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scaredyclassic.
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May 10, 2010 at 4:14 PM #549940May 10, 2010 at 4:52 PM #548977
bearishgurl
ParticipantThese are people I know right now who were affected:
91914: single mom of 3 (all minors) with toxic loan who was paid $4K to walk away in 12/09. She put about $100K down (divorce settlement) in 2004, but removed over $200K in “equity” since then, paying exorbitant points and fees for her “cash-out” transactions. Property recently sold by bank for about 90% of what she pd. She’s now living with mom again, who is 93, after filing Chapter 7 in 12/09. Education: HS Diploma.
91913: single mom of 2 (1 minor child) still squatting after 20 mos. of no payments, 3.5 yrs. behind on taxes and two HOA liens outstanding. Lost decent job two mos. ago. Purch. in 1998 for $97K but managed to borrow since then $185K more than her home is now worth. Has had “roommate” for four years who pays her monthly “rent.” Education: HS Diploma. Her last “toxic loan” was intended to “avoid foreclosure” but instead mortgage broker made off with $60K of her “cash-out” under a fraudulent investment scheme. Mtg. broker is under investigation by the DA’s office for defrauding nearly 50 people but he laundered some of this $$ into Mexico and lost much of it paying inflated prices for condos in Coronado, which he lost in foreclosure. She and all the other victims met him at a local “church” where he was a very active member.
92104: family of five (2 minor children) parlayed the wife’s family acreage in 91902 (deeded to them in 2002 by her living mom with just $88K owing on it) into an $860K Craftsman in North Park in 2005 with plans to convert to four units. Put just $150K down and made only four mtg. payments. Spent the rest on vehicles and private school. 1st TD (private lender) foreclosed timely at the 7-8 mo. mark. Couple has since filed Chapter 7 (where they had to give up 3 of their vehicles) and divorced. She’s back living with mom. He’s living in rental in dtn. SD. He: HS Diploma; She: HS Dropout.
91910: family of four (2 minor children) pd. $590K in 2006 with nothing down, using purchase $$ first and second. First foreclosed within two years. Unclear how many payments were made. Property sold by bank for $273K in 2009. Both parents had good jobs and were HS graduates.
The reason I am including the educational levels here is not to make fun of anyone (I myself don’t have a college degree) but to illustrate the willingness of lenders to just hand out $$ if you could fog a mirror (not based on “real” income).
After #1 and #2 applied for but had not yet closed on their last “toxic” cash-out refis, they both at different times came to me for advice on their loans. I requested they each bring me their Reg Z’s (GFE’s) and escrow instructions and estimated closing stmts. #1 brought me only the GFE and #2 brought me everything. I strongly advised both of them NOT TO GO THRU with the loan but each of them was dead set on receiving what cash they could from the transaction. When I told each of them they should back out of the transaction immediately, I never heard back from either of them until foreclosure was looming again, at which time I told them I could no longer help them.
Which begs the question? So, who’s the smart money, here? All I can tell you is that I know for a fact they each paid DEARLY with their FICO scores. And as all of you PIGGS are aware, FICO is what makes the world go round.
May 10, 2010 at 4:52 PM #549088ParticipantThese are people I know right now who were affected:
91914: single mom of 3 (all minors) with toxic loan who was paid $4K to walk away in 12/09. She put about $100K down (divorce settlement) in 2004, but removed over $200K in “equity” since then, paying exorbitant points and fees for her “cash-out” transactions. Property recently sold by bank for about 90% of what she pd. She’s now living with mom again, who is 93, after filing Chapter 7 in 12/09. Education: HS Diploma.
91913: single mom of 2 (1 minor child) still squatting after 20 mos. of no payments, 3.5 yrs. behind on taxes and two HOA liens outstanding. Lost decent job two mos. ago. Purch. in 1998 for $97K but managed to borrow since then $185K more than her home is now worth. Has had “roommate” for four years who pays her monthly “rent.” Education: HS Diploma. Her last “toxic loan” was intended to “avoid foreclosure” but instead mortgage broker made off with $60K of her “cash-out” under a fraudulent investment scheme. Mtg. broker is under investigation by the DA’s office for defrauding nearly 50 people but he laundered some of this $$ into Mexico and lost much of it paying inflated prices for condos in Coronado, which he lost in foreclosure. She and all the other victims met him at a local “church” where he was a very active member.
92104: family of five (2 minor children) parlayed the wife’s family acreage in 91902 (deeded to them in 2002 by her living mom with just $88K owing on it) into an $860K Craftsman in North Park in 2005 with plans to convert to four units. Put just $150K down and made only four mtg. payments. Spent the rest on vehicles and private school. 1st TD (private lender) foreclosed timely at the 7-8 mo. mark. Couple has since filed Chapter 7 (where they had to give up 3 of their vehicles) and divorced. She’s back living with mom. He’s living in rental in dtn. SD. He: HS Diploma; She: HS Dropout.
91910: family of four (2 minor children) pd. $590K in 2006 with nothing down, using purchase $$ first and second. First foreclosed within two years. Unclear how many payments were made. Property sold by bank for $273K in 2009. Both parents had good jobs and were HS graduates.
The reason I am including the educational levels here is not to make fun of anyone (I myself don’t have a college degree) but to illustrate the willingness of lenders to just hand out $$ if you could fog a mirror (not based on “real” income).
After #1 and #2 applied for but had not yet closed on their last “toxic” cash-out refis, they both at different times came to me for advice on their loans. I requested they each bring me their Reg Z’s (GFE’s) and escrow instructions and estimated closing stmts. #1 brought me only the GFE and #2 brought me everything. I strongly advised both of them NOT TO GO THRU with the loan but each of them was dead set on receiving what cash they could from the transaction. When I told each of them they should back out of the transaction immediately, I never heard back from either of them until foreclosure was looming again, at which time I told them I could no longer help them.
Which begs the question? So, who’s the smart money, here? All I can tell you is that I know for a fact they each paid DEARLY with their FICO scores. And as all of you PIGGS are aware, FICO is what makes the world go round.
May 10, 2010 at 4:52 PM #549577ParticipantThese are people I know right now who were affected:
91914: single mom of 3 (all minors) with toxic loan who was paid $4K to walk away in 12/09. She put about $100K down (divorce settlement) in 2004, but removed over $200K in “equity” since then, paying exorbitant points and fees for her “cash-out” transactions. Property recently sold by bank for about 90% of what she pd. She’s now living with mom again, who is 93, after filing Chapter 7 in 12/09. Education: HS Diploma.
91913: single mom of 2 (1 minor child) still squatting after 20 mos. of no payments, 3.5 yrs. behind on taxes and two HOA liens outstanding. Lost decent job two mos. ago. Purch. in 1998 for $97K but managed to borrow since then $185K more than her home is now worth. Has had “roommate” for four years who pays her monthly “rent.” Education: HS Diploma. Her last “toxic loan” was intended to “avoid foreclosure” but instead mortgage broker made off with $60K of her “cash-out” under a fraudulent investment scheme. Mtg. broker is under investigation by the DA’s office for defrauding nearly 50 people but he laundered some of this $$ into Mexico and lost much of it paying inflated prices for condos in Coronado, which he lost in foreclosure. She and all the other victims met him at a local “church” where he was a very active member.
92104: family of five (2 minor children) parlayed the wife’s family acreage in 91902 (deeded to them in 2002 by her living mom with just $88K owing on it) into an $860K Craftsman in North Park in 2005 with plans to convert to four units. Put just $150K down and made only four mtg. payments. Spent the rest on vehicles and private school. 1st TD (private lender) foreclosed timely at the 7-8 mo. mark. Couple has since filed Chapter 7 (where they had to give up 3 of their vehicles) and divorced. She’s back living with mom. He’s living in rental in dtn. SD. He: HS Diploma; She: HS Dropout.
91910: family of four (2 minor children) pd. $590K in 2006 with nothing down, using purchase $$ first and second. First foreclosed within two years. Unclear how many payments were made. Property sold by bank for $273K in 2009. Both parents had good jobs and were HS graduates.
The reason I am including the educational levels here is not to make fun of anyone (I myself don’t have a college degree) but to illustrate the willingness of lenders to just hand out $$ if you could fog a mirror (not based on “real” income).
After #1 and #2 applied for but had not yet closed on their last “toxic” cash-out refis, they both at different times came to me for advice on their loans. I requested they each bring me their Reg Z’s (GFE’s) and escrow instructions and estimated closing stmts. #1 brought me only the GFE and #2 brought me everything. I strongly advised both of them NOT TO GO THRU with the loan but each of them was dead set on receiving what cash they could from the transaction. When I told each of them they should back out of the transaction immediately, I never heard back from either of them until foreclosure was looming again, at which time I told them I could no longer help them.
Which begs the question? So, who’s the smart money, here? All I can tell you is that I know for a fact they each paid DEARLY with their FICO scores. And as all of you PIGGS are aware, FICO is what makes the world go round.
May 10, 2010 at 4:52 PM #549677ParticipantThese are people I know right now who were affected:
91914: single mom of 3 (all minors) with toxic loan who was paid $4K to walk away in 12/09. She put about $100K down (divorce settlement) in 2004, but removed over $200K in “equity” since then, paying exorbitant points and fees for her “cash-out” transactions. Property recently sold by bank for about 90% of what she pd. She’s now living with mom again, who is 93, after filing Chapter 7 in 12/09. Education: HS Diploma.
91913: single mom of 2 (1 minor child) still squatting after 20 mos. of no payments, 3.5 yrs. behind on taxes and two HOA liens outstanding. Lost decent job two mos. ago. Purch. in 1998 for $97K but managed to borrow since then $185K more than her home is now worth. Has had “roommate” for four years who pays her monthly “rent.” Education: HS Diploma. Her last “toxic loan” was intended to “avoid foreclosure” but instead mortgage broker made off with $60K of her “cash-out” under a fraudulent investment scheme. Mtg. broker is under investigation by the DA’s office for defrauding nearly 50 people but he laundered some of this $$ into Mexico and lost much of it paying inflated prices for condos in Coronado, which he lost in foreclosure. She and all the other victims met him at a local “church” where he was a very active member.
92104: family of five (2 minor children) parlayed the wife’s family acreage in 91902 (deeded to them in 2002 by her living mom with just $88K owing on it) into an $860K Craftsman in North Park in 2005 with plans to convert to four units. Put just $150K down and made only four mtg. payments. Spent the rest on vehicles and private school. 1st TD (private lender) foreclosed timely at the 7-8 mo. mark. Couple has since filed Chapter 7 (where they had to give up 3 of their vehicles) and divorced. She’s back living with mom. He’s living in rental in dtn. SD. He: HS Diploma; She: HS Dropout.
91910: family of four (2 minor children) pd. $590K in 2006 with nothing down, using purchase $$ first and second. First foreclosed within two years. Unclear how many payments were made. Property sold by bank for $273K in 2009. Both parents had good jobs and were HS graduates.
The reason I am including the educational levels here is not to make fun of anyone (I myself don’t have a college degree) but to illustrate the willingness of lenders to just hand out $$ if you could fog a mirror (not based on “real” income).
After #1 and #2 applied for but had not yet closed on their last “toxic” cash-out refis, they both at different times came to me for advice on their loans. I requested they each bring me their Reg Z’s (GFE’s) and escrow instructions and estimated closing stmts. #1 brought me only the GFE and #2 brought me everything. I strongly advised both of them NOT TO GO THRU with the loan but each of them was dead set on receiving what cash they could from the transaction. When I told each of them they should back out of the transaction immediately, I never heard back from either of them until foreclosure was looming again, at which time I told them I could no longer help them.
Which begs the question? So, who’s the smart money, here? All I can tell you is that I know for a fact they each paid DEARLY with their FICO scores. And as all of you PIGGS are aware, FICO is what makes the world go round.
May 10, 2010 at 4:52 PM #549955ParticipantThese are people I know right now who were affected:
91914: single mom of 3 (all minors) with toxic loan who was paid $4K to walk away in 12/09. She put about $100K down (divorce settlement) in 2004, but removed over $200K in “equity” since then, paying exorbitant points and fees for her “cash-out” transactions. Property recently sold by bank for about 90% of what she pd. She’s now living with mom again, who is 93, after filing Chapter 7 in 12/09. Education: HS Diploma.
91913: single mom of 2 (1 minor child) still squatting after 20 mos. of no payments, 3.5 yrs. behind on taxes and two HOA liens outstanding. Lost decent job two mos. ago. Purch. in 1998 for $97K but managed to borrow since then $185K more than her home is now worth. Has had “roommate” for four years who pays her monthly “rent.” Education: HS Diploma. Her last “toxic loan” was intended to “avoid foreclosure” but instead mortgage broker made off with $60K of her “cash-out” under a fraudulent investment scheme. Mtg. broker is under investigation by the DA’s office for defrauding nearly 50 people but he laundered some of this $$ into Mexico and lost much of it paying inflated prices for condos in Coronado, which he lost in foreclosure. She and all the other victims met him at a local “church” where he was a very active member.
92104: family of five (2 minor children) parlayed the wife’s family acreage in 91902 (deeded to them in 2002 by her living mom with just $88K owing on it) into an $860K Craftsman in North Park in 2005 with plans to convert to four units. Put just $150K down and made only four mtg. payments. Spent the rest on vehicles and private school. 1st TD (private lender) foreclosed timely at the 7-8 mo. mark. Couple has since filed Chapter 7 (where they had to give up 3 of their vehicles) and divorced. She’s back living with mom. He’s living in rental in dtn. SD. He: HS Diploma; She: HS Dropout.
91910: family of four (2 minor children) pd. $590K in 2006 with nothing down, using purchase $$ first and second. First foreclosed within two years. Unclear how many payments were made. Property sold by bank for $273K in 2009. Both parents had good jobs and were HS graduates.
The reason I am including the educational levels here is not to make fun of anyone (I myself don’t have a college degree) but to illustrate the willingness of lenders to just hand out $$ if you could fog a mirror (not based on “real” income).
After #1 and #2 applied for but had not yet closed on their last “toxic” cash-out refis, they both at different times came to me for advice on their loans. I requested they each bring me their Reg Z’s (GFE’s) and escrow instructions and estimated closing stmts. #1 brought me only the GFE and #2 brought me everything. I strongly advised both of them NOT TO GO THRU with the loan but each of them was dead set on receiving what cash they could from the transaction. When I told each of them they should back out of the transaction immediately, I never heard back from either of them until foreclosure was looming again, at which time I told them I could no longer help them.
Which begs the question? So, who’s the smart money, here? All I can tell you is that I know for a fact they each paid DEARLY with their FICO scores. And as all of you PIGGS are aware, FICO is what makes the world go round.
May 10, 2010 at 5:54 PM #548992UCGal
Participant92026 – family of 4 (2 minor kids), dad lost job. Wife still employed. House sold short for $300k less than they paid. (aprox 800k to 500k) Lost their $50k downpayment. Probably got some free rent along the way. Now renting. Both parents college educated and have/had power careers. Kids go to private schools. Decision was based on degree they were underwater.
May 10, 2010 at 5:54 PM #549103Participant92026 – family of 4 (2 minor kids), dad lost job. Wife still employed. House sold short for $300k less than they paid. (aprox 800k to 500k) Lost their $50k downpayment. Probably got some free rent along the way. Now renting. Both parents college educated and have/had power careers. Kids go to private schools. Decision was based on degree they were underwater.
May 10, 2010 at 5:54 PM #549593Participant92026 – family of 4 (2 minor kids), dad lost job. Wife still employed. House sold short for $300k less than they paid. (aprox 800k to 500k) Lost their $50k downpayment. Probably got some free rent along the way. Now renting. Both parents college educated and have/had power careers. Kids go to private schools. Decision was based on degree they were underwater.
May 10, 2010 at 5:54 PM #549692Participant92026 – family of 4 (2 minor kids), dad lost job. Wife still employed. House sold short for $300k less than they paid. (aprox 800k to 500k) Lost their $50k downpayment. Probably got some free rent along the way. Now renting. Both parents college educated and have/had power careers. Kids go to private schools. Decision was based on degree they were underwater.
May 10, 2010 at 5:54 PM #549970Participant92026 – family of 4 (2 minor kids), dad lost job. Wife still employed. House sold short for $300k less than they paid. (aprox 800k to 500k) Lost their $50k downpayment. Probably got some free rent along the way. Now renting. Both parents college educated and have/had power careers. Kids go to private schools. Decision was based on degree they were underwater.
May 10, 2010 at 7:08 PM #549012zk
Participant60 minutes kept talking about whether it’s amoral or whether it should bother your conscience to walk away when you can afford to pay, but only briefly touched on what, to me, is the most important point in this debate. When you sign a contract to borrow money on a house, you’re not saying, “I’ll pay you as long as I can afford it.” You’re saying, “I’ll make payments on the loan or I’ll give you the house back.” When you strategically default, you are fulfilling your part of the contract (as long as you don’t stay in the house when they come to get it).
60 minutes bias is usually quite obvious. In this case, I think they’ve been more subtle, making it look like they’re slanting it one way when, in actuality, they’re slanting it the other.
May 10, 2010 at 7:08 PM #549123Participant60 minutes kept talking about whether it’s amoral or whether it should bother your conscience to walk away when you can afford to pay, but only briefly touched on what, to me, is the most important point in this debate. When you sign a contract to borrow money on a house, you’re not saying, “I’ll pay you as long as I can afford it.” You’re saying, “I’ll make payments on the loan or I’ll give you the house back.” When you strategically default, you are fulfilling your part of the contract (as long as you don’t stay in the house when they come to get it).
60 minutes bias is usually quite obvious. In this case, I think they’ve been more subtle, making it look like they’re slanting it one way when, in actuality, they’re slanting it the other.
May 10, 2010 at 7:08 PM #549613Participant60 minutes kept talking about whether it’s amoral or whether it should bother your conscience to walk away when you can afford to pay, but only briefly touched on what, to me, is the most important point in this debate. When you sign a contract to borrow money on a house, you’re not saying, “I’ll pay you as long as I can afford it.” You’re saying, “I’ll make payments on the loan or I’ll give you the house back.” When you strategically default, you are fulfilling your part of the contract (as long as you don’t stay in the house when they come to get it).
60 minutes bias is usually quite obvious. In this case, I think they’ve been more subtle, making it look like they’re slanting it one way when, in actuality, they’re slanting it the other.
May 10, 2010 at 7:08 PM #549713Participant60 minutes kept talking about whether it’s amoral or whether it should bother your conscience to walk away when you can afford to pay, but only briefly touched on what, to me, is the most important point in this debate. When you sign a contract to borrow money on a house, you’re not saying, “I’ll pay you as long as I can afford it.” You’re saying, “I’ll make payments on the loan or I’ll give you the house back.” When you strategically default, you are fulfilling your part of the contract (as long as you don’t stay in the house when they come to get it).
60 minutes bias is usually quite obvious. In this case, I think they’ve been more subtle, making it look like they’re slanting it one way when, in actuality, they’re slanting it the other.
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