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Raybyrnes.
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June 26, 2007 at 9:35 PM #62356June 26, 2007 at 9:35 PM #62403
gary_broker
ParticipantAs an engineer in the rocket industry and a 20 year veteran of the RE market (broker and mortgage broker) I sympathize with many of the views posted here. I entered the market thinking 95% of the agents were useless buffoons. It took a while but I found that there are a decent percentage of highly qualified and caring agents out there. Every industry has individuals who are exceptional at what they do…understand that real estate is no different.
One thing many here are missing is that no matter how much homework you do, if you screw up (and even if you don’t sometimes) you will likely be sued. One major reason that many people prefer to use an agent is for their Errors and Omissions insurance (which brings protection to you in the form of deep pockets).
Case in point. My architect knows real estate better than just about anybody I know. He has been designing very upscale houses under his own firm for 25 years. Last year he decided to sell his own home. He found a buyer and was able to close the deal quickly. Nine months later he got a letter from an attorney informing him of mold infestation that was discovered when the new owner tore apart a bathroom while undergoing a major remodel. Basically it was a trumped up charge of failure to disclose. He hired an attorney and decided to fight it as it would have been impossible for him to be aware of the mold unless he had gutted the bathroom himself. The buyers wanted $200K, after three months he was at $20K in legal fees and his attorney’s advised him to settle for $75K. All told it cost him $95K…a very hard pill to swallow (BTW: the house sold for $540K).
As this market continues to turn south (yes.. I am a bear) more people will become upside down in their homes. Folks that bought near the peak will be looking for any way to maintain ownership and suing the seller is easy pickens. Knowing what I know I would never sell real estate in today’s market unrepresented.
June 26, 2007 at 10:04 PM #62366Anonymous
GuestThat’s the best answer yet, gary_broker. No one wants to be sued, any law suit costs money even if you have a realtor. A realtor is like insurance, you probably don’t need it, but it sure helps when you do need it.
June 26, 2007 at 10:04 PM #62413GuestThat’s the best answer yet, gary_broker. No one wants to be sued, any law suit costs money even if you have a realtor. A realtor is like insurance, you probably don’t need it, but it sure helps when you do need it.
June 27, 2007 at 8:18 AM #62416JJGittes
ParticipantI don’t understand gary broker’s point. How would ‘representation’ by a realtor have prevented that lawsuit? And if you think your realtor will jump in the middle and save you in that circumstance, you are dreaming. While there is some utility to having somebody between you and the seller, ultimately it is the homeowner that is on the hook for the disclosures. In fact, once the lawsuits start to fly, your realtor and you will certainly no longer be on the same team. And last time I checked, there is no ‘realtor-client’ privilege in the law.
If you want actual ‘representation’, hire a lawyer.
Gary’s story is a nonsequiter.
June 27, 2007 at 8:18 AM #62463ParticipantI don’t understand gary broker’s point. How would ‘representation’ by a realtor have prevented that lawsuit? And if you think your realtor will jump in the middle and save you in that circumstance, you are dreaming. While there is some utility to having somebody between you and the seller, ultimately it is the homeowner that is on the hook for the disclosures. In fact, once the lawsuits start to fly, your realtor and you will certainly no longer be on the same team. And last time I checked, there is no ‘realtor-client’ privilege in the law.
If you want actual ‘representation’, hire a lawyer.
Gary’s story is a nonsequiter.
June 27, 2007 at 8:19 AM #62418donaldduckmoore
ParticipantHaving a realtor does not mean you are not responsible when the buyer sues. Everyone along the line will get involved if there is a lawsuit.
June 27, 2007 at 8:19 AM #62465ParticipantHaving a realtor does not mean you are not responsible when the buyer sues. Everyone along the line will get involved if there is a lawsuit.
June 27, 2007 at 9:24 AM #62424sdrealtor
ParticipantJJ
The court holds real estate licensee’s to a very high standard of care. Having a realtor wouldnt have prevented that lawsuit. It provides a deep pocket in the form of E&O insurance from which to recover losses.That was Gary’s point.
June 27, 2007 at 9:24 AM #62471ParticipantJJ
The court holds real estate licensee’s to a very high standard of care. Having a realtor wouldnt have prevented that lawsuit. It provides a deep pocket in the form of E&O insurance from which to recover losses.That was Gary’s point.
June 27, 2007 at 9:25 AM #62426NotCranky
ParticipantYou are absoultely right Donald, The agency law in California maintains that the principle is liable for almost everything but the agents “Torts”, Of course in real life good agents, or their brokers, correct the mistakes they make,usually with that big o fat commission. Knock on wood I have never had to. In my experience it is not very easy to get someone in trouble over the small potatoes generally involved in real estate disptutes.If someone is honest they probably don’t even need to carry E&O. I have tried to get help with Cheaters and rule benders, as with most agencies, the DRE is practically lame duck, there are many offenses they will jump on but they don’t referee the buisness. “Somebody has to be smarter and have more integrity than the schmucks you run into out there, as in “a ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure” Most problems are handled, between the parties, by mediation,and by small claims. Mold is a “pet case” ,drummed up by Lawyers probably. There always seems to be one “issue of the day” over which one will be sued to allow lawyers to steal to make a living. In the case discussed here on mold, somebody probably forgot to fill out a “required mold disclosure” and some ambulance chaser jumped on it. Could even have been a dIY seller who got scammed. I say shame on the system and the people who use it for things like this. Disclaimer: CYA
June 27, 2007 at 9:25 AM #62473ParticipantYou are absoultely right Donald, The agency law in California maintains that the principle is liable for almost everything but the agents “Torts”, Of course in real life good agents, or their brokers, correct the mistakes they make,usually with that big o fat commission. Knock on wood I have never had to. In my experience it is not very easy to get someone in trouble over the small potatoes generally involved in real estate disptutes.If someone is honest they probably don’t even need to carry E&O. I have tried to get help with Cheaters and rule benders, as with most agencies, the DRE is practically lame duck, there are many offenses they will jump on but they don’t referee the buisness. “Somebody has to be smarter and have more integrity than the schmucks you run into out there, as in “a ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure” Most problems are handled, between the parties, by mediation,and by small claims. Mold is a “pet case” ,drummed up by Lawyers probably. There always seems to be one “issue of the day” over which one will be sued to allow lawyers to steal to make a living. In the case discussed here on mold, somebody probably forgot to fill out a “required mold disclosure” and some ambulance chaser jumped on it. Could even have been a dIY seller who got scammed. I say shame on the system and the people who use it for things like this. Disclaimer: CYA
June 27, 2007 at 12:11 PM #62484GuestI dont think we need a professional class of people to come between buyers and sellers and foment an adversarial relationship for financial gain. also california law states that only the principals to the transaction actually write the offer. agents do not write offers, they fill in blanks and check off boxes on forms that were written by lawyers. true that agents have learned, hopefully, what all the legal jargon means in real terms but cant we buyers and sellers learn that in a hour of two from some other source and save thousands of dollars on commissions? i think so. also it is not necessary to be an agent to get a commission when you buy property so why would anyone actually want to be an agent anyway? all they really do is send you to a bank and try to get you emotionally involved by “looking” at the property as soon as possible. SFR agents really know nothing about creative financing which in most cases actuallly would be very helpful to both buyers and sellers to be informed about. but agents never ask the right questions and neither do most buyers.
gary jackson
green vine investments
5318 e. second st., #647
long beach, ca 90803-5354June 27, 2007 at 12:11 PM #62531GuestI dont think we need a professional class of people to come between buyers and sellers and foment an adversarial relationship for financial gain. also california law states that only the principals to the transaction actually write the offer. agents do not write offers, they fill in blanks and check off boxes on forms that were written by lawyers. true that agents have learned, hopefully, what all the legal jargon means in real terms but cant we buyers and sellers learn that in a hour of two from some other source and save thousands of dollars on commissions? i think so. also it is not necessary to be an agent to get a commission when you buy property so why would anyone actually want to be an agent anyway? all they really do is send you to a bank and try to get you emotionally involved by “looking” at the property as soon as possible. SFR agents really know nothing about creative financing which in most cases actuallly would be very helpful to both buyers and sellers to be informed about. but agents never ask the right questions and neither do most buyers.
gary jackson
green vine investments
5318 e. second st., #647
long beach, ca 90803-5354June 27, 2007 at 12:22 PM #62486Participant“SFR agents really know nothing about creative financing which in most cases ”
Somehow I think this is your line of work? Forgive me if I am to assuming. Got any hard money for me? -
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