Terrorism

[Arraya]

Don’t tell surveyor that Jesus is the most quoted prophet in the Koran.

[Arraya]

[quote]the CIA and the other agencies were looking through the same beer goggles you were looking through – that it was just not possible the idea that a muslim, who starts studying the koran in depth and becomes more devout towards the koranic faith would become a jihadist. Most people, even most muslims, do not know how and why a person who becomes more devout in the islamic faith can become a jihadist. So I more than understand the CIA and the other infidels who didn’t know.[/quote]

Ok, you have to be the biggest tool in the world with this statement

1) portraying the CIA as, just so so naive, like me. HAHAH
2) The guy WAS TELLING THEM HE WAS GOING CRAZY AND DANGEROUS for over a year. Do you think that could have been a tip off, huh? I mean he did make a report with pictures. haha
3) Trying to make a case that his deep faith led him to violence rather than obvious growing psychologic issues. Obviously overlooking some very big points to make your case. Another case of surveyor overlooking huge bits of data to make a simplistic point.

I recommend to anybody, go find the report on the net and read it, it was basically him telling people in a very professional way that he was slipping mentally into wanting to commit violence against the military. Really it was Jihadism in a power point presentation. Apparently, he felt it was a war against his religion. I wonder why that is surveyor, hmmm

Ok, I’ll concede, the CIA has never gotten a powerpoint presentation from a terrorist before they strike. ha That had to throw them a little, but they did watch him for half a year. This is reminiscent of “Able Danger” surely you know what that is being the you are such a terrorism expert? Right?

Anyway, Do you know ANYTHING about the CIA? Anything at all?

They have been working with terrorist groups for decades. In one capacity or another. Seems religious zealots are easy to manipulate. hmmm..

With their MULTI-DECADE experience they might just know a little more than you.

Bin Ladin was a CIA operative. This is not a secret. It is not tin foil. It is known. They were mujahdeen back then. Fighting the soviets, but still supposed zealots.

Do you know the reason that OBL and Khalid sheikh mohammed gave us for attacking the twin towers? Well, first OBL denied it them turned around and decided to take credit for it a few days later. No, it was not because we are dirty infidels. Do you know what they said? I bet you don’t. Mr. terrorist expert. Little advice, learn to listen to what they are saying. Sometimes it can be enlightening. Of course, you will say, “Well they are lying, this is the real reason because I read it on newsmax. Or some other propaganda site that provokes religious fervor.

Do you know where the word Al Queda Came from? When was it first used within the US? Come on, you are so smart about these things. No cheating with google.

You probably get all your information from world net daily or anti-mullah.com. huh?

Do you know who gary webb or Bob Baur are? Both tell interesting stories.

How about Sibel Edmonds, another whistleblower regarding intelligence and arms proliferation with militant groups in the ME? Seems we have been selling weapons to all kinds of bad guys for years and she stumbled into it as a translator after 9/11. She now has a gag order on her. Surely you know her story since you a such an expert on the area of ME and terrorism. Right?

One thing is for sure: The line between the CIA/Mossad/M16 amorphous entity and “terrorist” groups is very, very blurry.

[quote]A CIA level conspiracy? Really? And I’m in the fairy tale world[/quote]

I don’t claim to be sure of anything. However, the CIA is conspiracy central, that is what they do. Conspire. We are only fed, publicly palatable half-truths and bits of information. They like to scare us with stories of crazed jihadists under every bed because it serves a larger, multi-faceted purpose.

This guy was a nut, going crazier and crazier while they were watching him for 6 months. Is it a conspiracy if you just let it happen and play dumb? Because that is what appears they are doing? A conspiracy of plausible deniability. Maybe it was they are completely incompetent boobs, which leads to the question. What purpose do they serve and how come we just continue to give the intelligence apparatus more money with every failure.

Drumming up support for war is very old business and it looks they walked into a gift. Admit it, the reports of a crazed terrorist in are armed services made you self-justify our war in the ME. Come on, be honest.

The CIA is propaganda central, that is in their job description. “By way of deception” who’s motto is that? Mr. Expert, huh?

In the ME, they call anybody AQ that is an insurgent. It’s a nice title to put on anybody that is fighting western forces. They may or may not be religious but just fighting against people that they see as oppressors. The Taliban is a real group. AQ, more of a title intelligence agencies gave a data base of militant groups that slowly morphed into our scariest enemy with recruiting stations in every mosque. More of a media creation than anything else.

Less than 5% of the people that go into the Taliban go because of ideology and the rest are there for financial reasons OR because they want revenge for a family member being killed. It has nothing to do with religion and it grows the more we bomb! A self-reinforcing ball of hate enabled and provoked by the people with the biggest guns. I don’t expect you to understand that, though.

Your view of ME politics, militant groups and religions is so simplistic, one sided and seemingly biased you sound like a crusader fighting for god.

[quote]Seriously that tin hat is starting to look good on you the more you post. 9/11 was committed by us, right?[/quote]

Committed by us, is a simplistic statement, like everything you say. More like, aloud to happen and given some level of technical assistance by elements with the US establishment.

Managed “blow back” for a psychological pretext leading to geo-strategic gain.

While the details remain obscure, the evidence sure leads you to that conclusion. I know you prefer “beliefs” over “evidence”, though, so you would not understand.

Sifting through the volumes of 9/11 evidence is analogous to archeology. Only some of the evidence for the distant ancestors of all living beings has been unearthed and catalogued. However, the fact that the currently known fossil record is incomplete does not prevent science from attempting to determine patterns and draw tentative conclusions about the history of life on Earth, knowing that additional evidence is likely to alter the story as we gain further knowledge. The early days of archeology saw spectacular forgeries “revealed” by unscrupulous advocates of particular theories, which parallels current efforts to distract and discredit 9/11 skeptics with disinformation. It is unlikely that any story of 9/11 is completely true, and hopefully enough of the documentation will be made public in the years to come – and enough whistleblowers step forward – so that historians will be able to more fully explain what happened to the United States of America.

Whatever details future archeologists of truth will unearth are unlikely to discredit the Reichstag Fire paradigm for understanding 9/11 – they merely will add to our understanding of the details of how the “Reichstag” was burned. The real issue is to explain why the attacks were perpetrated.

The PNAC crew, do you know who that is?, which openly pined for, in their words “A NEW PEARL HARBOR” pre-9/11 to get into the ME should be suspect for a myriad of reasons.

It is interesting reading their published work on how they understand the need for psychological pretexts or mass psychological conditioning. Almost like heads of state can’t really explain empire business because the kids won’t understand, so an enemy is needed. This is where provoked religious fervor and associated reciprocation comes in handy. See game theory for purposes of war.

There IS a case against them.

But alas, the rational movement was hijacked by the crazies around 2004 with, Alien watchers, neo-nazi’s and illuminati freaks. It became a circus.

MIke Ruppert wrote the seminal book on the subject “Crossing the Rubicon The Decline of the American Empire at the End of the Age of Oil”. Most of the other volumes are crap and aren’t worth the paper they are written on.

History is really one conspiracy after another. Wealth and power necessitate it. The notion that there is one over riding conspiracy is correct in the abstract. Those who seek wealth and power will conspire to attain what they seek. The truth is, those of like mind will gladly slit the throat’s of temporary allies to scramble even further up the pile. A pile that is a created out of the minds of men who wish to dominate.

The real truth of the matter, is nobody is in control. It’s like a run away train in the middle of the night with lots of entities seeking control. While, we, average people are just fed easily consumable reasons for actions and reactions, that are explained away as scary enemies.

Nations, governments, economies, religions etc are all a product of mind and do not exist “in reality”. They are little lines we draw, that have put us in cultural straight jackets of our own making and demise.

Guys like you are incapable of deep self examination and spread fear far and wide. The notion that the darkness you perceive and feel threatened by is amplified by your own inner darkness. You understanding of religious fervor is because it is in you. In some form or fashion.

Now, the breakup of all the systems of control is currently underway. 9/11 and the “war on terror” was a desperate attempt to keep that control. Ground zero is the ME. It’s now taking hold on a global scale. What is born out of the fires of change will largely determine the fate of mankind. Here is a hint, if you are willing to discard others to save yourself (dehumanization) you are already lost.

[Arraya]

[quote]the CIA and the other agencies were looking through the same beer goggles you were looking through – that it was just not possible the idea that a muslim, who starts studying the koran in depth and becomes more devout towards the koranic faith would become a jihadist. Most people, even most muslims, do not know how and why a person who becomes more devout in the islamic faith can become a jihadist. So I more than understand the CIA and the other infidels who didn’t know.[/quote]

Ok, you have to be the biggest tool in the world with this statement

1) portraying the CIA as, just so so naive, like me. HAHAH
2) The guy WAS TELLING THEM HE WAS GOING CRAZY AND DANGEROUS for over a year. Do you think that could have been a tip off, huh? I mean he did make a report with pictures. haha
3) Trying to make a case that his deep faith led him to violence rather than obvious growing psychologic issues. Obviously overlooking some very big points to make your case. Another case of surveyor overlooking huge bits of data to make a simplistic point.

I recommend to anybody, go find the report on the net and read it, it was basically him telling people in a very professional way that he was slipping mentally into wanting to commit violence against the military. Really it was Jihadism in a power point presentation. Apparently, he felt it was a war against his religion. I wonder why that is surveyor, hmmm

Ok, I’ll concede, the CIA has never gotten a powerpoint presentation from a terrorist before they strike. ha That had to throw them a little, but they did watch him for half a year. This is reminiscent of “Able Danger” surely you know what that is being the you are such a terrorism expert? Right?

Anyway, Do you know ANYTHING about the CIA? Anything at all?

They have been working with terrorist groups for decades. In one capacity or another. Seems religious zealots are easy to manipulate. hmmm..

With their MULTI-DECADE experience they might just know a little more than you.

Bin Ladin was a CIA operative. This is not a secret. It is not tin foil. It is known. They were mujahdeen back then. Fighting the soviets, but still supposed zealots.

Do you know the reason that OBL and Khalid sheikh mohammed gave us for attacking the twin towers? Well, first OBL denied it them turned around and decided to take credit for it a few days later. No, it was not because we are dirty infidels. Do you know what they said? I bet you don’t. Mr. terrorist expert. Little advice, learn to listen to what they are saying. Sometimes it can be enlightening. Of course, you will say, “Well they are lying, this is the real reason because I read it on newsmax. Or some other propaganda site that provokes religious fervor.

Do you know where the word Al Queda Came from? When was it first used within the US? Come on, you are so smart about these things. No cheating with google.

You probably get all your information from world net daily or anti-mullah.com. huh?

Do you know who gary webb or Bob Baur are? Both tell interesting stories.

How about Sibel Edmonds, another whistleblower regarding intelligence and arms proliferation with militant groups in the ME? Seems we have been selling weapons to all kinds of bad guys for years and she stumbled into it as a translator after 9/11. She now has a gag order on her. Surely you know her story since you a such an expert on the area of ME and terrorism. Right?

One thing is for sure: The line between the CIA/Mossad/M16 amorphous entity and “terrorist” groups is very, very blurry.

[quote]A CIA level conspiracy? Really? And I’m in the fairy tale world[/quote]

I don’t claim to be sure of anything. However, the CIA is conspiracy central, that is what they do. Conspire. We are only fed, publicly palatable half-truths and bits of information. They like to scare us with stories of crazed jihadists under every bed because it serves a larger, multi-faceted purpose.

This guy was a nut, going crazier and crazier while they were watching him for 6 months. Is it a conspiracy if you just let it happen and play dumb? Because that is what appears they are doing? A conspiracy of plausible deniability. Maybe it was they are completely incompetent boobs, which leads to the question. What purpose do they serve and how come we just continue to give the intelligence apparatus more money with every failure.

Drumming up support for war is very old business and it looks they walked into a gift. Admit it, the reports of a crazed terrorist in are armed services made you self-justify our war in the ME. Come on, be honest.

The CIA is propaganda central, that is in their job description. “By way of deception” who’s motto is that? Mr. Expert, huh?

In the ME, they call anybody AQ that is an insurgent. It’s a nice title to put on anybody that is fighting western forces. They may or may not be religious but just fighting against people that they see as oppressors. The Taliban is a real group. AQ, more of a title intelligence agencies gave a data base of militant groups that slowly morphed into our scariest enemy with recruiting stations in every mosque. More of a media creation than anything else.

Less than 5% of the people that go into the Taliban go because of ideology and the rest are there for financial reasons OR because they want revenge for a family member being killed. It has nothing to do with religion and it grows the more we bomb! A self-reinforcing ball of hate enabled and provoked by the people with the biggest guns. I don’t expect you to understand that, though.

Your view of ME politics, militant groups and religions is so simplistic, one sided and seemingly biased you sound like a crusader fighting for god.

[quote]Seriously that tin hat is starting to look good on you the more you post. 9/11 was committed by us, right?[/quote]

Committed by us, is a simplistic statement, like everything you say. More like, aloud to happen and given some level of technical assistance by elements with the US establishment.

Managed “blow back” for a psychological pretext leading to geo-strategic gain.

While the details remain obscure, the evidence sure leads you to that conclusion. I know you prefer “beliefs” over “evidence”, though, so you would not understand.

Sifting through the volumes of 9/11 evidence is analogous to archeology. Only some of the evidence for the distant ancestors of all living beings has been unearthed and catalogued. However, the fact that the currently known fossil record is incomplete does not prevent science from attempting to determine patterns and draw tentative conclusions about the history of life on Earth, knowing that additional evidence is likely to alter the story as we gain further knowledge. The early days of archeology saw spectacular forgeries “revealed” by unscrupulous advocates of particular theories, which parallels current efforts to distract and discredit 9/11 skeptics with disinformation. It is unlikely that any story of 9/11 is completely true, and hopefully enough of the documentation will be made public in the years to come – and enough whistleblowers step forward – so that historians will be able to more fully explain what happened to the United States of America.

Whatever details future archeologists of truth will unearth are unlikely to discredit the Reichstag Fire paradigm for understanding 9/11 – they merely will add to our understanding of the details of how the “Reichstag” was burned. The real issue is to explain why the attacks were perpetrated.

The PNAC crew, do you know who that is?, which openly pined for, in their words “A NEW PEARL HARBOR” pre-9/11 to get into the ME should be suspect for a myriad of reasons.

It is interesting reading their published work on how they understand the need for psychological pretexts or mass psychological conditioning. Almost like heads of state can’t really explain empire business because the kids won’t understand, so an enemy is needed. This is where provoked religious fervor and associated reciprocation comes in handy. See game theory for purposes of war.

There IS a case against them.

But alas, the rational movement was hijacked by the crazies around 2004 with, Alien watchers, neo-nazi’s and illuminati freaks. It became a circus.

MIke Ruppert wrote the seminal book on the subject “Crossing the Rubicon The Decline of the American Empire at the End of the Age of Oil”. Most of the other volumes are crap and aren’t worth the paper they are written on.

History is really one conspiracy after another. Wealth and power necessitate it. The notion that there is one over riding conspiracy is correct in the abstract. Those who seek wealth and power will conspire to attain what they seek. The truth is, those of like mind will gladly slit the throat’s of temporary allies to scramble even further up the pile. A pile that is a created out of the minds of men who wish to dominate.

The real truth of the matter, is nobody is in control. It’s like a run away train in the middle of the night with lots of entities seeking control. While, we, average people are just fed easily consumable reasons for actions and reactions, that are explained away as scary enemies.

Nations, governments, economies, religions etc are all a product of mind and do not exist “in reality”. They are little lines we draw, that have put us in cultural straight jackets of our own making and demise.

Guys like you are incapable of deep self examination and spread fear far and wide. The notion that the darkness you perceive and feel threatened by is amplified by your own inner darkness. You understanding of religious fervor is because it is in you. In some form or fashion.

Now, the breakup of all the systems of control is currently underway. 9/11 and the “war on terror” was a desperate attempt to keep that control. Ground zero is the ME. It’s now taking hold on a global scale. What is born out of the fires of change will largely determine the fate of mankind. Here is a hint, if you are willing to discard others to save yourself (dehumanization) you are already lost.

[Arraya]

[quote]the CIA and the other agencies were looking through the same beer goggles you were looking through – that it was just not possible the idea that a muslim, who starts studying the koran in depth and becomes more devout towards the koranic faith would become a jihadist. Most people, even most muslims, do not know how and why a person who becomes more devout in the islamic faith can become a jihadist. So I more than understand the CIA and the other infidels who didn’t know.[/quote]

Ok, you have to be the biggest tool in the world with this statement

1) portraying the CIA as, just so so naive, like me. HAHAH
2) The guy WAS TELLING THEM HE WAS GOING CRAZY AND DANGEROUS for over a year. Do you think that could have been a tip off, huh? I mean he did make a report with pictures. haha
3) Trying to make a case that his deep faith led him to violence rather than obvious growing psychologic issues. Obviously overlooking some very big points to make your case. Another case of surveyor overlooking huge bits of data to make a simplistic point.

I recommend to anybody, go find the report on the net and read it, it was basically him telling people in a very professional way that he was slipping mentally into wanting to commit violence against the military. Really it was Jihadism in a power point presentation. Apparently, he felt it was a war against his religion. I wonder why that is surveyor, hmmm

Ok, I’ll concede, the CIA has never gotten a powerpoint presentation from a terrorist before they strike. ha That had to throw them a little, but they did watch him for half a year. This is reminiscent of “Able Danger” surely you know what that is being the you are such a terrorism expert? Right?

Anyway, Do you know ANYTHING about the CIA? Anything at all?

They have been working with terrorist groups for decades. In one capacity or another. Seems religious zealots are easy to manipulate. hmmm..

With their MULTI-DECADE experience they might just know a little more than you.

Bin Ladin was a CIA operative. This is not a secret. It is not tin foil. It is known. They were mujahdeen back then. Fighting the soviets, but still supposed zealots.

Do you know the reason that OBL and Khalid sheikh mohammed gave us for attacking the twin towers? Well, first OBL denied it them turned around and decided to take credit for it a few days later. No, it was not because we are dirty infidels. Do you know what they said? I bet you don’t. Mr. terrorist expert. Little advice, learn to listen to what they are saying. Sometimes it can be enlightening. Of course, you will say, “Well they are lying, this is the real reason because I read it on newsmax. Or some other propaganda site that provokes religious fervor.

Do you know where the word Al Queda Came from? When was it first used within the US? Come on, you are so smart about these things. No cheating with google.

You probably get all your information from world net daily or anti-mullah.com. huh?

Do you know who gary webb or Bob Baur are? Both tell interesting stories.

How about Sibel Edmonds, another whistleblower regarding intelligence and arms proliferation with militant groups in the ME? Seems we have been selling weapons to all kinds of bad guys for years and she stumbled into it as a translator after 9/11. She now has a gag order on her. Surely you know her story since you a such an expert on the area of ME and terrorism. Right?

One thing is for sure: The line between the CIA/Mossad/M16 amorphous entity and “terrorist” groups is very, very blurry.

[quote]A CIA level conspiracy? Really? And I’m in the fairy tale world[/quote]

I don’t claim to be sure of anything. However, the CIA is conspiracy central, that is what they do. Conspire. We are only fed, publicly palatable half-truths and bits of information. They like to scare us with stories of crazed jihadists under every bed because it serves a larger, multi-faceted purpose.

This guy was a nut, going crazier and crazier while they were watching him for 6 months. Is it a conspiracy if you just let it happen and play dumb? Because that is what appears they are doing? A conspiracy of plausible deniability. Maybe it was they are completely incompetent boobs, which leads to the question. What purpose do they serve and how come we just continue to give the intelligence apparatus more money with every failure.

Drumming up support for war is very old business and it looks they walked into a gift. Admit it, the reports of a crazed terrorist in are armed services made you self-justify our war in the ME. Come on, be honest.

The CIA is propaganda central, that is in their job description. “By way of deception” who’s motto is that? Mr. Expert, huh?

In the ME, they call anybody AQ that is an insurgent. It’s a nice title to put on anybody that is fighting western forces. They may or may not be religious but just fighting against people that they see as oppressors. The Taliban is a real group. AQ, more of a title intelligence agencies gave a data base of militant groups that slowly morphed into our scariest enemy with recruiting stations in every mosque. More of a media creation than anything else.

Less than 5% of the people that go into the Taliban go because of ideology and the rest are there for financial reasons OR because they want revenge for a family member being killed. It has nothing to do with religion and it grows the more we bomb! A self-reinforcing ball of hate enabled and provoked by the people with the biggest guns. I don’t expect you to understand that, though.

Your view of ME politics, militant groups and religions is so simplistic, one sided and seemingly biased you sound like a crusader fighting for god.

[quote]Seriously that tin hat is starting to look good on you the more you post. 9/11 was committed by us, right?[/quote]

Committed by us, is a simplistic statement, like everything you say. More like, aloud to happen and given some level of technical assistance by elements with the US establishment.

Managed “blow back” for a psychological pretext leading to geo-strategic gain.

While the details remain obscure, the evidence sure leads you to that conclusion. I know you prefer “beliefs” over “evidence”, though, so you would not understand.

Sifting through the volumes of 9/11 evidence is analogous to archeology. Only some of the evidence for the distant ancestors of all living beings has been unearthed and catalogued. However, the fact that the currently known fossil record is incomplete does not prevent science from attempting to determine patterns and draw tentative conclusions about the history of life on Earth, knowing that additional evidence is likely to alter the story as we gain further knowledge. The early days of archeology saw spectacular forgeries “revealed” by unscrupulous advocates of particular theories, which parallels current efforts to distract and discredit 9/11 skeptics with disinformation. It is unlikely that any story of 9/11 is completely true, and hopefully enough of the documentation will be made public in the years to come – and enough whistleblowers step forward – so that historians will be able to more fully explain what happened to the United States of America.

Whatever details future archeologists of truth will unearth are unlikely to discredit the Reichstag Fire paradigm for understanding 9/11 – they merely will add to our understanding of the details of how the “Reichstag” was burned. The real issue is to explain why the attacks were perpetrated.

The PNAC crew, do you know who that is?, which openly pined for, in their words “A NEW PEARL HARBOR” pre-9/11 to get into the ME should be suspect for a myriad of reasons.

It is interesting reading their published work on how they understand the need for psychological pretexts or mass psychological conditioning. Almost like heads of state can’t really explain empire business because the kids won’t understand, so an enemy is needed. This is where provoked religious fervor and associated reciprocation comes in handy. See game theory for purposes of war.

There IS a case against them.

But alas, the rational movement was hijacked by the crazies around 2004 with, Alien watchers, neo-nazi’s and illuminati freaks. It became a circus.

MIke Ruppert wrote the seminal book on the subject “Crossing the Rubicon The Decline of the American Empire at the End of the Age of Oil”. Most of the other volumes are crap and aren’t worth the paper they are written on.

History is really one conspiracy after another. Wealth and power necessitate it. The notion that there is one over riding conspiracy is correct in the abstract. Those who seek wealth and power will conspire to attain what they seek. The truth is, those of like mind will gladly slit the throat’s of temporary allies to scramble even further up the pile. A pile that is a created out of the minds of men who wish to dominate.

The real truth of the matter, is nobody is in control. It’s like a run away train in the middle of the night with lots of entities seeking control. While, we, average people are just fed easily consumable reasons for actions and reactions, that are explained away as scary enemies.

Nations, governments, economies, religions etc are all a product of mind and do not exist “in reality”. They are little lines we draw, that have put us in cultural straight jackets of our own making and demise.

Guys like you are incapable of deep self examination and spread fear far and wide. The notion that the darkness you perceive and feel threatened by is amplified by your own inner darkness. You understanding of religious fervor is because it is in you. In some form or fashion.

Now, the breakup of all the systems of control is currently underway. 9/11 and the “war on terror” was a desperate attempt to keep that control. Ground zero is the ME. It’s now taking hold on a global scale. What is born out of the fires of change will largely determine the fate of mankind. Here is a hint, if you are willing to discard others to save yourself (dehumanization) you are already lost.

[Arraya]

[quote]the CIA and the other agencies were looking through the same beer goggles you were looking through – that it was just not possible the idea that a muslim, who starts studying the koran in depth and becomes more devout towards the koranic faith would become a jihadist. Most people, even most muslims, do not know how and why a person who becomes more devout in the islamic faith can become a jihadist. So I more than understand the CIA and the other infidels who didn’t know.[/quote]

Ok, you have to be the biggest tool in the world with this statement

1) portraying the CIA as, just so so naive, like me. HAHAH
2) The guy WAS TELLING THEM HE WAS GOING CRAZY AND DANGEROUS for over a year. Do you think that could have been a tip off, huh? I mean he did make a report with pictures. haha
3) Trying to make a case that his deep faith led him to violence rather than obvious growing psychologic issues. Obviously overlooking some very big points to make your case. Another case of surveyor overlooking huge bits of data to make a simplistic point.

I recommend to anybody, go find the report on the net and read it, it was basically him telling people in a very professional way that he was slipping mentally into wanting to commit violence against the military. Really it was Jihadism in a power point presentation. Apparently, he felt it was a war against his religion. I wonder why that is surveyor, hmmm

Ok, I’ll concede, the CIA has never gotten a powerpoint presentation from a terrorist before they strike. ha That had to throw them a little, but they did watch him for half a year. This is reminiscent of “Able Danger” surely you know what that is being the you are such a terrorism expert? Right?

Anyway, Do you know ANYTHING about the CIA? Anything at all?

They have been working with terrorist groups for decades. In one capacity or another. Seems religious zealots are easy to manipulate. hmmm..

With their MULTI-DECADE experience they might just know a little more than you.

Bin Ladin was a CIA operative. This is not a secret. It is not tin foil. It is known. They were mujahdeen back then. Fighting the soviets, but still supposed zealots.

Do you know the reason that OBL and Khalid sheikh mohammed gave us for attacking the twin towers? Well, first OBL denied it them turned around and decided to take credit for it a few days later. No, it was not because we are dirty infidels. Do you know what they said? I bet you don’t. Mr. terrorist expert. Little advice, learn to listen to what they are saying. Sometimes it can be enlightening. Of course, you will say, “Well they are lying, this is the real reason because I read it on newsmax. Or some other propaganda site that provokes religious fervor.

Do you know where the word Al Queda Came from? When was it first used within the US? Come on, you are so smart about these things. No cheating with google.

You probably get all your information from world net daily or anti-mullah.com. huh?

Do you know who gary webb or Bob Baur are? Both tell interesting stories.

How about Sibel Edmonds, another whistleblower regarding intelligence and arms proliferation with militant groups in the ME? Seems we have been selling weapons to all kinds of bad guys for years and she stumbled into it as a translator after 9/11. She now has a gag order on her. Surely you know her story since you a such an expert on the area of ME and terrorism. Right?

One thing is for sure: The line between the CIA/Mossad/M16 amorphous entity and “terrorist” groups is very, very blurry.

[quote]A CIA level conspiracy? Really? And I’m in the fairy tale world[/quote]

I don’t claim to be sure of anything. However, the CIA is conspiracy central, that is what they do. Conspire. We are only fed, publicly palatable half-truths and bits of information. They like to scare us with stories of crazed jihadists under every bed because it serves a larger, multi-faceted purpose.

This guy was a nut, going crazier and crazier while they were watching him for 6 months. Is it a conspiracy if you just let it happen and play dumb? Because that is what appears they are doing? A conspiracy of plausible deniability. Maybe it was they are completely incompetent boobs, which leads to the question. What purpose do they serve and how come we just continue to give the intelligence apparatus more money with every failure.

Drumming up support for war is very old business and it looks they walked into a gift. Admit it, the reports of a crazed terrorist in are armed services made you self-justify our war in the ME. Come on, be honest.

The CIA is propaganda central, that is in their job description. “By way of deception” who’s motto is that? Mr. Expert, huh?

In the ME, they call anybody AQ that is an insurgent. It’s a nice title to put on anybody that is fighting western forces. They may or may not be religious but just fighting against people that they see as oppressors. The Taliban is a real group. AQ, more of a title intelligence agencies gave a data base of militant groups that slowly morphed into our scariest enemy with recruiting stations in every mosque. More of a media creation than anything else.

Less than 5% of the people that go into the Taliban go because of ideology and the rest are there for financial reasons OR because they want revenge for a family member being killed. It has nothing to do with religion and it grows the more we bomb! A self-reinforcing ball of hate enabled and provoked by the people with the biggest guns. I don’t expect you to understand that, though.

Your view of ME politics, militant groups and religions is so simplistic, one sided and seemingly biased you sound like a crusader fighting for god.

[quote]Seriously that tin hat is starting to look good on you the more you post. 9/11 was committed by us, right?[/quote]

Committed by us, is a simplistic statement, like everything you say. More like, aloud to happen and given some level of technical assistance by elements with the US establishment.

Managed “blow back” for a psychological pretext leading to geo-strategic gain.

While the details remain obscure, the evidence sure leads you to that conclusion. I know you prefer “beliefs” over “evidence”, though, so you would not understand.

Sifting through the volumes of 9/11 evidence is analogous to archeology. Only some of the evidence for the distant ancestors of all living beings has been unearthed and catalogued. However, the fact that the currently known fossil record is incomplete does not prevent science from attempting to determine patterns and draw tentative conclusions about the history of life on Earth, knowing that additional evidence is likely to alter the story as we gain further knowledge. The early days of archeology saw spectacular forgeries “revealed” by unscrupulous advocates of particular theories, which parallels current efforts to distract and discredit 9/11 skeptics with disinformation. It is unlikely that any story of 9/11 is completely true, and hopefully enough of the documentation will be made public in the years to come – and enough whistleblowers step forward – so that historians will be able to more fully explain what happened to the United States of America.

Whatever details future archeologists of truth will unearth are unlikely to discredit the Reichstag Fire paradigm for understanding 9/11 – they merely will add to our understanding of the details of how the “Reichstag” was burned. The real issue is to explain why the attacks were perpetrated.

The PNAC crew, do you know who that is?, which openly pined for, in their words “A NEW PEARL HARBOR” pre-9/11 to get into the ME should be suspect for a myriad of reasons.

It is interesting reading their published work on how they understand the need for psychological pretexts or mass psychological conditioning. Almost like heads of state can’t really explain empire business because the kids won’t understand, so an enemy is needed. This is where provoked religious fervor and associated reciprocation comes in handy. See game theory for purposes of war.

There IS a case against them.

But alas, the rational movement was hijacked by the crazies around 2004 with, Alien watchers, neo-nazi’s and illuminati freaks. It became a circus.

MIke Ruppert wrote the seminal book on the subject “Crossing the Rubicon The Decline of the American Empire at the End of the Age of Oil”. Most of the other volumes are crap and aren’t worth the paper they are written on.

History is really one conspiracy after another. Wealth and power necessitate it. The notion that there is one over riding conspiracy is correct in the abstract. Those who seek wealth and power will conspire to attain what they seek. The truth is, those of like mind will gladly slit the throat’s of temporary allies to scramble even further up the pile. A pile that is a created out of the minds of men who wish to dominate.

The real truth of the matter, is nobody is in control. It’s like a run away train in the middle of the night with lots of entities seeking control. While, we, average people are just fed easily consumable reasons for actions and reactions, that are explained away as scary enemies.

Nations, governments, economies, religions etc are all a product of mind and do not exist “in reality”. They are little lines we draw, that have put us in cultural straight jackets of our own making and demise.

Guys like you are incapable of deep self examination and spread fear far and wide. The notion that the darkness you perceive and feel threatened by is amplified by your own inner darkness. You understanding of religious fervor is because it is in you. In some form or fashion.

Now, the breakup of all the systems of control is currently underway. 9/11 and the “war on terror” was a desperate attempt to keep that control. Ground zero is the ME. It’s now taking hold on a global scale. What is born out of the fires of change will largely determine the fate of mankind. Here is a hint, if you are willing to discard others to save yourself (dehumanization) you are already lost.

[Arraya]

[quote]the CIA and the other agencies were looking through the same beer goggles you were looking through – that it was just not possible the idea that a muslim, who starts studying the koran in depth and becomes more devout towards the koranic faith would become a jihadist. Most people, even most muslims, do not know how and why a person who becomes more devout in the islamic faith can become a jihadist. So I more than understand the CIA and the other infidels who didn’t know.[/quote]

Ok, you have to be the biggest tool in the world with this statement

1) portraying the CIA as, just so so naive, like me. HAHAH
2) The guy WAS TELLING THEM HE WAS GOING CRAZY AND DANGEROUS for over a year. Do you think that could have been a tip off, huh? I mean he did make a report with pictures. haha
3) Trying to make a case that his deep faith led him to violence rather than obvious growing psychologic issues. Obviously overlooking some very big points to make your case. Another case of surveyor overlooking huge bits of data to make a simplistic point.

I recommend to anybody, go find the report on the net and read it, it was basically him telling people in a very professional way that he was slipping mentally into wanting to commit violence against the military. Really it was Jihadism in a power point presentation. Apparently, he felt it was a war against his religion. I wonder why that is surveyor, hmmm

Ok, I’ll concede, the CIA has never gotten a powerpoint presentation from a terrorist before they strike. ha That had to throw them a little, but they did watch him for half a year. This is reminiscent of “Able Danger” surely you know what that is being the you are such a terrorism expert? Right?

Anyway, Do you know ANYTHING about the CIA? Anything at all?

They have been working with terrorist groups for decades. In one capacity or another. Seems religious zealots are easy to manipulate. hmmm..

With their MULTI-DECADE experience they might just know a little more than you.

Bin Ladin was a CIA operative. This is not a secret. It is not tin foil. It is known. They were mujahdeen back then. Fighting the soviets, but still supposed zealots.

Do you know the reason that OBL and Khalid sheikh mohammed gave us for attacking the twin towers? Well, first OBL denied it them turned around and decided to take credit for it a few days later. No, it was not because we are dirty infidels. Do you know what they said? I bet you don’t. Mr. terrorist expert. Little advice, learn to listen to what they are saying. Sometimes it can be enlightening. Of course, you will say, “Well they are lying, this is the real reason because I read it on newsmax. Or some other propaganda site that provokes religious fervor.

Do you know where the word Al Queda Came from? When was it first used within the US? Come on, you are so smart about these things. No cheating with google.

You probably get all your information from world net daily or anti-mullah.com. huh?

Do you know who gary webb or Bob Baur are? Both tell interesting stories.

How about Sibel Edmonds, another whistleblower regarding intelligence and arms proliferation with militant groups in the ME? Seems we have been selling weapons to all kinds of bad guys for years and she stumbled into it as a translator after 9/11. She now has a gag order on her. Surely you know her story since you a such an expert on the area of ME and terrorism. Right?

One thing is for sure: The line between the CIA/Mossad/M16 amorphous entity and “terrorist” groups is very, very blurry.

[quote]A CIA level conspiracy? Really? And I’m in the fairy tale world[/quote]

I don’t claim to be sure of anything. However, the CIA is conspiracy central, that is what they do. Conspire. We are only fed, publicly palatable half-truths and bits of information. They like to scare us with stories of crazed jihadists under every bed because it serves a larger, multi-faceted purpose.

This guy was a nut, going crazier and crazier while they were watching him for 6 months. Is it a conspiracy if you just let it happen and play dumb? Because that is what appears they are doing? A conspiracy of plausible deniability. Maybe it was they are completely incompetent boobs, which leads to the question. What purpose do they serve and how come we just continue to give the intelligence apparatus more money with every failure.

Drumming up support for war is very old business and it looks they walked into a gift. Admit it, the reports of a crazed terrorist in are armed services made you self-justify our war in the ME. Come on, be honest.

The CIA is propaganda central, that is in their job description. “By way of deception” who’s motto is that? Mr. Expert, huh?

In the ME, they call anybody AQ that is an insurgent. It’s a nice title to put on anybody that is fighting western forces. They may or may not be religious but just fighting against people that they see as oppressors. The Taliban is a real group. AQ, more of a title intelligence agencies gave a data base of militant groups that slowly morphed into our scariest enemy with recruiting stations in every mosque. More of a media creation than anything else.

Less than 5% of the people that go into the Taliban go because of ideology and the rest are there for financial reasons OR because they want revenge for a family member being killed. It has nothing to do with religion and it grows the more we bomb! A self-reinforcing ball of hate enabled and provoked by the people with the biggest guns. I don’t expect you to understand that, though.

Your view of ME politics, militant groups and religions is so simplistic, one sided and seemingly biased you sound like a crusader fighting for god.

[quote]Seriously that tin hat is starting to look good on you the more you post. 9/11 was committed by us, right?[/quote]

Committed by us, is a simplistic statement, like everything you say. More like, aloud to happen and given some level of technical assistance by elements with the US establishment.

Managed “blow back” for a psychological pretext leading to geo-strategic gain.

While the details remain obscure, the evidence sure leads you to that conclusion. I know you prefer “beliefs” over “evidence”, though, so you would not understand.

Sifting through the volumes of 9/11 evidence is analogous to archeology. Only some of the evidence for the distant ancestors of all living beings has been unearthed and catalogued. However, the fact that the currently known fossil record is incomplete does not prevent science from attempting to determine patterns and draw tentative conclusions about the history of life on Earth, knowing that additional evidence is likely to alter the story as we gain further knowledge. The early days of archeology saw spectacular forgeries “revealed” by unscrupulous advocates of particular theories, which parallels current efforts to distract and discredit 9/11 skeptics with disinformation. It is unlikely that any story of 9/11 is completely true, and hopefully enough of the documentation will be made public in the years to come – and enough whistleblowers step forward – so that historians will be able to more fully explain what happened to the United States of America.

Whatever details future archeologists of truth will unearth are unlikely to discredit the Reichstag Fire paradigm for understanding 9/11 – they merely will add to our understanding of the details of how the “Reichstag” was burned. The real issue is to explain why the attacks were perpetrated.

The PNAC crew, do you know who that is?, which openly pined for, in their words “A NEW PEARL HARBOR” pre-9/11 to get into the ME should be suspect for a myriad of reasons.

It is interesting reading their published work on how they understand the need for psychological pretexts or mass psychological conditioning. Almost like heads of state can’t really explain empire business because the kids won’t understand, so an enemy is needed. This is where provoked religious fervor and associated reciprocation comes in handy. See game theory for purposes of war.

There IS a case against them.

But alas, the rational movement was hijacked by the crazies around 2004 with, Alien watchers, neo-nazi’s and illuminati freaks. It became a circus.

MIke Ruppert wrote the seminal book on the subject “Crossing the Rubicon The Decline of the American Empire at the End of the Age of Oil”. Most of the other volumes are crap and aren’t worth the paper they are written on.

History is really one conspiracy after another. Wealth and power necessitate it. The notion that there is one over riding conspiracy is correct in the abstract. Those who seek wealth and power will conspire to attain what they seek. The truth is, those of like mind will gladly slit the throat’s of temporary allies to scramble even further up the pile. A pile that is a created out of the minds of men who wish to dominate.

The real truth of the matter, is nobody is in control. It’s like a run away train in the middle of the night with lots of entities seeking control. While, we, average people are just fed easily consumable reasons for actions and reactions, that are explained away as scary enemies.

Nations, governments, economies, religions etc are all a product of mind and do not exist “in reality”. They are little lines we draw, that have put us in cultural straight jackets of our own making and demise.

Guys like you are incapable of deep self examination and spread fear far and wide. The notion that the darkness you perceive and feel threatened by is amplified by your own inner darkness. You understanding of religious fervor is because it is in you. In some form or fashion.

Now, the breakup of all the systems of control is currently underway. 9/11 and the “war on terror” was a desperate attempt to keep that control. Ground zero is the ME. It’s now taking hold on a global scale. What is born out of the fires of change will largely determine the fate of mankind. Here is a hint, if you are willing to discard others to save yourself (dehumanization) you are already lost.

[surveyor]

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some tin foil hats for you, Arraya.

[surveyor]

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some tin foil hats for you, Arraya.

[surveyor]

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some tin foil hats for you, Arraya.

[surveyor]

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some tin foil hats for you, Arraya.

[surveyor]

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some tin foil hats for you, Arraya.

[Arraya]

[quote=surveyor]/
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some tin foil hats for you, Arraya.[/quote]

Come on slick, you can do better than that. Falling back on the old “conspiracy” as a derogatory statement. Do you know the definition of “conspiracy”. It is the nature of power, which Adam Smith knew quite well. No doubt, I show evidence that makes you uncomfortable.

I show data and draw conclusions. Unlike you, who rely on belief over data. Like when I showed you multiple rabbi’s calling for violence which you never replied to. You discard all evidence that does not fit you beliefs. You just ignore it. Please show me more verses from the Koran as proof. hahaha For muslim induced religious violence is only one tiny facet of the global drama unfolding, while you ignore a myriad of other forces. You have a beef with the devil and are fighting for God, aren’t you? Just like the Jihadists. Mirrors are sometimes uncomfortable, I know?

What have I presented in my posts that is inaccurate? I did not claim anything. I show dots(evidence) and draw pictures. You rely on pictures pre-drawn mostly of your own cultural bias and spoon fed data. Completely ignoring things that just don’t fit.

You have no insight or analyitical ability. With nothing more enlightening than I could read on world net daily.

Energy and currency systems are the reigns of power in the world today. However, I don’t think you understand either of them.

Onward christian soldier, into the see of internet thought, and come back when you are more learned.

[Arraya]

[quote=surveyor]/
—

some tin foil hats for you, Arraya.[/quote]

Come on slick, you can do better than that. Falling back on the old “conspiracy” as a derogatory statement. Do you know the definition of “conspiracy”. It is the nature of power, which Adam Smith knew quite well. No doubt, I show evidence that makes you uncomfortable.

I show data and draw conclusions. Unlike you, who rely on belief over data. Like when I showed you multiple rabbi’s calling for violence which you never replied to. You discard all evidence that does not fit you beliefs. You just ignore it. Please show me more verses from the Koran as proof. hahaha For muslim induced religious violence is only one tiny facet of the global drama unfolding, while you ignore a myriad of other forces. You have a beef with the devil and are fighting for God, aren’t you? Just like the Jihadists. Mirrors are sometimes uncomfortable, I know?

What have I presented in my posts that is inaccurate? I did not claim anything. I show dots(evidence) and draw pictures. You rely on pictures pre-drawn mostly of your own cultural bias and spoon fed data. Completely ignoring things that just don’t fit.

You have no insight or analyitical ability. With nothing more enlightening than I could read on world net daily.

Energy and currency systems are the reigns of power in the world today. However, I don’t think you understand either of them.

Onward christian soldier, into the see of internet thought, and come back when you are more learned.

[Arraya]

[quote=surveyor]/
—

some tin foil hats for you, Arraya.[/quote]

Come on slick, you can do better than that. Falling back on the old “conspiracy” as a derogatory statement. Do you know the definition of “conspiracy”. It is the nature of power, which Adam Smith knew quite well. No doubt, I show evidence that makes you uncomfortable.

I show data and draw conclusions. Unlike you, who rely on belief over data. Like when I showed you multiple rabbi’s calling for violence which you never replied to. You discard all evidence that does not fit you beliefs. You just ignore it. Please show me more verses from the Koran as proof. hahaha For muslim induced religious violence is only one tiny facet of the global drama unfolding, while you ignore a myriad of other forces. You have a beef with the devil and are fighting for God, aren’t you? Just like the Jihadists. Mirrors are sometimes uncomfortable, I know?

What have I presented in my posts that is inaccurate? I did not claim anything. I show dots(evidence) and draw pictures. You rely on pictures pre-drawn mostly of your own cultural bias and spoon fed data. Completely ignoring things that just don’t fit.

You have no insight or analyitical ability. With nothing more enlightening than I could read on world net daily.

Energy and currency systems are the reigns of power in the world today. However, I don’t think you understand either of them.

Onward christian soldier, into the see of internet thought, and come back when you are more learned.

[Arraya]

[quote=surveyor]/
—

some tin foil hats for you, Arraya.[/quote]

Come on slick, you can do better than that. Falling back on the old “conspiracy” as a derogatory statement. Do you know the definition of “conspiracy”. It is the nature of power, which Adam Smith knew quite well. No doubt, I show evidence that makes you uncomfortable.

I show data and draw conclusions. Unlike you, who rely on belief over data. Like when I showed you multiple rabbi’s calling for violence which you never replied to. You discard all evidence that does not fit you beliefs. You just ignore it. Please show me more verses from the Koran as proof. hahaha For muslim induced religious violence is only one tiny facet of the global drama unfolding, while you ignore a myriad of other forces. You have a beef with the devil and are fighting for God, aren’t you? Just like the Jihadists. Mirrors are sometimes uncomfortable, I know?

What have I presented in my posts that is inaccurate? I did not claim anything. I show dots(evidence) and draw pictures. You rely on pictures pre-drawn mostly of your own cultural bias and spoon fed data. Completely ignoring things that just don’t fit.

You have no insight or analyitical ability. With nothing more enlightening than I could read on world net daily.

Energy and currency systems are the reigns of power in the world today. However, I don’t think you understand either of them.

Onward christian soldier, into the see of internet thought, and come back when you are more learned.

[Author]

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