we think they do a good job. We just think they are overcompensated.

As for the transparancy issue, from your earlier post can I infer that you are all for making all compensation to public servants publically available also. Would you agree with that?[/quote]

Um, yeah…it already is.

[Author]

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