Military Times calls for Firing of Rumsfeld

[Anonymous]

Fine commentary, PD; thanks.

zk, it was not a mistake to invade Iraq. Why? The underlying gamble was that we could create a democracy in an Arab nation, which would domino to the other Arab nations. Democracy would provide an outlet for addressing the rightful resentment of the Arabs against their governments. Wisely, the Saudis exported those homegrown Wahabi terrorists. Now, those Wahabi terrorists are everyone else’s problem. Sure, maybe we could have started regime change with Saudi Arabia instead of Iraq. But, if we did such, we surely would have had the Chinese, Russians, and French to fight right away, given Saudi Arabia’s oil.

That was the bet. You may disagree with it. But, Bush clearly laid that out as the gameplan. I found the logic compelling.

Such can work, still. But only if we more aggressively fight, disregarding the opinion of the leftists and media.

[PerryChase]

Making it nice for the bleeding hearts?! Come on, Bush had all the power for 6 years. He could’ve done (and did) what he wanted. Don’t blame the opposition, blame the people in power.

Conservative always say that you have to confess and repent for heading down the wrong path. Iraq was a mistake. The least the Republicans could do is come clean and admit it. Look at Arnold, he did and won by a landslide.

Until Bush says that Iraq was a mistake (or until a change in the executive) none of our allies around the world will want to help us. The only way America can “win” in Iraq is with the support of the world community. There’s a price to be paid for hubris.

We are advocating freedom and democracy. PD, are you suggesting we throw that out the window and plunder Iraq and subjugate its people to our will?

[PD]

Perry, although you like to think your beloved democrats have no power or say, Bush does not have the powers of a dictator. The way this war has been fought has been determined by public sentiment to a significant degree. All that anti-US reporting and the quick rush to condemn any collateral damage severely impacted how we fought and how we are fighting.

Once again, Perry, you avoid the real meat of the matter (what should we do now) and point fingers. Quit whining and produce a solution.

We need to protect and nurture our own country ahead of all others.

[qcomer]

The ignorance of republicans or Americans in general about the arab world reminds me of the ignorance/disrespect some ultra liberals show to the religious/cultural values of real americans and are bashed by republicans for their arrogance and for just not “getting it”. Yet their own policies towards middle east are arrogantly idealistic, far from ground realities of the ME and just plain ignorant of real values of the arab/ME/muslim world.

I like republicans for their practical approaches to problems. But for some reason, with Iraq, they opted for a stupid/arrogant/ignorant ideology of the neo cons. What historical parallels (in MidEast) do you have of an invasion bringing in democracy AND stability to the region? Even if you succeed in stabilising Iraq, what makes you think it will cause Saud family to allow elections and what makes you think muslims there will not choose another Hamas type? What did the democratically elected Hamas administration brought to the table for Americans? You had democratically elected govts in Pakistan from 1988-1999, in which it became real breeding ground of terrorism and training centre for Talebans. Today, if Pakistanis can choose a govt, they will over-throw Mush in a blink. If you consider democracy as an ideological silver bullet to the problem of Islamic fundamentalism then why not start with countries that are real problems like Saud’s/Pakistan/Iran? The whole idea of democracy bringing stability to the middle east with Iraq acting as a beacon of freedom and bearer of American interests, is just loonie.

[zk]

First of all, jg, by saying that the gamble was that we could create a democracy in an Arab nation, you are admitting that bush lied to us by giving us several other reasons for invading Iraq. “Bush clearly laid (the domino theory) out as the gameplan.” Maybe after it became obvious that there were no WMDs he did. But not while he was convincing everyone we should invade.

Second, there was plenty of evidence that trying to turn a country with the culture of Iraq’s into a democracy by force wouldn’t work. The bush administration chose to ignore that evidence and thousands of our soldiers are now dead because of it. To assume that we can invade a country and it will turn into a democracy is ridiculous. To not have known that beforehand put the bush administration in the minority.

Third, even if our plan of creating democracy which would magically create other democracies (explain how that would happen, please), what would we get out of that? “Democracy would provide an outlet for addressing the rightful resentment of the Arabs against their governments.” As if anybody in the bush administration gives the tiniest bit of a damn about the people of the middle east. Less terrorism? Maybe. If the democracy dominoes actually fell. Even then maybe not. But if we can’t create one democracy despite all the force of the mightiest military in the history of humankind, then what makes you think Iran and Syria will magically turn into democracies on their own?

So, to answer your question, the war was a mistake because we’ve killed thousands of Americans, maimed tens of thousands of Americans, spent trillions of Americans’ dollars, angered the world, created more and angrier terrorists, and all for the pursuit of a goal that only one who possesses the arrogance and ignorance of the current president actually thought could be accomplished.

[Anonymous]

Solution to Iraq:
Step 1: Replace leadership
Step 2: New leadership develop plan to clean up the mess left by previous leadership

Step 1 partially accomplished.

[JES]

ZK –

You managed to capitalize the words ‘Arab’ (twice), ‘Iran’ and ‘Syria’, but left ‘Bush’ lowercased four times. This seems like a very passive aggressive way of showcasing your disdain for the President. Are we to assume that you have more respect for Iran and Syria than you do for Bush? I’m not a big fan of his either, but I still respect the office that he holds.

[PerryChase]

Was listening to some of Rumsfeld’s notable quotes. I’m going to miss his colorful press conferences.

[blahblahblah]

I’ll miss not only Rumsfeld’s amazing poetry, but also his 1000 Fighting Styles.

[Anonymous]

zk, sometimes you’ve just got to do what hasn’t been done before: democratize the Muslims (Ottoman Empire/Turkey), democratize Japan, pacify/return to democracy Germany. Otherwise, you have to deal with a bigger problem, later.

We differ: I believe that the terrorists are coming our way. They tried to blow up the World Trade Center in ’93, plotted to blow up a series of U.S.-bound planes via the Bojinka plot in the mid ’90s, etc. We can defeat the terrorists now, in Iraq, before they get nukes. Or, we can wash our hands of Iraq now, wait a few years for some nukes to hit the U.S., then deal with the terrorists thereafter.

[zk]

JES,

I respect the citizens of Iran and Syria. Not their leaders or their system of government. I have no respect whatsoever for gwb.

As far as respecting the “office that he holds,” to be honest with you, I’m not even sure what that means. Sure, it’s probably the most powerful position in the world. But does that mean that any person who holds that office deserves respect? Of course not. Does it mean that if I show no respect for bush that I have no respect for his office? I don’t think it does. But I don’t know for sure because, like I said, I’m not sure what that means. In any case, I have no respect for the man, and it is the man, not the office, for whom I hold very great contempt and disgust.

[zk]

“We differ: I believe that the terrorists are coming our way.”

No, we agree on that. I also believe that they’re coming our way. And I think that we should do everything that we can to stop them. But we’re busy using all the resources we could be using toward that goal on invading a country that had nothing to do with 9/11 and very little to do with terrorism in general. We’ve wasted so much and accomplished so little. In fact, we’ve wasted so much and we’ve gone backwards. If we’d spent so much in lives and money and world political capital on actually fighting the terrorists rather than pursuing the neocons’ goal, we’d probably have gotten a lot closer to keeping the terrorists from coming our way.

[PD]

So the enemy of your enemy is your friend, zk? Those some citizens you respect so much would love to vaporize you, your family and your friends.
I’m no friend of Syria or Iran.

[blahblahblah]

I think Rumsfeld has resigned his position so that he can take the fight directly to the terrorists using his 1000 Fighting Styles! Twin Cobra Fist! HAAAAAIYAAH!!

[Anonymous]

PD, do you really believe the average citizens of Iran and Syria want to kill Americans? I suspect you have not been out of the Unites States very much (if at all) based on your apparent ignorance and lack of respect for other cultures.

[Author]

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