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scaredyclassic.
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March 13, 2016 at 6:50 PM #795647March 13, 2016 at 8:30 PM #795653
FlyerInHi
GuestUN Secretaries General do not come from any country that has a permanent seat on the security council.
Right wing conspiracy theories. They think the UN will send in black helicopters to take away out guns.
immigration creates growth and opportunities. There are winners and losers but, overall, the economy grows faster and more prosperous. There is consensus among economists on that, even more so on the Republican side. It’s the republican base that doesn’t like immigration.
If you’re smart, adaptable and hardworking, then you should support immigration. If you want to coast, then maybe you don’t like it. Unauthorized immigrants are like refugees. If we welcome them with periodic amnesty, on humanitarian grounds, then they become part of us and help grow our economy.
March 13, 2016 at 8:38 PM #795654
svelteParticipant[quote=joec]
What I don’t get is why LEGAL immigrants want to support ILLEGAL immigrants who are probably affecting their financial and job prospects far more. Having more workers compete with you if you are legal doesn’t help you and I’d assume legal immigrants (Mexican, Asian, whoever) should be against all the freebees you see bantered about. Maybe it’s your family, but legal immigrants can bring them in legally as well…I don’t get this point.
[/quote]
Well if you’re talking about immediate family, maybe.But extended family and friends, no legal immigrants can’t.
And this is why legal immigrants support illegal immigrants, from my observations. They are just like everyone else – they prefer to be surrounded by their family and friends.
March 13, 2016 at 9:04 PM #795655
CoronitaParticipantI’m not a big fan of Rubio also, but something he said hit spot on..
[quote]
Rubio said: “I’m very concerned about that. We don’t know what’s going to happen next here. I know that we’ve reached the point where people in American politics have decided that if they don’t agree with you, they can get angry at you, that you’re a bad and evil person, that they can say anything they want about you.”“I think that all the gates of civility have been blown apart. We’ve now reached a point where everyone on both sides everyone is just saying or doing whatever they want, and you know, you can’t just say or do whatever you want,” he said. “This is not about political correctness. This is about rules of civility and the way a society talks to each other.”
[/quote]
http://www.cnn.com/2016/03/13/politics/marco-rubio-donald-trump-support/index.html
March 13, 2016 at 9:52 PM #795656CoronitaParticipant[quote=joec]Trump’s a bully and mostly (like nearly ALL the candidates) looking out for himself, but calling him insane is a bit off I feel.
[/quote]He wasn’t insane until he started to campaign as such. For the most part, he appeared sane before his bid for the white house
[/quote]
[quote]
If he was truly insane, he would have squandered all his born wealth and would be a total failure with no marriages and living in a ditch or dead.
[/quote]Wrong. You equate financial success to sane people, and equate financial ruin to insane people. That can’t be further from the truth. There are plenty of evil people who are incredibly wealthy. Just look up David Duke. He’s richer than you are.
[quote]
From all data, I think it’s fair to say he was born a millionaire and made himself into a billionaire (how much, still over $1 bil)…more than what most people would amount to.
He also raised 3 kids which nearly all the press and people who know them state are decent and upstanding kids…especially Ivanka.
[/quote]Insane people are nice to their families and people who worship him. Name one nice thing that Trump said about anyone who isn’t white. You’re asian, I’m so surprised this doesn’t concern you. It might not be your fight for now, it will be.
[quote]
I think in the end, Trump is extremely calculating and has a good sense of what the mood/feel/whatever you want to call it is for people and uses it to make sure he’s getting his share/cut…and uses it to succeed.
[/quote]Yes calculated evil, and knowing exactly which buttons to push to get people so push forward his agenda. If I was religious, I would say he’s close enough to the anti-christ.
[quote]
It’s true he’s no conservative, but maybe that’s a good thing since there’s been ads against him for coming out and supporting universal health care
(my main concern in general) and other things “conservative” far right republicans would never support.
[/quote]People are mixing character with political viewpoint. Example: I might not like Obama. I might not even like Bernie for being a leftist socialist. However, Bernie doesn’t strike me as someone evil, not in what he says, not in what he does. Perhaps very misguided and what he would do would piss me off from a policy standpoint.
Trump lacks character. He takes paints himself a moderate for exactly the reasons that you just exhibit. To win you over on his political viewpoint, so he can get away with his agenda of his racist/devisive agenda, and with enough “moderate” people saying “well, he’s a moderate, and I agree with enough of his moderate viewpoints, hence he must be ok”.
[quote]
What I don’t get is why LEGAL immigrants want to support ILLEGAL immigrants who are probably affecting their financial and job prospects far more. Having more workers compete with you if you are legal doesn’t help you and I’d assume legal immigrants (Mexican, Asian, whoever) should be against all the freebees you see bantered about. Maybe it’s your family, but legal immigrants can bring them in legally as well…I don’t get this point.
[/quote]A lot of people keep saying illegals are hindering them financially. Let me ask exactly what did illegals do to hurt you personally financially? Welfare? What about the majority of welfare recipients being from southern states which are U.S. citizens? If we really want to talk about freebies, why not point the finger there. The percentage of welfare leeches from southern states is much larger than the freebies that illegals get. (I can’t believe as a republican, I just said that. But it’s true)
And let’s be frank, the reason why illegal alien exist is because of our government/social policies, not because of the illegal people themselves. If a politician really wants to solve the illegal alien problem, the solution is simple…stop giving financial incentives to people who come here who aren’t here legally. Get rid of welfare, healthcare, and entitlement benefits completely. Don’t blame the latinos, or asians, or what have you. Blame the policy and change the policy. In as much as why are people blaming H1-B people, when the blame should be directed at the few CEOs and companies that exploit the H1-B system?
I don’t know. If you aren’t white, be very very afraid right now. It might start with just illegal latinos, or muslims. But who’s to draw the line. There are already plenty of people pissed off at the H1-B blaming indians. There are plenty of people shut out of the housing market that are blaming the asians. If you enable Trump’s game, why do you think this sort of blaming is going to stop short of you, unless they don’t view you as a threat financially or socially. You aren’t white afterall. This is the entire problem I have with Trump’s supporters. Mix a bunch of mad people who are frustrated with being left behind, add a dash of racism to the mix, and you get a very scary bunch of people that want view you who isn’t white as a threat to their future who will do anything and back anything to “take you down”, even if it means to bully you over. And as an asian, you’ll get kicked around again.. Because once again, you wanted to play it safe, and didn’t think anything would happen to you. Asians get kicked around a lot, because a lot of asians let it happen.
You’ll always be a second class citizen no matter how successful you are, or how much money you have…no matter how much money you have, you won’t mind getting kicked around, and people will think you won’t mind getting kicked around.March 13, 2016 at 10:25 PM #795659scaredyclassic
Participant[quote=flu][quote=joec]Trump’s a bully and mostly (like nearly ALL the candidates) looking out for himself, but calling him insane is a bit off I feel.
[/quote]He wasn’t insane until he started to campaign as such. For the most part, he appeared sane before his bid for the white house
[/quote]
[quote]
If he was truly insane, he would have squandered all his born wealth and would be a total failure with no marriages and living in a ditch or dead.
[/quote]Wrong. You equate financial success to sane people, and equate financial ruin to insane people. That can’t be further from the truth. There are plenty of evil people who are incredibly wealthy. Just look up David Duke. He’s richer than you are.
[quote]
From all data, I think it’s fair to say he was born a millionaire and made himself into a billionaire (how much, still over $1 bil)…more than what most people would amount to.
He also raised 3 kids which nearly all the press and people who know them state are decent and upstanding kids…especially Ivanka.
[/quote]Insane people are nice to their families and people who worship him. Name one nice thing that Trump said about anyone who isn’t white. You’re asian, I’m so surprised this doesn’t concern you. It might not be your fight for now, it will be.
[quote]
I think in the end, Trump is extremely calculating and has a good sense of what the mood/feel/whatever you want to call it is for people and uses it to make sure he’s getting his share/cut…and uses it to succeed.
[/quote]Yes calculated evil, and knowing exactly which buttons to push to get people so push forward his agenda. If I was religious, I would say he’s close enough to the anti-christ.
[quote]
It’s true he’s no conservative, but maybe that’s a good thing since there’s been ads against him for coming out and supporting universal health care
(my main concern in general) and other things “conservative” far right republicans would never support.
[/quote]People are mixing character with political viewpoint. Example: I might not like Obama. I might not even like Bernie for being a leftist socialist. However, Bernie doesn’t strike me as someone evil, not in what he says, not in what he does. Perhaps very misguided and what he would do would piss me off from a policy standpoint.
Trump lacks character. He takes paints himself a moderate for exactly the reasons that you just exhibit. To win you over on his political viewpoint, so he can get away with his agenda of his racist/devisive agenda, and with enough “moderate” people saying “well, he’s a moderate, and I agree with enough of his moderate viewpoints, hence he must be ok”.
[quote]
What I don’t get is why LEGAL immigrants want to support ILLEGAL immigrants who are probably affecting their financial and job prospects far more. Having more workers compete with you if you are legal doesn’t help you and I’d assume legal immigrants (Mexican, Asian, whoever) should be against all the freebees you see bantered about. Maybe it’s your family, but legal immigrants can bring them in legally as well…I don’t get this point.
[/quote]A lot of people keep saying illegals are hindering them financially. Let me ask exactly what did illegals do to hurt you personally financially? Welfare? What about the majority of welfare recipients being from southern states which are U.S. citizens? If we really want to talk about freebies, why not point the finger there. The percentage of welfare leeches from southern states is much larger than the freebies that illegals get. (I can’t believe as a republican, I just said that. But it’s true)
And let’s be frank, the reason why illegal alien exist is because of our government/social policies, not because of the illegal people themselves. If a politician really wants to solve the illegal alien problem, the solution is simple…stop giving financial incentives to people who come here who aren’t here legally. Get rid of welfare, healthcare, and entitlement benefits completely. Don’t blame the latinos, or asians, or what have you. Blame the policy and change the policy. In as much as why are people blaming H1-B people, when the blame should be directed at the few CEOs and companies that exploit the H1-B system?
I don’t know. If you aren’t white, be very very afraid right now. It might start with just illegal latinos, or muslims. But who’s to draw the line. There are already plenty of people pissed off at the H1-B blaming indians. There are plenty of people shut out of the housing market that are blaming the asians. If you enable Trump’s game, why do you think this sort of blaming is going to stop short of you, unless they don’t view you as a threat financially or socially. You aren’t white afterall. This is the entire problem I have with Trump’s supporters. Mix a bunch of mad people who are frustrated with being left behind, add a dash of racism to the mix, and you get a very scary bunch of people that want view you who isn’t white as a threat to their future who will do anything and back anything to “take you down”, even if it means to bully you over. And as an asian, you’ll get kicked around again.. Because once again, you wanted to play it safe, and didn’t think anything would happen to you. Asians get kicked around a lot, because a lot of asians let it happen.
You’ll always be a second class citizen no matter how successful you are, or how much money you have…no matter how much money you have, you won’t mind getting kicked around, and people will think you won’t mind getting kicked around.[/quote]Agree.
I was wrong for thinking trump was entertaining.
It is not funny anymore.
The republicans need to shut him down. Just change the rules and put someone not insane and preferably not Cruz on the ticket. Screw trump.
March 13, 2016 at 10:38 PM #795661utcsox
Participant[quote=flu]I’m not a big fan of Rubio also, but something he said hit spot on..
[quote]
Rubio said: “I’m very concerned about that. We don’t know what’s going to happen next here. I know that we’ve reached the point where people in American politics have decided that if they don’t agree with you, they can get angry at you, that you’re a bad and evil person, that they can say anything they want about you.”“I think that all the gates of civility have been blown apart. We’ve now reached a point where everyone on both sides everyone is just saying or doing whatever they want, and you know, you can’t just say or do whatever you want,” he said. “This is not about political correctness. This is about rules of civility and the way a society talks to each other.”
[/quote]http://www.cnn.com/2016/03/13/politics/marco-rubio-donald-trump-support/index.html%5B/quote%5D
Let’s dispel once and for all with this fiction that Little Marco doesn’t know what he’s talking about; he knows EXACTLY what he is talking about. See the paragraph below yourself. Remember, Little Marco is supposed to be a moderate RINO.
“Remember, Rubio is the candidate who says President Barack Obama is “undermining this country” as “part of a plan to weaken America on the global stage.” Rubio says of Obama that “all this damage that he’s done to America is deliberate.” He attacked the president’s choice to speak at a mosque as an example of his “constant pitting people against each other,” which is “hurting our country badly.”
Last month, when CNN asked Rubio’s spokesman Alex Conant whether the senator believes Obama is “intentionally trying to destroy the country,” Conant said “absolutely.”
http://www.businessinsider.com/marco-rubio-donald-trump-obama-2016-3
March 13, 2016 at 10:45 PM #795662CoronitaParticipant[quote=scaredyclassic][
Agree.
I was wrong for thinking trump was entertaining.
It is not funny anymore.
The republicans need to shut him down. Just change the rules and put someone not insane and preferably not Cruz on the ticket. Screw trump.[/quote]
This was never funny to begin with. I don’t care what side the politician is on. You can’t come out a say XYZ race/ethnicity isn’t bring their best or blame and entire faction. I don’t care if it’s white, black, latino, asian, blue, etc. The day he came out with the mexico isn’t sending their best, was the day I said he had to go. Even for a republican.
I’d like to see as a country, we’re better then this. Even from the GOP.
March 13, 2016 at 10:54 PM #795664CoronitaParticipant[quote=utcsox][quote=flu]I’m not a big fan of Rubio also, but something he said hit spot on..
[quote]
Rubio said: “I’m very concerned about that. We don’t know what’s going to happen next here. I know that we’ve reached the point where people in American politics have decided that if they don’t agree with you, they can get angry at you, that you’re a bad and evil person, that they can say anything they want about you.”“I think that all the gates of civility have been blown apart. We’ve now reached a point where everyone on both sides everyone is just saying or doing whatever they want, and you know, you can’t just say or do whatever you want,” he said. “This is not about political correctness. This is about rules of civility and the way a society talks to each other.”
[/quote]http://www.cnn.com/2016/03/13/politics/marco-rubio-donald-trump-support/index.html%5B/quote%5D
Let’s dispel once and for all with this fiction that Little Marco doesn’t know what he’s talking about; he knows EXACTLY what he is talking about. See the paragraph below yourself. Remember, Little Marco is supposed to be a moderate RINO.
“Remember, Rubio is the candidate who says President Barack Obama is “undermining this country” as “part of a plan to weaken America on the global stage.” Rubio says of Obama that “all this damage that he’s done to America is deliberate.” He attacked the president’s choice to speak at a mosque as an example of his “constant pitting people against each other,” which is “hurting our country badly.”
Last month, when CNN asked Rubio’s spokesman Alex Conant whether the senator believes Obama is “intentionally trying to destroy the country,” Conant said “absolutely.”
http://www.businessinsider.com/marco-rubio-donald-trump-obama-2016-3%5B/quote%5D
Yes, I’m aware of this Marco flip flop, just like every other flip flop. Again, I’m not saying he’s a great guy. None of them are. But let’s face it, the only candidate from both party that is systematically demonstrating being a racist and inciting racism is Trump and only Trump.
I don’t have a problem any politician stating how horrible a job Obama did or how Hillary might be. That’s part of this political game. But people keep equating Trump “being an outsider” or being a “moderate” to excuse his alarming behavior. I don’t expect people who aren’t colored to understand, but this shit terrifies the fvck out of me.
I’m not latino, I’m not muslim, and I’m not indian, which apparently seems to be the order of Trump’s attacks. But enabling Trump, is like me wondering when is it my turn.
My votes, are in this particular order
1. Anyone but Trump
2. Anyone but Hillary
3. Anyone but CruzI haven’t decided between 2 and 3 yet. That might change. But 1 is definitely non negotiable.
March 13, 2016 at 11:59 PM #795665an
Participant#neverTrump. I can deal/settle w/ Hillary and Cruz, but definitely #neverTrump.
March 14, 2016 at 8:00 AM #795671zk
Participant[quote=utcsox]
Last month, when CNN asked Rubio’s spokesman Alex Conant whether the senator believes Obama is “intentionally trying to destroy the country,” Conant said “absolutely.”[/quote]
I had a friend who listened to fox news and read the blaze and pretty much had been thoroughly manipulated by the right-wing noise machine. He mentioned that he thought Obama was deliberately hurting the country. It’s a common theme in the right-wing echo chamber. They really do believe it. I asked my friend what he thought Obama’s motivation to hurt the country was. That extremely simple and obvious question stumped him. He hadn’t thought about it (surprise!).
I have yet to hear what right wingers think Obama’s motivation for destroying the country would be. Even when I google it, I get a bunch of right-wing noise machine websites saying “here’s proof Obama is purposely destroying America,” but I get nothing on “why.”
The proof that he’s destroying America is all nonsense, of course, but I can see how somebody not very skeptical would fall for it. What I don’t understand is how they can get all those people to fall for the idea of him doing it on purpose without even providing at least some semi-plausible reason why Obama would want to do that. You apparently don’t have to answer such obvious questions if you’re really good at emotional manipulation.
If anybody reading this thinks Obama is deliberately destroying our country, I’d really be interested to hear what you think his motivation for that would be. I’m hoping to hear something reasonable, because I hate to think that such a large a segment of our population is so unquestioning that they could be so easily made to believe something so far-fetched, and with no explanation of why, even.
March 14, 2016 at 9:52 AM #795673GuestZk, the reason Obama is deliberately hurting the country is because he’s Muslim and hates America.
The right wing has 2 narratives. 1) Obama is an incompetent idiot. 2) Obama knows exactly what he’s doing.
However, if he’s incompetent, he cannot know exactly.
March 14, 2016 at 10:39 AM #795676Guest[quote=zk]
I had a friend who listened to fox news and read the blaze and pretty much had been thoroughly manipulated by the right-wing noise machine. He mentioned that he thought Obama was deliberately hurting the country. It’s a common theme in the right-wing echo chamber. They really do believe it. I asked my friend what he thought Obama’s motivation to hurt the country was. That extremely simple and obvious question stumped him. He hadn’t thought about it (surprise!).
[/quote]I don’t know if you feel the same zk, but I’m losing patience with my right wing friends.
They tend to have a Trump like attitude about things. They use lots of sarcasm and “duh, you’re so stupid” type arguments. So, we’re supposed to be the nice intellectual, ivory tower elitists who take it quietly and politely. But when you dish out the same rhetoric, they get all in a tizzy.
ZK, do you feel that you give more in your friendship with that person? Is it an assymetric friendship where you have to be more patient and forgiving?
March 14, 2016 at 11:13 AM #795678no_such_reality
Participant[quote=scaredyclassic]
Agree.
I was wrong for thinking trump was entertaining.
It is not funny anymore.
The republicans need to shut him down. Just change the rules and put someone not insane and preferably not Cruz on the ticket. Screw trump.[/quote]
No. America desperately needs Trump. The disenfranchisement, the resentment, has metastasized into full blown cancer and the people haven’t realized it.
Pushing it under at this point will make it worse going forward.
What America needs, is for Trump to be the nominee and for decent Americans to give him the pummeling he deserves and not just pummel, but give the embarrassing exposure that he needs.
Suppressing it will not make this cancer go away, it will make it stronger the next time it rises, which will be rapid. Literally, next election cycle.
No, the American people really need to see Trump and what he’s doing for what it is and to that they’re getting hijacked by the cancer and need to eradicate it.
Perhaps we’ll get lucky and one party will collapse and we’ll end up with a fight in one majority party between extremists and moderates.
Unfortunately, Hillary makes this less likely, IMHO as she represents the status quo that is leaving 90% of our country behind.
March 14, 2016 at 11:38 AM #795679Participant[quote=FlyerInHi]Zk, the reason Obama is deliberately hurting the country is because he’s Muslim and hates America.
The right wing has 2 narratives. 1) Obama is an incompetent idiot. 2) Obama knows exactly what he’s doing.
However, if he’s incompetent, he cannot know exactly.[/quote]
Thanks, Brian, but I want to hear from somebody who believes it. And “Obama hates America” isn’t enough, I want to know what they think is the reason he hates America.
“Because he’s a muslim” doesn’t really fly, either. Most muslims don’t hate America. I’d say only a very small percentage of them do. And I want to ask a believer (among many other questions) questions about their belief that he’s a muslim.
paramount? Anyone?
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