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FlyerInHi.
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June 17, 2016 at 7:46 AM #798772June 17, 2016 at 9:12 AM #798775
zk
Participant[quote=svelte]
The common denominator in these mass murders is, as you rightly point out, a deranged mind.[/quote]
It appears that you assume that a person must be deranged to commit mass murder.
Why do you assume that?
June 17, 2016 at 9:23 AM #798776
svelteParticipant[quote=zk][quote=svelte]
The common denominator in these mass murders is, as you rightly point out, a deranged mind.[/quote]
It appears that you assume that a person must be deranged to commit mass murder.
Why do you assume that?[/quote]
Because logical healthy minds do not commit mass murder.
That’s why I don’t understand the “competent to stand trial” thing. People who murder multiple people that aren’t holding them captive (or similar) are not mentally competent.
June 17, 2016 at 11:00 AM #798781Participant[quote=svelte][quote=zk][quote=svelte]
The common denominator in these mass murders is, as you rightly point out, a deranged mind.[/quote]
It appears that you assume that a person must be deranged to commit mass murder.
Why do you assume that?[/quote]
Because logical healthy minds do not commit mass murder.
That’s why I don’t understand the “competent to stand trial” thing. People who murder multiple people that aren’t holding them captive (or similar) are not mentally competent.[/quote]
What about someone who commits a single murder? Does a logical, healthy mind commit a single murder?
June 17, 2016 at 11:19 AM #798782svelteParticipant[quote=zk][quote=svelte]
Because logical healthy minds do not commit mass murder.That’s why I don’t understand the “competent to stand trial” thing. People who murder multiple people that aren’t holding them captive (or similar) are not mentally competent.[/quote]
What about someone who commits a single murder? Does a logical, healthy mind commit a single murder?[/quote]
I think there are more reasonable situations where a single murder could be committed than multiple murders. It gets into more of a gray area. Perceptions of self defense can come into play as well as other situations. But yeah there can be cases where a single murder is done by a logical healthy mind. There are also cases where it is done with an unhealthy mind. It’s not as clear cut as going out and shooting everyone who happens to be in a particular building at a particular time. That’s always an unhealthy mind.
June 17, 2016 at 1:42 PM #798787FlyerInHi
Guest[quote=njtosd] The whole heaven and hell idea is based on the ability to make choices (and the existence of such choice has come into question: http://blogs.scientificamerican.com/mind-guest-blog/what-neuroscience-says-about-free-will/)[/quote]
I agree with your most recent posts.
Science and knowledge are certainly calling into question how we’ve been viewing things.
June 17, 2016 at 5:01 PM #798794
CoronitaParticipantRest in Peace Christina Grimmie. How sad your talented life…
…. tragically ended, and so quickly it was forgotten by many becauase media and our politicians decided politicize a heinous act that happened the next day also in Orlando, simply because that mad man, also American born, was Muslim..
Funny how few are talking about gun control and mental health.
June 17, 2016 at 6:14 PM #798795njtosd
Participant[quote=flu]Rest in Peace Christina Grimmie. How sad your talented life…
…. tragically ended, and so quickly it was forgotten by many becauase media and our politicians decided politicize a heinous act that happened the next day also in Orlando, simply because that mad man, also American born, was Muslim..
Funny how few are talking about gun control and mental health.[/quote]
Especially when 2/3 of gun related deaths in the US are suicides. http://mobile.nytimes.com/2015/10/09/upshot/gun-deaths-are-mostly-suicides.html
And, 70% of the suicides are white males:
https://afsp.org/about-suicide/suicide-statistics/Therefore, close to 50% of US gun deaths are suicides committed by white men.
Interestingly, the suicide rate in the US is fairly average, which means the availability of guns, in large part, simply changes the means of suicide.
In any event – gun deaths are CLEARLY a mental health issue. The guy who wrote FREAKONOMICS said he had a series of five factors that could be used to pretty accurately predict who was a terrorist. My guess is that something similar could be done to identify dangerously unhinged types. Or, offer an enormous reward to those who thwart mass shootings. I’ll bet the Orlando shooter’s wife would have tipped off the authorities for $5 million.
June 18, 2016 at 6:51 AM #798807Hobie
ParticipantLooks like we’ve come full circle back to the mental health issue. How many of us have had experiences where someone stated that someone they know, worked with, etc. are next to go postal.
Problem is we don’t have a method of drawing a box around someone saying they are nuts and we have to limit their American rights.
Until that gets worked out, crazy will do what crazy does.
June 18, 2016 at 7:29 AM #798808Participant[quote=svelte][quote=zk][quote=svelte]
Because logical healthy minds do not commit mass murder.That’s why I don’t understand the “competent to stand trial” thing. People who murder multiple people that aren’t holding them captive (or similar) are not mentally competent.[/quote]
What about someone who commits a single murder? Does a logical, healthy mind commit a single murder?[/quote]
I think there are more reasonable situations where a single murder could be committed than multiple murders. It gets into more of a gray area. Perceptions of self defense can come into play as well as other situations. But yeah there can be cases where a single murder is done by a logical healthy mind. There are also cases where it is done with an unhealthy mind. It’s not as clear cut as going out and shooting everyone who happens to be in a particular building at a particular time. That’s always an unhealthy mind.[/quote]
We’re not really defining “deranged” or “healthy mind,” here, which makes it difficult to agree what we’re even talking about. A perfectly healthy mind wouldn’t even slap someone who didn’t deserve it, in my opinion. After that, it’s just degrees. And, if it’s just degrees, why are we punishing someone for wife beating but not someone who commits mass murder?
June 18, 2016 at 7:53 AM #798809ParticipantIf a person clearly has schizophrenia (the inability to differentiate fantasy from reality), that might be a different story. And that’s why we have the insanity defense. But I’ve seen no evidence that this jackass suffers from that. Only that he’s been a raging asshole his whole life.
June 18, 2016 at 5:22 PM #798834joec
ParticipantUnder the right stimulus, I think a perfectly sane/mind could do some pretty bad stuff.
Maybe it will be more targeted, but similar to road rage issues or people just being pissed at their situation or lot in life, a poor unconnected society leads to more of these blow ups.
I know of a divorced professional pretty ticked off at his situation who can decide to take it out.
Trying to correctly identify these things will be very hard and you will have tons of people probably locked up.
Sounds like that movie that locks people up before they commit the actual crime.
June 19, 2016 at 11:05 AM #798842GuestThe movie is minority report.
As a teenager, the shooter was taking steroids and drugs that he bought on the Internet. I think that screwed up his young brain. Plus, as njtosd said, his dad is delusional so there’s probably some inherited genetic mental problems.
I have a friend who’s alcoholic, overweight, lonely, and owns guns. He frequently talks about blowing trespassers’ brains out. In fact, he’s convinced there’s a lot a crime and he’s waiting for when he will pull the trigger. That’s whack. I can imagine a road rage incident or something grave. BTW, he’s not my friend anymore because I told him his life is fucked up.
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