Home › Forums › Financial Markets/Economics › The Donald Trump, Illegal Alien, Foreigner, Immigrant Bitch and Moan Thread
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no_such_reality.
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June 25, 2016 at 5:10 PM #799105June 25, 2016 at 5:11 PM #799104
bearishgurl
Participantcarli, the “academic paper” you posted on statistics on children of undocumented immigrants:
http://dornsife.usc.edu/assets/sites/731/docs/chirla_v10_small.pdf
… mainly discusses CA RESIDENT children of undocumented immigrants in CA. Ex: children of lettuce pickers in Salinas, children of garment workers in LA, children of beef and poultry workers in San Joaquin, Merced and Fresno Counties, etc.
The paper has ABSOLUTELY NOTHING TO DO with the subject I brought up – which only affects San Diego and Imperial Counties. That is … foreign children and US Citizen NON-RESIDENT children who live OUTSIDE the US crossing the border every day to attend US schools!
June 25, 2016 at 5:34 PM #799106
CoronitaParticipant[quote=SK in CV][quote=flu]SK, forgot to ask earlier also. What kind of put spread are you doing on VZ and T?[/quote]
On T, I think I sold a put at $40 and bought a put at $35, and took in about $1 premium. Options are quoted as a single share but trade on a 100 share contract, so I took in about $100. (Actually 2, since I sold/bought 2 contracts) My max risk is the difference between the two or $500. If the stock falls below $40, it can be put to me, and I just ended up buying T for $39/sh. With its current dividend, I wouldn’t mind owning it at $39. VZ was similar, I think the strikes were $52/47 and I didn’t take in quite a buck. That was right at the open when vol was really high. If the bottom falls out, i’m out $500. If nothing happens, I keep my premium. If it falls a few bucks, i’m in at $51 and change.[/quote]
I get it…So basically, a bull put spread, i think…
*It nets you $1/share (1 contract = 100 shares, knew that…) immediately…
*If stock doesn’t move or rises, both put options expire, and you keep $1/share.
*If the stock tanks, to say $45/sh, you’re limiting your damage, because you have to buy the stock at $52 (the put you sold), but you can sell at $47 (the put you bought)….So you’re limited damage is $400 ($4/share, after the $1/share premium you were already paid)
*If the stock ends up somewhere in the middle, say at $49… The $52 gets exercised and you buy the stock at $52/share, less $1 in option premium you were already paid.
I’ve read about some of these option strategies a long time ago, but didn’t know what they were for….
Dumb question. If one thinks the stock is going to rise, why not just buy the stock? What advantage does this put spread have over just buying? Excuse the dumb question…
The only option trading I’ve ever done was to either write covered calls or buy put options as a hedge against company issued stock options or RSUs that were unvested and/or nearly vesting…and that was back a long time ago, when companies didn’t have so many policies about owning derivatives as an employee…So I’m curious how people are using these other strategies.
June 25, 2016 at 5:51 PM #799107spdrun
Participantbearishgurl: seems like most of the kids mentioned in the articles are non-resident CITIZENS. Exactly how common is this? I’d think there was a limited supply of such people.
As far as non-resident, non-citizen children crossing the border to attend school daily, I think the border guards would have something to say about that – eventually.
June 25, 2016 at 6:01 PM #799109carli
Participant[quote=bearishgurl][quote=carli]. . . I’m sure you’ve noticed the motto of Rich’s Piggington forum listed at the bottom of the page, “In God We Trust. Everyone Else Bring Data.” I believe you and I fall under the “Everyone Else” category. :-)[/quote]carli, I have been out of town all week. I DID post links but you failed to read the links (especially the CA links) and watch the videos. The kids themselves interviewed in the links I provided stated that there is an underground network at their SD South County school where they try to alert each other if any of the other border crossing student’s residency is questioned by their school (usually triggered by poor attendance and punctuality, falling asleep in class, etc). In one link, the protagonist clearly stated that he “thought” there were 100 students at his (Chula Vista) high school who reside in MX (likely a lower estimate than reality) and that he had to camp on the floor of his “aunt’s” house for a month when he was tipped off by a fellow border-crossing student that he might have a home visit from the school to inquire about his residency. (This is not uncommon, btw). My OWN kids have even told me numerous times over the years that dozens of their classmates admitted to them that they live in MX! Even when they were in elementary school and I asked, “why don’t you invite xyz to your birthday party,” they would respond, “Oh, he/she lives in TJ and won’t be able to come.”
SUHSD administrators admitted in one link that I provided here that they had no way of verifying the information given to them by prospective or continuing students’ parent (or adults pretending to be parents) and had to depend on the addresses and “guardianship affidavits” filed to establish residency as being the truth.
The reason I posted links as old as 25 years here is because I wanted to emphasize how long this charade has actually been going on! (It’s actually been going on as far back as I remember but it is much more “lucrative” today for a MX student to attend school in the US because the differences in the quality between the public schools in the two countries is markedly greater now than it was in the ’70’s and ’80’s.) In any case, most of the links I posted were from the last four years.
You’re another one who needs to flick the flies off your starched cuffs from your lofty seat in your NIMBY tower (30+ miles away from the int’l border?) and put on your glasses. I brought data. I ALWAYS bring data. I have had hundreds of folders of bookmarks FULL of data for YEARS in one of my browsers. If you choose not to READ, WATCH and LEARN, that’s on YOU!
Just like with the serious problems CA residents have with Covered CA and Medi-Cal under the ACA and the dozens of links I furnished for your information on that thread, you don’t and didn’t read any of them because you really don’t want to know. Why?? Because these issues don’t affect YOU or YOUR kids. Plain and simple.[/quote]
Ok, got it, now you’ve added some weird personal attacks about my family and me to your false claims, anecdotes, and previously posted articles about the plight of border kids trying to get an education. Nothing you’ve provided qualifies as actual data. Show me a study or anything that could be considered factual that supports your claims.
Remember, you claimed we are spending “a fortune” and “billions” on the situation and that we’re paying for 25% more schools, teachers and administrators in South County than necessary due to non-resident children. But I can’t find anything to support that. Can you?
I’ll wait. And until then, I’m not interested in going around and around so you can spout more hate about immigration and make uninformed, nasty statements about my family and me. Thank you.
June 25, 2016 at 6:03 PM #799110Participant[quote=bearishgurl]carli, the “academic paper” you posted on statistics on children of undocumented immigrants:
http://dornsife.usc.edu/assets/sites/731/docs/chirla_v10_small.pdf
… mainly discusses CA RESIDENT children of undocumented immigrants in CA. Ex: children of lettuce pickers in Salinas, children of garment workers in LA, children of beef and poultry workers in San Joaquin, Merced and Fresno Counties, etc.
The paper has ABSOLUTELY NOTHING TO DO with the subject I brought up – which only affects San Diego and Imperial Counties. That is … foreign children and US Citizen NON-RESIDENT children who live OUTSIDE the US crossing the border every day to attend US schools![/quote]
Read it again, BG.
June 25, 2016 at 6:08 PM #799111Participant[quote=spdrun]bearishgurl: seems like most of the kids mentioned in the articles are non-resident CITIZENS. Exactly how common is this? I’d think there was a limited supply of such people.
As far as non-resident, non-citizen children crossing the border to attend school daily, I think the border guards would have something to say about that – eventually.[/quote]Many Mexican citizen children have documents to get across the border and back. Their parents often shop north of the border and some of them have relatives living on this side as well.
CA LAW states that students proving residency for public school attendance purposes MUST LIVE WITHIN the district AND within the attendance boundaries of the school they are attempting to enroll in. OR, successfully seek and obtain a zone transfer or interdistrict transfer from the district they are residents of or the district they wish to attend a particular school in.
Of course, one living in MEXICO is not considered a resident of ANY school district in CA. They are NON-residents.
Citizenship of the students or their parents has no bearing on whether daily border crossers are entitled to attend public school in CA or TX. ONLY “residency” does.
June 25, 2016 at 6:17 PM #799113SK in CV
Participant[quote=flu]
Dumb question. If one thinks the stock is going to rise, why not just buy the stock? What advantage does this put spread have over just buying? Excuse the dumb question…The only option trading I’ve ever done was to either write covered calls or buy put options as a hedge against company issued stock options or RSUs that were unvested and/or nearly vesting…and that was back a long time ago, when companies didn’t have so many policies about owning derivatives as an employee…So I’m curious how people are using these other strategies.[/quote]
Not a dumb question at all. In fact, it’s one that I’ve asked 100 times. As it happens, the woman sitting next to me has made a living trading futures and options for the last 5 or 6 years. And I’m following her lead. It has to do with use of capital….even though I’m sitting with a lot of cash, I have these derivative non-cash positions that are hopefully making me money. I’m not convinced it’s the right thing.
Diamonds (Dow ETF) is now paying about 2.754% I think. She convinced me that instead of buying a few hundred shares, I should sell a wide put spread and take in (at current volatility) about $100 a month. That’s $12/yr on a $175 stock that I haven’t actually bought. 6.66% is a pretty decent return. Now if I had actually bought it, or it gets put to me, i’d sell covered calls against it every month. I’d limit my upside but increase yield to upwards towards 10%.
As I said, I follow her. I ask her the same question at least once a month. And she’s way smarter than I am. So I listen. (And she doesn’t read here, so I don’t score any points by saying that.)
June 25, 2016 at 7:13 PM #799114Participant[quote=carli]Ok, got it, now you’ve added some weird personal attacks about my family and me to your false claims, anecdotes, and previously posted articles about the plight of border kids trying to get an education. Nothing you’ve provided qualifies as actual data. Show me a study or anything that could be considered factual that supports your claims.
Remember, you claimed we are spending “a fortune” and “billions” on the situation and that we’re paying for 25% more schools, teachers and administrators in South County than necessary due to non-resident children. But I can’t find anything to support that. Can you?
I’ll wait. And until then, I’m not interested in going around and around so you can spout more hate about immigration and make uninformed, nasty statements about my family and me. Thank you.[/quote]You’re crying “wolf” now. No one has “attacked” you or your family. It is very, very difficult to explain this situation to someone who has never experienced anything like this in the schools their own children attended. School starts around here on July 20 this year, I believe. Wait until August 1-3, after all the students have successfully matriculated into the new school year and simply drive thru one of the South County high school student parking lots for yourself (around 10:00 – 10:30 am is best as all the spaces will be filled at that time). Try to observe the percentage of license plates of parked cars which have Baja, CA license plates. (Of course, this does not account for all the Mexican students dropped off and picked up daily or who ride the trolley and bus from and to the the border every day, but it’s a start.) Until you see it with your own eyes and hear it with your own ears, you won’t be able to truly understand the depth and breadth of the problem. You may choose whichever HS you want to visit. While you’re here, you may as well visit the parking lots of at least two!
The problem is that South County public school administrators and the teacher’s union like the “status quo” because it keeps all of them in a job and padding their defined benefit pensions year after year just by virtue of occupying their positions. So they’re not going to be too helpful with actual “statistics” and they most certainly know (or have a very close approximation of) exactly what they are! Regardless of what students and their parents/”guardians” are claiming on their bogus “guardianship affidavits.” I would be interested to know the percentage of “guardianship affidavits” which were filed this past year within CVESD and SUHSD (and prior years for comparison, if that info is available) in relation to the number of enrolled students each district actually has. I mean, seriously, what is the true percentage of US-resident kids who are actually residing with a “guardian” instead of their parent(s)?
We all KNOW that there is no such thing as a “border kid.” What is the reason behind using that euphemism, carli? Political correctness, perhaps?? A kid attending a CA public school in SD or Imperial County either resides in Mexico or resides in the US … end of story. The border is a thin strip of land where no one resides. A kid can’t live in both countries at the same time, unless their OWN parents actually OWN or RENT residential property on this side of the border and it is furnished and available at whim for ALL the members of their family to come here and occupy it on any given day of the year (meaning NOT leased out to a third party) and they DO occupy it during the school year as their principal residence. There ARE a few homes like this in South County but they are mostly owned by Mexico City and Guadalajara residents, NOT residents of Tijuana and other border cities. And these families only spend 2-3 weeks per year actually using the home. Their minor children (if they have any) are schooled in Mexico.
None of these non-resident daily border-crossing kids stealing seats from SD County schools are in a “plight.” They can and should be getting their educations in Tijuana and surrounds … where they RESIDE. CA taxpayers owe them nothing.
June 25, 2016 at 7:35 PM #799115Participant[quote=bearishgurl]Try to observe the percentage of license plates of parked cars which have Baja, CA license plates. (Of course, this does not account for all the Mexican students dropped off and picked up daily or who ride the trolley and bus from and to the the border every day, but it’s a start.) Until you see it with your own eyes and hear it with your own ears, you won’t be able to truly understand the depth and breadth of the problem. [/quote]
BG, your personal experience is clearly a powerful force in influencing your opinions, but it is not a valid substitute for data, for obvious reasons. You chose to cite a very specific number – 25% – and you stated that we are spending “billions” on this problem. Please cite any data or research at all that supports your claims. Thank you.
June 25, 2016 at 9:01 PM #799117Participantbearishgurl: the number of kids that:
(1) have US citizenship
(2) live in Mexico
and (3) go to school in the US,is probably an edge case since all three conditions need met.
June 25, 2016 at 9:01 PM #799116CoronitaParticipant[quote=SK in CV][quote=flu]
Dumb question. If one thinks the stock is going to rise, why not just buy the stock? What advantage does this put spread have over just buying? Excuse the dumb question…The only option trading I’ve ever done was to either write covered calls or buy put options as a hedge against company issued stock options or RSUs that were unvested and/or nearly vesting…and that was back a long time ago, when companies didn’t have so many policies about owning derivatives as an employee…So I’m curious how people are using these other strategies.[/quote]
Not a dumb question at all. In fact, it’s one that I’ve asked 100 times. As it happens, the woman sitting next to me has made a living trading futures and options for the last 5 or 6 years. And I’m following her lead. It has to do with use of capital….even though I’m sitting with a lot of cash, I have these derivative non-cash positions that are hopefully making me money. I’m not convinced it’s the right thing.
Diamonds (Dow ETF) is now paying about 2.754% I think. She convinced me that instead of buying a few hundred shares, I should sell a wide put spread and take in (at current volatility) about $100 a month. That’s $12/yr on a $175 stock that I haven’t actually bought. 6.66% is a pretty decent return. Now if I had actually bought it, or it gets put to me, i’d sell covered calls against it every month. I’d limit my upside but increase yield to upwards towards 10%.
As I said, I follow her. I ask her the same question at least once a month. And she’s way smarter than I am. So I listen. (And she doesn’t read here, so I don’t score any points by saying that.)[/quote]
Sorry, I’m not following the 10% yield using covered calls. Care to explain? I’m really slow about these things….
When you first mentioned $1/premium a share….I was wondering why are you doing this for a $1/share…But then you put it into a bigger context for me $12/year for a $175/share… I never thought about it this way.
Just curious, I think I know, but what are the worst case scenarios wrto downside risk, beyond what you already sort of highlighted with the example with T?
I guess, I’m just wondering that if you happen to be in a situation in which the stock prices falls below the put you wrote, but above the put you bought, chances are you have to buy the stock….What is your exit strategy at that point? Your own the stock, your put option you bought is out of money (although unexpired).. Now what?
Also, for a company like ATT that is playing close to a 5% dividend, does the ex-dividend date play any role into when you implement your strategy… Do you try to get the dividend, do you try to avoid the dividend buy doing your transactions after the ex-dividend date, or does it not matter?
I appreciate you sharing…I was just reminded there are a lot of smarter people out their in this world than me, lol….
June 25, 2016 at 9:06 PM #799118Participant[quote=flu]
Sorry, I’m not following the 10% yield using covered calls. Care to explain? I’m really slow about these things….
When you first mentioned $1/premium a share….I was wondering why are you doing this for a $1/share…But then you put it into a bigger context for me $12/year for a $175/share… I never thought about it this way. Just curious, I think I know, but what are the worst case scenarios wrto downside risk, beyond what you already sort of highlighted with the example with T? ..I appreciate you sharing…I was just reminded there are a lot of smarter people out their in this world than me, lol….[/quote]
I missed an important step. On the DIA trade, which is where the “$12/yr for a $175/share” came in, I didn’t mention that I’m rolling it every month. The sweet spot is getting in at about 45 days from expiration, and I try to roll at about 15 days. Rolling spreads can be difficult sometimes, particularly when trying to adjust the strikes. Often, I end up buying the current month back and selling the next month. I had orders in to roll spreads in 3 different accounts all day Thurs & Friday and couldn’t get a fill. It was slightly early because I was trying to take advantage of the higher following month volatility. I’ll probably buy them all back on Monday and sell Aug spreads at whatever strikes make sense.
June 25, 2016 at 9:09 PM #799119CoronitaParticipantSK, if you don’t mind can we continue our discussion here?
http://piggington.com/ot_are_you_doing_anything_hedge_against_possibility_brexit_take
I’m going to rename this thread, the Donald Trump/Illegal Alien Bitch and Moan Thread.
June 25, 2016 at 9:36 PM #799124HLS
Participant[quote=flu]
If one thinks the stock is going to rise, why not just buy the stock? What advantage does this put spread have over just buying?
[/quote]Limit Risk OR ability to Leverage.
Understanding options is a completely different way of viewing the stock market.
Think of options as insurance. Anybody has the choice to be the insured party (pay the premium)
OR
be the insurance company (collect the premium)
AND you decide how long you want exposure.when buying options, you can never lose more than what you pay for the option.
(Selling options has different risk)On Thursday GLD (Gold ETF) $120 Calls for Friday expiration were about $1.00.(1 contract for $100) allowed you to benefit on the move for about 10 ounces of Gold.
Buying 10 ounces of gold was $12,600.As it turns out, on Friday the move in gold meant that
the $1 option on Thursday was worth $6 on Friday.
($500 profit on $100 investment)
The $12,600 investment was worth about $13,200.
($600 profit on $12,600 investment)If gold had dropped $60, you would have lost $600 holding gold and only lost $100 if you had options.
Instead of selling covered calls, you can buy calls and sell calls against them to create almost as much income
with less risk.Many 401K plans do not allow you to short the market, so options can be used to benefit/offset from a downturn.
Buying calls does not allow you to collect dividends vs. if you owned the stock.
When selling calls on a dividend paying stock, you run the risk of having the option exercised early and you can be responsible for paying the dividend although you are not collecting the dividend.Understanding the risks, it’s possible to make money from the stock market without ever actually owning any stock.
Also, an easy way to control hundreds of ounces of gold, silver etc with limited downside risk and unlimited upside risk.
Options are much less risky than stocks when understood. -
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