[quote=UCGal][quote=harvey][quote=UCGal]FYI – you can retire at 50 in the private sector too – just takes a lot of saving/planning/debt reduction and a Live Below Your Means lifestyle.[/quote]
This is another one of the odd “false equivalence” arguments we get in this debate.
If we follow the logic, we can claim that anyone can retire at any age. Just stop working, and you are “retired!”
The distinction – and the issue – deals with the income and and the risk that comes with retiring at a particular age.
I’m sure you’ll be pretty happy when you retire at 55, but also a little nervous.
What happens if you live longer than you expect, or your investments don’t yield the returns you planned?
Public-sector retirees don’t have any of those risks. In fact, you are bearing the risk for them. If their pension investments fall short, you will pay for it from the savings you scrimped through your Live Below Your Means lifestyle.
Why would we continue to promote such an unfair system?[/quote]
You are making a point that is important. The stock market has risk. But you and others promote putting our entire retirement eggs into the stock market. My parents generation were given pensions by their private employers. My first few jobs, in the 80s had pensions but I did not stay long enough to vest… enticed into job jumping to up my salary.
401(k) plans didn’t come into existence till 1978. Now it’s the only game in town.
My employer chose to freeze my pension. They chose to under fund it. Rather than be mad that other people have a less risky vehicle for retirement income I choose to be mad that everyone has been forced to put their savings at risk in the stock market. I don’t begrudge those that have pensions… I’m pissed I no longer have that option.
Imagine if you were in your mid 60s with hopes of retiring… and it was late 2007….. would you be happier with a pension or an imploding 401(k) balance.
The unfairness is that corporations diverted funds from the pensions or eliminated them. The unfairness is that governments were not required to properly fund the pensions they agreed to pay.
But I suspect we will never agree on this. I like pensions, and want mine back. You like the riskiness of the market. I work with what I have… so, yeah, I Max out my 401(k)…. but I’d rather have my old pension unfrozen.[/quote]
Great post, UCGal!
Like you, instead of wanting to take away from the few remaining workers who have these benefits, I’d rather fight to get those benefits back for more private sector workers.
We were transitioned to DC pensions because corporations/shareholders wanted more for themselves, ignoring the fact that it was the **workers** who created the value/profit in the first place.
I’m pro-labor, not pro-public worker. Some people can’t grasp the difference.
