Founder Of Reaganomics Says That “Without A Revolution, Americans Are History”

[CA renter]

[quote=SD Realtor]Actually Arraya was correct. An inevitable outcome of capitalism is such that the drive for profits will take no prisoners. The bottom line will always search for the labor force that is the cheapest and globalization fed that drive. Unions are not a bad thing and I think serve a useful purpose. However if there is a labor force that will work for a much lower wage due to a lower standard of living then the unionized labor force then who is at fault here? Pure capitalism dictates you follow the margin and go to the lower salaried work force dont you? Shouldn’t you?

I don’t think there is anyone who is more pro free markets and pro capitalism then me. However pure capitalism has drawbacks and this is one of them. It is a very hard dilema to resolve. CAR I agree with alot of your points and yes I guess placing hefty tax burdens on corps who outsource and manufacture overseas is a POSSIBLE solution. However when does it become protectionist? So if USA company makes a widget overseas for 5 bucks and can sell it in the USA for 20 bucks you say tax the hell out of them for making it overseas correct? Effectively force them to make a decision to continue to make it overseas for 5 bucks, then tax them another 10 bucks for doing that so the profit is only 5 bucks. Or dont tax them if they make it in the USA for 13 bucks so the profit is 7 bucks. So what about the cost of the company to retool back in the USA and all the costs associated with USA employment? Also what about foreign company X who will make the same widget offshore for that same 5 bucks and send it to the USA and undercut the USA company who you effectively forced to stay here? Do you put huge tarrifs on those foreign companies? Do you really think those foreign govts won’t start doing the same thing?

I don’t really have or know of a good solution. It is to f’d up right now. However those who say we can bring back American jobs and bring them back immediately I think are full of it.

Tough problem to solve.[/quote]

SDR,

We are a debtor nation and a net importer now. Protectionism would hurt other countries far more than it would hurt ours. I favor *fair trade* where we trade with other countries that have the same labor and environmental protections (and wages) that we do.

As for the retooling, this is exactly why so many people were opposed to the offshoring in the first place. We HAD the technology and the plants here to manufacture whatever we need. By allowing the corporatists/capitalists to offshore our jobs, we’ve allowed them to destroy our ability to support ourselves.

I have tremendous faith in the American people (as long as we can keep them from being brainwashed). We have some of the most creative, innovative, and flexible workers in the world. We can work our way out of this if we could ever get our politicians out of the capitalists’ pockets.

[Arraya]

Around the turn of the century factory workers were openly communist-socialist. There was also violent clashes between labor and capital. When they were working on abolishing slavery the southern plantation owners argued that slaves had it better than factory workers and they were not too far off. Unions were a defense mechanism to a brutal working environment.

[Arraya]

Around the turn of the century factory workers were openly communist-socialist. There was also violent clashes between labor and capital. When they were working on abolishing slavery the southern plantation owners argued that slaves had it better than factory workers and they were not too far off. Unions were a defense mechanism to a brutal working environment.

[Arraya]

Around the turn of the century factory workers were openly communist-socialist. There was also violent clashes between labor and capital. When they were working on abolishing slavery the southern plantation owners argued that slaves had it better than factory workers and they were not too far off. Unions were a defense mechanism to a brutal working environment.

[Arraya]

Around the turn of the century factory workers were openly communist-socialist. There was also violent clashes between labor and capital. When they were working on abolishing slavery the southern plantation owners argued that slaves had it better than factory workers and they were not too far off. Unions were a defense mechanism to a brutal working environment.

[Arraya]

Around the turn of the century factory workers were openly communist-socialist. There was also violent clashes between labor and capital. When they were working on abolishing slavery the southern plantation owners argued that slaves had it better than factory workers and they were not too far off. Unions were a defense mechanism to a brutal working environment.

[all]

[quote=CA renter]
We are a debtor nation and a net importer now. Protectionism would hurt other countries far more than it would hurt ours. I favor *fair trade* where we trade with other countries that have the same labor and environmental protections (and wages) that we do.
[/quote]

There was a piece on NPR about a company trying to set up a solar power plant in Panoche Valley. Alas, blunt-nosed leopard lizard lives in the valley and the company was forced to spend $7MM (and time) to collect info for the environmental impact study. That just makes no sense – their counterpart in China will cause far more environmental damage producing energy for the Americans.

[quote=CA renter]
I have tremendous faith in the American people (as long as we can keep them from being brainwashed). We have some of the most creative, innovative, and flexible workers in the world. We can work our way out of this if we could ever get our politicians out of the capitalists’ pockets.[/quote]

This is how people in almost any country in the world would describe themselves. In case of the American workers, is the superior creativity and flexibility result of superior genes, superior education&training, harsh living conditions the workers suffered through or something else?

Based on my experience, people are mostly fungible and those who are special in some way are as likely to be American as anything else.

[all]

[quote=CA renter]
We are a debtor nation and a net importer now. Protectionism would hurt other countries far more than it would hurt ours. I favor *fair trade* where we trade with other countries that have the same labor and environmental protections (and wages) that we do.
[/quote]

There was a piece on NPR about a company trying to set up a solar power plant in Panoche Valley. Alas, blunt-nosed leopard lizard lives in the valley and the company was forced to spend $7MM (and time) to collect info for the environmental impact study. That just makes no sense – their counterpart in China will cause far more environmental damage producing energy for the Americans.

[quote=CA renter]
I have tremendous faith in the American people (as long as we can keep them from being brainwashed). We have some of the most creative, innovative, and flexible workers in the world. We can work our way out of this if we could ever get our politicians out of the capitalists’ pockets.[/quote]

This is how people in almost any country in the world would describe themselves. In case of the American workers, is the superior creativity and flexibility result of superior genes, superior education&training, harsh living conditions the workers suffered through or something else?

Based on my experience, people are mostly fungible and those who are special in some way are as likely to be American as anything else.

[all]

[quote=CA renter]
We are a debtor nation and a net importer now. Protectionism would hurt other countries far more than it would hurt ours. I favor *fair trade* where we trade with other countries that have the same labor and environmental protections (and wages) that we do.
[/quote]

There was a piece on NPR about a company trying to set up a solar power plant in Panoche Valley. Alas, blunt-nosed leopard lizard lives in the valley and the company was forced to spend $7MM (and time) to collect info for the environmental impact study. That just makes no sense – their counterpart in China will cause far more environmental damage producing energy for the Americans.

[quote=CA renter]
I have tremendous faith in the American people (as long as we can keep them from being brainwashed). We have some of the most creative, innovative, and flexible workers in the world. We can work our way out of this if we could ever get our politicians out of the capitalists’ pockets.[/quote]

This is how people in almost any country in the world would describe themselves. In case of the American workers, is the superior creativity and flexibility result of superior genes, superior education&training, harsh living conditions the workers suffered through or something else?

Based on my experience, people are mostly fungible and those who are special in some way are as likely to be American as anything else.

[all]

[quote=CA renter]
We are a debtor nation and a net importer now. Protectionism would hurt other countries far more than it would hurt ours. I favor *fair trade* where we trade with other countries that have the same labor and environmental protections (and wages) that we do.
[/quote]

There was a piece on NPR about a company trying to set up a solar power plant in Panoche Valley. Alas, blunt-nosed leopard lizard lives in the valley and the company was forced to spend $7MM (and time) to collect info for the environmental impact study. That just makes no sense – their counterpart in China will cause far more environmental damage producing energy for the Americans.

[quote=CA renter]
I have tremendous faith in the American people (as long as we can keep them from being brainwashed). We have some of the most creative, innovative, and flexible workers in the world. We can work our way out of this if we could ever get our politicians out of the capitalists’ pockets.[/quote]

This is how people in almost any country in the world would describe themselves. In case of the American workers, is the superior creativity and flexibility result of superior genes, superior education&training, harsh living conditions the workers suffered through or something else?

Based on my experience, people are mostly fungible and those who are special in some way are as likely to be American as anything else.

[all]

[quote=CA renter]
We are a debtor nation and a net importer now. Protectionism would hurt other countries far more than it would hurt ours. I favor *fair trade* where we trade with other countries that have the same labor and environmental protections (and wages) that we do.
[/quote]

There was a piece on NPR about a company trying to set up a solar power plant in Panoche Valley. Alas, blunt-nosed leopard lizard lives in the valley and the company was forced to spend $7MM (and time) to collect info for the environmental impact study. That just makes no sense – their counterpart in China will cause far more environmental damage producing energy for the Americans.

[quote=CA renter]
I have tremendous faith in the American people (as long as we can keep them from being brainwashed). We have some of the most creative, innovative, and flexible workers in the world. We can work our way out of this if we could ever get our politicians out of the capitalists’ pockets.[/quote]

This is how people in almost any country in the world would describe themselves. In case of the American workers, is the superior creativity and flexibility result of superior genes, superior education&training, harsh living conditions the workers suffered through or something else?

Based on my experience, people are mostly fungible and those who are special in some way are as likely to be American as anything else.

[teaboy]

It seems to me that other countries with huge deficits(e.g. Greece, UK, etc) have accepted the inevitable decline in their citizen’s relative wealth and have already decided to “tighten their belts” by increasing taxes and reducing spending/services.

It seems common sense to me that we can’t “spend our way out of the deficits” here, so eventually we’ll need to increase taxes and reduce spending/services, too.

Surely the only question is when and how this might come. Will it be over the next 12 months or the next 12 years?
Whatever happens, maybe I’m naive, but I feel like it’ll most likely be a long slow decline than some huge sudden drop. Statements like “hyperinflation” and “worthless [US] currency” in the original article are attention-grabbing exaggerations which are highly unlikely imho and distract from discussions on the more likely occurences.

Perhaps the undue sense of entitlement Americans have is the reason why few politicians are brave or stupid enough to publicly take this stance (i.e. increase taxes and reduce spending/services) today.
Hmm, if so, then my guess is over the next 12 years…

tb

[teaboy]

It seems to me that other countries with huge deficits(e.g. Greece, UK, etc) have accepted the inevitable decline in their citizen’s relative wealth and have already decided to “tighten their belts” by increasing taxes and reducing spending/services.

It seems common sense to me that we can’t “spend our way out of the deficits” here, so eventually we’ll need to increase taxes and reduce spending/services, too.

Surely the only question is when and how this might come. Will it be over the next 12 months or the next 12 years?
Whatever happens, maybe I’m naive, but I feel like it’ll most likely be a long slow decline than some huge sudden drop. Statements like “hyperinflation” and “worthless [US] currency” in the original article are attention-grabbing exaggerations which are highly unlikely imho and distract from discussions on the more likely occurences.

Perhaps the undue sense of entitlement Americans have is the reason why few politicians are brave or stupid enough to publicly take this stance (i.e. increase taxes and reduce spending/services) today.
Hmm, if so, then my guess is over the next 12 years…

tb

[teaboy]

It seems to me that other countries with huge deficits(e.g. Greece, UK, etc) have accepted the inevitable decline in their citizen’s relative wealth and have already decided to “tighten their belts” by increasing taxes and reducing spending/services.

It seems common sense to me that we can’t “spend our way out of the deficits” here, so eventually we’ll need to increase taxes and reduce spending/services, too.

Surely the only question is when and how this might come. Will it be over the next 12 months or the next 12 years?
Whatever happens, maybe I’m naive, but I feel like it’ll most likely be a long slow decline than some huge sudden drop. Statements like “hyperinflation” and “worthless [US] currency” in the original article are attention-grabbing exaggerations which are highly unlikely imho and distract from discussions on the more likely occurences.

Perhaps the undue sense of entitlement Americans have is the reason why few politicians are brave or stupid enough to publicly take this stance (i.e. increase taxes and reduce spending/services) today.
Hmm, if so, then my guess is over the next 12 years…

tb

[teaboy]

It seems to me that other countries with huge deficits(e.g. Greece, UK, etc) have accepted the inevitable decline in their citizen’s relative wealth and have already decided to “tighten their belts” by increasing taxes and reducing spending/services.

It seems common sense to me that we can’t “spend our way out of the deficits” here, so eventually we’ll need to increase taxes and reduce spending/services, too.

Surely the only question is when and how this might come. Will it be over the next 12 months or the next 12 years?
Whatever happens, maybe I’m naive, but I feel like it’ll most likely be a long slow decline than some huge sudden drop. Statements like “hyperinflation” and “worthless [US] currency” in the original article are attention-grabbing exaggerations which are highly unlikely imho and distract from discussions on the more likely occurences.

Perhaps the undue sense of entitlement Americans have is the reason why few politicians are brave or stupid enough to publicly take this stance (i.e. increase taxes and reduce spending/services) today.
Hmm, if so, then my guess is over the next 12 years…

tb

[Author]

Posts