Quiet title

[FlyerInHi]

For what it’s worth, the prelim is clean. That’s why I’m thinking I should do it.

Another question is how often does a court take title away to award it to a claimant? I think very, very, very rare as courts prefer monetary damages instead of specific performance as in the case of blogstar who want access to his easement.

If I were to buy the property and a claimant came out of the woodwork years down the road, what could he/she practically and cost effectively do?

[bearishgurl]

[quote=gzz]”QT default judgments cannot stick without defendant being given this opportunity … regardless of if they defaulted.”

The one time I got a default judgment against a deep pocketed defendant I had to do two prove up hearings and mail notice of the hearings. I was not aware of this particular rule, but I would always expect that the judge would want to have some sort of hearing with additional notice outside of small collections type cases.[/quote]

gzz, as you know, your two “prove-up” hearings you noticed and showed up for to obtain your default judgment are nowhere near the amount of work and preparation that an evidentiary hearing would be, not to mention the time and cost for witness prep and expert fees (if needed).

[quote=gzz]I did not need a marketing budget because I was the only lawyer in California who would take a certain type of real estate case on contingency during the real estate crisis eight years ago, so I just publicized my first few cases and Google searches did the rest.[/quote]

If you worked on RE cases during the “real estate crisis,” that crisis had been largely wound down by January of 2012, when the Harbour Vista, LLC v HSBC Mtg Svcs opinion was published. I can understand why you would not be familiar with it if you haven’t taken any RE cases since then. See my earlier post to the OP on this thread, below. It seems that the court here is further clarifying CCP 764.010, including the need (or not) for oral argument:

The court shall examine into and determine the plaintiff’s title against the claims of all the defendants.  The court shall not enter judgment by default but shall in all cases require evidence of plaintiff’s title and hear such evidence as may be offered respecting the claims of any of the defendants, other than claims the validity of which is admitted by the plaintiff in the complaint.  The court shall render judgment in accordance with the evidence and the law.

[quote=bearishgurl]I should add that “you will not be able to take a(n) automatic default judgment.” Whether or not the defendant shows up at the evidentiary hearing, the court will make a ruling on the “quiet title” action only. The plaintiff is not obligated to serve or notify the defendant of the evidentiary hearing … only to set the date with the court. Procedurally, the court will then send the defendant a Notice of Hearing. If the plaintiff has other causes of action pending in their complaint, they will NOT be adjudicated at the evidentiary hearing (Harbour Vista, LLC, v. HSBC Mortgage Services Inc. (2011) 201 Cal.App.4th 1496 at 1508-1509).[/quote][bold added]

[bearishgurl]

[quote=FlyerInHi]For what it’s worth, the prelim is clean. That’s why I’m thinking I should do it.

Another question is how often does a court take title away to award it to a claimant? I think very, very, very rare as courts prefer monetary damages instead of specific performance as in the case of blogstar who want access to his easement.

If I were to buy the property and a claimant came out of the woodwork years down the road, what could he/she practically and cost effectively do?
[/quote]FIH, I just scanned your posts again and you didn’t state here until the above post that you have in your possession a preliminary title report for the condo you are considering purchasing. How old is the report? Did you buy it yourself or did the seller hand you a copy of his/hers? If you didn’t buy it, does it appear to be missing any pages? If you purchased it, could you get a discounted (or free) update from your title co on the day (or day before) you will fund the deal?

During the time your seller owned the property, did he/she own it by themselves or did they have a co-owner at one time? If they did once have a co-owner, and your seller now owns it by themselves, did they file a quitclaim deed from both of them to just your seller? If so, was each signature on that deed notarized before filing? (I don’t know the laws in NV regarding notarization of deeds.)

Do you know if your seller’s BK has been fully discharged?

[FlyerInHi]

I got the prelim from the title officer. it’s a day old.
The property is in escrow. The seller is about to file for bankruptcy I believe, and he’s in talks with his bankruptcy attorney. Of course, there’s more that I’m not privy to.

I think this is a case where spdrun would say the seller is stupid in that there’s no need to tell title/escrow what they can’t find out by themselves.

It looks like a deal to me for I can’t foresee anyone bringing suit to get title, and successfully doing so. If anything, any claimant would only be entitled to a share of the proceed of the sale.

[bearishgurl]

[quote=FlyerInHi]I got the prelim from the title officer. it’s a day old.
The property is in escrow. The seller is about to file for bankruptcy I believe, and he’s in talks with his bankruptcy attorney. Of course, there’s more that I’m not privy to.

I think this is a case where spdrun would say the seller is stupid in that there’s no need to tell title/escrow what they can’t find out by themselves.

It looks like a deal to me for I can’t foresee anyone bringing suit to get title, and successfully doing so. If anything, any claimant would only be entitled to a share of the proceed of the sale.[/quote]Did you check the civil and domestic (court) registers in your county for the seller’s name, FIH? Is/was the seller party to suit that is about to conclude or has recently concluded? If so, have you seen the judgment?

You do realize that there is a waiting period (varies by state) before a judgment creditor can take legal action to collect their judgment, right?

You didn’t state if the seller had always owned the property by themselves or if it was quitclaimed to them as sole owner at some point.

Since your seller told you he/she was considering filing for BK protection, have you asked them why they are finding it necessary to consider that? Are you sure they haven’t already filed? If they waffle the answer to this question or refuse to discuss it with you, that is a “red flag” indicating they have something to hide from you.

The fact that they are contemplating filing for BK protection (and refuse to pay for a title report to guarantee marketable title to real property they want to unload on some poor sucker?) should be another waving red flag to their prospective buyer who knew about their intention but was “not privy” to the details.

[FlyerInHi]

The seller lives out of state. He just has 2 investment properties in this county.
Nothing with their names (he and his wife)
He’s owned them for a long time. He didn’t tell me anything but I believe he answered the title questionnaire which caused title not to want to write a policy.

[bearishgurl]

[quote=FlyerInHi]The seller lives out of state. He just has 2 investment properties in this county.
Nothing with their names (he and his wife)
He’s owned them for a long time. He didn’t tell me anything but I believe he answered the title questionnaire which caused title not to want to write a policy.[/quote]

Deep red FLAG (maroon, actually) :=0

[NotCranky]

[quote=bearishgurl][quote=Blogstar] . . . What happens if the neighbor and I file suit at the same time more or less? Is there more hours for the Lawyer now answering the other complaint too? How much?[/quote]

This can’t happen, Russ. If the cases are filed within 59 days of one another and not yet served (the second filer doesn’t yet know about the first filer), then I believe the second case number will be “consolidated” into the first case number and all or a portion of the second-case filer’s first paper fee will be returned to them because they will now need to file a response to the first case if/when they are served with it and pay it over again. I don’t know how long it is taking the clerks to input new filings in the computer but I suspect they do it on the afternoon of filing, since the business office now closes at 3:30 pm and they don’t get off until 4:30 pm (or it is done by back-end staff all during the business day). So by the very next business day, the first case with the exact party names is in the court’s computer (which could ostensibly cause the second case filing with the exact same party names) to be rejected or consolidated shortly after filing it.

[quote=blogstar]I am really on the fence about the demand alone first, or just filing a suit and serving it with a settlement letter. Most attorneys I am talking to will write the demand for a flat fee without retainer.

I’ll ask about the flat rate thing for getting through your suggested steps. I copied that post and have it handy now.[/quote]Earlier on this thread, I suggested to you trying to get a “Limited Scope Representation” retainer agreement for the purpose of the atty preparing and sending your demand letter, preparing all your papers to file suit, leaving you to do the filing, finding a process server and other grunt work, such as gathering documents you might need in the future, etc. I feel that arrangement could save you a boatload of money as long as you didn’t end up needing to schedule an evidentiary hearing or trial, which could prove to be too “tricky” to prepare for and handle successfully by yourself (even if the other party didn’t show up for it after being notified by the court).[/quote]

Thanks for the info: I doubt I’ll try to go limited scope representation. I am leaning toward giving a solid firm some money to do all those steps gzz outlined.

[NotCranky]

[quote=Hobie]Good stuff from Gzz.

Gzz: I know the best option is to have atty run the case but Blog seems to have lots of evidence to support is claim of interference with the easement. Do you think he could be successful pro per? I guessing neighbor doesn’t have many defenses.

Blog: If you have other access to your property, why did you purchase easement? Easier access? I do understand you purchased it before neighbor moved in but selling it to neighbor is one of the settlement options. Regarding settlement, the value is what you determine, not what you paid.

Question: If you are not using the easement currently, why is neighbor hassling you? Or do the other neighbors still use the road and you are just his favorite one to pick on? Does he want that piece to build something on? Paddock, etc.

Not saying to roll over but just getting more info to help form strategy.[/quote]

I purchased the easement because the other road is longer , it’s prescriptive not perfected, the layout is a mess, too many other very independent minded people to share it with. It’s functional but not ideal. Some people like it all rutted up, don’t want improvements because people will drive too fast. Another guy doesn’t want gravel because he thinks he will take a spill on his heavy motorcycle. Stuff like that.

I understated the value of the grant deed easement I am sure. An easement that can pass a buyer’s title and especially a lenders title needs makes the property worth quite a bit more. In fact, I bought it very cheaply cash because it was technically landlocked, thinking about working on getting these easements over time. I just don’t remember to think about that often because I want to leave this property to my kids. But yeah, I need to protect my rights over the express easement.

I think I told you about who else he has excluded from the easement in the PM’s? Don’t want to go into that here. He is trying for increased privacy. He has an unusually extreme need for isolation and control as far as I can tell. He justifies trying to accomplish this separation with the idea that I am a bad guy attacking precious wetlands that nobody else sees. He can’t rest a minute until his adverse possession,( which he can’t really accomplish by the means he is using) is complete , so he has to threaten me constantly to keep me out of the easement. So as much as getting control of my road to actually use it , I think his fantasy needs to be broken so he can quit protecting it , harassing me.

[bearishgurl]

[quote=Blogstar]Thanks for the info: I doubt I’ll try to go limited scope representation. I am leaning toward giving a solid firm some money to do all those steps gzz outlined.[/quote]I was just reminding you that with a Limited Scope Representation retainer agreement, you will typically be quoted a flat rate for agreed upon tasks. You had mentioned today, I believe, that you were interested in getting a flat rate quote and in my experience, that is one way to compel attorneys to work for a flat rate. Many will not even entertain this idea.

[Hobie]

Blog: I see. I was just wondering about options re settlement. One idea was you could legally keep the easement, but agree to not use it for a limited time. Then hope he dies or moves and you’re set.

If privacy is his thing, would planting a wall of bushes help this? I know you already thought of this but again just getting options on table trying to keeping peace with crazy.

Still think you have to sue him to keep you ducks in order to be able to enforce on him. Kinda feels like dude won’t back down without the real possibility he will go to jail. That may get him on to an new hobby.

[NotCranky]

[quote=Hobie]Blog: I see. I was just wondering about options re settlement. One idea was you could legally keep the easement, but agree to not use it for a limited time. Then hope he dies or moves and you’re set.

If privacy is his thing, would planting a wall of bushes help this? I know you already thought of this but again just getting options on table trying to keeping peace with crazy.

Still think you have to sue him to keep you ducks in order to be able to enforce on him. Kinda feels like dude won’t back down without the real possibility he will go to jail. That may get him on to an new hobby.[/quote]

Right now I can do the work without fees or permits. I just got it cleared from every land use authority in the U.S. and NASA too. I am afraid that some new regulations or some incompetent official will come up and end this privilege for real ,or put some huge and expensive requirements in the way.
There is a ditch in the road I need to fill with rock or make and Arizona crossing. Just last year there was a huge movement that gave the Army Corp of Engineers potential to put every little contour of the surface of the planet under their jurisdiction. The EPA claimed that anyone that thought they would was paranoid ,but let me tell you , since this nut claimed the Army Gorps of Engineers put a biological designation on this little ditch I called them, sent them satellite pictures and close up photos. They had no record of there being any biological protected ditch out here. Do you think they said no this little ditch in the upland of the San Diego Foothills is not in our jurisdiction? No, they are doing a Survey on it. It’s working out because I have it in writing that they will rule it not “Waters of the United States”, or give me a no cost permit , but you can see where my concerns come from. There much be a million ditches like this in the county. I have 5 bigger just ones on my 20 acres. That’s potentially a lot of “Waters of the United States” .

Even day before yesterday when I was clearing it with code enforcement , the chief of that department said I may not be able to clear a little bit of brush that has grown back where my road is blocked! We argued a little then she looked up some regulations as to why it was “exempt”. Pretty soon these people are going to decide if we can or can’t wear hats on a sunny day. No sir you would be diverting a few of the sun’s rays. Of course you will be able to buy a hat permit for $$$ as long as you only wear it on Tuesdays and it is of a neutral color.

[NotCranky]

You can imagine I am a little uptight about suing for my rights against a rogue neighbor when the government, any government, can kill it or at least make me have a completely new fight, when I am finished.

[NotCranky]

Back to the legal process: Say some kind of quick settlement goes forward, how is this enforceable? Settlement pretty much being get your fence out of my
easement road. What consequences are there if the neighbor returns in some other from to blocking or sabotaging the road?

[Hobie]

This is what the injunction is for.

[Author]

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