How to Buy w/out a Realtor?

[Anonymous]

Actually sdr I paid 3.9% not 4.9 (.9% to my agent and 3% to buyers agent). That saved a few grand so I’ll take it. But my point was that if the buyers came without an agent, could have saved a LOT more.

The problem is the dumbass public who insists on using traditional realtors. If the sellers had any common sense and used discount realtors, then there would be a real advantage to coming in as a buyer without an agent.

[CA renter]

[quote=SD Realtor]Seems like threads like this recur every year or so. I have stayed out of this one because it is no use arguing. Some people do find value in having representation and some do not. Obviously individual levels of real estate knowledge vary with each buyer.

One thing that those who argue against the usefulness of a buyers agent do not understand is the simple numbers game with the experiences. Each of you may have bought a home or two without an agent. However the simple number of transactions a good agent is involved in tend to give that agent more experience overall in the process. Could that experience have helped you? Maybe and maybe not? I have recently been involved in a renovation and everything I watched the contractors do, I know I could have done. However it would have taken me awhile longer and I would have screwed up something in the process and had to redo it. I tried that with the sprinkler system, I did it, I screwed some stuff out, tore it out and fixed it and now it works. What took me about 4 days would have taken and expert with a crew 1 day. It is done though. Again, I think agency is devalued because the skill level of many agents is subpar at best.

We all know real estate is not brain surgery. That is not the argument here. Also as many of you hope for a change in the establishment of how real estate transactions occur, I don’t really see that happening. Maybe it will, but to much money to be lost by the rich guys.

From my perspective of reading the threads it seems like those who have had success without an agent feel that calling for an end to agency is correct for EVERYONE and I don’t see it that way. I think the real problem is that most agents are indeed boobs. As an electrical engineer agency is like childs play from an intelligence standpoint however the skills needed to be a good agent are vastly underated. They are two-fold and involve people skills and experience. I will say for sure sure sure that you experience level including the number or transactions and the number of agents you work with will help. I know of at least 3 transactions where I got my buyers offers accepted because I had worked with the listing agents before AND I was able to advise my clients on what they needed to do to get over the top in the multiple counters they were in. The same is true for identifying which agents suck,

To me, that does add value but to many of you it does not and that is okay by me. I am not going to say your purchases will or will not work out because THAT IS IMPOSSIBLE to prognosticate and I tend to try to follow logic.

So I guess my answer is that it is all in the eye of the beholder, and every case varies. As far as the 6% stuff goes that is all crap. Any poster who whines about that has not done any homework at all. There are plenty of options out there for both buyers and sellers to save on commissions and there have been these options for quite a long time. Conversely, as many hoped these would become mainstream vehicles for the market, they have not and I doubt they will. However SOME OF THEM are great opportunities for people to save money and still get top notch service.[/quote]

Great post, SDR. Agree 100%.

BTW, I think it’s instructive to keep in mind that the posters we see here on this site are not your typical buyers. For the most part, Pigg posters are very much in tune with what’s going on in their local markets, and they could very well be better informed than a majority of the agents who work in their communities (the well-established, long-time agents, notwithstanding).

I’ll also add that I come from a family of brokers and investors (and DH from parents who worked in commercial RE), so have been exposed to real estate my entire life. We’ve been following the housing market for many, many years, and actively look at houses, lots, new developments, talk to people in the industry, gauge buyer traffic, seller expectations, etc., in addition to doing computer research. I think most other posters also come here with more background RE knowledge than the average buyer, so the philosophy of Pigg buyers would naturally differ from more “normal” buyers who only pay attention to RE when they want to move, or to keep tabs on how much “equity” they’ve made that month.

It’s surprising to me how little most people know about real estate, and I would NEVER encourage someone to go it alone if they didn’t really understand what they were getting into. Even then, I would always advise them to use an attorney if they aren’t using an agent.

[CA renter]

[quote=SD Realtor]Seems like threads like this recur every year or so. I have stayed out of this one because it is no use arguing. Some people do find value in having representation and some do not. Obviously individual levels of real estate knowledge vary with each buyer.

One thing that those who argue against the usefulness of a buyers agent do not understand is the simple numbers game with the experiences. Each of you may have bought a home or two without an agent. However the simple number of transactions a good agent is involved in tend to give that agent more experience overall in the process. Could that experience have helped you? Maybe and maybe not? I have recently been involved in a renovation and everything I watched the contractors do, I know I could have done. However it would have taken me awhile longer and I would have screwed up something in the process and had to redo it. I tried that with the sprinkler system, I did it, I screwed some stuff out, tore it out and fixed it and now it works. What took me about 4 days would have taken and expert with a crew 1 day. It is done though. Again, I think agency is devalued because the skill level of many agents is subpar at best.

We all know real estate is not brain surgery. That is not the argument here. Also as many of you hope for a change in the establishment of how real estate transactions occur, I don’t really see that happening. Maybe it will, but to much money to be lost by the rich guys.

From my perspective of reading the threads it seems like those who have had success without an agent feel that calling for an end to agency is correct for EVERYONE and I don’t see it that way. I think the real problem is that most agents are indeed boobs. As an electrical engineer agency is like childs play from an intelligence standpoint however the skills needed to be a good agent are vastly underated. They are two-fold and involve people skills and experience. I will say for sure sure sure that you experience level including the number or transactions and the number of agents you work with will help. I know of at least 3 transactions where I got my buyers offers accepted because I had worked with the listing agents before AND I was able to advise my clients on what they needed to do to get over the top in the multiple counters they were in. The same is true for identifying which agents suck,

To me, that does add value but to many of you it does not and that is okay by me. I am not going to say your purchases will or will not work out because THAT IS IMPOSSIBLE to prognosticate and I tend to try to follow logic.

So I guess my answer is that it is all in the eye of the beholder, and every case varies. As far as the 6% stuff goes that is all crap. Any poster who whines about that has not done any homework at all. There are plenty of options out there for both buyers and sellers to save on commissions and there have been these options for quite a long time. Conversely, as many hoped these would become mainstream vehicles for the market, they have not and I doubt they will. However SOME OF THEM are great opportunities for people to save money and still get top notch service.[/quote]

Great post, SDR. Agree 100%.

BTW, I think it’s instructive to keep in mind that the posters we see here on this site are not your typical buyers. For the most part, Pigg posters are very much in tune with what’s going on in their local markets, and they could very well be better informed than a majority of the agents who work in their communities (the well-established, long-time agents, notwithstanding).

I’ll also add that I come from a family of brokers and investors (and DH from parents who worked in commercial RE), so have been exposed to real estate my entire life. We’ve been following the housing market for many, many years, and actively look at houses, lots, new developments, talk to people in the industry, gauge buyer traffic, seller expectations, etc., in addition to doing computer research. I think most other posters also come here with more background RE knowledge than the average buyer, so the philosophy of Pigg buyers would naturally differ from more “normal” buyers who only pay attention to RE when they want to move, or to keep tabs on how much “equity” they’ve made that month.

It’s surprising to me how little most people know about real estate, and I would NEVER encourage someone to go it alone if they didn’t really understand what they were getting into. Even then, I would always advise them to use an attorney if they aren’t using an agent.

[CA renter]

[quote=SD Realtor]Seems like threads like this recur every year or so. I have stayed out of this one because it is no use arguing. Some people do find value in having representation and some do not. Obviously individual levels of real estate knowledge vary with each buyer.

One thing that those who argue against the usefulness of a buyers agent do not understand is the simple numbers game with the experiences. Each of you may have bought a home or two without an agent. However the simple number of transactions a good agent is involved in tend to give that agent more experience overall in the process. Could that experience have helped you? Maybe and maybe not? I have recently been involved in a renovation and everything I watched the contractors do, I know I could have done. However it would have taken me awhile longer and I would have screwed up something in the process and had to redo it. I tried that with the sprinkler system, I did it, I screwed some stuff out, tore it out and fixed it and now it works. What took me about 4 days would have taken and expert with a crew 1 day. It is done though. Again, I think agency is devalued because the skill level of many agents is subpar at best.

We all know real estate is not brain surgery. That is not the argument here. Also as many of you hope for a change in the establishment of how real estate transactions occur, I don’t really see that happening. Maybe it will, but to much money to be lost by the rich guys.

From my perspective of reading the threads it seems like those who have had success without an agent feel that calling for an end to agency is correct for EVERYONE and I don’t see it that way. I think the real problem is that most agents are indeed boobs. As an electrical engineer agency is like childs play from an intelligence standpoint however the skills needed to be a good agent are vastly underated. They are two-fold and involve people skills and experience. I will say for sure sure sure that you experience level including the number or transactions and the number of agents you work with will help. I know of at least 3 transactions where I got my buyers offers accepted because I had worked with the listing agents before AND I was able to advise my clients on what they needed to do to get over the top in the multiple counters they were in. The same is true for identifying which agents suck,

To me, that does add value but to many of you it does not and that is okay by me. I am not going to say your purchases will or will not work out because THAT IS IMPOSSIBLE to prognosticate and I tend to try to follow logic.

So I guess my answer is that it is all in the eye of the beholder, and every case varies. As far as the 6% stuff goes that is all crap. Any poster who whines about that has not done any homework at all. There are plenty of options out there for both buyers and sellers to save on commissions and there have been these options for quite a long time. Conversely, as many hoped these would become mainstream vehicles for the market, they have not and I doubt they will. However SOME OF THEM are great opportunities for people to save money and still get top notch service.[/quote]

Great post, SDR. Agree 100%.

BTW, I think it’s instructive to keep in mind that the posters we see here on this site are not your typical buyers. For the most part, Pigg posters are very much in tune with what’s going on in their local markets, and they could very well be better informed than a majority of the agents who work in their communities (the well-established, long-time agents, notwithstanding).

I’ll also add that I come from a family of brokers and investors (and DH from parents who worked in commercial RE), so have been exposed to real estate my entire life. We’ve been following the housing market for many, many years, and actively look at houses, lots, new developments, talk to people in the industry, gauge buyer traffic, seller expectations, etc., in addition to doing computer research. I think most other posters also come here with more background RE knowledge than the average buyer, so the philosophy of Pigg buyers would naturally differ from more “normal” buyers who only pay attention to RE when they want to move, or to keep tabs on how much “equity” they’ve made that month.

It’s surprising to me how little most people know about real estate, and I would NEVER encourage someone to go it alone if they didn’t really understand what they were getting into. Even then, I would always advise them to use an attorney if they aren’t using an agent.

[CA renter]

[quote=SD Realtor]Seems like threads like this recur every year or so. I have stayed out of this one because it is no use arguing. Some people do find value in having representation and some do not. Obviously individual levels of real estate knowledge vary with each buyer.

One thing that those who argue against the usefulness of a buyers agent do not understand is the simple numbers game with the experiences. Each of you may have bought a home or two without an agent. However the simple number of transactions a good agent is involved in tend to give that agent more experience overall in the process. Could that experience have helped you? Maybe and maybe not? I have recently been involved in a renovation and everything I watched the contractors do, I know I could have done. However it would have taken me awhile longer and I would have screwed up something in the process and had to redo it. I tried that with the sprinkler system, I did it, I screwed some stuff out, tore it out and fixed it and now it works. What took me about 4 days would have taken and expert with a crew 1 day. It is done though. Again, I think agency is devalued because the skill level of many agents is subpar at best.

We all know real estate is not brain surgery. That is not the argument here. Also as many of you hope for a change in the establishment of how real estate transactions occur, I don’t really see that happening. Maybe it will, but to much money to be lost by the rich guys.

From my perspective of reading the threads it seems like those who have had success without an agent feel that calling for an end to agency is correct for EVERYONE and I don’t see it that way. I think the real problem is that most agents are indeed boobs. As an electrical engineer agency is like childs play from an intelligence standpoint however the skills needed to be a good agent are vastly underated. They are two-fold and involve people skills and experience. I will say for sure sure sure that you experience level including the number or transactions and the number of agents you work with will help. I know of at least 3 transactions where I got my buyers offers accepted because I had worked with the listing agents before AND I was able to advise my clients on what they needed to do to get over the top in the multiple counters they were in. The same is true for identifying which agents suck,

To me, that does add value but to many of you it does not and that is okay by me. I am not going to say your purchases will or will not work out because THAT IS IMPOSSIBLE to prognosticate and I tend to try to follow logic.

So I guess my answer is that it is all in the eye of the beholder, and every case varies. As far as the 6% stuff goes that is all crap. Any poster who whines about that has not done any homework at all. There are plenty of options out there for both buyers and sellers to save on commissions and there have been these options for quite a long time. Conversely, as many hoped these would become mainstream vehicles for the market, they have not and I doubt they will. However SOME OF THEM are great opportunities for people to save money and still get top notch service.[/quote]

Great post, SDR. Agree 100%.

BTW, I think it’s instructive to keep in mind that the posters we see here on this site are not your typical buyers. For the most part, Pigg posters are very much in tune with what’s going on in their local markets, and they could very well be better informed than a majority of the agents who work in their communities (the well-established, long-time agents, notwithstanding).

I’ll also add that I come from a family of brokers and investors (and DH from parents who worked in commercial RE), so have been exposed to real estate my entire life. We’ve been following the housing market for many, many years, and actively look at houses, lots, new developments, talk to people in the industry, gauge buyer traffic, seller expectations, etc., in addition to doing computer research. I think most other posters also come here with more background RE knowledge than the average buyer, so the philosophy of Pigg buyers would naturally differ from more “normal” buyers who only pay attention to RE when they want to move, or to keep tabs on how much “equity” they’ve made that month.

It’s surprising to me how little most people know about real estate, and I would NEVER encourage someone to go it alone if they didn’t really understand what they were getting into. Even then, I would always advise them to use an attorney if they aren’t using an agent.

[CA renter]

[quote=SD Realtor]Seems like threads like this recur every year or so. I have stayed out of this one because it is no use arguing. Some people do find value in having representation and some do not. Obviously individual levels of real estate knowledge vary with each buyer.

One thing that those who argue against the usefulness of a buyers agent do not understand is the simple numbers game with the experiences. Each of you may have bought a home or two without an agent. However the simple number of transactions a good agent is involved in tend to give that agent more experience overall in the process. Could that experience have helped you? Maybe and maybe not? I have recently been involved in a renovation and everything I watched the contractors do, I know I could have done. However it would have taken me awhile longer and I would have screwed up something in the process and had to redo it. I tried that with the sprinkler system, I did it, I screwed some stuff out, tore it out and fixed it and now it works. What took me about 4 days would have taken and expert with a crew 1 day. It is done though. Again, I think agency is devalued because the skill level of many agents is subpar at best.

We all know real estate is not brain surgery. That is not the argument here. Also as many of you hope for a change in the establishment of how real estate transactions occur, I don’t really see that happening. Maybe it will, but to much money to be lost by the rich guys.

From my perspective of reading the threads it seems like those who have had success without an agent feel that calling for an end to agency is correct for EVERYONE and I don’t see it that way. I think the real problem is that most agents are indeed boobs. As an electrical engineer agency is like childs play from an intelligence standpoint however the skills needed to be a good agent are vastly underated. They are two-fold and involve people skills and experience. I will say for sure sure sure that you experience level including the number or transactions and the number of agents you work with will help. I know of at least 3 transactions where I got my buyers offers accepted because I had worked with the listing agents before AND I was able to advise my clients on what they needed to do to get over the top in the multiple counters they were in. The same is true for identifying which agents suck,

To me, that does add value but to many of you it does not and that is okay by me. I am not going to say your purchases will or will not work out because THAT IS IMPOSSIBLE to prognosticate and I tend to try to follow logic.

So I guess my answer is that it is all in the eye of the beholder, and every case varies. As far as the 6% stuff goes that is all crap. Any poster who whines about that has not done any homework at all. There are plenty of options out there for both buyers and sellers to save on commissions and there have been these options for quite a long time. Conversely, as many hoped these would become mainstream vehicles for the market, they have not and I doubt they will. However SOME OF THEM are great opportunities for people to save money and still get top notch service.[/quote]

Great post, SDR. Agree 100%.

BTW, I think it’s instructive to keep in mind that the posters we see here on this site are not your typical buyers. For the most part, Pigg posters are very much in tune with what’s going on in their local markets, and they could very well be better informed than a majority of the agents who work in their communities (the well-established, long-time agents, notwithstanding).

I’ll also add that I come from a family of brokers and investors (and DH from parents who worked in commercial RE), so have been exposed to real estate my entire life. We’ve been following the housing market for many, many years, and actively look at houses, lots, new developments, talk to people in the industry, gauge buyer traffic, seller expectations, etc., in addition to doing computer research. I think most other posters also come here with more background RE knowledge than the average buyer, so the philosophy of Pigg buyers would naturally differ from more “normal” buyers who only pay attention to RE when they want to move, or to keep tabs on how much “equity” they’ve made that month.

It’s surprising to me how little most people know about real estate, and I would NEVER encourage someone to go it alone if they didn’t really understand what they were getting into. Even then, I would always advise them to use an attorney if they aren’t using an agent.

[bearishgurl]

[quote=matt-waiting]Thanks bearishgirl. I will contact you when I am looking for a paralegal/part time RE agent, who refuses to accept that a 1.5% rebate has the same result as saving on “commission.”

If I decide to to buy in the land of delusion, I will ask for your local expertise.[/quote]

That’s fine, Matt. I don’t currently work as a RE agent. Why don’t you go find yourself a nice, green newbie discount agent and after your transaction is over and you are paid your split, ring us up here in Pigg-Land and let us know how it all went ;=)

[bearishgurl]

[quote=matt-waiting]Thanks bearishgirl. I will contact you when I am looking for a paralegal/part time RE agent, who refuses to accept that a 1.5% rebate has the same result as saving on “commission.”

If I decide to to buy in the land of delusion, I will ask for your local expertise.[/quote]

That’s fine, Matt. I don’t currently work as a RE agent. Why don’t you go find yourself a nice, green newbie discount agent and after your transaction is over and you are paid your split, ring us up here in Pigg-Land and let us know how it all went ;=)

[bearishgurl]

[quote=matt-waiting]Thanks bearishgirl. I will contact you when I am looking for a paralegal/part time RE agent, who refuses to accept that a 1.5% rebate has the same result as saving on “commission.”

If I decide to to buy in the land of delusion, I will ask for your local expertise.[/quote]

That’s fine, Matt. I don’t currently work as a RE agent. Why don’t you go find yourself a nice, green newbie discount agent and after your transaction is over and you are paid your split, ring us up here in Pigg-Land and let us know how it all went ;=)

[bearishgurl]

[quote=matt-waiting]Thanks bearishgirl. I will contact you when I am looking for a paralegal/part time RE agent, who refuses to accept that a 1.5% rebate has the same result as saving on “commission.”

If I decide to to buy in the land of delusion, I will ask for your local expertise.[/quote]

That’s fine, Matt. I don’t currently work as a RE agent. Why don’t you go find yourself a nice, green newbie discount agent and after your transaction is over and you are paid your split, ring us up here in Pigg-Land and let us know how it all went ;=)

[bearishgurl]

[quote=matt-waiting]Thanks bearishgirl. I will contact you when I am looking for a paralegal/part time RE agent, who refuses to accept that a 1.5% rebate has the same result as saving on “commission.”

If I decide to to buy in the land of delusion, I will ask for your local expertise.[/quote]

That’s fine, Matt. I don’t currently work as a RE agent. Why don’t you go find yourself a nice, green newbie discount agent and after your transaction is over and you are paid your split, ring us up here in Pigg-Land and let us know how it all went ;=)

[NotCranky]

The funny thing about these threads is that they are against using a realtor. Then the Realtors get to use it to showcase themselves and have some of their fans stand up for them. The technicalities of how to go it alone currently or in the future are rarely discussed.

I don’t agree that there are not enough intelligent people to create some mass to drive a well planned alternate system.
The system was not challenged much by the discounters in any fashion that would make DIY easier, so that really doesn’t matter. Those systems don’t circumvent the MLS, lock boxes ect.

Technology could be used to safely allow registration of buyers to access sellers/houses without an agent. Many other for profit things could be done to facilitate self service. Saying it can’t happen doesn’t make any sense. Sellers could then list to “safe” services themselves, assured that registered unrepresented buyers would be approaching them.Maybe being pre qualified for a loan or showing sufficient funds could be a requirement to register. Other facets are easily arranged and people could pay for the actual assistance they receive and not for all the time and money Realtors waste chasing around deals,holding listings they don’t sell,schmoozing etc. Changes could occur to make it much easier to do without an agent for sellers and buyers than it currently is…again I think there are plenty of people smart enough for this and the enabled open market could motivate more to come up to speed.

[NotCranky]

The funny thing about these threads is that they are against using a realtor. Then the Realtors get to use it to showcase themselves and have some of their fans stand up for them. The technicalities of how to go it alone currently or in the future are rarely discussed.

I don’t agree that there are not enough intelligent people to create some mass to drive a well planned alternate system.
The system was not challenged much by the discounters in any fashion that would make DIY easier, so that really doesn’t matter. Those systems don’t circumvent the MLS, lock boxes ect.

Technology could be used to safely allow registration of buyers to access sellers/houses without an agent. Many other for profit things could be done to facilitate self service. Saying it can’t happen doesn’t make any sense. Sellers could then list to “safe” services themselves, assured that registered unrepresented buyers would be approaching them.Maybe being pre qualified for a loan or showing sufficient funds could be a requirement to register. Other facets are easily arranged and people could pay for the actual assistance they receive and not for all the time and money Realtors waste chasing around deals,holding listings they don’t sell,schmoozing etc. Changes could occur to make it much easier to do without an agent for sellers and buyers than it currently is…again I think there are plenty of people smart enough for this and the enabled open market could motivate more to come up to speed.

[NotCranky]

The funny thing about these threads is that they are against using a realtor. Then the Realtors get to use it to showcase themselves and have some of their fans stand up for them. The technicalities of how to go it alone currently or in the future are rarely discussed.

I don’t agree that there are not enough intelligent people to create some mass to drive a well planned alternate system.
The system was not challenged much by the discounters in any fashion that would make DIY easier, so that really doesn’t matter. Those systems don’t circumvent the MLS, lock boxes ect.

Technology could be used to safely allow registration of buyers to access sellers/houses without an agent. Many other for profit things could be done to facilitate self service. Saying it can’t happen doesn’t make any sense. Sellers could then list to “safe” services themselves, assured that registered unrepresented buyers would be approaching them.Maybe being pre qualified for a loan or showing sufficient funds could be a requirement to register. Other facets are easily arranged and people could pay for the actual assistance they receive and not for all the time and money Realtors waste chasing around deals,holding listings they don’t sell,schmoozing etc. Changes could occur to make it much easier to do without an agent for sellers and buyers than it currently is…again I think there are plenty of people smart enough for this and the enabled open market could motivate more to come up to speed.

[NotCranky]

The funny thing about these threads is that they are against using a realtor. Then the Realtors get to use it to showcase themselves and have some of their fans stand up for them. The technicalities of how to go it alone currently or in the future are rarely discussed.

I don’t agree that there are not enough intelligent people to create some mass to drive a well planned alternate system.
The system was not challenged much by the discounters in any fashion that would make DIY easier, so that really doesn’t matter. Those systems don’t circumvent the MLS, lock boxes ect.

Technology could be used to safely allow registration of buyers to access sellers/houses without an agent. Many other for profit things could be done to facilitate self service. Saying it can’t happen doesn’t make any sense. Sellers could then list to “safe” services themselves, assured that registered unrepresented buyers would be approaching them.Maybe being pre qualified for a loan or showing sufficient funds could be a requirement to register. Other facets are easily arranged and people could pay for the actual assistance they receive and not for all the time and money Realtors waste chasing around deals,holding listings they don’t sell,schmoozing etc. Changes could occur to make it much easier to do without an agent for sellers and buyers than it currently is…again I think there are plenty of people smart enough for this and the enabled open market could motivate more to come up to speed.

[Author]

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