OT: NYT article on, among other things, the limits of our ability to acknowledge what we don’t know

[eavesdropper]

[quote=Allan from Fallbrook][quote=jpinpb]LOL. A truce. Except it was clear to me it wasn’t meant as political at all. e-dropper has been trying very hard to direct the posts to the topic at hand, even in explaining the use of SP.

I really hope it doesn’t come to not even the mere use of a politician’s name as an example. Should we not mention Clinton’s name as a soccer fan? I think as long as we don’t argue about parties and attacks, we are okay. This was a cerebral topic, IMO and not political.

(Pleeeassse do not deviate from the topic and discuss Clinton, least I suffer e-dropper’s fate – no cover ups or anything – nor wanting to discuss soccer here)[/quote]

Jp: Well stated, and you’re right. Had Eaves used Mother Teresa, or Michael Jackson, or even Adolf Hitler as her example, it would have been a complete non-issue. I think certain posters on this board are now overly sensitive and the mere whiff of potential politics sets them off.

I thought Eaves went out of her way to explain herself, but it fell on completely deaf ears. Well, when you try to use logic, reason and a rationale argument and that fails…[/quote]

jp, jim, alan, and brian, thanks for your input, and your support. I had, indeed, planned that as my last post attempting to explain my actions. I spent too much time on that effort, and now am really crunching the books so as to not flunk my finals.

However, it’s good to see so many of the great minds of Piggs checking in on this thread. Jim, I am honored to have fallen on my sword if that’s what it took to get y’all in on what I consider a great topic. I have continued to follow the series of articles, and it’s is truly compelling. Kudos to davelj for bringing to our attention.

Installment 2 is especially enlightening on the topic of anosognosia, providing much info on Dr. Babinski, the neurologist who introduced the topic in the literature a hundred years ago (also the guy who’s responsible for your physician scraping the bottom of your feet with the sharp end of the reflex hammer during your physical). Anosognosia can be very confusing, but the info in article #2 is illuminating.

[Arraya]

A prime example right here…

http://www.zerohedge.com/article/fed-has-lost-it-publishes-essay-bashing-bloggers-tells-general-public-broadly-ignore-those-w#comments

The Fed Has Lost It; Publishes Essay Bashing Bloggers, Tells General Public To Broadly Ignore Those Without An Econ PhD

[Arraya]

A prime example right here…

http://www.zerohedge.com/article/fed-has-lost-it-publishes-essay-bashing-bloggers-tells-general-public-broadly-ignore-those-w#comments

The Fed Has Lost It; Publishes Essay Bashing Bloggers, Tells General Public To Broadly Ignore Those Without An Econ PhD

[Arraya]

A prime example right here…

http://www.zerohedge.com/article/fed-has-lost-it-publishes-essay-bashing-bloggers-tells-general-public-broadly-ignore-those-w#comments

The Fed Has Lost It; Publishes Essay Bashing Bloggers, Tells General Public To Broadly Ignore Those Without An Econ PhD

[Arraya]

A prime example right here…

http://www.zerohedge.com/article/fed-has-lost-it-publishes-essay-bashing-bloggers-tells-general-public-broadly-ignore-those-w#comments

The Fed Has Lost It; Publishes Essay Bashing Bloggers, Tells General Public To Broadly Ignore Those Without An Econ PhD

[Arraya]

A prime example right here…

http://www.zerohedge.com/article/fed-has-lost-it-publishes-essay-bashing-bloggers-tells-general-public-broadly-ignore-those-w#comments

The Fed Has Lost It; Publishes Essay Bashing Bloggers, Tells General Public To Broadly Ignore Those Without An Econ PhD

[eavesdropper]

[quote=walterwhite]i think we are encouraged to suffer from this. i read an article in a recent trade journal about “confidence” in my line of work. a successful person said when she was young, she was asked by senior partner if she knew how to do a particular task ona tight timeline. she said ‘sure!” she gave this as an example of the correct way to be at work to move ahead. i understand a can-do attitude, and “fake it till you make it”, the problem is, dude, you may be the guy who leaks a billion barrels int he gulf or whatever. on the other hand, president is so complex a task no one is really competent, i suppose.[/quote]

Scaredy, I think the practice you cite is endemic in the workplace, especially today plenty of evidence in documentaries like “Smartest Guys In The Room” or some of the recent Frontline docs on the financial meltdown.

But anosognosia is different. These people honestly have absolutely no clue that they’re not dealing with a full deck, so to speak. Socially, they are competent, and function in a completely normal way. They escape notice from almost everyone because there’s not the duplication of skills in the workplace that there used to be. I think, in many situations, jobs have become so specialized that their co-workers (and, in some cases, their supervisors) may have no clue as to what their job really entails. If they are really confident in their abilities, it becomes even difficult to determine that they are incompetent.

Here’s part of Dr. Babinski’s description: “One such patient . . . hit by left hemiplegia has largely maintained her intellectual and affective faculties, for many months. She remembered past events well, was willing to talk, expressed herself correctly, her ideas were sensible; she was interested in persons known to her and asked about new people . . . No hallucinations, delirium, confusional state, confabulation. What did contrast with the apparent preservation of intelligence of this patient was that she seemed to ignore the existence of a nearly complete hemiplegia, which she had been afraid of for many years. Never did she complain about it; never did she even allude to it. If she was asked to move her right arm, she immediately executed the command. If she was asked to move the left one, she stayed still, silent, and behaved as if the question had been put to somebody else.”

Fascinating.

[eavesdropper]

[quote=walterwhite]i think we are encouraged to suffer from this. i read an article in a recent trade journal about “confidence” in my line of work. a successful person said when she was young, she was asked by senior partner if she knew how to do a particular task ona tight timeline. she said ‘sure!” she gave this as an example of the correct way to be at work to move ahead. i understand a can-do attitude, and “fake it till you make it”, the problem is, dude, you may be the guy who leaks a billion barrels int he gulf or whatever. on the other hand, president is so complex a task no one is really competent, i suppose.[/quote]

Scaredy, I think the practice you cite is endemic in the workplace, especially today plenty of evidence in documentaries like “Smartest Guys In The Room” or some of the recent Frontline docs on the financial meltdown.

But anosognosia is different. These people honestly have absolutely no clue that they’re not dealing with a full deck, so to speak. Socially, they are competent, and function in a completely normal way. They escape notice from almost everyone because there’s not the duplication of skills in the workplace that there used to be. I think, in many situations, jobs have become so specialized that their co-workers (and, in some cases, their supervisors) may have no clue as to what their job really entails. If they are really confident in their abilities, it becomes even difficult to determine that they are incompetent.

Here’s part of Dr. Babinski’s description: “One such patient . . . hit by left hemiplegia has largely maintained her intellectual and affective faculties, for many months. She remembered past events well, was willing to talk, expressed herself correctly, her ideas were sensible; she was interested in persons known to her and asked about new people . . . No hallucinations, delirium, confusional state, confabulation. What did contrast with the apparent preservation of intelligence of this patient was that she seemed to ignore the existence of a nearly complete hemiplegia, which she had been afraid of for many years. Never did she complain about it; never did she even allude to it. If she was asked to move her right arm, she immediately executed the command. If she was asked to move the left one, she stayed still, silent, and behaved as if the question had been put to somebody else.”

Fascinating.

[eavesdropper]

[quote=walterwhite]i think we are encouraged to suffer from this. i read an article in a recent trade journal about “confidence” in my line of work. a successful person said when she was young, she was asked by senior partner if she knew how to do a particular task ona tight timeline. she said ‘sure!” she gave this as an example of the correct way to be at work to move ahead. i understand a can-do attitude, and “fake it till you make it”, the problem is, dude, you may be the guy who leaks a billion barrels int he gulf or whatever. on the other hand, president is so complex a task no one is really competent, i suppose.[/quote]

Scaredy, I think the practice you cite is endemic in the workplace, especially today plenty of evidence in documentaries like “Smartest Guys In The Room” or some of the recent Frontline docs on the financial meltdown.

But anosognosia is different. These people honestly have absolutely no clue that they’re not dealing with a full deck, so to speak. Socially, they are competent, and function in a completely normal way. They escape notice from almost everyone because there’s not the duplication of skills in the workplace that there used to be. I think, in many situations, jobs have become so specialized that their co-workers (and, in some cases, their supervisors) may have no clue as to what their job really entails. If they are really confident in their abilities, it becomes even difficult to determine that they are incompetent.

Here’s part of Dr. Babinski’s description: “One such patient . . . hit by left hemiplegia has largely maintained her intellectual and affective faculties, for many months. She remembered past events well, was willing to talk, expressed herself correctly, her ideas were sensible; she was interested in persons known to her and asked about new people . . . No hallucinations, delirium, confusional state, confabulation. What did contrast with the apparent preservation of intelligence of this patient was that she seemed to ignore the existence of a nearly complete hemiplegia, which she had been afraid of for many years. Never did she complain about it; never did she even allude to it. If she was asked to move her right arm, she immediately executed the command. If she was asked to move the left one, she stayed still, silent, and behaved as if the question had been put to somebody else.”

Fascinating.

[eavesdropper]

[quote=walterwhite]i think we are encouraged to suffer from this. i read an article in a recent trade journal about “confidence” in my line of work. a successful person said when she was young, she was asked by senior partner if she knew how to do a particular task ona tight timeline. she said ‘sure!” she gave this as an example of the correct way to be at work to move ahead. i understand a can-do attitude, and “fake it till you make it”, the problem is, dude, you may be the guy who leaks a billion barrels int he gulf or whatever. on the other hand, president is so complex a task no one is really competent, i suppose.[/quote]

Scaredy, I think the practice you cite is endemic in the workplace, especially today plenty of evidence in documentaries like “Smartest Guys In The Room” or some of the recent Frontline docs on the financial meltdown.

But anosognosia is different. These people honestly have absolutely no clue that they’re not dealing with a full deck, so to speak. Socially, they are competent, and function in a completely normal way. They escape notice from almost everyone because there’s not the duplication of skills in the workplace that there used to be. I think, in many situations, jobs have become so specialized that their co-workers (and, in some cases, their supervisors) may have no clue as to what their job really entails. If they are really confident in their abilities, it becomes even difficult to determine that they are incompetent.

Here’s part of Dr. Babinski’s description: “One such patient . . . hit by left hemiplegia has largely maintained her intellectual and affective faculties, for many months. She remembered past events well, was willing to talk, expressed herself correctly, her ideas were sensible; she was interested in persons known to her and asked about new people . . . No hallucinations, delirium, confusional state, confabulation. What did contrast with the apparent preservation of intelligence of this patient was that she seemed to ignore the existence of a nearly complete hemiplegia, which she had been afraid of for many years. Never did she complain about it; never did she even allude to it. If she was asked to move her right arm, she immediately executed the command. If she was asked to move the left one, she stayed still, silent, and behaved as if the question had been put to somebody else.”

Fascinating.

[eavesdropper]

[quote=walterwhite]i think we are encouraged to suffer from this. i read an article in a recent trade journal about “confidence” in my line of work. a successful person said when she was young, she was asked by senior partner if she knew how to do a particular task ona tight timeline. she said ‘sure!” she gave this as an example of the correct way to be at work to move ahead. i understand a can-do attitude, and “fake it till you make it”, the problem is, dude, you may be the guy who leaks a billion barrels int he gulf or whatever. on the other hand, president is so complex a task no one is really competent, i suppose.[/quote]

Scaredy, I think the practice you cite is endemic in the workplace, especially today plenty of evidence in documentaries like “Smartest Guys In The Room” or some of the recent Frontline docs on the financial meltdown.

But anosognosia is different. These people honestly have absolutely no clue that they’re not dealing with a full deck, so to speak. Socially, they are competent, and function in a completely normal way. They escape notice from almost everyone because there’s not the duplication of skills in the workplace that there used to be. I think, in many situations, jobs have become so specialized that their co-workers (and, in some cases, their supervisors) may have no clue as to what their job really entails. If they are really confident in their abilities, it becomes even difficult to determine that they are incompetent.

Here’s part of Dr. Babinski’s description: “One such patient . . . hit by left hemiplegia has largely maintained her intellectual and affective faculties, for many months. She remembered past events well, was willing to talk, expressed herself correctly, her ideas were sensible; she was interested in persons known to her and asked about new people . . . No hallucinations, delirium, confusional state, confabulation. What did contrast with the apparent preservation of intelligence of this patient was that she seemed to ignore the existence of a nearly complete hemiplegia, which she had been afraid of for many years. Never did she complain about it; never did she even allude to it. If she was asked to move her right arm, she immediately executed the command. If she was asked to move the left one, she stayed still, silent, and behaved as if the question had been put to somebody else.”

Fascinating.

[desmond]

[quote=Allan from Fallbrook][quote=Jim Jones]Can we bury the Palin argument without choosing a winner and move back onto the original topic the thread was created to discuss?

A truce please![/quote]

Jim: Exactly. In Eavesdropper’s defense, she’s a very intelligent poster, decidely not partisan and did an excellent job of explaining her choice of using Sarah Palin (and in a way that was NOT a political threadjack).

Desmond, however, cannot seem to either grasp this, or is unwilling to accept a well-reasoned and well-explained rationale. I credit Eaves for trying to walk him through this, but, at some point, you have to realize that this person is either unable to understand or unwilling to listen.

Eavesdropper: Your attempt was well done, but clearly fell on deaf ears. Leave him be to go mutter in the corner now.[/quote]

Thanks Allan, that was a low blow. I have never talked politics, E tried to imply that I would be happy to read about Barney Frank, etc. I can’t stand any of them, I am tired how most threads turn to some political analogy and the people that side with the poster then bash the other side. I am not a super intellect as you can see from my threads. I never mutter in any corner, I just like to point out the obvious (at least to me).

[desmond]

[quote=Allan from Fallbrook][quote=Jim Jones]Can we bury the Palin argument without choosing a winner and move back onto the original topic the thread was created to discuss?

A truce please![/quote]

Jim: Exactly. In Eavesdropper’s defense, she’s a very intelligent poster, decidely not partisan and did an excellent job of explaining her choice of using Sarah Palin (and in a way that was NOT a political threadjack).

Desmond, however, cannot seem to either grasp this, or is unwilling to accept a well-reasoned and well-explained rationale. I credit Eaves for trying to walk him through this, but, at some point, you have to realize that this person is either unable to understand or unwilling to listen.

Eavesdropper: Your attempt was well done, but clearly fell on deaf ears. Leave him be to go mutter in the corner now.[/quote]

Thanks Allan, that was a low blow. I have never talked politics, E tried to imply that I would be happy to read about Barney Frank, etc. I can’t stand any of them, I am tired how most threads turn to some political analogy and the people that side with the poster then bash the other side. I am not a super intellect as you can see from my threads. I never mutter in any corner, I just like to point out the obvious (at least to me).

[desmond]

[quote=Allan from Fallbrook][quote=Jim Jones]Can we bury the Palin argument without choosing a winner and move back onto the original topic the thread was created to discuss?

A truce please![/quote]

Jim: Exactly. In Eavesdropper’s defense, she’s a very intelligent poster, decidely not partisan and did an excellent job of explaining her choice of using Sarah Palin (and in a way that was NOT a political threadjack).

Desmond, however, cannot seem to either grasp this, or is unwilling to accept a well-reasoned and well-explained rationale. I credit Eaves for trying to walk him through this, but, at some point, you have to realize that this person is either unable to understand or unwilling to listen.

Eavesdropper: Your attempt was well done, but clearly fell on deaf ears. Leave him be to go mutter in the corner now.[/quote]

Thanks Allan, that was a low blow. I have never talked politics, E tried to imply that I would be happy to read about Barney Frank, etc. I can’t stand any of them, I am tired how most threads turn to some political analogy and the people that side with the poster then bash the other side. I am not a super intellect as you can see from my threads. I never mutter in any corner, I just like to point out the obvious (at least to me).

[desmond]

[quote=Allan from Fallbrook][quote=Jim Jones]Can we bury the Palin argument without choosing a winner and move back onto the original topic the thread was created to discuss?

A truce please![/quote]

Jim: Exactly. In Eavesdropper’s defense, she’s a very intelligent poster, decidely not partisan and did an excellent job of explaining her choice of using Sarah Palin (and in a way that was NOT a political threadjack).

Desmond, however, cannot seem to either grasp this, or is unwilling to accept a well-reasoned and well-explained rationale. I credit Eaves for trying to walk him through this, but, at some point, you have to realize that this person is either unable to understand or unwilling to listen.

Eavesdropper: Your attempt was well done, but clearly fell on deaf ears. Leave him be to go mutter in the corner now.[/quote]

Thanks Allan, that was a low blow. I have never talked politics, E tried to imply that I would be happy to read about Barney Frank, etc. I can’t stand any of them, I am tired how most threads turn to some political analogy and the people that side with the poster then bash the other side. I am not a super intellect as you can see from my threads. I never mutter in any corner, I just like to point out the obvious (at least to me).

[Author]

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