[quote=walterwhite]still, with some thought, you can plan out good routes in lots of places.

Am i dumb to think there could be an economy with less stuff that is just better made?

Like with bikes–we have people spending 5k for a bike made of plastic (they call it carbon) that is theoretically very stong, as strong as steel, unless it gets a nick in it, in which case it can catastrophically fail and collaps (unlike steel). The bikes are imo crap, and are relegated to the trash heap fairly quickly. once the mold is made for them, they are made super cheap in taiwan, so builders love them.

crap, crap crap….landfill. expensive garbage with lots of marketing behind it.

whereas a steel bike can be yours forfreakingever…i guess it’s better to sell someone 10 $5,000 bikes than one $7,000 bike….i don’t know. is the future really just more and more production and consumption?

i often look and admired my carradice bike saddlebag. It’s a bikebag made by hand in england for like a century…it’s beautiful hard wearing, made of leather with metal buckles and thick canvas and a wooden dowel, lasts one person literally a lifetime, perfect function, gorgeous style, just amazing. I paid around $70 in 1999, now I think they’re 140 or so now…mine is just getting broken in. This bag is beloved by me, thisbag has improved the last 10 years of my life, this bag is a pleasure to own, this bag was truly deeply worth the money I paid for it. I admire this bag and the people who make it, i use it constantly.

v. crappy nylon bags with zippers that break and that rot in the sun and that are garbage shortly….

what if the future were about focussig on better shit instead of more shit?[/quote]

Precisely why some of us really hate our current version of “free trade.” We gave up great jobs and well-made durable goods. Yes, they were more expensive than the plastic junk made in China, but a US-made, $500 widget might last a lifetime (or 20-30 years), while a Chinese-made $100K widget lasts only a couple of years.

Short-term thinking — encouraged by our marketing machine that convinces everyone that newer versions are “cooler” and “better” — has blinded people to the fact that this cheap crap is MORE expensive over time, creates many times more pollution on the manufacturing and distribution side, and then more pollution again on the end-of-cycle side when it’s thrown away or recycled (which also takes energy and causes pollution of its own).

The game is all about increasing consumption and increasing corporate profit margins…all at the expense of the environment, consumers, and working people in the USA.