Ot would we all be safer if everyone were armed?

[jstoesz]

That’s why people should only have shotguns…If the loser is dumb enough to mess with you, you don’t have to be very good at aiming. And as Cheney has proven, it is less than lethal at further distances…
So lets break out the gun racks and put a shotgun in every home and car!

[Djshakes]

[quote=bubba99]All of my coworkers, and many of my friends carry guns most of the time. My observations are that it really does not make them or society any safer. In fact it only makes a gun available to the first criminal who is strong enough to take it away.

Law enforcement officers (LEOs)are way too slow to shoot making them vulnerable to having their guns and lives taken. Non-LEOs are generally too slow and unskilled to be effective. And rarely do they take into account “whats behind the target”. Making their using a gun dangerous to bystanders.

Many bad guys have spent years in prison studying how to disarm citizens, lifting weights and to attack with such speed that even the best trained armed people are at risk.

21 feet is the magic distance. A skilled criminal within 21 feet, can probably kill an armed person before he/she can draw and fire.[/quote]

Armed robber is taking hostages and making threats. I would rather take my chances that a bystander shoots them instead of waiting for my time in the execution line.

You underestimate gun owners that respect and fire their weapons regularly. I guarantee half of them shoot better than some fat donut eating cop…or worse yet, some mall cop.

[Djshakes]

[quote=bubba99]All of my coworkers, and many of my friends carry guns most of the time. My observations are that it really does not make them or society any safer. In fact it only makes a gun available to the first criminal who is strong enough to take it away.

Law enforcement officers (LEOs)are way too slow to shoot making them vulnerable to having their guns and lives taken. Non-LEOs are generally too slow and unskilled to be effective. And rarely do they take into account “whats behind the target”. Making their using a gun dangerous to bystanders.

Many bad guys have spent years in prison studying how to disarm citizens, lifting weights and to attack with such speed that even the best trained armed people are at risk.

21 feet is the magic distance. A skilled criminal within 21 feet, can probably kill an armed person before he/she can draw and fire.[/quote]

Armed robber is taking hostages and making threats. I would rather take my chances that a bystander shoots them instead of waiting for my time in the execution line.

You underestimate gun owners that respect and fire their weapons regularly. I guarantee half of them shoot better than some fat donut eating cop…or worse yet, some mall cop.

[Djshakes]

[quote=bubba99]All of my coworkers, and many of my friends carry guns most of the time. My observations are that it really does not make them or society any safer. In fact it only makes a gun available to the first criminal who is strong enough to take it away.

Law enforcement officers (LEOs)are way too slow to shoot making them vulnerable to having their guns and lives taken. Non-LEOs are generally too slow and unskilled to be effective. And rarely do they take into account “whats behind the target”. Making their using a gun dangerous to bystanders.

Many bad guys have spent years in prison studying how to disarm citizens, lifting weights and to attack with such speed that even the best trained armed people are at risk.

21 feet is the magic distance. A skilled criminal within 21 feet, can probably kill an armed person before he/she can draw and fire.[/quote]

Armed robber is taking hostages and making threats. I would rather take my chances that a bystander shoots them instead of waiting for my time in the execution line.

You underestimate gun owners that respect and fire their weapons regularly. I guarantee half of them shoot better than some fat donut eating cop…or worse yet, some mall cop.

[Djshakes]

[quote=bubba99]All of my coworkers, and many of my friends carry guns most of the time. My observations are that it really does not make them or society any safer. In fact it only makes a gun available to the first criminal who is strong enough to take it away.

Law enforcement officers (LEOs)are way too slow to shoot making them vulnerable to having their guns and lives taken. Non-LEOs are generally too slow and unskilled to be effective. And rarely do they take into account “whats behind the target”. Making their using a gun dangerous to bystanders.

Many bad guys have spent years in prison studying how to disarm citizens, lifting weights and to attack with such speed that even the best trained armed people are at risk.

21 feet is the magic distance. A skilled criminal within 21 feet, can probably kill an armed person before he/she can draw and fire.[/quote]

Armed robber is taking hostages and making threats. I would rather take my chances that a bystander shoots them instead of waiting for my time in the execution line.

You underestimate gun owners that respect and fire their weapons regularly. I guarantee half of them shoot better than some fat donut eating cop…or worse yet, some mall cop.

[Djshakes]

[quote=bubba99]All of my coworkers, and many of my friends carry guns most of the time. My observations are that it really does not make them or society any safer. In fact it only makes a gun available to the first criminal who is strong enough to take it away.

Law enforcement officers (LEOs)are way too slow to shoot making them vulnerable to having their guns and lives taken. Non-LEOs are generally too slow and unskilled to be effective. And rarely do they take into account “whats behind the target”. Making their using a gun dangerous to bystanders.

Many bad guys have spent years in prison studying how to disarm citizens, lifting weights and to attack with such speed that even the best trained armed people are at risk.

21 feet is the magic distance. A skilled criminal within 21 feet, can probably kill an armed person before he/she can draw and fire.[/quote]

Armed robber is taking hostages and making threats. I would rather take my chances that a bystander shoots them instead of waiting for my time in the execution line.

You underestimate gun owners that respect and fire their weapons regularly. I guarantee half of them shoot better than some fat donut eating cop…or worse yet, some mall cop.

[faterikcartman]

When the police and military ditch their guns then I’ll consider the concept that they don’t work for self defence.

Those who refuse to live by the sword are doomed to die at the hands of those that do.

If you refuse to take personal responsibility for the defence of yourself and your family you become the subject of someone else. In feudal times it was forbidden for serfs to bear weapons. And the ruling class stripped the excess production from them.

Beware creeping incrementalism. There is, and has been, a gradual chipping away at individual freedom. Each movement relatively small and couched in the language of “reasonableness”. So that too few connect the dots and grasp the bigger picture.

There is a movement out there that wants to strip arms from the hands of the people. But not everyone. At the same time, from the same group, there are cries for increased armed security of politicians. Cries for the police to become even better armed. And this same cadre also cries that the “rich” don’t need any more than anyone else. That their excess production should be stripped from them at the point of a gun and given into the hands of the ruling class to spend as they will.

Is your freedom worth the hand outs this ruling class will give you, stolen from the hands of your fellow citizens?

I’m reminded here and will mention the mandatory health insurance coverage mandated by Obamacare. Remember the debates about how they would justify the coercion? The latest word is that it would be a tax and enforcement of its collection would be in the hands of the IRS.

What happens when you refuse to pay your taxes? As I alluded to above, armed IRS agents will raid you. You will be tried. There is a likelihood you will be imprisoned. If you resist you will be shot. This is not hyperbole. This is fact which anyone here can verify.

So you may abort and murder your unborn child. No question — it’s your body, your choice. You may engage in unprotected anal sex with strangers helping to spread what we are told is a world-wide pandemic killing millions. That is your right to control your own body and your own choices and no one may stop you.

Yet the same group that champions these positions is now telling you that even if you are in perfect health and wish to gamble on health insurance because you need YOUR money to spend on other priorities of your choosing you may not argue it is your body and your choice, rather, you will pay or we will have you arrested and imprisoned for tax evasion and if you resist you will be shot.

On a daily basis I’m stunned that hardly anyone thinks things through. They spend their days rejecting anything one group says as propaganda, but blindly accepting anything the other group says as if the words came from God, to the prophets, and out the mouth of Keith Olbermann.

So they go on their merry way watching television until disaster is upon them. Whereupon they scratch their heads in disbelief wondering how things got to this point. And then petition the very same people who got them in trouble to bail them out.

So back to Archie Bunker. In 1938 Hitler passed a gun control act. The state had military type firearms to be sure. The Jews? Well, not so much. In 1968 the USA passed a gun control law that was strikingly similar. Today there are motivated people that would strip guns from everyone, not just the Jews.

It is at this point that people start to scoff. They tell themselves this can never happen here. That these are the words of the paranoid and malcontent. I submit that the naysayers are ignorant of the history of man and the fall of nations. I suspect they are completely unaware of the gun control measures that precipitated tyrannical regimes including Hitler’s as mentioned above.

It is all too easy to fall for the soothing platitudes and “reasonable” measures when times are relatively good and the state seemingly benign. But the power you abdicate now, and authority you grant the state now, will set the stage for how things proceed when times are bad and the government malignant.

When you fellow man or the state wishes you ill and you’ve abdicated both your right and ability to defend yourself and your family you are dependent on the arms of others. And has another has said, for evil to win all that is necessary is for the good to do nothing. As history as shown, with enough gun control, even if the good are willing, they will fail if you take away their ability.

[faterikcartman]

When the police and military ditch their guns then I’ll consider the concept that they don’t work for self defence.

Those who refuse to live by the sword are doomed to die at the hands of those that do.

If you refuse to take personal responsibility for the defence of yourself and your family you become the subject of someone else. In feudal times it was forbidden for serfs to bear weapons. And the ruling class stripped the excess production from them.

Beware creeping incrementalism. There is, and has been, a gradual chipping away at individual freedom. Each movement relatively small and couched in the language of “reasonableness”. So that too few connect the dots and grasp the bigger picture.

There is a movement out there that wants to strip arms from the hands of the people. But not everyone. At the same time, from the same group, there are cries for increased armed security of politicians. Cries for the police to become even better armed. And this same cadre also cries that the “rich” don’t need any more than anyone else. That their excess production should be stripped from them at the point of a gun and given into the hands of the ruling class to spend as they will.

Is your freedom worth the hand outs this ruling class will give you, stolen from the hands of your fellow citizens?

I’m reminded here and will mention the mandatory health insurance coverage mandated by Obamacare. Remember the debates about how they would justify the coercion? The latest word is that it would be a tax and enforcement of its collection would be in the hands of the IRS.

What happens when you refuse to pay your taxes? As I alluded to above, armed IRS agents will raid you. You will be tried. There is a likelihood you will be imprisoned. If you resist you will be shot. This is not hyperbole. This is fact which anyone here can verify.

So you may abort and murder your unborn child. No question — it’s your body, your choice. You may engage in unprotected anal sex with strangers helping to spread what we are told is a world-wide pandemic killing millions. That is your right to control your own body and your own choices and no one may stop you.

Yet the same group that champions these positions is now telling you that even if you are in perfect health and wish to gamble on health insurance because you need YOUR money to spend on other priorities of your choosing you may not argue it is your body and your choice, rather, you will pay or we will have you arrested and imprisoned for tax evasion and if you resist you will be shot.

On a daily basis I’m stunned that hardly anyone thinks things through. They spend their days rejecting anything one group says as propaganda, but blindly accepting anything the other group says as if the words came from God, to the prophets, and out the mouth of Keith Olbermann.

So they go on their merry way watching television until disaster is upon them. Whereupon they scratch their heads in disbelief wondering how things got to this point. And then petition the very same people who got them in trouble to bail them out.

So back to Archie Bunker. In 1938 Hitler passed a gun control act. The state had military type firearms to be sure. The Jews? Well, not so much. In 1968 the USA passed a gun control law that was strikingly similar. Today there are motivated people that would strip guns from everyone, not just the Jews.

It is at this point that people start to scoff. They tell themselves this can never happen here. That these are the words of the paranoid and malcontent. I submit that the naysayers are ignorant of the history of man and the fall of nations. I suspect they are completely unaware of the gun control measures that precipitated tyrannical regimes including Hitler’s as mentioned above.

It is all too easy to fall for the soothing platitudes and “reasonable” measures when times are relatively good and the state seemingly benign. But the power you abdicate now, and authority you grant the state now, will set the stage for how things proceed when times are bad and the government malignant.

When you fellow man or the state wishes you ill and you’ve abdicated both your right and ability to defend yourself and your family you are dependent on the arms of others. And has another has said, for evil to win all that is necessary is for the good to do nothing. As history as shown, with enough gun control, even if the good are willing, they will fail if you take away their ability.

[faterikcartman]

When the police and military ditch their guns then I’ll consider the concept that they don’t work for self defence.

Those who refuse to live by the sword are doomed to die at the hands of those that do.

If you refuse to take personal responsibility for the defence of yourself and your family you become the subject of someone else. In feudal times it was forbidden for serfs to bear weapons. And the ruling class stripped the excess production from them.

Beware creeping incrementalism. There is, and has been, a gradual chipping away at individual freedom. Each movement relatively small and couched in the language of “reasonableness”. So that too few connect the dots and grasp the bigger picture.

There is a movement out there that wants to strip arms from the hands of the people. But not everyone. At the same time, from the same group, there are cries for increased armed security of politicians. Cries for the police to become even better armed. And this same cadre also cries that the “rich” don’t need any more than anyone else. That their excess production should be stripped from them at the point of a gun and given into the hands of the ruling class to spend as they will.

Is your freedom worth the hand outs this ruling class will give you, stolen from the hands of your fellow citizens?

I’m reminded here and will mention the mandatory health insurance coverage mandated by Obamacare. Remember the debates about how they would justify the coercion? The latest word is that it would be a tax and enforcement of its collection would be in the hands of the IRS.

What happens when you refuse to pay your taxes? As I alluded to above, armed IRS agents will raid you. You will be tried. There is a likelihood you will be imprisoned. If you resist you will be shot. This is not hyperbole. This is fact which anyone here can verify.

So you may abort and murder your unborn child. No question — it’s your body, your choice. You may engage in unprotected anal sex with strangers helping to spread what we are told is a world-wide pandemic killing millions. That is your right to control your own body and your own choices and no one may stop you.

Yet the same group that champions these positions is now telling you that even if you are in perfect health and wish to gamble on health insurance because you need YOUR money to spend on other priorities of your choosing you may not argue it is your body and your choice, rather, you will pay or we will have you arrested and imprisoned for tax evasion and if you resist you will be shot.

On a daily basis I’m stunned that hardly anyone thinks things through. They spend their days rejecting anything one group says as propaganda, but blindly accepting anything the other group says as if the words came from God, to the prophets, and out the mouth of Keith Olbermann.

So they go on their merry way watching television until disaster is upon them. Whereupon they scratch their heads in disbelief wondering how things got to this point. And then petition the very same people who got them in trouble to bail them out.

So back to Archie Bunker. In 1938 Hitler passed a gun control act. The state had military type firearms to be sure. The Jews? Well, not so much. In 1968 the USA passed a gun control law that was strikingly similar. Today there are motivated people that would strip guns from everyone, not just the Jews.

It is at this point that people start to scoff. They tell themselves this can never happen here. That these are the words of the paranoid and malcontent. I submit that the naysayers are ignorant of the history of man and the fall of nations. I suspect they are completely unaware of the gun control measures that precipitated tyrannical regimes including Hitler’s as mentioned above.

It is all too easy to fall for the soothing platitudes and “reasonable” measures when times are relatively good and the state seemingly benign. But the power you abdicate now, and authority you grant the state now, will set the stage for how things proceed when times are bad and the government malignant.

When you fellow man or the state wishes you ill and you’ve abdicated both your right and ability to defend yourself and your family you are dependent on the arms of others. And has another has said, for evil to win all that is necessary is for the good to do nothing. As history as shown, with enough gun control, even if the good are willing, they will fail if you take away their ability.

[faterikcartman]

When the police and military ditch their guns then I’ll consider the concept that they don’t work for self defence.

Those who refuse to live by the sword are doomed to die at the hands of those that do.

If you refuse to take personal responsibility for the defence of yourself and your family you become the subject of someone else. In feudal times it was forbidden for serfs to bear weapons. And the ruling class stripped the excess production from them.

Beware creeping incrementalism. There is, and has been, a gradual chipping away at individual freedom. Each movement relatively small and couched in the language of “reasonableness”. So that too few connect the dots and grasp the bigger picture.

There is a movement out there that wants to strip arms from the hands of the people. But not everyone. At the same time, from the same group, there are cries for increased armed security of politicians. Cries for the police to become even better armed. And this same cadre also cries that the “rich” don’t need any more than anyone else. That their excess production should be stripped from them at the point of a gun and given into the hands of the ruling class to spend as they will.

Is your freedom worth the hand outs this ruling class will give you, stolen from the hands of your fellow citizens?

I’m reminded here and will mention the mandatory health insurance coverage mandated by Obamacare. Remember the debates about how they would justify the coercion? The latest word is that it would be a tax and enforcement of its collection would be in the hands of the IRS.

What happens when you refuse to pay your taxes? As I alluded to above, armed IRS agents will raid you. You will be tried. There is a likelihood you will be imprisoned. If you resist you will be shot. This is not hyperbole. This is fact which anyone here can verify.

So you may abort and murder your unborn child. No question — it’s your body, your choice. You may engage in unprotected anal sex with strangers helping to spread what we are told is a world-wide pandemic killing millions. That is your right to control your own body and your own choices and no one may stop you.

Yet the same group that champions these positions is now telling you that even if you are in perfect health and wish to gamble on health insurance because you need YOUR money to spend on other priorities of your choosing you may not argue it is your body and your choice, rather, you will pay or we will have you arrested and imprisoned for tax evasion and if you resist you will be shot.

On a daily basis I’m stunned that hardly anyone thinks things through. They spend their days rejecting anything one group says as propaganda, but blindly accepting anything the other group says as if the words came from God, to the prophets, and out the mouth of Keith Olbermann.

So they go on their merry way watching television until disaster is upon them. Whereupon they scratch their heads in disbelief wondering how things got to this point. And then petition the very same people who got them in trouble to bail them out.

So back to Archie Bunker. In 1938 Hitler passed a gun control act. The state had military type firearms to be sure. The Jews? Well, not so much. In 1968 the USA passed a gun control law that was strikingly similar. Today there are motivated people that would strip guns from everyone, not just the Jews.

It is at this point that people start to scoff. They tell themselves this can never happen here. That these are the words of the paranoid and malcontent. I submit that the naysayers are ignorant of the history of man and the fall of nations. I suspect they are completely unaware of the gun control measures that precipitated tyrannical regimes including Hitler’s as mentioned above.

It is all too easy to fall for the soothing platitudes and “reasonable” measures when times are relatively good and the state seemingly benign. But the power you abdicate now, and authority you grant the state now, will set the stage for how things proceed when times are bad and the government malignant.

When you fellow man or the state wishes you ill and you’ve abdicated both your right and ability to defend yourself and your family you are dependent on the arms of others. And has another has said, for evil to win all that is necessary is for the good to do nothing. As history as shown, with enough gun control, even if the good are willing, they will fail if you take away their ability.

[faterikcartman]

When the police and military ditch their guns then I’ll consider the concept that they don’t work for self defence.

Those who refuse to live by the sword are doomed to die at the hands of those that do.

If you refuse to take personal responsibility for the defence of yourself and your family you become the subject of someone else. In feudal times it was forbidden for serfs to bear weapons. And the ruling class stripped the excess production from them.

Beware creeping incrementalism. There is, and has been, a gradual chipping away at individual freedom. Each movement relatively small and couched in the language of “reasonableness”. So that too few connect the dots and grasp the bigger picture.

There is a movement out there that wants to strip arms from the hands of the people. But not everyone. At the same time, from the same group, there are cries for increased armed security of politicians. Cries for the police to become even better armed. And this same cadre also cries that the “rich” don’t need any more than anyone else. That their excess production should be stripped from them at the point of a gun and given into the hands of the ruling class to spend as they will.

Is your freedom worth the hand outs this ruling class will give you, stolen from the hands of your fellow citizens?

I’m reminded here and will mention the mandatory health insurance coverage mandated by Obamacare. Remember the debates about how they would justify the coercion? The latest word is that it would be a tax and enforcement of its collection would be in the hands of the IRS.

What happens when you refuse to pay your taxes? As I alluded to above, armed IRS agents will raid you. You will be tried. There is a likelihood you will be imprisoned. If you resist you will be shot. This is not hyperbole. This is fact which anyone here can verify.

So you may abort and murder your unborn child. No question — it’s your body, your choice. You may engage in unprotected anal sex with strangers helping to spread what we are told is a world-wide pandemic killing millions. That is your right to control your own body and your own choices and no one may stop you.

Yet the same group that champions these positions is now telling you that even if you are in perfect health and wish to gamble on health insurance because you need YOUR money to spend on other priorities of your choosing you may not argue it is your body and your choice, rather, you will pay or we will have you arrested and imprisoned for tax evasion and if you resist you will be shot.

On a daily basis I’m stunned that hardly anyone thinks things through. They spend their days rejecting anything one group says as propaganda, but blindly accepting anything the other group says as if the words came from God, to the prophets, and out the mouth of Keith Olbermann.

So they go on their merry way watching television until disaster is upon them. Whereupon they scratch their heads in disbelief wondering how things got to this point. And then petition the very same people who got them in trouble to bail them out.

So back to Archie Bunker. In 1938 Hitler passed a gun control act. The state had military type firearms to be sure. The Jews? Well, not so much. In 1968 the USA passed a gun control law that was strikingly similar. Today there are motivated people that would strip guns from everyone, not just the Jews.

It is at this point that people start to scoff. They tell themselves this can never happen here. That these are the words of the paranoid and malcontent. I submit that the naysayers are ignorant of the history of man and the fall of nations. I suspect they are completely unaware of the gun control measures that precipitated tyrannical regimes including Hitler’s as mentioned above.

It is all too easy to fall for the soothing platitudes and “reasonable” measures when times are relatively good and the state seemingly benign. But the power you abdicate now, and authority you grant the state now, will set the stage for how things proceed when times are bad and the government malignant.

When you fellow man or the state wishes you ill and you’ve abdicated both your right and ability to defend yourself and your family you are dependent on the arms of others. And has another has said, for evil to win all that is necessary is for the good to do nothing. As history as shown, with enough gun control, even if the good are willing, they will fail if you take away their ability.

[Djshakes]

[quote=Djshakes]
I don’t buy guns to fight against the government. Anyone with that mentality is retarded. [/quote]

I retract this after reading the last post, which was great. It is hard for anyone to make cries of “conspiracy nut” after ready fatericcartmen’s post. To some, everyone that thinks that way is a conspiracy nut…until it happens.

Case and point. My buddy lives in Santa Monica surrounded by libs. A couple of his neighbors found out he had some guns and scoffed at him. Then the riots broke out and I believe Jessie Jackson, Al Sharpton or someone said something to the regards of “The three B’s are next”. Meaning Brentwood, Beverly hills and another city in the area. This scared people. He told me those same snobby libs that scoffed at him now approached him fearful of the situation and said “You have guns, right?” FU was his response.

[Djshakes]

[quote=Djshakes]
I don’t buy guns to fight against the government. Anyone with that mentality is retarded. [/quote]

I retract this after reading the last post, which was great. It is hard for anyone to make cries of “conspiracy nut” after ready fatericcartmen’s post. To some, everyone that thinks that way is a conspiracy nut…until it happens.

Case and point. My buddy lives in Santa Monica surrounded by libs. A couple of his neighbors found out he had some guns and scoffed at him. Then the riots broke out and I believe Jessie Jackson, Al Sharpton or someone said something to the regards of “The three B’s are next”. Meaning Brentwood, Beverly hills and another city in the area. This scared people. He told me those same snobby libs that scoffed at him now approached him fearful of the situation and said “You have guns, right?” FU was his response.

[Djshakes]

[quote=Djshakes]
I don’t buy guns to fight against the government. Anyone with that mentality is retarded. [/quote]

I retract this after reading the last post, which was great. It is hard for anyone to make cries of “conspiracy nut” after ready fatericcartmen’s post. To some, everyone that thinks that way is a conspiracy nut…until it happens.

Case and point. My buddy lives in Santa Monica surrounded by libs. A couple of his neighbors found out he had some guns and scoffed at him. Then the riots broke out and I believe Jessie Jackson, Al Sharpton or someone said something to the regards of “The three B’s are next”. Meaning Brentwood, Beverly hills and another city in the area. This scared people. He told me those same snobby libs that scoffed at him now approached him fearful of the situation and said “You have guns, right?” FU was his response.

[Djshakes]

[quote=Djshakes]
I don’t buy guns to fight against the government. Anyone with that mentality is retarded. [/quote]

I retract this after reading the last post, which was great. It is hard for anyone to make cries of “conspiracy nut” after ready fatericcartmen’s post. To some, everyone that thinks that way is a conspiracy nut…until it happens.

Case and point. My buddy lives in Santa Monica surrounded by libs. A couple of his neighbors found out he had some guns and scoffed at him. Then the riots broke out and I believe Jessie Jackson, Al Sharpton or someone said something to the regards of “The three B’s are next”. Meaning Brentwood, Beverly hills and another city in the area. This scared people. He told me those same snobby libs that scoffed at him now approached him fearful of the situation and said “You have guns, right?” FU was his response.

[Author]

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