[quote=CA renter][quote=no_such_reality]CAR, mismanagement in an administrative sense, not a they don’t get it done sense.
By more right, I meant, if you’re right and I’m wrong on the hours, than that outliers is 4652 hours verus lower (i.e $25/hr versus $30something/hr, IOW, more hours to make that money. If the rate is as you point out ~$25/hr.
If you’re right, a Fire Fighter II at max makes $21/hr. (that concerns me, far too low). If you’re right, then 30% of Fire Figher IIs are working nearly or more than 4000 hours a year. That’s more than $90K with the $63K being for 2904 hours plus 1.5X one everything else. The outliers are working 4900 and 5200 hours. 5200 hours is two and half full time jobs (obviously some other multiplier is kicking and it’s not 5200 hours)
That is a management problem. A manager and organization cannot run 1/3rd of the team for 4000 hours a year, let alone year after year.
I see lower income people struggling with two or three part time jobs or two full time jobs or a job and a half. They’re stressed, they’re fatigued.
It’s a leadership problem.[/quote]
nsr,
I’m quite sure it’s for the 2904 hours, but will try to confirm it. Yes, that’s why I said that my numbers were the most *conservative* WRT hours worked. If we use a lower pay rate on that scale, then they are actually working more hours.
See, this is why some of us have been trying to explain — over and over again, to people who refuse to listen to anything that disproves their dogmatic beliefs — that the number of hours worked to make this money is tremendous. You have no idea what kind of a toll this takes on the employees and their families. It’s still cheaper for the cities to use O/T employees rather than hiring additional workers because of the recruitment, training, administration, equipment costs, benefits and pension costs, etc. Because I already know where a lot of people will go next…no, they cannot use new (lower-paid/without benefits) trainees or cadets because many of these positions are senior postions which require engineers and captains.
Yes, that’s what they make per hour; and yes, that’s why some of us get so pissed off when people claim that they are “overpaid.” Yes the benefits are worth a lot, which is why I said (and others here have said) that without these benefits, the turnover would be much higher, the quality of the personnel would be much lower, and the willingness/ability to do an exceptionally good job (which most of them do) would be greatly diminished.[/quote]
Found a letter from the SD Firefighters’ Union to the mayor and city council. It addresses many of the points made above WRT misleading information about firefighters and their pay.
Also found a salary table that gives their hourly rates. Not sure what the “Step 112” is, but am guessing that it has something to do with the additional hours worked (not O/T, but the “7K” hours)???? FWIW, I would agree that getting a hard number is more difficult than it should be in this case. This is not the case with all departments, but is more likely with larger departments and ones that have “step” increases, and more varied positions (see page 44).
Based on this, it DOES look like the State Controller’s numbers only account for 2,080 hours/year (multiplying the hourly rates by 2,080 gives the same min/max numbers on the SC’s site). I’m sure they must have a reason for doing this, but I have no idea what it would be. If you look at the City of SD’s salary table (the best source for finding this information), the hourly rate looks to be about right, though; nobody is trying to hide or obscure anything. When you multiply the hourly rate by 2,080 (hours per year), you get the numbers shown on the State Controller’s site. FWIW, the firefighters I know — from various departments and in various positions — are paid quite a bit less per hour than what’s shown on the SDFD table, though that might be offset somewhat by better benefits (maybe, but I don’t know).
In this case, it would appear that the FF’s base salary would be the hourly rate X 2912 (base hours, per their letter). This would be their base salary, from what I can tell.
FWIW, I’m not familiar enough with SDFD to know about the various pay rates and positions, or why it’s laid out the way it is…
Just going through the hourly rates for all these different positions, and it looks to me like firefighters’ pay is very much in line with everyone else’s. One has to wonder why they are so often singled-out for being “overcompensated” after looking at those numbers.
