OT: Garage gurus. Removing effed bolts….

[Coronita]

X-cross posted elsewhere too because I can use someone’s expertise on this…

I was in the process of doing my timing belts…(Yes, because the book value of my beater is probably $2.8k and the stealership wanted $2200-2400…And the local guys wanted $1600-1800ish. So I figure, how hard could this be)

I got pretty far, which I thought would be the hard part…Of course, while doing the easy part of trying to get this off…

[img_assist|nid=20346|title=effed|desc=|link=node|align=left|width=300]

I managed to strip 2 of the 4 bolts.. Anyone got any ideas on how I should get these off? Some details.

*These bolts are 6mm “allen hex” bolts with the hex on the inside.
*I tried already 3 different 6mm allen sockets…all stripped the bolts further..
*I tried hammering two Torx t-40 socket in there and using the torx sockets… Those stripped too
*I tried hammering a SAE 5/16″ hex in there.. I was able to get the socket into the bolt about 1/4″ deep. When I turned, it also stripped
*I tried hammering a 7 mm allen socket in there, same problem..

Now what?
For reference..That pulley is located at the bottom…here….

[img_assist|nid=20348|title=effed2|desc=|link=node|align=left|width=400]

[spdrun]

Cuss. Swear some more. Throw a few tools. Then…

Dremel two flats on the outside of the fawked bolts, use a pair of big locking pliers to grab the bolt, then use another pair of locking pliers to turn the first pair. If you orient them the right way, you can also slip a pipe over the handle of the second pair without releasing them to get more leverage.

You can also try a damaged nut removal socket if you have a set.

Oh right, and spray the things with PBlaster repeatedly and let it work into the threads overnight before touching anything.

If none of this works, buy/beg/borrow/steal a wire-feed welder, weld a nut or bolt to the bolts, and use a socket to turn the new, unbuggered head.

[Coronita]

[quote=spdrun]Cuss. Swear some more. Throw a few tools.

[/quote]
Done that…

[quote]

Dremel two flats on the outside of the fawked bolts, use a pair of big locking pliers to grab the bolt, then use another pair of locking pliers to turn the first pair. If you orient them the right way, you can also slip a pipe over the handle of the second pair without releasing them to get more leverage.

Oh right, and spray the things with PBlaster repeatedly and let it work in overnight before touching anything.

[/quote]

Attempted that too. There isn’t enough clearance for a larger vise grip pliers to reach the bolt without hitting the center shaft bolt, and a smaller vise grip that fits won’t grip tight enough.

[quote]
If none of this works, buy/beg/borrow/steal a wire-feed welder, weld a nut or bolt to the bolts, and use a socket to turn the new, unbuggered head.[/quote]
Interesting…. Need to find someone that has a welder.

[an]

Try these:http://www.sears.com/search=stripped%20nut%20remover

[spdrun]

If you can’t get a welder, I wonder if JB-welding something to the inside of the bolts and waiting for the JB to harden for a day might work in a pinch. Also, there exist special Allen bolt extractor tools that “screw into” the inside of the bolts with a reverse thread so they tighten when you turn the bolt counterclockwise.

But they should be used with care since they’re hardened steel, and breaking them will complicate bolt removal by other means. Ask me how I know.

[CDMA ENG]

[quote=AN]Try these:http://www.sears.com/search=stripped%20nut%20remover%5B/quote%5D

Agree with AN but I would drill them out…

http://www.zoro.com/i/G0549114/?utm_source=google_shopping&utm_medium=cpc&utm_campaign=Google_Shopping_Feed&gclid=CjwKEAiAt4mlBRDXwt_m9ICU4DcSJAAS_X0WKXFN16b0xkNCncJgx9XCwBStwS0QjV9_0YeUK5VWLxoCKLbw_wcB

Peace out…

CE

[kismetsdad]

I would sacrifice the pulley and cut the shoulder of pulley off. This looks like it will give decent access for vise grips on bolts. Replacing pully can’t be too expensive Then lots of liquid wrench over couple of days.. I like the welder idea too. I would predict drilling bolts would only bring misery like a bolt broken off in crank

You can check out my previous timing belt work at:
http://www.shastaanesthesia.com/Lexus/Page1.html

[Hobie]

I think you are going to have trouble getting an external grabbing bolt remover inside the pulley.

My best suggestion is to load the car on a trailer and take it to a TIG welder. The TIG is hot and very precise heat to attach a longer, larger bolt to the damaged one so you can get a big wrench on it from beyond the pulley. A MIG may work, but the guys who have both will use the TIG always.

The added benefit of a TIG is you will thermal cycle the bolt which will help crack it loose.

Before you light up the welder, be sure to disconnect the ECM or any other electronic device. Welders can induce damaging stray high voltage even when the battery is disconnected.

I would not try to hand drill the hardened bolt. If you slip off you will damage the crank. No need to cut up the pulley with the TIG technique.

As you probably know, or tried, these bolts are easier to remove with an impact. Of course hand torque them to install.

Good Luck! I’m impressed you are among the few to tackle wrenching, especially in your neighborhood 😉

[Coronita]

Alright.. Round #2 this afternoon….Thanks for the suggestions. Had to move the car into the garage since it’s suppose to rain…..That was fun moving it with almost no coolant and no power steering, if only for a few seconds…

[Coronita]

[quote=kismetsdad]I would sacrifice the pulley and cut the shoulder of pulley off. This looks like it will give decent access for vise grips on bolts. Replacing pully can’t be too expensive Then lots of liquid wrench over couple of days.. I like the welder idea too. I would predict drilling bolts would only bring misery like a bolt broken off in crank

You can check out my previous timing belt work at:
http://www.shastaanesthesia.com/Lexus/Page1.html%5B/quote%5D

Thanks.. Unrelated question. Why kind of lift is that in your garage??? Nice….

[NotCranky]

cut a deep slot in the bolt head with grinder. jam a heavy straight screw driver into the slot and use vise grips on the screw driver while pushing in hard, maybe even rig a pice of a screw driver to air wrench and try that.

[Coronita]

Ok…Hours later….

[img_assist|nid=20349|title=effed3|desc=|link=node|align=left|width=200]

0. Soaked bolts with pb blaster overnight..

1. Tried getting a vise grip on to the bottom right bolt before grinding the sides completely… No dice…

2. Tried to fit a bolt extractor (the ones that fit on the outside)…No clearance between the bolt and the center bolt to stick a socket in there….

3. On the left bolt, drilled a 5/32″ hole to get a bolt extractor in there….In the war between the bolt and the bolt extractor, the bolt won….

[img_assist|nid=20350|title=effed4|desc=|link=node|align=left|width=200]

Notice the extractor is pretty much bent and stripped at the tip. Yes, that’s a made in usa extractor. Not a made in china or elsewhere bit…

Well, at least this is happening in 2014…
However, I really don’t want to start 2015 this way :(… I guess indirectly, I’m adding more to my tool collection, though not exactly the way I wanted to….

*The pulley is tough steel (tougher then the bolts) so cutting through it probably isn’t an option. Plus I believe it’s a $250 part from the steeler….

*Folks suggesting I use a grinder to cut a lot in between to bolts and to jam a large screwdriver or something similar…You think I’ll be able to turn it that way before I destroy the top of the bolt? The bolt was fairly easy to drill into using a standard drill bit (not a fancy carbide drill bit or anything)….So I’m a little concerned it getting all warped…. Also, I don’t have an impact wrench, otherwise I would use a chisel and try to impact it out CCW.

* If I completely drill through.. How hard is it to tap a new thread (for someone that’s never done it)

*Any other suggestions? Or should I wave the white flag and have it towed to have it done….

BTW: This is what the shaft looks like with the pulley off, if that makes a difference as to the decision you would take……

[img_assist|nid=20351|desc=|link=node|align=left|width=300]

[spdrun]

Find a bolt where the screw part fits closely within the hole in the bolts. That will hold it in place. Plain steel, non galvanized (toxic fumes), non stainless. Weld it to the bolt head after cleaning any plating or finish there may be off with a flap wheel.

You don’t need a fancy or expensive welder. Something like this with flux-core wire should do. You don’t need pretty welds, just ones strong enough to remove the #%$^&ing bolt.

http://sandiego.craigslist.org/esd/tls/4820020314.html

Adequate auto-dark helmet will run you $100 or so. Don’t bother with the theatre masks that you have to hold in your hand — they’re useless as well as needing three hands to use.

Practice with the two bolts you CAN remove clamped in a vise before going at the real thing. If that doesn’t work, you can always move to plan B, grind off the bolt, and drill out the rest.

[moneymaker]

#1 make sure you know which direction the bolt is supposed to be turned, not sure of the little guys but sometimes the big guy gets turned opposite i.e. clockwise to get out.

[NotCranky]

I’d exhaust all options for getting the bolts out without messing with the female threads. You might have removed some material with the bolt extraction so the head might be too weak for the slot and screwdriver suggestion?

I have gotten away with pounding a smaller socket or wrench on the bolt head once or twice in my life too. Easier on larger bolts.

[Author]

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