OLBERMANN AND GARAFOLO: Playing the Racist Game

[partypup]

[quote=Allan from Fallbrook]

The irony of course is that everybody, to a certain extent, is racist, consciously or unconsciously. Black people can be tremendously racist, especially when it comes to Asians and Mexicans. Asians can be racists, too, and even within their own racial group (have you ever heard Japanese people ripping on Koreans, Vietnamese and Chinese?)..[/quote]

Speaking as a black person, I can honestly say that far too many members of my extended family are racist – although they would not consider themselves to be such. They have a distinctly “us vs them” mentality that permeates almost every aspect of their dealings with white people. Having grown up in a primarily white community and gone to primarily white schools, my sense is that black people actually have MORE racist tendencies than white people. And it pains me to say that because it really shows that victims often choose to emulate their oppressors (just look at the treatment Palestinians get from Israelis) rather than distance themselves from that behavior. It amazes me sometimes how open-minded many white people can be when dealing with black people, whereas many black people are quick to openly draw on stereotypes and make fun of white people for being un-hip, uncool or whatever. Just think about the percentage of white people who voted for Obama vs the percentage of black people who voted for McCain or Hillary. Yet no one considers black people to be racist for voting for Obama solely based on his race, and that’s exactly what the majority of black people openly admitted to doing. I almost get the sense that black people feel that being the victims of institutional racism in the past has given them license – in perpetuity – to pay it back on spades. And I just don’t get this. When I was in law school I took a class called “Race, Racism and the Law,” and you wouldn’t believe the number of black (and white) students who believed that racism is by definition an instrument of power, and that a minority group can never be racist against the majority. I also don’t understand why so many white people literally cower in fear when they are accused of being racist. By contrast, if you call a black person racist they will just shrug and dismiss it. The word holds absolutely no power whatsoever over them, but it is practically kryptonite for white people. When debating Obama’s merits (or lack thereof) during the campaign, some white people actually had the nerve to call ME racist against black people! That’s how utterly ludicrous this discourse has become. As another poster said, I almost feel sorry for white people. They are too afraid to speak their mind or to be honest with themselves, and this is unfortunate because as you said, Allan, deep down, we ALL have prejudices and preferences. Yet it is only white people (who hold the dubious distinction of being in the “majority”) who must censor themselves.

It’s not right, it’s not fair, and it’s embarrassing. And what’s most distressing is that this double standard creates a tension between the races that is only exacerbated over time. Thanks to the media’s shameless over-protection of Obama, he is in danger of being the first first affirmative action president.

[Allan from Fallbrook]

Partypup: I remember Marion claiming that you WEREN’T black, because you didn’t believe as she did. Or, alternately, she referred to you as an Uncle Tom and for no crime other than having the temerity to challenge her views, which she considered “real black”.

Whites have been conditioned to instantly recoil and apologize whenever accused of racism, whether it’s true or not. I remember some government official, who was either fired or forced to resign and because he used the word “niggardly”. There were howls of protest about this, but no one bothered to pick up a dictionary and actually look up what the word meant (hint: It isn’t racist at all).

I had a history prof who was black that offered up the same “racism is structural” nonsense, meaning because whites are the majority and control the power, blacks cannot be racist. This same professor opined that blacks, unlike whites, never went in for empire building. I stupidly brought up Shaka Zulu and his empire of the savannah. Whoops.

Whites have been conditioned by the PC crowd, the Leftists and fine educational institutions ranging from Kindergarten to secondary to accept that we’re innately bad, have brought nothing but suffering to the world and, if left to our own devices, would undoubtedly have charred the world to cinders by now.

[Allan from Fallbrook]

Partypup: I remember Marion claiming that you WEREN’T black, because you didn’t believe as she did. Or, alternately, she referred to you as an Uncle Tom and for no crime other than having the temerity to challenge her views, which she considered “real black”.

Whites have been conditioned to instantly recoil and apologize whenever accused of racism, whether it’s true or not. I remember some government official, who was either fired or forced to resign and because he used the word “niggardly”. There were howls of protest about this, but no one bothered to pick up a dictionary and actually look up what the word meant (hint: It isn’t racist at all).

I had a history prof who was black that offered up the same “racism is structural” nonsense, meaning because whites are the majority and control the power, blacks cannot be racist. This same professor opined that blacks, unlike whites, never went in for empire building. I stupidly brought up Shaka Zulu and his empire of the savannah. Whoops.

Whites have been conditioned by the PC crowd, the Leftists and fine educational institutions ranging from Kindergarten to secondary to accept that we’re innately bad, have brought nothing but suffering to the world and, if left to our own devices, would undoubtedly have charred the world to cinders by now.

[Allan from Fallbrook]

Partypup: I remember Marion claiming that you WEREN’T black, because you didn’t believe as she did. Or, alternately, she referred to you as an Uncle Tom and for no crime other than having the temerity to challenge her views, which she considered “real black”.

Whites have been conditioned to instantly recoil and apologize whenever accused of racism, whether it’s true or not. I remember some government official, who was either fired or forced to resign and because he used the word “niggardly”. There were howls of protest about this, but no one bothered to pick up a dictionary and actually look up what the word meant (hint: It isn’t racist at all).

I had a history prof who was black that offered up the same “racism is structural” nonsense, meaning because whites are the majority and control the power, blacks cannot be racist. This same professor opined that blacks, unlike whites, never went in for empire building. I stupidly brought up Shaka Zulu and his empire of the savannah. Whoops.

Whites have been conditioned by the PC crowd, the Leftists and fine educational institutions ranging from Kindergarten to secondary to accept that we’re innately bad, have brought nothing but suffering to the world and, if left to our own devices, would undoubtedly have charred the world to cinders by now.

[Allan from Fallbrook]

Partypup: I remember Marion claiming that you WEREN’T black, because you didn’t believe as she did. Or, alternately, she referred to you as an Uncle Tom and for no crime other than having the temerity to challenge her views, which she considered “real black”.

Whites have been conditioned to instantly recoil and apologize whenever accused of racism, whether it’s true or not. I remember some government official, who was either fired or forced to resign and because he used the word “niggardly”. There were howls of protest about this, but no one bothered to pick up a dictionary and actually look up what the word meant (hint: It isn’t racist at all).

I had a history prof who was black that offered up the same “racism is structural” nonsense, meaning because whites are the majority and control the power, blacks cannot be racist. This same professor opined that blacks, unlike whites, never went in for empire building. I stupidly brought up Shaka Zulu and his empire of the savannah. Whoops.

Whites have been conditioned by the PC crowd, the Leftists and fine educational institutions ranging from Kindergarten to secondary to accept that we’re innately bad, have brought nothing but suffering to the world and, if left to our own devices, would undoubtedly have charred the world to cinders by now.

[Allan from Fallbrook]

Partypup: I remember Marion claiming that you WEREN’T black, because you didn’t believe as she did. Or, alternately, she referred to you as an Uncle Tom and for no crime other than having the temerity to challenge her views, which she considered “real black”.

Whites have been conditioned to instantly recoil and apologize whenever accused of racism, whether it’s true or not. I remember some government official, who was either fired or forced to resign and because he used the word “niggardly”. There were howls of protest about this, but no one bothered to pick up a dictionary and actually look up what the word meant (hint: It isn’t racist at all).

I had a history prof who was black that offered up the same “racism is structural” nonsense, meaning because whites are the majority and control the power, blacks cannot be racist. This same professor opined that blacks, unlike whites, never went in for empire building. I stupidly brought up Shaka Zulu and his empire of the savannah. Whoops.

Whites have been conditioned by the PC crowd, the Leftists and fine educational institutions ranging from Kindergarten to secondary to accept that we’re innately bad, have brought nothing but suffering to the world and, if left to our own devices, would undoubtedly have charred the world to cinders by now.

[Ricechex]

I always enjoy the race threads on Piggs. I think culture, age and demographics determine how words are used. For instance, in Ohio, I have heard the term “Oriental” and it struck me, because ya just don’t hear it out here. It was not used in a derogatory fashion, yes afx, context is certainly important.

My grandmother, not racist as far as I knew, referred to black people as “colored.” (I was always terribly embarassed, but she never used it in a derogatory fashion) I refer to black people as black. That was the term when I was growing up. I have noticed that younger people, use the term African-American. In the past couple of weeks I have had to make a couple of reports to Child Protective Services.

First scenario, older hotline worker, report on an African family.

Hotline Worker: Mother’s name? Address? Phone?
Me: XXXXX
Hotline Worker: Race?
Me: African.
Hotline Worker: You mean “African American?”
Me: No, I mean “African.” They are from Nigeria, been here about a year.
Hotline Worker: Father’s name? Address? Phone?
Me: XXXX
Hotline Worker: Race?
Me: African.
Hotline Worker: You mean “African American?”
Me: No, I mean “African.”

A couple of weeks later, making a report on a black family. This time, the hotline worker, was a young girl (seemed so by the voice).

Hotline Worker: Mother’s name? Address? Phone?
Me: XXXXX
Hotline Worker: Race?
Me: Black.
Hotline Worker: You mean “African American?”
Me: Sure.
Hotline Worker: Father’s name? Address? Phone?
Me: XXXX
Hotline Worker: Race?
Me: Black.
Hotline Worker: You mean “African American?”
Me: Sure.

Clearly, the first worker wanted to box it up as African American. The second worker was correcting me.

So, I guess it all depends.

[Ricechex]

I always enjoy the race threads on Piggs. I think culture, age and demographics determine how words are used. For instance, in Ohio, I have heard the term “Oriental” and it struck me, because ya just don’t hear it out here. It was not used in a derogatory fashion, yes afx, context is certainly important.

My grandmother, not racist as far as I knew, referred to black people as “colored.” (I was always terribly embarassed, but she never used it in a derogatory fashion) I refer to black people as black. That was the term when I was growing up. I have noticed that younger people, use the term African-American. In the past couple of weeks I have had to make a couple of reports to Child Protective Services.

First scenario, older hotline worker, report on an African family.

Hotline Worker: Mother’s name? Address? Phone?
Me: XXXXX
Hotline Worker: Race?
Me: African.
Hotline Worker: You mean “African American?”
Me: No, I mean “African.” They are from Nigeria, been here about a year.
Hotline Worker: Father’s name? Address? Phone?
Me: XXXX
Hotline Worker: Race?
Me: African.
Hotline Worker: You mean “African American?”
Me: No, I mean “African.”

A couple of weeks later, making a report on a black family. This time, the hotline worker, was a young girl (seemed so by the voice).

Hotline Worker: Mother’s name? Address? Phone?
Me: XXXXX
Hotline Worker: Race?
Me: Black.
Hotline Worker: You mean “African American?”
Me: Sure.
Hotline Worker: Father’s name? Address? Phone?
Me: XXXX
Hotline Worker: Race?
Me: Black.
Hotline Worker: You mean “African American?”
Me: Sure.

Clearly, the first worker wanted to box it up as African American. The second worker was correcting me.

So, I guess it all depends.

[Ricechex]

I always enjoy the race threads on Piggs. I think culture, age and demographics determine how words are used. For instance, in Ohio, I have heard the term “Oriental” and it struck me, because ya just don’t hear it out here. It was not used in a derogatory fashion, yes afx, context is certainly important.

My grandmother, not racist as far as I knew, referred to black people as “colored.” (I was always terribly embarassed, but she never used it in a derogatory fashion) I refer to black people as black. That was the term when I was growing up. I have noticed that younger people, use the term African-American. In the past couple of weeks I have had to make a couple of reports to Child Protective Services.

First scenario, older hotline worker, report on an African family.

Hotline Worker: Mother’s name? Address? Phone?
Me: XXXXX
Hotline Worker: Race?
Me: African.
Hotline Worker: You mean “African American?”
Me: No, I mean “African.” They are from Nigeria, been here about a year.
Hotline Worker: Father’s name? Address? Phone?
Me: XXXX
Hotline Worker: Race?
Me: African.
Hotline Worker: You mean “African American?”
Me: No, I mean “African.”

A couple of weeks later, making a report on a black family. This time, the hotline worker, was a young girl (seemed so by the voice).

Hotline Worker: Mother’s name? Address? Phone?
Me: XXXXX
Hotline Worker: Race?
Me: Black.
Hotline Worker: You mean “African American?”
Me: Sure.
Hotline Worker: Father’s name? Address? Phone?
Me: XXXX
Hotline Worker: Race?
Me: Black.
Hotline Worker: You mean “African American?”
Me: Sure.

Clearly, the first worker wanted to box it up as African American. The second worker was correcting me.

So, I guess it all depends.

[Ricechex]

I always enjoy the race threads on Piggs. I think culture, age and demographics determine how words are used. For instance, in Ohio, I have heard the term “Oriental” and it struck me, because ya just don’t hear it out here. It was not used in a derogatory fashion, yes afx, context is certainly important.

My grandmother, not racist as far as I knew, referred to black people as “colored.” (I was always terribly embarassed, but she never used it in a derogatory fashion) I refer to black people as black. That was the term when I was growing up. I have noticed that younger people, use the term African-American. In the past couple of weeks I have had to make a couple of reports to Child Protective Services.

First scenario, older hotline worker, report on an African family.

Hotline Worker: Mother’s name? Address? Phone?
Me: XXXXX
Hotline Worker: Race?
Me: African.
Hotline Worker: You mean “African American?”
Me: No, I mean “African.” They are from Nigeria, been here about a year.
Hotline Worker: Father’s name? Address? Phone?
Me: XXXX
Hotline Worker: Race?
Me: African.
Hotline Worker: You mean “African American?”
Me: No, I mean “African.”

A couple of weeks later, making a report on a black family. This time, the hotline worker, was a young girl (seemed so by the voice).

Hotline Worker: Mother’s name? Address? Phone?
Me: XXXXX
Hotline Worker: Race?
Me: Black.
Hotline Worker: You mean “African American?”
Me: Sure.
Hotline Worker: Father’s name? Address? Phone?
Me: XXXX
Hotline Worker: Race?
Me: Black.
Hotline Worker: You mean “African American?”
Me: Sure.

Clearly, the first worker wanted to box it up as African American. The second worker was correcting me.

So, I guess it all depends.

[Ricechex]

I always enjoy the race threads on Piggs. I think culture, age and demographics determine how words are used. For instance, in Ohio, I have heard the term “Oriental” and it struck me, because ya just don’t hear it out here. It was not used in a derogatory fashion, yes afx, context is certainly important.

My grandmother, not racist as far as I knew, referred to black people as “colored.” (I was always terribly embarassed, but she never used it in a derogatory fashion) I refer to black people as black. That was the term when I was growing up. I have noticed that younger people, use the term African-American. In the past couple of weeks I have had to make a couple of reports to Child Protective Services.

First scenario, older hotline worker, report on an African family.

Hotline Worker: Mother’s name? Address? Phone?
Me: XXXXX
Hotline Worker: Race?
Me: African.
Hotline Worker: You mean “African American?”
Me: No, I mean “African.” They are from Nigeria, been here about a year.
Hotline Worker: Father’s name? Address? Phone?
Me: XXXX
Hotline Worker: Race?
Me: African.
Hotline Worker: You mean “African American?”
Me: No, I mean “African.”

A couple of weeks later, making a report on a black family. This time, the hotline worker, was a young girl (seemed so by the voice).

Hotline Worker: Mother’s name? Address? Phone?
Me: XXXXX
Hotline Worker: Race?
Me: Black.
Hotline Worker: You mean “African American?”
Me: Sure.
Hotline Worker: Father’s name? Address? Phone?
Me: XXXX
Hotline Worker: Race?
Me: Black.
Hotline Worker: You mean “African American?”
Me: Sure.

Clearly, the first worker wanted to box it up as African American. The second worker was correcting me.

So, I guess it all depends.

[CA renter]

This is the kind of dialogue that could actually “fix” some of the problems with “racism.”

We can’t fix the problem if we can’t define it. We can’t define it unless we can openly discuss everyone’s perspectives and better understand the history and context of our beliefs.

Davelj made an excellent point about “racism” really being about culture. He hit the nail on the head, IMHO. Most people I know couldn’t care less about a person’s color, as long as that person shared a similar culture/belief system. Race really doesn’t matter.

One story: back when I was in college, we had a “Black House” and a “Hispanic House” for black and hispanic students. No “White House” though.

They also had a “black” graduation ceremony that (black) students could choose to attend instead of the regular ceremony with everyone else. I can assure you we did NOT have a separate “white” graduation ceremony.

Yes, “racism” goes both ways.

[CA renter]

This is the kind of dialogue that could actually “fix” some of the problems with “racism.”

We can’t fix the problem if we can’t define it. We can’t define it unless we can openly discuss everyone’s perspectives and better understand the history and context of our beliefs.

Davelj made an excellent point about “racism” really being about culture. He hit the nail on the head, IMHO. Most people I know couldn’t care less about a person’s color, as long as that person shared a similar culture/belief system. Race really doesn’t matter.

One story: back when I was in college, we had a “Black House” and a “Hispanic House” for black and hispanic students. No “White House” though.

They also had a “black” graduation ceremony that (black) students could choose to attend instead of the regular ceremony with everyone else. I can assure you we did NOT have a separate “white” graduation ceremony.

Yes, “racism” goes both ways.

[CA renter]

This is the kind of dialogue that could actually “fix” some of the problems with “racism.”

We can’t fix the problem if we can’t define it. We can’t define it unless we can openly discuss everyone’s perspectives and better understand the history and context of our beliefs.

Davelj made an excellent point about “racism” really being about culture. He hit the nail on the head, IMHO. Most people I know couldn’t care less about a person’s color, as long as that person shared a similar culture/belief system. Race really doesn’t matter.

One story: back when I was in college, we had a “Black House” and a “Hispanic House” for black and hispanic students. No “White House” though.

They also had a “black” graduation ceremony that (black) students could choose to attend instead of the regular ceremony with everyone else. I can assure you we did NOT have a separate “white” graduation ceremony.

Yes, “racism” goes both ways.

[CA renter]

This is the kind of dialogue that could actually “fix” some of the problems with “racism.”

We can’t fix the problem if we can’t define it. We can’t define it unless we can openly discuss everyone’s perspectives and better understand the history and context of our beliefs.

Davelj made an excellent point about “racism” really being about culture. He hit the nail on the head, IMHO. Most people I know couldn’t care less about a person’s color, as long as that person shared a similar culture/belief system. Race really doesn’t matter.

One story: back when I was in college, we had a “Black House” and a “Hispanic House” for black and hispanic students. No “White House” though.

They also had a “black” graduation ceremony that (black) students could choose to attend instead of the regular ceremony with everyone else. I can assure you we did NOT have a separate “white” graduation ceremony.

Yes, “racism” goes both ways.

[Author]

Posts