OT: Well, you have until 2013 to buy stuff from amazon without paying state sales tax...

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Submitted by flu on April 30, 2012 - 5:04pm

Correction. Looks like it will be 2013.... Internet sales tax with amazon....That's the timeline...Yes, even you Brian...

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424...

http://articles.latimes.com/2011/sep/08/...

That is if the federal mandate doesn't preempt CA (which given the way things have been working for CA in trying to collect additional taxes like Mello Ruse (sic), probably will end up in Amazon's failure)...

Meanwhile, you can thank CA for the reason why Amazon had shutdown all CA affiliate programs as a result... And why CA was marked as a "bad state" internally within the company......


People who have worked for Amazon have said that the retailer gave them a list of "bad states" and "red states" to avoid traveling to, given that a worker's actions in those states could trigger laws that could force Amazon to collect sales taxes.

http://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/news/...

http://money.cnn.com/2011/06/29/technolo...

Pure genius, Brown.... How's those pension accounts looking these days?

Submitted by harvey on April 30, 2012 - 5:17pm.

I know everyone likes to pick on Brian.

But does anybody here actually bother to compute and pay online sales taxes every year?

Eh, um....of course I do...but I mean...maybe others don't....

Submitted by AN on April 30, 2012 - 5:18pm.

pri_dk wrote:
I know everyone likes to pick on Brian.

But does anybody here actually bother to compute and pay online sales taxes every year?

Eh, um....of course I do...but I mean...maybe others don't....


That isn't the point...

Submitted by harvey on April 30, 2012 - 5:21pm.

flu,

I just noticed that your linked articles are pretty old. I can't find anything recent about CA. The only news I see for today is this, about TX:

http://www.dailyfinance.com/2012/04/30/w...

Submitted by flu on April 30, 2012 - 5:36pm.

Actual pri, it wasn't "picking on Brian" in the sense.
In fact, Brian has stated many many times he doesn't buy from amazon, so it won't affect him directly.. And Brian, let me apologize because if it offends you, because I know we got this funny issue about sales tax MR debate/argument going on from before...A long time back there was this discussion about how it wasn't necessary to pay internet sales tax thing was from an earlier discussion, but absolutely why it's not ok to include mello ruse as as tax deduction...... It's just kinda funny, we have the reverse situation now. Legally, for now, you don't need exclude mello ruse as a deduction, but you will be paying internet sales tax very soon...

BUT, the bigger issue i find disturbing is CA and brown (and frankly other states) seem to be just about trying every possible thing to nickel and dime everyone from businesses to consumers...When we really should be focusing on reducing spending... I don't see how this is going to help in the long run... Less business in state? Amazon is counting on a federal ruling to shoot this thing down...

Submitted by flu on April 30, 2012 - 5:38pm.

pri_dk wrote:
flu,

I just noticed that your linked articles are pretty old. I can't find anything recent about CA. The only news I see for today is this, about TX:

http://www.dailyfinance.com/2012/04/30/what-amazoncoms-change-of-heart-means-for-you/

I know. the wsj article is the latest. I actually almost missed the article, and only came across it because of something else unrelated I was reading. I'm surprised there wasn't more discussion about it, since I would think it would be a pretty big impact on consumers in CA and that people would want to know...

It's interesting though that while amazon and other etailers battles the state sales tax thing, I'm curious why there aren't more "shipping holding companies".
You know. Buy something expensive like a TV, and ship it to a a holding company in Oregon, and then have the Oregon company, open and repack the item, and then ship it back to you in California after it's "used".

Submitted by davelj on April 30, 2012 - 6:33pm.

Possibly dumb question: What about Kindle (or other e-reader) purchases? Are they being taxed at all? Will they be subject to state taxes based on the registered residence of the user? We're not paying taxes on i-tune downloads, right?

It seems like anything that can be downloaded to a device online - music, books, films, etc. - are going to be very hard to tax at the state level, or maybe I'm missing something.

Submitted by paramount on April 30, 2012 - 10:15pm.

And please don't fall for the so-called millionaire's tax Gov. Brown is putting out there.

It's a tax increase for everyone in California - all to benefit the already high-flyer gov't workers.

Submitted by flu on May 1, 2012 - 12:03am.

davelj wrote:
Possibly dumb question: What about Kindle (or other e-reader) purchases? Are they being taxed at all? Will they be subject to state taxes based on the registered residence of the user? We're not paying taxes on i-tune downloads, right?

It seems like anything that can be downloaded to a device online - music, books, films, etc. - are going to be very hard to tax at the state level, or maybe I'm missing something.

no idea...

Submitted by flu on May 1, 2012 - 12:05am.

Side note.

I really think Amazon should go out and buy acquire Best Buy right now.....And timing of this is critical...

1. Being a brick and mortar (right) now is extremely hard because, partly because of a competitive disadvantage of sales tax. I think no sales tax is one of the reasons Amazon is successful (among others). But that advantage very well might come to an end in 2-4 years (at least it will take awhile for Fed to make any ruling on it).

2. Best Buy is on life support right now... However, if Best Buy can survive for the next 2-3 years, and the internet sales tax thing does kick in more states, Amazon may not be as compelling before simply because all else being equal, people would rather see it, touch it, and take it home right away if the price is virtually the same, and I think Best Buy might actually grow stronger again if it survives because you'll see a shift back into brick and mortar companies. By acquiring it now, it's cheaper and it's one less competitor to deal with in the future.

3. Amazon can restructure/reinvent the Best Buy stores to be similar to how Apple makes its Apple stores. Get more people to buy it's online services and online devices, by offering services locally in house. Handle exchanges and returns. Possibly cut down on shipping expenses, etc...

4. If the fed ends up passing laws that takes away an sort of internet sales tax, it will take some time..When that happens, Amazon can sell or spin off Best Buy again into a separate company..It will get a much better price than it paid because under the Amazon management, perhaps it would be more profitable..And if the internet sales tax thing is settled by the fed, Best Buy as a spinoff would again be at a competitive disadvantage versus Amazon.com....

Submitted by harvey on May 1, 2012 - 7:17am.

davelj wrote:
It seems like anything that can be downloaded to a device online - music, books, films, etc. - are going to be very hard to tax at the state level, or maybe I'm missing something.

I believe that anything transmitted electronically is not subject to sales tax.

This was years ago, but at one time I handled software purchases for my firm. We bought a lot of customized stuff so the vendors would send us updates all the time. Our accountants told me to have it shipped electronically and never to ship a CD because it would be subject to tax if there was a "physical exchange" or some term like that.

No idea if any of this is current.

Submitted by Aecetia on May 1, 2012 - 10:35am.

flu,

"BUT, the bigger issue i find disturbing is CA and brown (and frankly other states) seem to be just about trying every possible thing to nickel and dime everyone from businesses to consumers...When we really should be focusing on reducing spending... I don't see how this is going to help in the long run... Less business in state? Amazon is counting on a federal ruling to shoot this thing down..."

This is an excellent point. They are desperate. Real estate is flat and they are not getting the income. Look at all the cuts that are being proposed in schools. They need to generate income or they will not be able to sustain their spending levels. They still don't get it.

Submitted by flu on May 1, 2012 - 11:02am.

Aecetia wrote:
flu,

"BUT, the bigger issue i find disturbing is CA and brown (and frankly other states) seem to be just about trying every possible thing to nickel and dime everyone from businesses to consumers...When we really should be focusing on reducing spending... I don't see how this is going to help in the long run... Less business in state? Amazon is counting on a federal ruling to shoot this thing down..."

This is an excellent point. They are desperate. Real estate is flat and they are not getting the income. Look at all the cuts that are being proposed in schools. They need to generate income or they will not be able to sustain their spending levels. They still don't get it.

And yet pensions for a government leaders and unions keep going up and up....Go figure....

Submitted by briansd1 on May 1, 2012 - 1:28pm.

flu wrote:

Meanwhile, you can thank CA for the reason why Amazon had shutdown all CA affiliate programs as a result... And why CA was marked as a "bad state" internally within the company......

So do you support California's efforts to collect use taxes or not?

Submitted by flu on May 1, 2012 - 2:03pm.

briansd1 wrote:
flu wrote:

Meanwhile, you can thank CA for the reason why Amazon had shutdown all CA affiliate programs as a result... And why CA was marked as a "bad state" internally within the company......

So do you support California's efforts to collect use taxes or not?

Nope, I don't. BUT, if it's the law, it's the law. And the law says, you should be paying for it, even IF it's hard for CA to collect. FTB says you should be paying for it...

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