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January 10, 2011 at 9:35 AM #651540January 10, 2011 at 9:37 AM #650436
Allan from Fallbrook
Participant[quote=briansd1]
I wonder how many mentally ill Americans are walking around untreated. [/quote]Brian: When I read some of your posts, I wonder exactly the same thing…
January 10, 2011 at 9:37 AM #650504Participant[quote=briansd1]
I wonder how many mentally ill Americans are walking around untreated. [/quote]Brian: When I read some of your posts, I wonder exactly the same thing…
January 10, 2011 at 9:37 AM #651086Participant[quote=briansd1]
I wonder how many mentally ill Americans are walking around untreated. [/quote]Brian: When I read some of your posts, I wonder exactly the same thing…
January 10, 2011 at 9:37 AM #651222Participant[quote=briansd1]
I wonder how many mentally ill Americans are walking around untreated. [/quote]Brian: When I read some of your posts, I wonder exactly the same thing…
January 10, 2011 at 9:37 AM #651545Participant[quote=briansd1]
I wonder how many mentally ill Americans are walking around untreated. [/quote]Brian: When I read some of your posts, I wonder exactly the same thing…
January 10, 2011 at 9:56 AM #650441Participant[quote=afx114]Here’s a good article with a historical perspective on political asassinations and their motives: http://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2011/01/the-cloudy-logic-of-political-shootings/69147/
The takeaway is that most of the time, an asassin’s political leanings generally have little or nothing to do with their actions, eg: Reagan was shot to impress Jodie Foster. However, causitic political environments create a scenario where a deranged individual can get more bang for their buck. So while this dude may not have been a card-carrying Tea Party member, he most certainly seized on the environment they have created to make a bigger statement than he otherwise could have.[/quote]
Afx: But, if we’re going to be fair, there was an element within the Democratic Party during the Bush (Dubya) years that actively agitated under the banner of “Bush = Hitler” and advocated for the assassination of a sitting president.
Both parties, GOP and Dems, have been co-opted by their most virulent and reactionary elements with a sadly predictable result. I don’t think this incident was that result; I think this incident was caused by a mentally ill person, but the tone and tenor of political discourse (such as it is) is much more vitriolic, with an undertone of repressed violence.
January 10, 2011 at 9:56 AM #650509Participant[quote=afx114]Here’s a good article with a historical perspective on political asassinations and their motives: http://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2011/01/the-cloudy-logic-of-political-shootings/69147/
The takeaway is that most of the time, an asassin’s political leanings generally have little or nothing to do with their actions, eg: Reagan was shot to impress Jodie Foster. However, causitic political environments create a scenario where a deranged individual can get more bang for their buck. So while this dude may not have been a card-carrying Tea Party member, he most certainly seized on the environment they have created to make a bigger statement than he otherwise could have.[/quote]
Afx: But, if we’re going to be fair, there was an element within the Democratic Party during the Bush (Dubya) years that actively agitated under the banner of “Bush = Hitler” and advocated for the assassination of a sitting president.
Both parties, GOP and Dems, have been co-opted by their most virulent and reactionary elements with a sadly predictable result. I don’t think this incident was that result; I think this incident was caused by a mentally ill person, but the tone and tenor of political discourse (such as it is) is much more vitriolic, with an undertone of repressed violence.
January 10, 2011 at 9:56 AM #651091Participant[quote=afx114]Here’s a good article with a historical perspective on political asassinations and their motives: http://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2011/01/the-cloudy-logic-of-political-shootings/69147/
The takeaway is that most of the time, an asassin’s political leanings generally have little or nothing to do with their actions, eg: Reagan was shot to impress Jodie Foster. However, causitic political environments create a scenario where a deranged individual can get more bang for their buck. So while this dude may not have been a card-carrying Tea Party member, he most certainly seized on the environment they have created to make a bigger statement than he otherwise could have.[/quote]
Afx: But, if we’re going to be fair, there was an element within the Democratic Party during the Bush (Dubya) years that actively agitated under the banner of “Bush = Hitler” and advocated for the assassination of a sitting president.
Both parties, GOP and Dems, have been co-opted by their most virulent and reactionary elements with a sadly predictable result. I don’t think this incident was that result; I think this incident was caused by a mentally ill person, but the tone and tenor of political discourse (such as it is) is much more vitriolic, with an undertone of repressed violence.
January 10, 2011 at 9:56 AM #651227Participant[quote=afx114]Here’s a good article with a historical perspective on political asassinations and their motives: http://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2011/01/the-cloudy-logic-of-political-shootings/69147/
The takeaway is that most of the time, an asassin’s political leanings generally have little or nothing to do with their actions, eg: Reagan was shot to impress Jodie Foster. However, causitic political environments create a scenario where a deranged individual can get more bang for their buck. So while this dude may not have been a card-carrying Tea Party member, he most certainly seized on the environment they have created to make a bigger statement than he otherwise could have.[/quote]
Afx: But, if we’re going to be fair, there was an element within the Democratic Party during the Bush (Dubya) years that actively agitated under the banner of “Bush = Hitler” and advocated for the assassination of a sitting president.
Both parties, GOP and Dems, have been co-opted by their most virulent and reactionary elements with a sadly predictable result. I don’t think this incident was that result; I think this incident was caused by a mentally ill person, but the tone and tenor of political discourse (such as it is) is much more vitriolic, with an undertone of repressed violence.
January 10, 2011 at 9:56 AM #651550Participant[quote=afx114]Here’s a good article with a historical perspective on political asassinations and their motives: http://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2011/01/the-cloudy-logic-of-political-shootings/69147/
The takeaway is that most of the time, an asassin’s political leanings generally have little or nothing to do with their actions, eg: Reagan was shot to impress Jodie Foster. However, causitic political environments create a scenario where a deranged individual can get more bang for their buck. So while this dude may not have been a card-carrying Tea Party member, he most certainly seized on the environment they have created to make a bigger statement than he otherwise could have.[/quote]
Afx: But, if we’re going to be fair, there was an element within the Democratic Party during the Bush (Dubya) years that actively agitated under the banner of “Bush = Hitler” and advocated for the assassination of a sitting president.
Both parties, GOP and Dems, have been co-opted by their most virulent and reactionary elements with a sadly predictable result. I don’t think this incident was that result; I think this incident was caused by a mentally ill person, but the tone and tenor of political discourse (such as it is) is much more vitriolic, with an undertone of repressed violence.
January 10, 2011 at 10:24 AM #650461afx114
ParticipantAgreed that there exists vitriolic assholes on both sides, but it’s a false equivalency to compare any of the left’s ill-advised statements to the right’s gleeful fetishization of guns, “don’t retreat, reload!”, “renewing the tree of liberty” and “2nd amendment remedies.” The comparison doesn’t even come close. I really was hoping the discussion wouldn’t turn into a left-vs-right thing, but it almost begs it.
Even if his personal motivations weren’t political, the fact that his target was a politician makes this an inherently political attack. Events like this don’t happen in a vacuum.
Would the narrative be different if it was a Republican that was targeted? You bet your ass. A stoner who reads the Communist Manifesto attempts to assassinate a Republican Congresswoman? How do you think that would be playing on Fox News?
And what if the kids name was Amir Aalam Hussein?
January 10, 2011 at 10:24 AM #650529ParticipantAgreed that there exists vitriolic assholes on both sides, but it’s a false equivalency to compare any of the left’s ill-advised statements to the right’s gleeful fetishization of guns, “don’t retreat, reload!”, “renewing the tree of liberty” and “2nd amendment remedies.” The comparison doesn’t even come close. I really was hoping the discussion wouldn’t turn into a left-vs-right thing, but it almost begs it.
Even if his personal motivations weren’t political, the fact that his target was a politician makes this an inherently political attack. Events like this don’t happen in a vacuum.
Would the narrative be different if it was a Republican that was targeted? You bet your ass. A stoner who reads the Communist Manifesto attempts to assassinate a Republican Congresswoman? How do you think that would be playing on Fox News?
And what if the kids name was Amir Aalam Hussein?
January 10, 2011 at 10:24 AM #651111ParticipantAgreed that there exists vitriolic assholes on both sides, but it’s a false equivalency to compare any of the left’s ill-advised statements to the right’s gleeful fetishization of guns, “don’t retreat, reload!”, “renewing the tree of liberty” and “2nd amendment remedies.” The comparison doesn’t even come close. I really was hoping the discussion wouldn’t turn into a left-vs-right thing, but it almost begs it.
Even if his personal motivations weren’t political, the fact that his target was a politician makes this an inherently political attack. Events like this don’t happen in a vacuum.
Would the narrative be different if it was a Republican that was targeted? You bet your ass. A stoner who reads the Communist Manifesto attempts to assassinate a Republican Congresswoman? How do you think that would be playing on Fox News?
And what if the kids name was Amir Aalam Hussein?
January 10, 2011 at 10:24 AM #651247ParticipantAgreed that there exists vitriolic assholes on both sides, but it’s a false equivalency to compare any of the left’s ill-advised statements to the right’s gleeful fetishization of guns, “don’t retreat, reload!”, “renewing the tree of liberty” and “2nd amendment remedies.” The comparison doesn’t even come close. I really was hoping the discussion wouldn’t turn into a left-vs-right thing, but it almost begs it.
Even if his personal motivations weren’t political, the fact that his target was a politician makes this an inherently political attack. Events like this don’t happen in a vacuum.
Would the narrative be different if it was a Republican that was targeted? You bet your ass. A stoner who reads the Communist Manifesto attempts to assassinate a Republican Congresswoman? How do you think that would be playing on Fox News?
And what if the kids name was Amir Aalam Hussein?
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