Non-salary CA budget cuts

[CA renter]

[quote=davelj]I saw a post on another site that quoted these CA budget numbers (the 08-09 figure is correct, I checked that one):

FY 98-99 $ 75 billion
FY 04-05 $107 billion
FY 08-09 $145 billion (proposed/enacted)

All I have to say is, Puhlease. CA’s population has increased from 33.5 million in 1998 to 37.1 million today. That’s 10.6% CUMULATIVE growth. Add in illegals and MAYBE you can double that – I’ll give this notion the benefit of the doubt. Then let’s add in cumulative inflation of 35% (3% per year). So, now we should have a budget that’s about 50% greater than 1998’s budget (in nominal dollars), or about $113 billion. Or “just” $32 billion below our current goal.

So, this isn’t that complicated, in theory. Go back to 1998’s budget and, line by line, increase each one by 50% and say to each department, “Here’s your budget. Figure it out.”

How did we manage a decade ago on such “meager” funds relative to the population? I guess we were real Spartans back then. I’m betting we can survive – just barely – on the “old” budget, adjusted for population and inflation.

In fact, I have a proposal. Just pass legislation that limits budget increases to the higher of CPI inflation or the increase in the state’s population. What’s wrong with this approach?

EDIT: Now that I think about it, I guess the budget increase should be limited to the CPI increase PLUS the change in the population, to keep spending/citizen constant in real dollars.[/quote]

Funny you mention this, dave. Just last night, I was thinking we should go back to 1997 budget levels.

As much as I defend unions and workers’ rights, there is a significant amount of mismanagement and waste. I just happen to think that unions and workers and NOT the problem, in general. We have a top-heavy administrative model, and too many people who are busy playing politics (with all the very expensive, taxpayer “deals” that entails) instead of watching out for the taxpayers and their constituents, in general.

[CA renter]

Russell,

I think many of us have the same experience WRT poor people — both native and immigrant, legal and illegal. My mother grew up during WWII in very bad circumstances (economically, personally, medically, socially, etc.). Still, she came here and made assimilating into our society her #1 goal while she managed to work her way out of poverty. She never used any “welfare” benefits of any sort, nor did any of her equally poor friends who immigrated around the same time.

If you care about poor people, then you would understand that they are most affected by illegal labor — and that legal immigrants (especially those who come from poor countries) are most affected by our lack of workable immigration policies.

I enjoy low prices, but enjoy higher wages even more. Yes, many Americans are very short-sighted, and fail to see the connection between the low costs they like to pay and the low wages with which they have to compete, but many of us are NOT stupid nor short-sighted.

I would rather pay an extra $2,000 per car so that the people who make that car can have health benefits and solid pension plans. I’d rather pay twice or three times as much for my produce so that the (legal!) farm workers could afford healthcare and live in clean, safe living conditions.

Yes, we need an underclass, but an underclass develops naturally in any society. The question is whether we want to live with a first-world underclass or a third-world underclass.

As many could probably guess from my posts, I’m a rather unabashed socialist (NOT communist — big difference), and specifically advocate for workers’ rights and oppose the concentration of wealth that we’ve been seeing in the past few decades.

We cannot help others unless we first help ourselves. Without a solid middle class, there is nothing to stand in the way of the growing wealth disparity. This is why I feel workers are foolish to rail against unions. If not for those unions, the non-union workers would quickly join the underclass — working for poverty-inducing wages and without worker protections WRT overtime, workplace safety, sick days, holiday pay, etc. Non-union employers have to compete with union employers for those workers, and the wages and benefits (and general quality of life) of non-union employees are raised because of the union workers’ efforts.

Allowing an ever-expanding base of desperate, unskilled, unrepresented workers who come here illegally puts workers — across all categories — at a great disadvantage.

If you care about poor people, you would understand that those of us who oppose illegal immigration are your best allies.

[CA renter]

Russell,

I think many of us have the same experience WRT poor people — both native and immigrant, legal and illegal. My mother grew up during WWII in very bad circumstances (economically, personally, medically, socially, etc.). Still, she came here and made assimilating into our society her #1 goal while she managed to work her way out of poverty. She never used any “welfare” benefits of any sort, nor did any of her equally poor friends who immigrated around the same time.

If you care about poor people, then you would understand that they are most affected by illegal labor — and that legal immigrants (especially those who come from poor countries) are most affected by our lack of workable immigration policies.

I enjoy low prices, but enjoy higher wages even more. Yes, many Americans are very short-sighted, and fail to see the connection between the low costs they like to pay and the low wages with which they have to compete, but many of us are NOT stupid nor short-sighted.

I would rather pay an extra $2,000 per car so that the people who make that car can have health benefits and solid pension plans. I’d rather pay twice or three times as much for my produce so that the (legal!) farm workers could afford healthcare and live in clean, safe living conditions.

Yes, we need an underclass, but an underclass develops naturally in any society. The question is whether we want to live with a first-world underclass or a third-world underclass.

As many could probably guess from my posts, I’m a rather unabashed socialist (NOT communist — big difference), and specifically advocate for workers’ rights and oppose the concentration of wealth that we’ve been seeing in the past few decades.

We cannot help others unless we first help ourselves. Without a solid middle class, there is nothing to stand in the way of the growing wealth disparity. This is why I feel workers are foolish to rail against unions. If not for those unions, the non-union workers would quickly join the underclass — working for poverty-inducing wages and without worker protections WRT overtime, workplace safety, sick days, holiday pay, etc. Non-union employers have to compete with union employers for those workers, and the wages and benefits (and general quality of life) of non-union employees are raised because of the union workers’ efforts.

Allowing an ever-expanding base of desperate, unskilled, unrepresented workers who come here illegally puts workers — across all categories — at a great disadvantage.

If you care about poor people, you would understand that those of us who oppose illegal immigration are your best allies.

[CA renter]

Russell,

I think many of us have the same experience WRT poor people — both native and immigrant, legal and illegal. My mother grew up during WWII in very bad circumstances (economically, personally, medically, socially, etc.). Still, she came here and made assimilating into our society her #1 goal while she managed to work her way out of poverty. She never used any “welfare” benefits of any sort, nor did any of her equally poor friends who immigrated around the same time.

If you care about poor people, then you would understand that they are most affected by illegal labor — and that legal immigrants (especially those who come from poor countries) are most affected by our lack of workable immigration policies.

I enjoy low prices, but enjoy higher wages even more. Yes, many Americans are very short-sighted, and fail to see the connection between the low costs they like to pay and the low wages with which they have to compete, but many of us are NOT stupid nor short-sighted.

I would rather pay an extra $2,000 per car so that the people who make that car can have health benefits and solid pension plans. I’d rather pay twice or three times as much for my produce so that the (legal!) farm workers could afford healthcare and live in clean, safe living conditions.

Yes, we need an underclass, but an underclass develops naturally in any society. The question is whether we want to live with a first-world underclass or a third-world underclass.

As many could probably guess from my posts, I’m a rather unabashed socialist (NOT communist — big difference), and specifically advocate for workers’ rights and oppose the concentration of wealth that we’ve been seeing in the past few decades.

We cannot help others unless we first help ourselves. Without a solid middle class, there is nothing to stand in the way of the growing wealth disparity. This is why I feel workers are foolish to rail against unions. If not for those unions, the non-union workers would quickly join the underclass — working for poverty-inducing wages and without worker protections WRT overtime, workplace safety, sick days, holiday pay, etc. Non-union employers have to compete with union employers for those workers, and the wages and benefits (and general quality of life) of non-union employees are raised because of the union workers’ efforts.

Allowing an ever-expanding base of desperate, unskilled, unrepresented workers who come here illegally puts workers — across all categories — at a great disadvantage.

If you care about poor people, you would understand that those of us who oppose illegal immigration are your best allies.

[CA renter]

Russell,

I think many of us have the same experience WRT poor people — both native and immigrant, legal and illegal. My mother grew up during WWII in very bad circumstances (economically, personally, medically, socially, etc.). Still, she came here and made assimilating into our society her #1 goal while she managed to work her way out of poverty. She never used any “welfare” benefits of any sort, nor did any of her equally poor friends who immigrated around the same time.

If you care about poor people, then you would understand that they are most affected by illegal labor — and that legal immigrants (especially those who come from poor countries) are most affected by our lack of workable immigration policies.

I enjoy low prices, but enjoy higher wages even more. Yes, many Americans are very short-sighted, and fail to see the connection between the low costs they like to pay and the low wages with which they have to compete, but many of us are NOT stupid nor short-sighted.

I would rather pay an extra $2,000 per car so that the people who make that car can have health benefits and solid pension plans. I’d rather pay twice or three times as much for my produce so that the (legal!) farm workers could afford healthcare and live in clean, safe living conditions.

Yes, we need an underclass, but an underclass develops naturally in any society. The question is whether we want to live with a first-world underclass or a third-world underclass.

As many could probably guess from my posts, I’m a rather unabashed socialist (NOT communist — big difference), and specifically advocate for workers’ rights and oppose the concentration of wealth that we’ve been seeing in the past few decades.

We cannot help others unless we first help ourselves. Without a solid middle class, there is nothing to stand in the way of the growing wealth disparity. This is why I feel workers are foolish to rail against unions. If not for those unions, the non-union workers would quickly join the underclass — working for poverty-inducing wages and without worker protections WRT overtime, workplace safety, sick days, holiday pay, etc. Non-union employers have to compete with union employers for those workers, and the wages and benefits (and general quality of life) of non-union employees are raised because of the union workers’ efforts.

Allowing an ever-expanding base of desperate, unskilled, unrepresented workers who come here illegally puts workers — across all categories — at a great disadvantage.

If you care about poor people, you would understand that those of us who oppose illegal immigration are your best allies.

[CA renter]

Russell,

I think many of us have the same experience WRT poor people — both native and immigrant, legal and illegal. My mother grew up during WWII in very bad circumstances (economically, personally, medically, socially, etc.). Still, she came here and made assimilating into our society her #1 goal while she managed to work her way out of poverty. She never used any “welfare” benefits of any sort, nor did any of her equally poor friends who immigrated around the same time.

If you care about poor people, then you would understand that they are most affected by illegal labor — and that legal immigrants (especially those who come from poor countries) are most affected by our lack of workable immigration policies.

I enjoy low prices, but enjoy higher wages even more. Yes, many Americans are very short-sighted, and fail to see the connection between the low costs they like to pay and the low wages with which they have to compete, but many of us are NOT stupid nor short-sighted.

I would rather pay an extra $2,000 per car so that the people who make that car can have health benefits and solid pension plans. I’d rather pay twice or three times as much for my produce so that the (legal!) farm workers could afford healthcare and live in clean, safe living conditions.

Yes, we need an underclass, but an underclass develops naturally in any society. The question is whether we want to live with a first-world underclass or a third-world underclass.

As many could probably guess from my posts, I’m a rather unabashed socialist (NOT communist — big difference), and specifically advocate for workers’ rights and oppose the concentration of wealth that we’ve been seeing in the past few decades.

We cannot help others unless we first help ourselves. Without a solid middle class, there is nothing to stand in the way of the growing wealth disparity. This is why I feel workers are foolish to rail against unions. If not for those unions, the non-union workers would quickly join the underclass — working for poverty-inducing wages and without worker protections WRT overtime, workplace safety, sick days, holiday pay, etc. Non-union employers have to compete with union employers for those workers, and the wages and benefits (and general quality of life) of non-union employees are raised because of the union workers’ efforts.

Allowing an ever-expanding base of desperate, unskilled, unrepresented workers who come here illegally puts workers — across all categories — at a great disadvantage.

If you care about poor people, you would understand that those of us who oppose illegal immigration are your best allies.

[NotCranky]

How can you say I don’t care about poor people just because I disagree with some of your views, most of which disagreement,I suppose, comes from varying opinions about nationalism and other stratification issues that we have not even begun to touch on? We are probably going to disagree on those things for eternity and it does not make me care less. Further more, I am concerned about the poor at this specific moment in time and voicing those concerns, not figuring out how to care about the poor after some abstract socialism is perfected.

[NotCranky]

How can you say I don’t care about poor people just because I disagree with some of your views, most of which disagreement,I suppose, comes from varying opinions about nationalism and other stratification issues that we have not even begun to touch on? We are probably going to disagree on those things for eternity and it does not make me care less. Further more, I am concerned about the poor at this specific moment in time and voicing those concerns, not figuring out how to care about the poor after some abstract socialism is perfected.

[NotCranky]

How can you say I don’t care about poor people just because I disagree with some of your views, most of which disagreement,I suppose, comes from varying opinions about nationalism and other stratification issues that we have not even begun to touch on? We are probably going to disagree on those things for eternity and it does not make me care less. Further more, I am concerned about the poor at this specific moment in time and voicing those concerns, not figuring out how to care about the poor after some abstract socialism is perfected.

[NotCranky]

How can you say I don’t care about poor people just because I disagree with some of your views, most of which disagreement,I suppose, comes from varying opinions about nationalism and other stratification issues that we have not even begun to touch on? We are probably going to disagree on those things for eternity and it does not make me care less. Further more, I am concerned about the poor at this specific moment in time and voicing those concerns, not figuring out how to care about the poor after some abstract socialism is perfected.

[NotCranky]

How can you say I don’t care about poor people just because I disagree with some of your views, most of which disagreement,I suppose, comes from varying opinions about nationalism and other stratification issues that we have not even begun to touch on? We are probably going to disagree on those things for eternity and it does not make me care less. Further more, I am concerned about the poor at this specific moment in time and voicing those concerns, not figuring out how to care about the poor after some abstract socialism is perfected.

[CA renter]

[quote=Russell]How can you say I don’t care about poor people just because I disagree with some of your views, most of which disagreement,I suppose, comes from varying opinions about nationalism and other stratification issues that we have not even begun to touch on? We are probably going to disagree on those things for eternity and it does not make me care less. Further more, I am concerned about the poor at this specific moment in time and voicing those concerns, not figuring out how to care about the poor after some abstract socialism is perfected.

[/quote]

It’s not abstract socialism, and that middle class already exists — though it is faltering, largely because of the outsourcing jobs/insourcing labor that we’ve been experiencing.

If we carefully integrate legal immigrants into our society, and guard workers’ rights, then they too can enjoy a higher quality of life and the ability to work their way up the ladder. With the massive, unchecked immigration of exceedingly poor and desperate people, new (legal!) immigrants will be fighting against a rising tide, and will be far less likely to improve their living conditions over time.

Instead of raising everybody up, what you are advocating will eventually bring everybody down, IMHO.

BTW, I’m talking about poor people TODAY who will benefit if they are not competing with people who will work for a tiny fraction of their wages.

[CA renter]

[quote=Russell]How can you say I don’t care about poor people just because I disagree with some of your views, most of which disagreement,I suppose, comes from varying opinions about nationalism and other stratification issues that we have not even begun to touch on? We are probably going to disagree on those things for eternity and it does not make me care less. Further more, I am concerned about the poor at this specific moment in time and voicing those concerns, not figuring out how to care about the poor after some abstract socialism is perfected.

[/quote]

It’s not abstract socialism, and that middle class already exists — though it is faltering, largely because of the outsourcing jobs/insourcing labor that we’ve been experiencing.

If we carefully integrate legal immigrants into our society, and guard workers’ rights, then they too can enjoy a higher quality of life and the ability to work their way up the ladder. With the massive, unchecked immigration of exceedingly poor and desperate people, new (legal!) immigrants will be fighting against a rising tide, and will be far less likely to improve their living conditions over time.

Instead of raising everybody up, what you are advocating will eventually bring everybody down, IMHO.

BTW, I’m talking about poor people TODAY who will benefit if they are not competing with people who will work for a tiny fraction of their wages.

[CA renter]

[quote=Russell]How can you say I don’t care about poor people just because I disagree with some of your views, most of which disagreement,I suppose, comes from varying opinions about nationalism and other stratification issues that we have not even begun to touch on? We are probably going to disagree on those things for eternity and it does not make me care less. Further more, I am concerned about the poor at this specific moment in time and voicing those concerns, not figuring out how to care about the poor after some abstract socialism is perfected.

[/quote]

It’s not abstract socialism, and that middle class already exists — though it is faltering, largely because of the outsourcing jobs/insourcing labor that we’ve been experiencing.

If we carefully integrate legal immigrants into our society, and guard workers’ rights, then they too can enjoy a higher quality of life and the ability to work their way up the ladder. With the massive, unchecked immigration of exceedingly poor and desperate people, new (legal!) immigrants will be fighting against a rising tide, and will be far less likely to improve their living conditions over time.

Instead of raising everybody up, what you are advocating will eventually bring everybody down, IMHO.

BTW, I’m talking about poor people TODAY who will benefit if they are not competing with people who will work for a tiny fraction of their wages.

[CA renter]

[quote=Russell]How can you say I don’t care about poor people just because I disagree with some of your views, most of which disagreement,I suppose, comes from varying opinions about nationalism and other stratification issues that we have not even begun to touch on? We are probably going to disagree on those things for eternity and it does not make me care less. Further more, I am concerned about the poor at this specific moment in time and voicing those concerns, not figuring out how to care about the poor after some abstract socialism is perfected.

[/quote]

It’s not abstract socialism, and that middle class already exists — though it is faltering, largely because of the outsourcing jobs/insourcing labor that we’ve been experiencing.

If we carefully integrate legal immigrants into our society, and guard workers’ rights, then they too can enjoy a higher quality of life and the ability to work their way up the ladder. With the massive, unchecked immigration of exceedingly poor and desperate people, new (legal!) immigrants will be fighting against a rising tide, and will be far less likely to improve their living conditions over time.

Instead of raising everybody up, what you are advocating will eventually bring everybody down, IMHO.

BTW, I’m talking about poor people TODAY who will benefit if they are not competing with people who will work for a tiny fraction of their wages.

[Author]

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