OT – Alcoholism and Addiction

[outtamojo]

[quote=Rustico]Yes JP, I have read up on it.There were other influences from books read and people I have met along the way, but the most comprehensive argument for this point of view that I have come across is “The Truth about Addiction and Recovery”.

Scaredy’s comments about teaching or learning moderation(or not) at some cultural level are also covered in the book. Some individual people,even groups of people, are just better prepared by various kinds of histories, to become extremely addicted to something than others are,but probably without any genetic differences to attribute. Is bulimia/Anorexia genetic because it is largely an American Phenomena?

Belief that it is the ethnicity of the people , without an attempt to debunk with a study of culture/histories can create some self fulfilling prophecy problems that lead to this speculation/confirmation bias with regard to genetics and problem drinking, crack cocaine use or abuse of anything else. Alcoholism depends on weaknesses of all kinds, but the problem drinking is still a symptom not a disease.[/quote]

Here is some info on the genetics of NON-alcoholics. There is a drug available that makes you feel terrible when you drink, which, on the flip side of this topic, is how I feel when I drink. Yeah, that’s why some don’t really join the party : (, all it takes is a few sips.
http://www.indiana.edu/~rcapub/v17n3/p18.html

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Acetaldehyde_dehydrogenase

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Disulfiram

[scaredyclassic]

i remember vividly a first party -drinking experience drinking way too much too fast at a h.s. party and throwing up on someone’s driveway. I even remember what jacket i was wearing and that a little bit of vomit got on it. i even kind of remember what i was thinking at the time– “dang, i was having fun, why did I have to overdo it?” But felt much better afterwards and wished i had a toothbrush.

What i try to teach my kids is that alcohol is truly a good thing, something that people were meant to use, but that the good feeling you get from alcohol does not increase as you drink more. it’s as good as it’s going to get with 1-2 drinks an hour is my lesson. faster and more doesn’t help with alcohol (and probably a lot of other things, too); in fact it makes things worse. it’s a lesson i review often with them. Who knows if it’ll stick or if they understand, or how they’ll figure things out themselves, but i think it’s a lot more persuasive than society’s current message, which is, adults only, sure, go to war when you’re 18, but don’t drink till you’re 21 because it’s too dangerous. Repression and prohibition and making something seem exotic and illicit leads to pent up demand that has to be unleashed, often in extreme ways.

drinking alone with porn is bad, but the isolation and sadness and unconnectedness are the problems, not alcohol in itself.

[scaredyclassic]

i remember vividly a first party -drinking experience drinking way too much too fast at a h.s. party and throwing up on someone’s driveway. I even remember what jacket i was wearing and that a little bit of vomit got on it. i even kind of remember what i was thinking at the time– “dang, i was having fun, why did I have to overdo it?” But felt much better afterwards and wished i had a toothbrush.

What i try to teach my kids is that alcohol is truly a good thing, something that people were meant to use, but that the good feeling you get from alcohol does not increase as you drink more. it’s as good as it’s going to get with 1-2 drinks an hour is my lesson. faster and more doesn’t help with alcohol (and probably a lot of other things, too); in fact it makes things worse. it’s a lesson i review often with them. Who knows if it’ll stick or if they understand, or how they’ll figure things out themselves, but i think it’s a lot more persuasive than society’s current message, which is, adults only, sure, go to war when you’re 18, but don’t drink till you’re 21 because it’s too dangerous. Repression and prohibition and making something seem exotic and illicit leads to pent up demand that has to be unleashed, often in extreme ways.

drinking alone with porn is bad, but the isolation and sadness and unconnectedness are the problems, not alcohol in itself.

[scaredyclassic]

i remember vividly a first party -drinking experience drinking way too much too fast at a h.s. party and throwing up on someone’s driveway. I even remember what jacket i was wearing and that a little bit of vomit got on it. i even kind of remember what i was thinking at the time– “dang, i was having fun, why did I have to overdo it?” But felt much better afterwards and wished i had a toothbrush.

What i try to teach my kids is that alcohol is truly a good thing, something that people were meant to use, but that the good feeling you get from alcohol does not increase as you drink more. it’s as good as it’s going to get with 1-2 drinks an hour is my lesson. faster and more doesn’t help with alcohol (and probably a lot of other things, too); in fact it makes things worse. it’s a lesson i review often with them. Who knows if it’ll stick or if they understand, or how they’ll figure things out themselves, but i think it’s a lot more persuasive than society’s current message, which is, adults only, sure, go to war when you’re 18, but don’t drink till you’re 21 because it’s too dangerous. Repression and prohibition and making something seem exotic and illicit leads to pent up demand that has to be unleashed, often in extreme ways.

drinking alone with porn is bad, but the isolation and sadness and unconnectedness are the problems, not alcohol in itself.

[scaredyclassic]

i remember vividly a first party -drinking experience drinking way too much too fast at a h.s. party and throwing up on someone’s driveway. I even remember what jacket i was wearing and that a little bit of vomit got on it. i even kind of remember what i was thinking at the time– “dang, i was having fun, why did I have to overdo it?” But felt much better afterwards and wished i had a toothbrush.

What i try to teach my kids is that alcohol is truly a good thing, something that people were meant to use, but that the good feeling you get from alcohol does not increase as you drink more. it’s as good as it’s going to get with 1-2 drinks an hour is my lesson. faster and more doesn’t help with alcohol (and probably a lot of other things, too); in fact it makes things worse. it’s a lesson i review often with them. Who knows if it’ll stick or if they understand, or how they’ll figure things out themselves, but i think it’s a lot more persuasive than society’s current message, which is, adults only, sure, go to war when you’re 18, but don’t drink till you’re 21 because it’s too dangerous. Repression and prohibition and making something seem exotic and illicit leads to pent up demand that has to be unleashed, often in extreme ways.

drinking alone with porn is bad, but the isolation and sadness and unconnectedness are the problems, not alcohol in itself.

[scaredyclassic]

i remember vividly a first party -drinking experience drinking way too much too fast at a h.s. party and throwing up on someone’s driveway. I even remember what jacket i was wearing and that a little bit of vomit got on it. i even kind of remember what i was thinking at the time– “dang, i was having fun, why did I have to overdo it?” But felt much better afterwards and wished i had a toothbrush.

What i try to teach my kids is that alcohol is truly a good thing, something that people were meant to use, but that the good feeling you get from alcohol does not increase as you drink more. it’s as good as it’s going to get with 1-2 drinks an hour is my lesson. faster and more doesn’t help with alcohol (and probably a lot of other things, too); in fact it makes things worse. it’s a lesson i review often with them. Who knows if it’ll stick or if they understand, or how they’ll figure things out themselves, but i think it’s a lot more persuasive than society’s current message, which is, adults only, sure, go to war when you’re 18, but don’t drink till you’re 21 because it’s too dangerous. Repression and prohibition and making something seem exotic and illicit leads to pent up demand that has to be unleashed, often in extreme ways.

drinking alone with porn is bad, but the isolation and sadness and unconnectedness are the problems, not alcohol in itself.

[USMCBunny]

briansd1,

Google Big Book online, give Chap 8 a read. It’s only like 9 pages and gives the best advice about encouraging a guy to take a look at himself that I have seen. I know it’s called “to the wives”… this book dates back a long way. Simple fact – this guy is not going to change a thing until he wants to. My sisters alcoholism will kill her…soon.

[USMCBunny]

briansd1,

Google Big Book online, give Chap 8 a read. It’s only like 9 pages and gives the best advice about encouraging a guy to take a look at himself that I have seen. I know it’s called “to the wives”… this book dates back a long way. Simple fact – this guy is not going to change a thing until he wants to. My sisters alcoholism will kill her…soon.

[USMCBunny]

briansd1,

Google Big Book online, give Chap 8 a read. It’s only like 9 pages and gives the best advice about encouraging a guy to take a look at himself that I have seen. I know it’s called “to the wives”… this book dates back a long way. Simple fact – this guy is not going to change a thing until he wants to. My sisters alcoholism will kill her…soon.

[USMCBunny]

briansd1,

Google Big Book online, give Chap 8 a read. It’s only like 9 pages and gives the best advice about encouraging a guy to take a look at himself that I have seen. I know it’s called “to the wives”… this book dates back a long way. Simple fact – this guy is not going to change a thing until he wants to. My sisters alcoholism will kill her…soon.

[USMCBunny]

briansd1,

Google Big Book online, give Chap 8 a read. It’s only like 9 pages and gives the best advice about encouraging a guy to take a look at himself that I have seen. I know it’s called “to the wives”… this book dates back a long way. Simple fact – this guy is not going to change a thing until he wants to. My sisters alcoholism will kill her…soon.

[briansd1]

walter, since you did research on the benefit of alcohol, do you think that all drinks are equal?

Wine, beer and hard liquor. I would think that the latter too don’t provide much benefits because they lack the antioxidants of wine. Beer is basically starch.

More broadly on the topic of addiction, my dad in his youth traveled to Laos. It was the time of Air America and plenty of Americans worked there (such as Alexander Haig).

Back then, my dad smoked opium. Only a small percent got addicted. And according to him, the addiction rate is about the same as today’s prohibition system in America.

He said that opium is wonderful and it’s a great way to kill pain, and die if you wish (only if euthanasia were legal).

[briansd1]

walter, since you did research on the benefit of alcohol, do you think that all drinks are equal?

Wine, beer and hard liquor. I would think that the latter too don’t provide much benefits because they lack the antioxidants of wine. Beer is basically starch.

More broadly on the topic of addiction, my dad in his youth traveled to Laos. It was the time of Air America and plenty of Americans worked there (such as Alexander Haig).

Back then, my dad smoked opium. Only a small percent got addicted. And according to him, the addiction rate is about the same as today’s prohibition system in America.

He said that opium is wonderful and it’s a great way to kill pain, and die if you wish (only if euthanasia were legal).

[briansd1]

walter, since you did research on the benefit of alcohol, do you think that all drinks are equal?

Wine, beer and hard liquor. I would think that the latter too don’t provide much benefits because they lack the antioxidants of wine. Beer is basically starch.

More broadly on the topic of addiction, my dad in his youth traveled to Laos. It was the time of Air America and plenty of Americans worked there (such as Alexander Haig).

Back then, my dad smoked opium. Only a small percent got addicted. And according to him, the addiction rate is about the same as today’s prohibition system in America.

He said that opium is wonderful and it’s a great way to kill pain, and die if you wish (only if euthanasia were legal).

[briansd1]

walter, since you did research on the benefit of alcohol, do you think that all drinks are equal?

Wine, beer and hard liquor. I would think that the latter too don’t provide much benefits because they lack the antioxidants of wine. Beer is basically starch.

More broadly on the topic of addiction, my dad in his youth traveled to Laos. It was the time of Air America and plenty of Americans worked there (such as Alexander Haig).

Back then, my dad smoked opium. Only a small percent got addicted. And according to him, the addiction rate is about the same as today’s prohibition system in America.

He said that opium is wonderful and it’s a great way to kill pain, and die if you wish (only if euthanasia were legal).

[Author]

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