San Diego Housing Market News and Analysis

Thanks! Keep us posted. For me, if I were buying a house and saw a selling price 200% higher than in 2003 I'd raise an eyebrow then click on another listing unless it was completely rebuilt.

I don't know the area at all so maybe Money magazine will prop the price up.

Give us a picture!

OK is one of the few prosperous states in the country, so you should do well on this sale. Just read that the unemployment rate in Tulsa is in the low 4's, a rarity. Norman is a university town also, a big plus.
Several things working against you: interest rates are trending up, and the selling season is mostly over, which suggests you should be pricing it aggressively and put on a big advertising blitz when it hits the market.
Lack of a garage is a big negative...is there room to easily add on for an ambitious buyer? Also, your rennovations suggest you have an old house, albeit in a good neighborhood.

Cool. 292K for a 2500 sf house in Norman, Oklahoma without a garage.

How much would it cost to rent a place like this ?

On the surface it would seem to me that places like Temecula/Murrieta are less expensive. I wonder when we'll see people flocking to Temecula from the midwest because of housing costs ;)

Keep a close eye on the most recently sold comps! And how comparable are they, really?! That's what your buyers are most likely doing. And try not to kid yourself. Be as objective as possible. Ask other people besides close friends and your realtor about your price point.
I've only been out to OK a few times, but I would guess that no garage is not a good thing there given the winter weather conditions.
I've sold homes in good and bad conditions and it never took longer than 2 months to get an offer that I could accept and close on. Having very accurate comps by my side really helped during negotiations when the buyers wanted my price to drop.

well it was the fugliest house on the block when i bought it, the
sellers had been vacant for 4 months so they were getting
real energized to sell and the house has been completely redone,
i've put over $50K into the place, so, it's very clean.

the house has a carport and room for a one car garage, so that's
not a big issue, it's like anything there is always a price and a buyer.

The neighborhood is very desirable, it's the only freehold land
surrounded by Brookhaven a very desirable neighborhood.

i'll keep you all informed.

I wish i coul dhave put it on the block sooner, but until the
painting and siding were done it was not going to be easily
sold and frankly, i wanted it very clean before holding the
open house.

Without knowing what the place looks like, I would definitely say that a 2500 sq ft without a 2 car or bigger garage is not so appealing.

I think the issue is how quick do you need to sell.

well here's a picture

http://www.openhouseok.com/showhome.oht?...

You've done a good job of preping the house--I suspect it will sell if it is in a good neighborhood and you've checked the comps.

The only problem is we aren't the buyers, nor do many/any of us know the area. I did take the photo link and your place is cool, love the floor and window casings. Without knowing the neighborhoods I did find others I liked better by clicking on the link from your listing and looking at all the Norman OK listings. I'm sure location is important but I'm wondering how bad is the neighborhood for this place.

http://www.openhouseok.com/showhome.oht?...

or this one with the same schools listed

http://www.openhouseok.com/showhome.oht?...

At 299 you are one of the highest ppsft, I have no clue if the others are in an undesirable part of town but I have to be honest, they are newer, have more options and are cheaper.

This bad boy is 5000 sq ft for the same 299k.

http://www.openhouseok.com/showhome.oht?...

I'm certain that location is important but is it as important, is it a very large place, can you have a significantly longer commute, is there a lake, river, forrest or something people pay to be closer to. I haven't a clue having never been in Oklahoma, it may be a very large town as far as square miles go. Out here, prices can be affected significantly because we are a seaside desert, so the weather pattern and topography can be wildly different ten miles away, is that the case in OK?

According to this, the home on the other side of your back fence is going for less (not sure if it is still on the market).

http://www.zillow.com/HomeDetails.htm?zp...

I ran your comps, I wish you luck but I am going to make my guess at 225K. Your zestimate is 197-250, but that's not where my opinion comes from. This goes back for one year of sales withing one mile of your house and i only included 2000-3000 sq ft since yours falls in the middle. They are in order of sq ft.

Here is a legend for the following data

address
sales price/sales date/ br/ba
sq ft/ lot size/ year built/ price per sq ft

1301 Brookhaven Blvd
$135,000 12/20/07 3 2.5 2,050 12,715 1963 $97

4214 Briarcrest Dr
$180,000 08/31/07 4 3 2,248 11,875 1973 $80

1508 Barwick Dr
$205,000 12/04/07 3 2.5 2,300 10,823 1969 $89

4209 Briarcrest Dr
$160,000 11/19/07 4 3 2,304 11,875 1973 $69

4307 Briarcrest Dr
$203,000 08/28/07 4 4 2,326 11,875 1973 $87

Burlington Pl
$180,000 10/15/07 4 2 2,416 12,180 1969 $74

1912 Guilford Ct
$297,500 01/10/08 4 3 2,475 20,473 1993 $120

4102 Northhampton Dr
$245,000 05/23/08 5 3.5 2,848 15,521 1979 $86

As you can see, only one house sold for more than $100 a square and it had a lot twice the average size and the size of yours (and it was 8 months ago). None of these are listed or had photos but this is how you figure comps, on sales price, not listed price. Some probably were not great inside but I can't imagine every 2-3k sq ft home within a mile of you sold in the last year was thrashed, some had to be nice, yet only 1 got more than 100 a square.

I hope you get what you are asking but if it sits another few months, take a look at houses within a mile, from a buyers perspective. I did and I found some nice ones for less or some for the same price that were very impressive. This one looks just a few hundred yards away, about three streets over. I tried to look within walking distance or in the same school zone and I found some stiff competition. Heres an example.

http://www.zillow.com/HomeDetails.htm?zp...

Bigger, newer, you get a 1000 sq ft workshop and a creek, you might also get flooding but how cool is it to get your own creek.

Good luck, I'm not trying to knock you, just offer an opinion from an outsider's perspective who has no emotional or financial investment in your house.

LOL Trying to get TWICE the price from 2003 and they tell us there was no bubble in the Midwest.

i appreciate the input, it's why i decided to go to the piggingtonians
to try and get some data and commentary.

Now the house you cited is in Blanchard which is some rural town,
nearby, wildly different school districts, wildly different environment.

Some of the other properties you cited are in the brookhaven
division which means paying their fees, and living under their
covenants, this is freehold property which i tend to value a lot
higher

there is a mistake in that entry you sent me.

It does clearly map to close to my division, but it shows a blanchard
zipcode.

is that a mapping error, a coding error? I don't know,
i can drive by look at it, see if it's for sale.

blanchard is 15 miles away which is why i first dismissed your notice.

pat, it isn't what you value higher, it is what the buyers value higher.

But that aside, I listed close to a dozen houses and sales, I'm sure a few have variables. The one directly behind you that you share your back fence with, is bigger, has a pool and is 40k cheaper. If it sold, what did it sell for? My guess is that is your best comp, price a tad below their closed sales price and you will have found your market. Price above and all you have is a decorative sign out front.

Some of the mapping data is incorrect, it always is. If your house was in my zip code I could tell you the price in ten seconds, but it's not. The point is that a data search of closed sales within a mile of your home, even if a few are errors, does not support a listing price over $100 a square.

I do think it is a cool little town, some of the architecure is nice, I just think you are overpriced for your market. If it sells great, if in 90 days you are still sitting there or if in 30 days nobody comes and views your home, then reprice. What does your realtor think? It has been 50 days, have you had any offers? The whole spring selling season went by without a sale so something is wrong.

Patb,
As someone aleady asked, it would help to know how much your house, realistically speaking, would rent for in today's market.

DM

Thanks for a glimpse into your home and neighborhood, patb. I'm a little bored of watching SD real estate, it is nice to spend some time thinking about another area for a change. You've got a great looking home there and you've done a fine job with the remodel.

As Jim the Realtor used to say (and probably still does), if in a month's time you:

- are getting offers, you're within 10% of the market price

- are getting people through but no offers, you're within 20% of the market price

- are not getting any lookers, you are at least 20% overpriced

From personal experience and watching other properties, I think these are excellent yardsticks.

Fees/Freehold, OK/CA, garage/carport, good school/poor school, pool/no pool, the yardsticks above take all of that out of the equation and get directly to the point: how much cash are buyers willing to yank out of their wallet to buy your specific home?

how much would it rent for?

the house next door rented at 1600/month
maybe a tad more.

Is it just me? Doesn't $300K sound like a lot of money for a house in Norman, Oklahoma? I thought homes there would be $159K.

Personally, I don't know much about Norman, Oklahoma. However, if that place can rent for $1600/month, I wouldn't pay much more than $250k for it based on today's interest rate. But that's just me. $250k @ 6.5% interest rate will give you ~$1600/month in mortgage.

1600 rent is 200-225k in my book for investment properties here, I suppose that same math would be applied elsewhere but without prop 13 protection I might adjust downward. I feel proud of myself, i guessed 225 without knowing the rent, I'm getting pretty good at this stuff.

I'm sticking with 225k for the sake of the betting pool, that's where it pencils out as a rental and that is where a renter decides to buy. Curiously, that is what I pay in rent and I can buy my place for 200k. I don't buy it because it doesn't fit my long term needs but if it did, I would at those numbers and that is where I think the buyers are valuing things right now. How they relate to rent, as opposed to appreciation because we all know that horse is dead for a while.

There are many 3 and some 4bdr homes in that range, but they are tract style, although few really look like tract homes, definitely not like tract homes in San Diego where the person next door or across the street has the same house. My mother sold a 3bdr a few miles away from the poster's location for about that range, it was around 1600 sqft.

People in these areas can buy a home while still in college, which worked out really well for people I knew in the midwest.

Hey tg, can you arrange for me to buy your pad for 200K ? Heck at a GRM = 125 that's about the same as Dallas/Fort Worth, but with much lower property tax rates (CA is ~1.2% versus 2 or 3% in Texas), and prop 13 protection. No wonder things have picked up in Temecula.

I've got a friend who has a square mile of land for sale about 5 miles outside the city limits of a fairly good sized OK city.

It is fenced, has a creek running through it, and 3/2 home over 2000 sf with garage. Asking price? $330K...for a square mile of land!!!

Of course, he bought it about 15 years back for under $80K.

He has a section, but, there are only 4 good sized Oklahoma cities.
Tulsa 180,000 people, Stillwater 50,000, OKC 150,000 with associated
communities of Edmond 30,000 and Norman 40,000

after that these town get to 15-20,000 real fast.

your buddy is selling land for 10 cents a square foot or
$4/000 per acre, that's not much

Former San Diegan, none of these are in my rental street but are examples of low GRM (most are shorts). If I post my exact hood I'll get stalkers. Wait, I want stalkers.

http://www.redfin.com/CA/Temecula/31214-...

139k, rent is about 1200

http://www.redfin.com/CA/Temecula/33433-...

189k, rent is about 1500

http://www.redfin.com/CA/Temecula/31017-...

199k, rent about 1600

http://www.redfin.com/CA/Temecula/33599-...

199k, about 1500 rent

http://www.redfin.com/CA/Temecula/44716-...

199k, about 1700 rent

http://www.redfin.com/CA/Temecula/44551-...

99k, maybe 1200 rent but at least 1000

http://www.redfin.com/CA/Temecula/44587-...

117k, 1000-1200 rent

There are 116 listings today in Temecula for under 200k, Rent is rarely under 1300 for pretty much anything that isn't a 1br apartment. Cheapest craigslist 2br I found was 1300, some of the same complexes are on craigs for a few hundred over what I quoted as rents, the rents I quoted are a tad low so they wont sit vacant. Too many "investors" paid more than twice these prices and need more so they ask too much IMHO, there are many rentals advertised at 20% more than the cost to buy with 0 down, so I can't imagine why anyone would rent them. I've thought about buying one of these as rentals and would stay on the south side of town, near the casino because there is only 1 apartment complex (1200 for a 2/2) for over 40k people and the casino employs about 4500 people (many renter demographic jobs and jobs with tips that will not be able to buy because stated income is over). I've held off because the casino just laid off about 10% of it's staff and I want to see the effect of that before becoming a landlord. Most of the jobs were created last year when the place doubled and the employees appear to commute in. My theory is that renters would prefer to not commute, there are no apartments zoned, the south side is almost built out and entirely zoned so long term it should be a decent investment at or below 125grm, but I also see the overcorrection and the credit crunch taking prices to 100 grm on a more consistent basis as opposed to the few examples I linked. For every one I linked is an exact one listed for twice that, so these were low price leaders in their category.

patb--

I'm unclear about this: Might you be transferred to San Diego? I think your house is lovely. Take this from someone (and spouse) who truly live in the fugliest girl on the block in our San Diego County neighborhood. It's all Persian Palaces and Spanish villas...'cepting for our "dollhouse," which is big enough for us, and that's all that matters.

I am personally interested in your tale because my dad's brother (they were both brought up in Chicago) still lives in OK, even though he is retired and has plenty of retirement income. His roof has been torn off three times by tornadoes. I am sincere -- what is the appeal of OK? Did you grow up there? If so, I understand. We'd like to leave So Cal but all of our family is here.

Yep, you actually listed the town he lives near.

And yes it is dirt cheap (pun intended), that was my point!

I think your house is nice - like the staircase, wood floors and some of the touches.

However, if I may be blunt...you need to do a better job of staging it. The house looks too sterile. Some specific suggestions:

1. Gussy up those bedrooms. As a buyer, I would see those bedrooms and run for the hills. There is nothing comfortable or inviting about the rooms. Go to Marshalls, Home Goods or TJ Maxx and buy "bed in a bag" (neutral) and some pillows. Buyers love beds that look inviting and comfortable.

2. I think your yellow kitchen is a turnoff. I would have painted that a neutral color. I also think in your price range, updated appliances would be more appropriate. But, I dont know if that's how Oklahomans feel...I would also take that dish rack off the counter. Put a couple of interesting things on the counter - for example, a bowl of fruit, flowers, etc.

3. I would rent a few pieces of furniture to do SOMETHING with that big, empty bonus room. Buyers appreciate seeing how space is used.

4. I would make that DR table more appealing. I've gone as far as to put entire place settings with lovely napkins at each place. But some inexpensive placemats, a vase with silk flowers will go a long way.

I hope you dont mind my feedback. Take it for what it's worth. Last year, I sold a house in another declining real estate market.

Homes in the area languished on the market for months. Ours sold in two weeks and I had THREE offers fighting over it. I attribute my success to the staging that we did. I hired a stager. I listened to her concerns. I paid her to use some of her bigger items. For the smaller touch, I opted NOT to pay her $2000 for rental - instead I spent half a day at HomeGoods, Marshalls, TJM, etc. and bought the stuff myself - most of it on clearance -for about $500.

When the house sold (we had already moved to CA), my realtor dropped off the items at Goodwill and got a donation slip for me.

I think your house is nice - like the staircase, wood floors and some of the touches.

However, if I may be blunt...you need to do a better job of staging it. The house looks too sterile. Some specific suggestions:

1. Gussy up those bedrooms. As a buyer, I would see those bedrooms and run for the hills. There is nothing comfortable or inviting about the rooms. Go to Marshalls, Home Goods or TJ Maxx and buy "bed in a bag" (neutral) and some pillows. Buyers love beds that look inviting and comfortable.

2. I think your yellow kitchen is a turnoff. I would have painted that a neutral color. I also think in your price range, updated appliances would be more appropriate. But, I dont know if that's how Oklahomans feel...I would also take that dish rack off the counter. Put a couple of interesting things on the counter - for example, a bowl of fruit, flowers, etc.

3. I would rent a few pieces of furniture to do SOMETHING with that big, empty bonus room. Buyers appreciate seeing how space is used.

4. I would make that DR table more appealing. I've gone as far as to put entire place settings with lovely napkins at each place. But some inexpensive placemats, a vase with silk flowers will go a long way.

I hope you dont mind my feedback. Take it for what it's worth. Last year, I sold a house in another declining real estate market.

Homes in the area languished on the market for months. Ours sold in two weeks and I had THREE offers fighting over it. I attribute my success to the staging that we did. I hired a stager. I listened to her concerns. I paid her to use some of her bigger items. For the smaller touch, I opted NOT to pay her $2000 for rental - instead I spent half a day at HomeGoods, Marshalls, TJM, etc. and bought the stuff myself - most of it on clearance -for about $500.

When the house sold (we had already moved to CA), my realtor dropped off the items at Goodwill and got a donation slip for me.