[quote=CA renter]
No, it means that things like the scientific explanation of the origin of the universe and the Biblical explanation are not incompatible. If you could set aside your biases for a moment, read the Biblical version, and then compare it to the scientific version. For many Christians, the Bible is not the actual “word of God” but the telling of the stories of God. Not everything is to be taken literally (such as the earth/universe being created in six Earth days), but if you look at the series of events, they are not out of line with one another. Many people believe that the “days” noted in religious texts simply refer to a period of time.
[/quote]
If you interpret something that outrageously loosely and ignore the parts that don’t match up, then pretty much any story is compatible with the origin of the universe.
[quote=CA renter]
What you seem to miss, zk, is that your belief in the absence of a god/higher power is no different than another person’s belief in the existence of a god/higher power. [/quote]
To believe in an omnipotent, magical being for which there is no evidence is not the same as thinking that the most likely reality is a universe that consists of matter that we can observe and that follows the laws of physics, many of which we can observe and test. We can’t be 100% certain that our observations are correct nor that this matter we appear to be observing actually does exist. But we do have mountains of evidence for it, vs. basically no evidence for an omnipotent being. Why would anyone believe in this omnipotent being? Because they want to. Or because their parents told them to and they’re not very skeptical. Can you think of another reason?
[quote=CA renter]
We DO NOT KNOW what exists outside of our very tiny window of knowledge. To claim that we know, one way or another, is ludicrous.
[/quote]
Who’s claiming to know?
[quote=CA renter]
Our differences seem to lie in the way we think. You seem to think more in terms of black and white, which is why your statements sound more absolute — whether about religion or vaccines, etc. I tend to think much more about all the grey, which is why I so often use terms like “IMHO/IMO,” “it seems,” “I believe,” etc. I will almost never speak in absolutes unless I know something for a fact. This is where you and I differ. [/quote]
I’ve stated in this thread and others that I think nobody knows anything with absolute certainty. But you either ignored or misread that.
[quote=CA renter]
For the record, I am not religious at all. My kids have never stepped foot in a church except for their grandmother’s funeral (not saying that’s either right or wrong). Personally, I’m agnostic and anti-religious because I hate how religion is used to control the masses (which, IMO, is why religion is so dogmatic…it keeps people fighting against one another and creates an easy way for those in power to get people to do what they want). Like scaredy, I acknowledge the benefits of religion in giving people something to help them with their fear of dying or by setting up incentives/disincentives to do the right thing and not do the wrong thing.
[/quote]
Noted for the record. Not sure of its importance.
[quote=CA renter]
But to claim that you KNOW that people who have a different belief system believe in a fantasy — assuming that a lack of evidence is what constitutes a fantasy — then you’re just as guilty as they are.
[/quote]
There you go making stuff up again. It is my opinion that people who believe in an omnipotent being for which there’s no evidence believe in a fantasy. I’ve never presented that as anything but my opinion. I’ve certainly never said I KNOW that they believe in a fantasy.
In any case, there is a lot of evidence for what I think is most likely true. That is not true for believers in gods.
[quote=CA renter]
There are so many things about the universe that we don’t understand — our knowledge is infinitesimally small
[/quote]
I disagree that our knowledge is infinitesimal. While there is a lot we don’t know, there is a lot we do know.
[quote=CA renter]
— we cannot claim one way or another without sounding foolish.
[/quote]
I agree that claiming anything with certainty is foolish. But, for the 11th time, I’m not claiming anything with certainty.
That being said, given the knowledge we do have, to believe in an omnipotent being for which there’s no evidence, and to base your life on it, would not, in almost all cases, happen without a strong desire to do so.
[quote=CA renter]
Are there other intelligent life forms in the universe? Statistically speaking, probably so. Could they be so much more intelligent than we are that if early humans have had contact with them, they might refer to them as a sort of god? As you probably know, there are many examples around the world where primitive people seemed to indicate visitors from space.
[/quote]
A superior intelligence is likely and also completely different from an omnipotent being. Sure, early humans could’ve referred to extraterrestrials as gods. Unless those extraterrestrials actually were gods, they were wrong about that. So I’m not sure what your point is.
[quote=CA renter]
The options are endless. None of us knows anything for a fact, so we all believe in a fantasy of some sort unless we just acknowledge all the possibilities and admit that we do not know.
[/quote]
Right. But how is the guy whose god is Goldie or the guy who has actual, diagnosable paranoid delusions or the guy who took acid living a fantasy any more than a christian or a muslim or the guy who worships zeus or any of the other thousands of gods whom humans have worshiped? There’s no evidence for any of those gods, nor for what the schizophrenic or the drug user sees, and I don’t know how one would say any of those gods or visions is less ludicrous than the others.
