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May 7, 2008 at 1:05 AM #200318May 7, 2008 at 1:55 AM #200197
orthofrancis
ParticipantSUV’s are 6x more likely to kill occupants of other vehicles
http://www.crashtest.com/explanations/safety/index.htm
In single vehicle crashes they contribute almost half the deaths despite being a significantly smaller percentage of vehicles.People in SUVs and Pick ups were 11% MORE LIKELY to die than people in cars
http://www.autosafety.org/article.php?did=949&scid=7SUV are also lousy at avoiding crashes
http://www.gladwell.com/pdf/suv.pdfPick up trucks are basically death traps – death rates (deaths per miles traveled) were approximately 50% higher than SUVs, and roughly 3x higher than cars
http://books.google.com/books?id=lZ2ojjLs658C&pg=PA62&lpg=PA62&dq=suv+death+rate+compare&source=web&ots=D4dVXGpnlU&sig=YWu8KdOCsQ_HE6BIqSuNvCwTElY&hl=en#PPA64,M1I’d rather avoid the whole accident in the first place with a good handling car, than rely on being hit, and hoping that you come out ok.
May 7, 2008 at 1:55 AM #200241ParticipantSUV’s are 6x more likely to kill occupants of other vehicles
http://www.crashtest.com/explanations/safety/index.htm
In single vehicle crashes they contribute almost half the deaths despite being a significantly smaller percentage of vehicles.People in SUVs and Pick ups were 11% MORE LIKELY to die than people in cars
http://www.autosafety.org/article.php?did=949&scid=7SUV are also lousy at avoiding crashes
http://www.gladwell.com/pdf/suv.pdfPick up trucks are basically death traps – death rates (deaths per miles traveled) were approximately 50% higher than SUVs, and roughly 3x higher than cars
http://books.google.com/books?id=lZ2ojjLs658C&pg=PA62&lpg=PA62&dq=suv+death+rate+compare&source=web&ots=D4dVXGpnlU&sig=YWu8KdOCsQ_HE6BIqSuNvCwTElY&hl=en#PPA64,M1I’d rather avoid the whole accident in the first place with a good handling car, than rely on being hit, and hoping that you come out ok.
May 7, 2008 at 1:55 AM #200266ParticipantSUV’s are 6x more likely to kill occupants of other vehicles
http://www.crashtest.com/explanations/safety/index.htm
In single vehicle crashes they contribute almost half the deaths despite being a significantly smaller percentage of vehicles.People in SUVs and Pick ups were 11% MORE LIKELY to die than people in cars
http://www.autosafety.org/article.php?did=949&scid=7SUV are also lousy at avoiding crashes
http://www.gladwell.com/pdf/suv.pdfPick up trucks are basically death traps – death rates (deaths per miles traveled) were approximately 50% higher than SUVs, and roughly 3x higher than cars
http://books.google.com/books?id=lZ2ojjLs658C&pg=PA62&lpg=PA62&dq=suv+death+rate+compare&source=web&ots=D4dVXGpnlU&sig=YWu8KdOCsQ_HE6BIqSuNvCwTElY&hl=en#PPA64,M1I’d rather avoid the whole accident in the first place with a good handling car, than rely on being hit, and hoping that you come out ok.
May 7, 2008 at 1:55 AM #200290ParticipantSUV’s are 6x more likely to kill occupants of other vehicles
http://www.crashtest.com/explanations/safety/index.htm
In single vehicle crashes they contribute almost half the deaths despite being a significantly smaller percentage of vehicles.People in SUVs and Pick ups were 11% MORE LIKELY to die than people in cars
http://www.autosafety.org/article.php?did=949&scid=7SUV are also lousy at avoiding crashes
http://www.gladwell.com/pdf/suv.pdfPick up trucks are basically death traps – death rates (deaths per miles traveled) were approximately 50% higher than SUVs, and roughly 3x higher than cars
http://books.google.com/books?id=lZ2ojjLs658C&pg=PA62&lpg=PA62&dq=suv+death+rate+compare&source=web&ots=D4dVXGpnlU&sig=YWu8KdOCsQ_HE6BIqSuNvCwTElY&hl=en#PPA64,M1I’d rather avoid the whole accident in the first place with a good handling car, than rely on being hit, and hoping that you come out ok.
May 7, 2008 at 1:55 AM #200325ParticipantSUV’s are 6x more likely to kill occupants of other vehicles
http://www.crashtest.com/explanations/safety/index.htm
In single vehicle crashes they contribute almost half the deaths despite being a significantly smaller percentage of vehicles.People in SUVs and Pick ups were 11% MORE LIKELY to die than people in cars
http://www.autosafety.org/article.php?did=949&scid=7SUV are also lousy at avoiding crashes
http://www.gladwell.com/pdf/suv.pdfPick up trucks are basically death traps – death rates (deaths per miles traveled) were approximately 50% higher than SUVs, and roughly 3x higher than cars
http://books.google.com/books?id=lZ2ojjLs658C&pg=PA62&lpg=PA62&dq=suv+death+rate+compare&source=web&ots=D4dVXGpnlU&sig=YWu8KdOCsQ_HE6BIqSuNvCwTElY&hl=en#PPA64,M1I’d rather avoid the whole accident in the first place with a good handling car, than rely on being hit, and hoping that you come out ok.
May 7, 2008 at 4:15 AM #200202luchabee
ParticipantOrthfrancis:
What? When I went to your link, this is what it said:
Size & Weight Matters – All cars must meet US Department Of Transportation standards for crash-worthiness. Larger and heavier cars, however, are usually safer in a collision than smaller ones. In relation to their numbers on the road, small cars account for more than twice as many deaths as large cars. If a heavier vehicle collides head-on with a lighter one, the lighter vehicle and its occupants will suffer substantially more damage.
Anyway, to maybe put away this unending series of random statistics, you are far more safer in driving a larger car period, according to IIHS data, with SUVs being anywhere from 2 to 5 times more safe than small cars.
Specifically, here is a partial source from Edmunds.com for deaths based on car type. Edmunds.com and the Insurance Institue for Highway Safety, I would assume, are obviously tools of the conservative right and those who love “destroying the environment” by driving an SUV. : )
——————————————————–
Edmunds.com article on higher fatality rates with smaller cars based on 2005 Insurance Institute Data
———————————————————Consumers shopping for a fuel-efficient vehicle will probably gravitate toward smaller cars. But by doing so will they put themselves at risk in the event of an accident?
The cold hard facts show that smaller, lighter cars are generally less safe than larger heavier cars. However, there is still a lot you can do to choose the safest small cars. But first, let’s start with a little background.
. . .
Furthermore, the numbers don’t bode well for small cars.
In the latest crash figures available from 2005, provided by the Insurance Institute for Highway Safety (see chart below), there were 144 fatalities per million registered vehicles for the smallest cars. That figure drops to 106 fatalities for the next larger class of cars. For large sedans, that number drops to 67 per million. For small SUVs, the figure was 60 deaths per million as compared with 48 for large SUVs. For pickups, totals increased to 122 per million for small trucks and 104 per million for large.
Clearly, larger cars tend to have fewer fatalities. But remember to put these figures into perspective. These figures are comparing the differences per million registered vehicles. . .
Meanwhile, large sedans, which are both heavier and better equipped, show the lowest totals. Still, how you drive is obviously an important factor in the process.
Driver deaths per million registered passenger vehicles 1-3 years old, 2005
Vehicle Size Rate
Car — Mini 144
Car — Small 106
Car — Midsize 70
Car — Large 67
Car — Very Large 44
Pickup — Small 122
Pickup — Large 104
Pickup — Very Large 101
SUV — Small 60
SUV — Midsize 57
SUV — Large 48
SUV — Very Large 24For the entire article, go to: http://www.edmunds.com/ownership/safety/articles/106748/article.html
May 7, 2008 at 4:15 AM #200245ParticipantOrthfrancis:
What? When I went to your link, this is what it said:
Size & Weight Matters – All cars must meet US Department Of Transportation standards for crash-worthiness. Larger and heavier cars, however, are usually safer in a collision than smaller ones. In relation to their numbers on the road, small cars account for more than twice as many deaths as large cars. If a heavier vehicle collides head-on with a lighter one, the lighter vehicle and its occupants will suffer substantially more damage.
Anyway, to maybe put away this unending series of random statistics, you are far more safer in driving a larger car period, according to IIHS data, with SUVs being anywhere from 2 to 5 times more safe than small cars.
Specifically, here is a partial source from Edmunds.com for deaths based on car type. Edmunds.com and the Insurance Institue for Highway Safety, I would assume, are obviously tools of the conservative right and those who love “destroying the environment” by driving an SUV. : )
——————————————————–
Edmunds.com article on higher fatality rates with smaller cars based on 2005 Insurance Institute Data
———————————————————Consumers shopping for a fuel-efficient vehicle will probably gravitate toward smaller cars. But by doing so will they put themselves at risk in the event of an accident?
The cold hard facts show that smaller, lighter cars are generally less safe than larger heavier cars. However, there is still a lot you can do to choose the safest small cars. But first, let’s start with a little background.
. . .
Furthermore, the numbers don’t bode well for small cars.
In the latest crash figures available from 2005, provided by the Insurance Institute for Highway Safety (see chart below), there were 144 fatalities per million registered vehicles for the smallest cars. That figure drops to 106 fatalities for the next larger class of cars. For large sedans, that number drops to 67 per million. For small SUVs, the figure was 60 deaths per million as compared with 48 for large SUVs. For pickups, totals increased to 122 per million for small trucks and 104 per million for large.
Clearly, larger cars tend to have fewer fatalities. But remember to put these figures into perspective. These figures are comparing the differences per million registered vehicles. . .
Meanwhile, large sedans, which are both heavier and better equipped, show the lowest totals. Still, how you drive is obviously an important factor in the process.
Driver deaths per million registered passenger vehicles 1-3 years old, 2005
Vehicle Size Rate
Car — Mini 144
Car — Small 106
Car — Midsize 70
Car — Large 67
Car — Very Large 44
Pickup — Small 122
Pickup — Large 104
Pickup — Very Large 101
SUV — Small 60
SUV — Midsize 57
SUV — Large 48
SUV — Very Large 24For the entire article, go to: http://www.edmunds.com/ownership/safety/articles/106748/article.html
May 7, 2008 at 4:15 AM #200271ParticipantOrthfrancis:
What? When I went to your link, this is what it said:
Size & Weight Matters – All cars must meet US Department Of Transportation standards for crash-worthiness. Larger and heavier cars, however, are usually safer in a collision than smaller ones. In relation to their numbers on the road, small cars account for more than twice as many deaths as large cars. If a heavier vehicle collides head-on with a lighter one, the lighter vehicle and its occupants will suffer substantially more damage.
Anyway, to maybe put away this unending series of random statistics, you are far more safer in driving a larger car period, according to IIHS data, with SUVs being anywhere from 2 to 5 times more safe than small cars.
Specifically, here is a partial source from Edmunds.com for deaths based on car type. Edmunds.com and the Insurance Institue for Highway Safety, I would assume, are obviously tools of the conservative right and those who love “destroying the environment” by driving an SUV. : )
——————————————————–
Edmunds.com article on higher fatality rates with smaller cars based on 2005 Insurance Institute Data
———————————————————Consumers shopping for a fuel-efficient vehicle will probably gravitate toward smaller cars. But by doing so will they put themselves at risk in the event of an accident?
The cold hard facts show that smaller, lighter cars are generally less safe than larger heavier cars. However, there is still a lot you can do to choose the safest small cars. But first, let’s start with a little background.
. . .
Furthermore, the numbers don’t bode well for small cars.
In the latest crash figures available from 2005, provided by the Insurance Institute for Highway Safety (see chart below), there were 144 fatalities per million registered vehicles for the smallest cars. That figure drops to 106 fatalities for the next larger class of cars. For large sedans, that number drops to 67 per million. For small SUVs, the figure was 60 deaths per million as compared with 48 for large SUVs. For pickups, totals increased to 122 per million for small trucks and 104 per million for large.
Clearly, larger cars tend to have fewer fatalities. But remember to put these figures into perspective. These figures are comparing the differences per million registered vehicles. . .
Meanwhile, large sedans, which are both heavier and better equipped, show the lowest totals. Still, how you drive is obviously an important factor in the process.
Driver deaths per million registered passenger vehicles 1-3 years old, 2005
Vehicle Size Rate
Car — Mini 144
Car — Small 106
Car — Midsize 70
Car — Large 67
Car — Very Large 44
Pickup — Small 122
Pickup — Large 104
Pickup — Very Large 101
SUV — Small 60
SUV — Midsize 57
SUV — Large 48
SUV — Very Large 24For the entire article, go to: http://www.edmunds.com/ownership/safety/articles/106748/article.html
May 7, 2008 at 4:15 AM #200295ParticipantOrthfrancis:
What? When I went to your link, this is what it said:
Size & Weight Matters – All cars must meet US Department Of Transportation standards for crash-worthiness. Larger and heavier cars, however, are usually safer in a collision than smaller ones. In relation to their numbers on the road, small cars account for more than twice as many deaths as large cars. If a heavier vehicle collides head-on with a lighter one, the lighter vehicle and its occupants will suffer substantially more damage.
Anyway, to maybe put away this unending series of random statistics, you are far more safer in driving a larger car period, according to IIHS data, with SUVs being anywhere from 2 to 5 times more safe than small cars.
Specifically, here is a partial source from Edmunds.com for deaths based on car type. Edmunds.com and the Insurance Institue for Highway Safety, I would assume, are obviously tools of the conservative right and those who love “destroying the environment” by driving an SUV. : )
——————————————————–
Edmunds.com article on higher fatality rates with smaller cars based on 2005 Insurance Institute Data
———————————————————Consumers shopping for a fuel-efficient vehicle will probably gravitate toward smaller cars. But by doing so will they put themselves at risk in the event of an accident?
The cold hard facts show that smaller, lighter cars are generally less safe than larger heavier cars. However, there is still a lot you can do to choose the safest small cars. But first, let’s start with a little background.
. . .
Furthermore, the numbers don’t bode well for small cars.
In the latest crash figures available from 2005, provided by the Insurance Institute for Highway Safety (see chart below), there were 144 fatalities per million registered vehicles for the smallest cars. That figure drops to 106 fatalities for the next larger class of cars. For large sedans, that number drops to 67 per million. For small SUVs, the figure was 60 deaths per million as compared with 48 for large SUVs. For pickups, totals increased to 122 per million for small trucks and 104 per million for large.
Clearly, larger cars tend to have fewer fatalities. But remember to put these figures into perspective. These figures are comparing the differences per million registered vehicles. . .
Meanwhile, large sedans, which are both heavier and better equipped, show the lowest totals. Still, how you drive is obviously an important factor in the process.
Driver deaths per million registered passenger vehicles 1-3 years old, 2005
Vehicle Size Rate
Car — Mini 144
Car — Small 106
Car — Midsize 70
Car — Large 67
Car — Very Large 44
Pickup — Small 122
Pickup — Large 104
Pickup — Very Large 101
SUV — Small 60
SUV — Midsize 57
SUV — Large 48
SUV — Very Large 24For the entire article, go to: http://www.edmunds.com/ownership/safety/articles/106748/article.html
May 7, 2008 at 4:15 AM #200330ParticipantOrthfrancis:
What? When I went to your link, this is what it said:
Size & Weight Matters – All cars must meet US Department Of Transportation standards for crash-worthiness. Larger and heavier cars, however, are usually safer in a collision than smaller ones. In relation to their numbers on the road, small cars account for more than twice as many deaths as large cars. If a heavier vehicle collides head-on with a lighter one, the lighter vehicle and its occupants will suffer substantially more damage.
Anyway, to maybe put away this unending series of random statistics, you are far more safer in driving a larger car period, according to IIHS data, with SUVs being anywhere from 2 to 5 times more safe than small cars.
Specifically, here is a partial source from Edmunds.com for deaths based on car type. Edmunds.com and the Insurance Institue for Highway Safety, I would assume, are obviously tools of the conservative right and those who love “destroying the environment” by driving an SUV. : )
——————————————————–
Edmunds.com article on higher fatality rates with smaller cars based on 2005 Insurance Institute Data
———————————————————Consumers shopping for a fuel-efficient vehicle will probably gravitate toward smaller cars. But by doing so will they put themselves at risk in the event of an accident?
The cold hard facts show that smaller, lighter cars are generally less safe than larger heavier cars. However, there is still a lot you can do to choose the safest small cars. But first, let’s start with a little background.
. . .
Furthermore, the numbers don’t bode well for small cars.
In the latest crash figures available from 2005, provided by the Insurance Institute for Highway Safety (see chart below), there were 144 fatalities per million registered vehicles for the smallest cars. That figure drops to 106 fatalities for the next larger class of cars. For large sedans, that number drops to 67 per million. For small SUVs, the figure was 60 deaths per million as compared with 48 for large SUVs. For pickups, totals increased to 122 per million for small trucks and 104 per million for large.
Clearly, larger cars tend to have fewer fatalities. But remember to put these figures into perspective. These figures are comparing the differences per million registered vehicles. . .
Meanwhile, large sedans, which are both heavier and better equipped, show the lowest totals. Still, how you drive is obviously an important factor in the process.
Driver deaths per million registered passenger vehicles 1-3 years old, 2005
Vehicle Size Rate
Car — Mini 144
Car — Small 106
Car — Midsize 70
Car — Large 67
Car — Very Large 44
Pickup — Small 122
Pickup — Large 104
Pickup — Very Large 101
SUV — Small 60
SUV — Midsize 57
SUV — Large 48
SUV — Very Large 24For the entire article, go to: http://www.edmunds.com/ownership/safety/articles/106748/article.html
May 7, 2008 at 6:13 AM #200222
CoronitaParticipant…
</i>
</i>
</i>
Damn italics.
I dont think we'll get any agreement on this subject matter, especially in CA where people love their cars. (Guilty myself as charged). So I don't think there's really a point debating this. If you'd rather drive what you drive, civics, prius, toyota, whatever, well whatever floats your boat.
Personally, I'd prefer to stick my wife and toddler strapped in an well designed , IIHS rated good/good/good Acura CUV with sufficient size and height without fear of it tipping over because I know my wife doesn't drive like a maniac like me. And I prefer to stick my toddler in the center of the middle row, leaving the third row completely unused, and leaving sufficient room for side/curtain airbags to deploy in the event of side collision. And yes I spent a lot of money buying a decent quality child car seat I could find, based on countless reviews, personal recommendations,etc. (Britax Boulevard with side impact protection if any expecting parents are reading
http://www.babyuniverse.com/Britax-Boulevard-Car-Seats/PID/4809834/ctid/17/INstock/Y/D/?_ts=A006
…FYI, Recaro also makes a great seat that would have been my top choice, but unfortunately isn't rear facing, so I couldn't use it for what we needed at the time, http://www.recarochildseats.com/sportChildSeats.asp).
And personally, I like driving a peppy sedan/coupe 4 banger better than an suv, despite my sedan getting worse gas mileage than my wife's suv.
Yes a lot of americans really can't afford what they drive. Yes, not everyone can afford to buy/lease an vehicle that is more expensive to operate that your traditional nip 4 banger. And yes, a lot of americans got in over their heads with consuming well beyond their means, so what's new….Yes, SUV and even CUV sales are going to tank with higher gas prices, and their will be fewer on the road long term, just like I'm sure there will be fewer bimmers, audis, mercs on the road.
No, this won't eliminate all SUV's from the road. Even with $5 gas prices or $10 gas prices, some of us will still drive around cars/SUVs/trucks, albeit more conservatively than this. Some of us don't lease our take out an upside down loan on cars, just like some of us never buy used cars for whatever reasons. Life isn't fair, and regulations aren't fair. Trivial fact an high powered sports sedan like an M3,M5,S4,RS4, or Merc AMG product most likely carries a gas guzzler tax. But taking hypothetically, if you took the same engine or a larger consuming engine and putting into an SUV/CUV, there isn't any gas guzzler tax. That's why if you buy an AMG M CUV, you won't pay gas guzzler, or a Q7 4.2, or a X5, or a XC90(though they are more efficient i think)..There are even subsidies if you use large/heavy SUVs/trucks for businesses. Yes, it's unfair, that's life. Write a letter to your senator and bitch about it if it bothers you.
No, $10 gas prices wouldn't be good for everyone. Because unless you are fool and think things like food/water/etc gets transported in electric powered semi-trucks, or feel comfortable flying in a solar powered 747, most likely the cost of transportation will be passed along to people like you and me, in which inevitability, you will suffer indirectly. (If any of you are doing any remodeling now, I feel sorry for you, because you are surely paying a lot more for concrete and slab stone than a few years ago. ) And I assure you $10/gallon gas prices will imply we will have a lot more problems than just folks tooting around in an SUV.
The good news is among most of us "dumb" americans who will suffer in the short term with rising prices of transportation, commodities,etc, there are a few of us ('us' being americans) who are smarter than the rest of us who will inevitability put their brilliant minds to tackle this problem like they tackled every other problem) and engineer new solutions to take us out of this mess, and make the lives for the rest of us better (and hopefully those folks will be financially/socially rewarded for doing so)….because like it or not, this country has some of the most brilliant minds in all fields. Americans are creative and if push comes to shove, someone will find an answer to our problems.
Until then, I'll drive my fat ass CUV and 4 banger that tanks premium grade fuel, thank you very much.
[img_assist|nid=5962|title=selfportrait|desc=|link=node|align=left|width=100|height=80]
—– Sour grapes for everyone!
May 7, 2008 at 6:13 AM #200264CoronitaParticipant…
</i>
</i>
</i>
Damn italics.
I dont think we'll get any agreement on this subject matter, especially in CA where people love their cars. (Guilty myself as charged). So I don't think there's really a point debating this. If you'd rather drive what you drive, civics, prius, toyota, whatever, well whatever floats your boat.
Personally, I'd prefer to stick my wife and toddler strapped in an well designed , IIHS rated good/good/good Acura CUV with sufficient size and height without fear of it tipping over because I know my wife doesn't drive like a maniac like me. And I prefer to stick my toddler in the center of the middle row, leaving the third row completely unused, and leaving sufficient room for side/curtain airbags to deploy in the event of side collision. And yes I spent a lot of money buying a decent quality child car seat I could find, based on countless reviews, personal recommendations,etc. (Britax Boulevard with side impact protection if any expecting parents are reading
http://www.babyuniverse.com/Britax-Boulevard-Car-Seats/PID/4809834/ctid/17/INstock/Y/D/?_ts=A006
…FYI, Recaro also makes a great seat that would have been my top choice, but unfortunately isn't rear facing, so I couldn't use it for what we needed at the time, http://www.recarochildseats.com/sportChildSeats.asp).
And personally, I like driving a peppy sedan/coupe 4 banger better than an suv, despite my sedan getting worse gas mileage than my wife's suv.
Yes a lot of americans really can't afford what they drive. Yes, not everyone can afford to buy/lease an vehicle that is more expensive to operate that your traditional nip 4 banger. And yes, a lot of americans got in over their heads with consuming well beyond their means, so what's new….Yes, SUV and even CUV sales are going to tank with higher gas prices, and their will be fewer on the road long term, just like I'm sure there will be fewer bimmers, audis, mercs on the road.
No, this won't eliminate all SUV's from the road. Even with $5 gas prices or $10 gas prices, some of us will still drive around cars/SUVs/trucks, albeit more conservatively than this. Some of us don't lease our take out an upside down loan on cars, just like some of us never buy used cars for whatever reasons. Life isn't fair, and regulations aren't fair. Trivial fact an high powered sports sedan like an M3,M5,S4,RS4, or Merc AMG product most likely carries a gas guzzler tax. But taking hypothetically, if you took the same engine or a larger consuming engine and putting into an SUV/CUV, there isn't any gas guzzler tax. That's why if you buy an AMG M CUV, you won't pay gas guzzler, or a Q7 4.2, or a X5, or a XC90(though they are more efficient i think)..There are even subsidies if you use large/heavy SUVs/trucks for businesses. Yes, it's unfair, that's life. Write a letter to your senator and bitch about it if it bothers you.
No, $10 gas prices wouldn't be good for everyone. Because unless you are fool and think things like food/water/etc gets transported in electric powered semi-trucks, or feel comfortable flying in a solar powered 747, most likely the cost of transportation will be passed along to people like you and me, in which inevitability, you will suffer indirectly. (If any of you are doing any remodeling now, I feel sorry for you, because you are surely paying a lot more for concrete and slab stone than a few years ago. ) And I assure you $10/gallon gas prices will imply we will have a lot more problems than just folks tooting around in an SUV.
The good news is among most of us "dumb" americans who will suffer in the short term with rising prices of transportation, commodities,etc, there are a few of us ('us' being americans) who are smarter than the rest of us who will inevitability put their brilliant minds to tackle this problem like they tackled every other problem) and engineer new solutions to take us out of this mess, and make the lives for the rest of us better (and hopefully those folks will be financially/socially rewarded for doing so)….because like it or not, this country has some of the most brilliant minds in all fields. Americans are creative and if push comes to shove, someone will find an answer to our problems.
Until then, I'll drive my fat ass CUV and 4 banger that tanks premium grade fuel, thank you very much.
[img_assist|nid=5962|title=selfportrait|desc=|link=node|align=left|width=100|height=80]
—– Sour grapes for everyone!
May 7, 2008 at 6:13 AM #200291CoronitaParticipant…
</i>
</i>
</i>
Damn italics.
I dont think we'll get any agreement on this subject matter, especially in CA where people love their cars. (Guilty myself as charged). So I don't think there's really a point debating this. If you'd rather drive what you drive, civics, prius, toyota, whatever, well whatever floats your boat.
Personally, I'd prefer to stick my wife and toddler strapped in an well designed , IIHS rated good/good/good Acura CUV with sufficient size and height without fear of it tipping over because I know my wife doesn't drive like a maniac like me. And I prefer to stick my toddler in the center of the middle row, leaving the third row completely unused, and leaving sufficient room for side/curtain airbags to deploy in the event of side collision. And yes I spent a lot of money buying a decent quality child car seat I could find, based on countless reviews, personal recommendations,etc. (Britax Boulevard with side impact protection if any expecting parents are reading
http://www.babyuniverse.com/Britax-Boulevard-Car-Seats/PID/4809834/ctid/17/INstock/Y/D/?_ts=A006
…FYI, Recaro also makes a great seat that would have been my top choice, but unfortunately isn't rear facing, so I couldn't use it for what we needed at the time, http://www.recarochildseats.com/sportChildSeats.asp).
And personally, I like driving a peppy sedan/coupe 4 banger better than an suv, despite my sedan getting worse gas mileage than my wife's suv.
Yes a lot of americans really can't afford what they drive. Yes, not everyone can afford to buy/lease an vehicle that is more expensive to operate that your traditional nip 4 banger. And yes, a lot of americans got in over their heads with consuming well beyond their means, so what's new….Yes, SUV and even CUV sales are going to tank with higher gas prices, and their will be fewer on the road long term, just like I'm sure there will be fewer bimmers, audis, mercs on the road.
No, this won't eliminate all SUV's from the road. Even with $5 gas prices or $10 gas prices, some of us will still drive around cars/SUVs/trucks, albeit more conservatively than this. Some of us don't lease our take out an upside down loan on cars, just like some of us never buy used cars for whatever reasons. Life isn't fair, and regulations aren't fair. Trivial fact an high powered sports sedan like an M3,M5,S4,RS4, or Merc AMG product most likely carries a gas guzzler tax. But taking hypothetically, if you took the same engine or a larger consuming engine and putting into an SUV/CUV, there isn't any gas guzzler tax. That's why if you buy an AMG M CUV, you won't pay gas guzzler, or a Q7 4.2, or a X5, or a XC90(though they are more efficient i think)..There are even subsidies if you use large/heavy SUVs/trucks for businesses. Yes, it's unfair, that's life. Write a letter to your senator and bitch about it if it bothers you.
No, $10 gas prices wouldn't be good for everyone. Because unless you are fool and think things like food/water/etc gets transported in electric powered semi-trucks, or feel comfortable flying in a solar powered 747, most likely the cost of transportation will be passed along to people like you and me, in which inevitability, you will suffer indirectly. (If any of you are doing any remodeling now, I feel sorry for you, because you are surely paying a lot more for concrete and slab stone than a few years ago. ) And I assure you $10/gallon gas prices will imply we will have a lot more problems than just folks tooting around in an SUV.
The good news is among most of us "dumb" americans who will suffer in the short term with rising prices of transportation, commodities,etc, there are a few of us ('us' being americans) who are smarter than the rest of us who will inevitability put their brilliant minds to tackle this problem like they tackled every other problem) and engineer new solutions to take us out of this mess, and make the lives for the rest of us better (and hopefully those folks will be financially/socially rewarded for doing so)….because like it or not, this country has some of the most brilliant minds in all fields. Americans are creative and if push comes to shove, someone will find an answer to our problems.
Until then, I'll drive my fat ass CUV and 4 banger that tanks premium grade fuel, thank you very much.
[img_assist|nid=5962|title=selfportrait|desc=|link=node|align=left|width=100|height=80]
—– Sour grapes for everyone!
May 7, 2008 at 6:13 AM #200315CoronitaParticipant…
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Damn italics.
I dont think we'll get any agreement on this subject matter, especially in CA where people love their cars. (Guilty myself as charged). So I don't think there's really a point debating this. If you'd rather drive what you drive, civics, prius, toyota, whatever, well whatever floats your boat.
Personally, I'd prefer to stick my wife and toddler strapped in an well designed , IIHS rated good/good/good Acura CUV with sufficient size and height without fear of it tipping over because I know my wife doesn't drive like a maniac like me. And I prefer to stick my toddler in the center of the middle row, leaving the third row completely unused, and leaving sufficient room for side/curtain airbags to deploy in the event of side collision. And yes I spent a lot of money buying a decent quality child car seat I could find, based on countless reviews, personal recommendations,etc. (Britax Boulevard with side impact protection if any expecting parents are reading
http://www.babyuniverse.com/Britax-Boulevard-Car-Seats/PID/4809834/ctid/17/INstock/Y/D/?_ts=A006
…FYI, Recaro also makes a great seat that would have been my top choice, but unfortunately isn't rear facing, so I couldn't use it for what we needed at the time, http://www.recarochildseats.com/sportChildSeats.asp).
And personally, I like driving a peppy sedan/coupe 4 banger better than an suv, despite my sedan getting worse gas mileage than my wife's suv.
Yes a lot of americans really can't afford what they drive. Yes, not everyone can afford to buy/lease an vehicle that is more expensive to operate that your traditional nip 4 banger. And yes, a lot of americans got in over their heads with consuming well beyond their means, so what's new….Yes, SUV and even CUV sales are going to tank with higher gas prices, and their will be fewer on the road long term, just like I'm sure there will be fewer bimmers, audis, mercs on the road.
No, this won't eliminate all SUV's from the road. Even with $5 gas prices or $10 gas prices, some of us will still drive around cars/SUVs/trucks, albeit more conservatively than this. Some of us don't lease our take out an upside down loan on cars, just like some of us never buy used cars for whatever reasons. Life isn't fair, and regulations aren't fair. Trivial fact an high powered sports sedan like an M3,M5,S4,RS4, or Merc AMG product most likely carries a gas guzzler tax. But taking hypothetically, if you took the same engine or a larger consuming engine and putting into an SUV/CUV, there isn't any gas guzzler tax. That's why if you buy an AMG M CUV, you won't pay gas guzzler, or a Q7 4.2, or a X5, or a XC90(though they are more efficient i think)..There are even subsidies if you use large/heavy SUVs/trucks for businesses. Yes, it's unfair, that's life. Write a letter to your senator and bitch about it if it bothers you.
No, $10 gas prices wouldn't be good for everyone. Because unless you are fool and think things like food/water/etc gets transported in electric powered semi-trucks, or feel comfortable flying in a solar powered 747, most likely the cost of transportation will be passed along to people like you and me, in which inevitability, you will suffer indirectly. (If any of you are doing any remodeling now, I feel sorry for you, because you are surely paying a lot more for concrete and slab stone than a few years ago. ) And I assure you $10/gallon gas prices will imply we will have a lot more problems than just folks tooting around in an SUV.
The good news is among most of us "dumb" americans who will suffer in the short term with rising prices of transportation, commodities,etc, there are a few of us ('us' being americans) who are smarter than the rest of us who will inevitability put their brilliant minds to tackle this problem like they tackled every other problem) and engineer new solutions to take us out of this mess, and make the lives for the rest of us better (and hopefully those folks will be financially/socially rewarded for doing so)….because like it or not, this country has some of the most brilliant minds in all fields. Americans are creative and if push comes to shove, someone will find an answer to our problems.
Until then, I'll drive my fat ass CUV and 4 banger that tanks premium grade fuel, thank you very much.
[img_assist|nid=5962|title=selfportrait|desc=|link=node|align=left|width=100|height=80]
—– Sour grapes for everyone!
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