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CA renter.
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October 25, 2011 at 1:32 PM #731298October 25, 2011 at 1:40 PM #731299
an
Participant[quote=CA renter]Just because you belong to a union does not mean that you “think” collectively, nor does it mean that you think everyone should be paid the same regardless of how well they perform.
Belonging to a union means that you **negotiate** with the “gatekeepers” collectively. Since they will ALWAYS have more power than individual workers, the only way for workers to ensure they get their share of the profits is to bargain collectively.[/quote]
You personally might not believe in equal pay regardless of performance, but that’s the typical union mantra, AFAIK. Tying back to housing, I see union in the same light as very strict HOA area like 4S/Del Sur. Sure, you can decorate the interior anyway you like, but try painting your house a color that’s not approved and see what will happen. In a union, if you don’t like the causes the union putting your dues behind, do you have an option to not pay for that contribution?Public union bought the gatekeepers. Us tax payer who are paying for both the union and the gatekeepers don’t have much of a choice in the whole negotiation, do we?
October 25, 2011 at 8:54 PM #731311permabear
ParticipantThis thread is depressing.
Divide and conquer.
Pay no attention to the top sliver avoiding their fair share of taxes, thus shifting the burden to everyone else. http://www.cbpp.org/cms/?fa=view&id=3220
Nope, it’s those union assholes that are after your paycheck.
After the unions are gone… it’s those overpaid [insert decently-paid profession here] assholes that are after your money. Better offshore them to keep Wal-mart prices low.
BTW, if you’re going to quote FDR, you should read the whole thing in context:
“Organizations of Government employees have a logical place in Government affairs.
The desire of Government employees for fair and adequate pay, reasonable hours of work, safe and suitable working conditions, development of opportunities for advancement, facilities for fair and impartial consideration and review of grievances, and other objectives of a proper employee relations policy, is basically no different from that of employees in private industry.”
http://www.dailykos.com/story/2011/02/21/948033/-Wisconsin:-GOP-Lying-About-FDR-Again
October 25, 2011 at 8:55 PM #731312Participantduplicate
October 25, 2011 at 9:45 PM #731314bearishgurl
Participant[quote=CA renter]No, public employees with these pension plans do not participate in Social Security. Even if they had private sector jobs and made SS contributions for the required quarters, their SS benefits are reduced if they get a govt pension.
“If you worked in a job not covered under Social Security; e.g., some federal, state, or local government employment, the pension you get based on that work may reduce your Social Security benefits. Your benefit can be reduced based on one of two provisions.
The first provision, called the Government Pension Offset (GPO), applies only if you receive a government pension and are eligible for Social Security benefits as a spouse or widow(er).
The second provision, called the Windfall Elimination Provision (WEP), affects how we calculate your Social Security retirement or disability benefits if you receive a pension from work not covered by Social Security. We modify the formula used to calculate your benefit amount, giving you a lower Social Security benefit.”
[/quote]
CAR, thank you for “outing” this “offset” here of between 4% and 20% (I believe) of Social Security benefits. This amount is taken from the govm’t worker’s pension every month to prevent “double-dipping.”
see: http://www.ssa.gov/retire2/gpo-calc.htm
It applies to State, County and City workers, as well.
Again, this is another “little understood” practice by “the masses.”
October 25, 2011 at 10:28 PM #731315paramount
Participant[quote=bearishgurl]
Again, this is another “little understood” practice by “the masses.”[/quote]Regardless – and many of the points made by CAR are really academic as well. The bottom line is that gov’t workers by and large have gold plated salaries and benefits – and those of who produce are tired of paying for them when we’re doing all we can to barely stay afloat.
*City Manager of Temecula making as much if not more than the President of the United States
*Lifeguards making making nearly a quarter of a million dollars/year
*Gov’t workers retiring in the their 50’s as millionaires
and on and on….WE’VE HAD ENOUGH!!!!!!!!!!!!
October 25, 2011 at 10:44 PM #731316Participant[quote=ucodegen]@bearishgurl
With respect to foreign paralegals, etc.
India’s second language is English, 3rd language for Filipinos (after Tagalog and Spanish).
It is already happening:
http://www.businessweek.com/magazine/content/06_38/b4001061.htm
Whether this is for better or worse.. dunno.[/quote]Your link refers to ONE CASE, ucodegen. A huge case with a lot of details in which each plaintiff’s claims are culled over and spelled out by a Filipino “paralegal,” lol (of course they are located in the Phillipines). It doesn’t require them to know the local rules, it doesn’t require them to know the particular judge’s “nuances,” it doesn’t require them to be able to determine if particular “US case law” is applicable to the problem at hand.
Do these “Filipino workers” have US paralegal certificates? I think not!
If each claim spells out the facts claimed by each Plaintiff, then WHO CARES if these “writings” are the “King’s English” or not! Who is reading this stuff? I’ll tell you who it is. It is actually lawyers in the US who will decide if each plaintiff, on their own merits, has a case against DuPont. NOT JUDGES!!
Do you think these US lawyers allow their “offshore contract workers” to draft their pleadings, motions and any other work that sees the “light of day?” Think again. LOL . . .!
Thank you for you post, ucodegen. In there, you have your answer.
Detailed clerical work . . . offshore workers can do . . . the “front office work” has to be done by the “local” pros. It is what it is . . . :=]
October 25, 2011 at 11:26 PM #731319Participant[quote=jstoesz] . . . BTW, to all who doubt moving away. MN is winning the day in my family! WIth a few more long drives to Southern California (the last one did not go well), We will never live there again! But I will miss the sailing.[/quote]
Gee, jstoesz, I’m sorry to hear your “north/south” road trips haven’t been “going well.” (I make several “south/north” road trips per year and look forward to them …always!) I sincerely hope you were able to take advantage of the recently heavily discounted “season tix” at Lake Tahoe for the 11/12 skiing season (to take your mind off things). Of course, using that pass would allow you to mingle with all those “wayward, loser young people” snowboarding “bump experts” in “baggy pants up to their nipples” that you would have to contend with on the “slopes,” lol.
see: http://piggington.com/rats
If you haven’t gotten your discounted season ticket yet, I believe it may be past time (check on this).
jstoesz, can you please explain to us “stationary Piggs” here what it was you were complaining about, again? I need a “refresher.” :=)
October 25, 2011 at 11:43 PM #731318Participant[quote=paramount][quote=bearishgurl]
Again, this is another “little understood” practice by “the masses.”[/quote]Regardless – and many of the points made by CAR are really academic as well. The bottom line is that gov’t workers by and large have gold plated salaries and benefits – and those of who produce are tired of paying for them when we’re doing all we can to barely stay afloat.
*City Manager of Temecula making as much if not more than the President of the United States
*Lifeguards making making nearly a quarter of a million dollars/year
*Gov’t workers retiring in the their 50’s as millionaires
and on and on….WE’VE HAD ENOUGH!!!!!!!!!!!![/quote]
paramount, I’m a “retired” (lol) “government worker” “well into my 50’s” who is NOT a “millionaire” (lol) and there are THOUSANDS UPON THOUSANDS MORE LIKE ME!!! HELLO-O-O-O!!!!
Oh, and let me jog your memory that I live and own in CHULA VISTA!!!!, (aargh) the bastion of “undereducated lowlifes” (lol) and full of “substandard schools” (lol again) acc to the “North County majority” on this board.
paramount, why don’t you ask yourself why I’m up at this hour tonite with Piggington lurking in the corner of my screen??
Ans: I have a “Change of Venue” response I’m trying to get out of my face and served in the next 24 hours, lol!
edit: my semi-addiction to Piggington is secondary, of course :={
October 26, 2011 at 12:19 AM #731320Participant[quote=CA renter] . . . All of the things that I don’t want to pay for are far more egregious than paying a bit toward the pension benefits for teachers, firefighters, cops, etc. (which taxpayers do NOT pay for, BTW — the VAST majority of the benefits — around 75% –comes from investment returns, and the rest is shared between employee and employer contributions).
That’s the price of democracy. We ALL have to pay for things we don’t want to pay for. Oftentimes, we are forced to pay for things that we absolutely despise. But if you can think of a better system, feel free to share your ideas.[/quote]
CAR, I’m now thinking that the “masses” don’t really choose to understand how much actually comes from an “entitled” government workers’s paycheck in the form of “mandatory retirement contributions.” It seems like they really “don’t want to know” because a “coveted” (lol) “defined benefit plan” has not been offered to them thru their “private” employer.
To the “masses” in “private employment:”
I urge you to SERVE your 6 to 24 mos of PROBATION in PUBLIC employment (and then AGAIN EVERY TIME you are “promoted” [even for 50 cents per hr] lol). While you are doing so, YOU HAVE (literally and figurately) NO RIGHTS! So BEND OVER!! And GET USED TO IT! Nevermind your “supervisor” who is in charge of your “eval” is grossly incompetent and possesses half your education :={
Remember, it is the HIGHEST one to three YEARS (avg) SALARY that is used for “retirement” calculations so you will need to APPLY FOR THOSE “INTERNAL” PROMOTIONS constantly. Don’t be complacent and complain on internet forums about your “meager” retirement funds! Get going on those lengthy applications for each and every position, Piggs! And all the “releases” you will sign for your “background check” where your “immediate neighbors” will be interviewed. Your future awaits!!!
GOOD LUCK, PIGGS!! (And be sure to make time to post on internet forums during the business day, as your every move is being “tracked,” lol :-]
**********
Good L@rd, I think EVERYBODY should have a chance at a FERS, PERS, CALPERS, SDCERA, SDCERS and related gov’t pensions… let’s open up the “floodgates” and see how many “viable” applicants we get, lol, lol . . . let it roll . . .
October 26, 2011 at 9:56 AM #731333eyePod
ParticipantI for one don’t want to pay higher taxes to continue to pay state workers pensions. That’s just crazy. Also, my point was not “I don’t get a pension so neither should they” (which I didn’t say) although that is a nice way to create a strawman and demonize me. Are you totally out of touch with economics? The private sector discontinued pensions because they could NOT fund them and stay in business. Guess why California is broke? Wake up and smell the coffee.
October 26, 2011 at 10:00 AM #731334ParticipantFilipinos do not speak Spanish, it’s not worth mentioning, at least not if your talking about 2011.
October 26, 2011 at 10:17 AM #731337ParticipantBottom line: Fund your own retirement and don’t expect others to do it for you.
October 26, 2011 at 1:18 PM #731356CDMA ENG
Participant[quote=eyePod]Filipinos do not speak Spanish, it’s not worth mentioning, at least not if your talking about 2011.[/quote]
Wrong. My inlaws were trained since elementary school in spanish. They are not fluent but they do know more words than most people living next to the border. In fact many common words that are used in Tagalog are spanish words.
The Tagalog language including the other dialects use plenty spanish however these days english has replaced spanish in schools but there is some much spanish words in the Tagalog language that it will never be replaced.
CE
October 26, 2011 at 4:22 PM #731361The-Shoveler
Participant[quote=bearishgurl]Good L@rd, I think EVERYBODY should have a chance at a FERS, PERS, CALPERS, SDCERA, SDCERS and related gov’t pensions… let’s open up the “floodgates” and see how many “viable” applicants we get, lol, lol . . . let it roll . . .[/quote]
Now your talking !!,
I always said the only way to ensure that SS stays viable is to make it the only plan available to federal and state employees that is funded and guaranteed by U.S. tax payers.Now we first need to ensure that all State employed residents who pay payroll taxes can participate in these plans and that they pay the exact same percentage the State employees pay, and have the same benefits. I think everyone will support these plans into the future (with enthusiasm even).
Otherwise even though they are by law not able to be defaulted by the state, new laws will be passed eventually (necessity is the mother of invention).
The Mayor of San Jose once said, one day in the not too distant future, there will only be one San Jose city employee, his job will be to pay the pensions of former city employees.
Well there is one other possibility, we could have some inflation. maybe 7 – 8 % for 5 to 10 years. That would probably get us there as well.
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