How much did you pay for solar?

[skerzz]

[quote=svelte]Got 71.1 kwh yesterday with 10.4 kw system.

Let’s see how they compare

6.83 = 71.1/10.4 – svelte
6.66 = 35/5.25 – ocrenter
7.01 = 31.54/4.5 – montana
6.5 = 24.7/3.8 – AN

Montana, looks like you’ve done best so far!

Also interesting that our results are so close together…looks like one can expect between 6.5 and 7 hours of energy on the BEST day of the year…

That’s probably on a crystal clear long day with zero clouds. Worst day will be much harder to compare apples to apples, since clouds will vary over the different homes.[/quote]

On June 2nd my 7.771KW (9KW DC) system produced 58.25 kwh. This was the best day ever (November 2014 install); for comparison, on June 18th, my system generated 57.51kwh. I’m located in San Marcos.

Sullivan Solar System. 36 x Kyocera 250w panels. String inverters, south and west facing install, no shading during day.

[CA renter]

[quote=ocrenter][quote=CA renter]

Good question! It’s 12,800 W DC, and 11,031 W AC. I used AC because when we were sold the system, it was sold as an 11 kW system. It’s also how it’s listed on Sullivan’s site. Would this explain the difference? Not sure how everyone else quoted theirs.

You’re probably right, OCR. If I calculate it based on the DC wattage, it’s more in line with everyone else’s numbers.

Sorry for the confusion, all.

Darn! I was hoping we’d be #1. :)[/quote]

Wow, that’s a huge system! 40 panels?! Did you cover your entire roof? 🙂

I’m surprised Sullivan would advertise and sell in AC, given the rest of the industry all sell in DC and therefore it would appear they would have a pricing disadvantage.[/quote]

Yes, it’s a huge system, but we have the dual pool pump issue — can’t fix that without tearing everything out of the concrete, according to what we were told. Before we moved into this house, we were working on it for a few months and the SDG&E bill on this house when it was empty was about the same as the one for our other house where we were living around the corner; the pool pumps seem to be the culprit, and we will be changing the main pump to a variable speed one when it gives up the ghost.

And after almost two decades of no A/C (we would drive around in our air conditioned car for hours on hot days, which gave us lots of time to look at real estate over those years), we finally got it when we bought this house and use it quite a bit…okay, we use it a lot. Our solar system was designed to cover ~100% of our usage.

[CA renter]

[quote=meadandale]They provide you both numbers, DC and AC-CEC.[/quote]

Yes, both numbers were in the contract details, which I had to break out in order to find the numbers, but the system was sold to us as an 11 kW solar system, and that’s what they have on the monitoring site, too — they don’t even mention the AC wattage on there. It’s strange that they would do this if the other companies are advertising in DC, but I do think that the AC numbers are better for the consumer since that’s what we use.

[CA renter]

[quote=svelte]

Great catch, ocrenter. I suspect everyone was giving their size in DC – I know I was. the revised number for CAR is:

6.8 = 87.31 / 12.8

which brings it right in line with everyone else.

It does sound as if she has 40 panels if she has the 320w Kyoceras.

We have 40 panels also but use the 260w RECs. We’ve got room for 10+ more panels, but it is looking like that won’t be necessary. We’ve been pleased with our performance so far![/quote]

Those numbers make more sense, though it would have been nice to be #1! 😉 I’m still surprised that it’s in line with everyone else’s numbers because of our shade. Would have thought that would have cut our efficiency down by quite a bit, but the trees don’t shade it as much when the sun is at its northernost point. In a couple of months, the trees will probably bring our numbers down.

Yep, 40 panels, and room for more, but we shouldn’t need them, either.

Glad to hear they are working out so well for you, too, svelte.

[an]

[quote=CA renter][quote=svelte]

Great catch, ocrenter. I suspect everyone was giving their size in DC – I know I was. the revised number for CAR is:

6.8 = 87.31 / 12.8

which brings it right in line with everyone else.

It does sound as if she has 40 panels if she has the 320w Kyoceras.

We have 40 panels also but use the 260w RECs. We’ve got room for 10+ more panels, but it is looking like that won’t be necessary. We’ve been pleased with our performance so far![/quote]

Those numbers make more sense, though it would have been nice to be #1! 😉 I’m still surprised that it’s in line with everyone else’s numbers because of our shade. Would have thought that would have cut our efficiency down by quite a bit, but the trees don’t shade it as much when the sun is at its northernost point. In a couple of months, the trees will probably bring our numbers down.

Yep, 40 panels, and room for more, but we shouldn’t need them, either.

Glad to hear they are working out so well for you, too, svelte.[/quote]I’m not sure what inverter and monitoring site you have, but I have Enphase microinverter and their site allow me to see exactly how much each panel make. One of my panel is covered by the chimney around winter time, so I see that one panel is making less than the panel right next to it. But during the summer time, I don’t see that problem, since the sun angle cause the shadow of the chimney not to be any issue.

[an]

This year have been pretty bad for solar production where I’m at. Way too many cloudy days. [img_assist|nid=25381|title=solar production|desc=|link=node|align=left|width=100|height=36]

[svelte]

Wow – that’s quite a difference between Jun and Jan! Jan is about a third of June!

Thanks, it gives me an idea of what to expect.

And yeah looks like 2015 has had more poor days where you’re at.

[ocrenter]

[quote=svelte]Wow – that’s quite a difference between Jun and Jan! Jan is about a third of June!

Thanks, it gives me an idea of what to expect.

And yeah looks like 2015 has had more poor days where you’re at.[/quote]

This is when time-of-use and net metering really shines.

We just banked $172 in credit for the month of June. I’m hoping these banked credit during the summer will make up for the lackluster production during the winter months.

[ocrenter]

[quote=AN]This year have been pretty bad for solar production where I’m at. Way too many cloudy days. [img_assist|nid=25381|title=solar production|desc=|link=node|align=left|width=100|height=36][/quote]

Bad for the pool as well. Even with the cover we are barely breaking 80 degree with the pool temp during July!

[an]

[quote=ocrenter]This is when time-of-use and net metering really shines.

We just banked $172 in credit for the month of June. I’m hoping these banked credit during the summer will make up for the lackluster production during the winter months.[/quote]Do you know if we have to get an EV to switch over to TOU?

[ocrenter]

[quote=AN][quote=ocrenter]This is when time-of-use and net metering really shines.

We just banked $172 in credit for the month of June. I’m hoping these banked credit during the summer will make up for the lackluster production during the winter months.[/quote]Do you know if we have to get an EV to switch over to TOU?[/quote]

I don’t believe so.

You can complete the form online on tge SDGE website. They will ask you for the type of EV. Just put down some random EV. They don’t ask for the vin number.

[svelte]

[quote=AN]It’s crazy how much the Leaf fall in value. You can pick up a Certified pre-owned 2013 Leaf SL with <20k miles for ~$16k. New, they're going for around $30k after tax rebate. 1/2 off in 2 years. I'm seriously thinking of picking up one and switch over to TOU. If I go with a 2012 model, I can pick one with only 26k miles for $10k.[/quote]

Well if they didn't want it to fall, they shouldn't have named it the Leaf. lol.

Used EV prices are getting slammed right now.

https://www.yahoo.com/autos/used-evs-hit-by-plunging-values-could-give-savvy-124255982617.html

An auction company published the following table:

Jul 2015 value / est. Jul 2016 value / % decline

2013 Nissan LEAF SL $14,900 / $7,650 / 48.7%

2012 Mitsu I-MiEV $7,950 / $4,400 / 44.7%

2013 Tesla Model S Perf $74,000 / $52,500 / 28.9%

2013 Chevy Volt $18,600 / $14,800 / 20.4%

2013 Ford Fusion
Energi Titanium $25,600 /$23,100 / 9.8%

[ocrenter]

[quote=svelte][quote=AN]It’s crazy how much the Leaf fall in value. You can pick up a Certified pre-owned 2013 Leaf SL with <20k miles for ~$16k. New, they're going for around $30k after tax rebate. 1/2 off in 2 years. I'm seriously thinking of picking up one and switch over to TOU. If I go with a 2012 model, I can pick one with only 26k miles for $10k.[/quote]

Well if they didn't want it to fall, they shouldn't have named it the Leaf. lol.

Used EV prices are getting slammed right now.

https://www.yahoo.com/autos/used-evs-hit-by-plunging-values-could-give-savvy-124255982617.html

An auction company published the following table:

Jul 2015 value / est. Jul 2016 value / % decline

2013 Nissan LEAF SL $14,900 / $7,650 / 48.7%

2012 Mitsu I-MiEV $7,950 / $4,400 / 44.7%

2013 Tesla Model S Perf $74,000 / $52,500 / 28.9%

2013 Chevy Volt $18,600 / $14,800 / 20.4%

2013 Ford Fusion
Energi Titanium $25,600 /$23,100 / 9.8%[/quote]

Not telling the whole story here.

Take the Nissan LEAF SL 2015 model, selling at average price of $30k on Autotrader. Minus the $10k fed/ca rebate, and you are looking at a $20k car.

2 years old 2013 SL model is at $15k, so that's a slide of $5k in 2 years, or 25%.

A new 2015 Nissan Juke SL is averaging $25k on Autotrader.

The 2 year old 2013 SL model is selling at $19k, essentially at 25% as well.

There's a well known problem with the batteries of the first generation LEAFs from 2011-12, the 2012 SL are averaging for about $10k on Autotrader. Essentially another 25% drop from that 2nd to 3rd year. This is not seen in the Juke as the 2012s are going for about $17.5k. But then the 2012 Juke does not have a known defect.

So can one really use the steep drop seen in the 2012 LEAFs as a guide to anticipate a similar drop with the 2013 LEAFs?

That Mitsubishi MiEV tops out at 60 miles on range, nobody buys it.

Everything else are fairly consistent with standard used car depreciation once accounting for the fed/state rebate.

[svelte]

[quote=ocrenter]

Not telling the whole story here.

Take the Nissan LEAF SL 2015 model, selling at average price of $30k on Autotrader. Minus the $10k fed/ca rebate, and you are looking at a $20k car.
[/quote]

I’m guessing you own or lease a Leaf.

I just did a search of all 2015 Leafs within 25 miles of my house, came up with 98 (that’s a lot!) with an average price of $31.7K. Even if you factor in a $10K rebate, that brings the price to $21.7K.

I did the same check for2013 Leafs, 2015 Jukes and 2013 Jukes.

2015 Leafs (98) – $31.7K average
2013 Leafs (13) – $15.3K average
Average drop: 30% (if rebate factored in)
Average drop: 52% (without factoring rebate)

2015 Jukes (7) – $28.2 average
2013 Jukes (11) = $19.2 average
Average drop: 32%

So from that aspect, you are correct that the Leaf is dropping as much as other small Nissans.

But for some reason you neglected to compare it to the Volt. Within 25 miles of my house:

2015 Volts (96) – $35.3K average
2013 Volts (3) – $20.4K average
Average drop: 19.5% (if rebate factored in)
Average drop: 43% (without factoring rebate)

So the EV with backup gas motor is holding up much better price-wise than the full electric. By a pretty wide margin.

[quote=ocrenter]
2 years old 2013 SL model is at $15k, so that’s a slide of $5k in 2 years, or 25%.

A new 2015 Nissan Juke SL is averaging $25k on Autotrader.

The 2 year old 2013 SL model is selling at $19k, essentially at 25% as well.

There’s a well known problem with the batteries of the first generation LEAFs from 2011-12, the 2012 SL are averaging for about $10k on Autotrader. Essentially another 25% drop from that 2nd to 3rd year. This is not seen in the Juke as the 2012s are going for about $17.5k. But then the 2012 Juke does not have a known defect.

So can one really use the steep drop seen in the 2012 LEAFs as a guide to anticipate a similar drop with the 2013 LEAFs?
[/quote]

Why are you bringing 2012 Leafs up, as the article didn’t say anything about the 2012s being used in the calculation, and they specifically picked the 2013s in their figures.

[quote=ocrenter]
That Mitsubishi MiEV tops out at 60 miles on range, nobody buys it.
[/quote]

I concur that the MiEV really isn’t even in the running. I’m not even sure I’ve ever laid eyes on one.

[ocrenter]

[quote=svelte]

I’m guessing you own or lease a Leaf.

I just did a search of all 2015 Leafs within 25 miles of my house, came up with 98 (that’s a lot!) with an average price of $31.7K. Even if you factor in a $10K rebate, that brings the price to $21.7K.

I did the same check for2013 Leafs, 2015 Jukes and 2013 Jukes.

2015 Leafs (98) – $31.7K average
2013 Leafs (13) – $15.3K average
Average drop: 30% (if rebate factored in)
Average drop: 52% (without factoring rebate)

2015 Jukes (7) – $28.2 average
2013 Jukes (11) = $19.2 average
Average drop: 32%

So from that aspect, you are correct that the Leaf is dropping as much as other small Nissans.

But for some reason you neglected to compare it to the Volt. Within 25 miles of my house:

2015 Volts (96) – $35.3K average
2013 Volts (3) – $20.4K average
Average drop: 19.5% (if rebate factored in)
Average drop: 43% (without factoring rebate)

So the EV with backup gas motor is holding up much better price-wise than the full electric. By a pretty wide margin.

[/quote]

Sorry, I do not have a LEAF. (Reminds me of BG thinking I live in 4S after me making comments about 4S.)

I did not look at the Volt because the article focused more on the near 50% drop forecasted for next year on BEVs in general.

[quote=svelte]

Why are you bringing 2012 Leafs up, as the article didn’t say anything about the 2012s being used in the calculation, and they specifically picked the 2013s in their figures

[/quote]

How do you think they forecasted future depreciation of 2013s for next year?

[Author]

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