San Diego Housing Market News and Analysis

Better the devil you know than the devil you don't.... And FYI, I just took a 1000 mile trip in a 30 year old car.

scaredy, just tuck a couple of beach towels in the seats and tell your kids they can ride in the old car on the next road trip with their bare feet hanging out the windows.

And carry a pan with you to put under it when you park it so as to not mess up the friend or relative's driveway whom you're staying with :=0

And don't forget to carry extra fluids, incl a few gallons of water for the radiator!!

im going to feel really stupid if I die in my old car due to lack of safety features. but so far nothing much has happened in 250,000 miles over a quarter century dangerwise. except for once a car came at me head on in NM and I swerved right, avoiding contact. so it's good at swerving...

spdrun, does your old Merc Diesel (do I have this right?) have hydraulics?

And can you hear it coming from up the street?

i believe my family thinks i am overthinking this.

PRO

Antilock brakes
airbags
a/c
struts that work
doesn't leak oil
no prior accidents
smells ok.

CONS

costs money.
could be too big.
could result in loss of identity as "crappy old car anti-consumption driver"

I wouldn't mind having a really old mercedes diesel.

No hydraulic rear suspension (thankfully -- expensive to fix!) and it's louder than a normal car outside, but not much louder.

Scardey. For peets sake, you're an attorney. You're spouse if I recall is a doctor. You live in a lower cost Temecula which you got a screaming deal on the home. You got a screaming deal on your loan. And you're probably getting a screaming deal on your car.

Granted it's a car is a depreciating asset, but let's put this in perspective. Even if you spend $30k for a car (which I doubt you are). You're honda will most likely last 20 years. $30k/20 years is like $1500/year or $125/month... Dude. Get rid of a cell phone or two or get rid of cable or eat out less..I'm sure you can figure out a way to eliminate $150/month in expeditures elsewhere. Or find a way to increase your monthly income by $150/month

For once in your life, enjoy it...If you don't enjoy it and save it... Fine. Say hello to uncle sam, and will more than happy spend it for you on something else. After all, he/she/they probably think you are rich anyway and want to robin hood distribute it to everyone else.

About 2-3 years ago, I was in your boat. Scraping every penny, every dollar, living like a hermit. It's how I've been most of my life. Then it dawned on me after I fired up my turbotax.. Holy crap...Interest (yeah, we can argue over 1-2%)....Dividend tax break? Going away... Capital gains breaks..going away... AMT? Still there...Meanwhile, borrowed money is cheap...
Folks living rent free/squatting? Obamacare? Folks complaining about taxing the "rich" more? And then the unexpected health shit. I was like, holy crap if I die tomorrow, tax shelter aside for my kid/family/etc, the rest gets redistributed to god-knows-who who will probably take borrow every $4 for every $1 uncle sam gives to them. Or yet, it goes into some bullshit missile used in the persian gulf, or to some public union pension, or some bank bailout, or some other ridiculous expenditure that uncle sam can think of..Meanwhile. I'm dead. I'm in a box, that's gradually decaying, and eventually worms or something else will start eating at my flesh...

Bullshit,bullshit,and more bullshit. So... Two years ago, no more. I don't condole spending up the ying yang, but come on enjoy life for a change. It's the best time to do it because not everyone else can, it's probably the cheapest time to do..And see if you can find a way to write it off. Open a small side business, and write off some additional expenses here and there and make it legitimate...You indicated you don't even itemize the last time you posted. There's part of your problem right there.

If you or your spouse gives you crap, just think there are people other people you know who are more irresponsible than you and they're doing just fine.You're buying 1 car. I bought 2 in less than 6 months. Haven't looked back ever since...And to some extent the tenants pay for it...

Enjoy life for a change, because you can....because you should. If you don't someone else will...at your expense.

Donate you're old car to Father Joes, Goodwill, or someone else that isn't as lucky as you, and be done with it.

No need for analysis to paralysis on this one. This one is a no brainer imho.

BTW: Scardy...Fvck the prius...

Get a Tesla S..

http://www.teslamotors.com/models/

At one point, I didn't think they were going to pull it off. But apparently they did... If they had stock for immediate delivery I would be all over it. But I think right now the backlog is about 1 year.

Different strokes for different folks. I can think of many ways to blow $1500/yr extra in preference to a new car (esp. a frickin' Accord!). Driving an old car doesn't mean "living like a hermit":
* Take a trip to some interesting place for a week. $1500 will cover air fare and hotel
* Buy a sailboat and fix it up.
* A few more hours of flying lessons
* A fixer-upper motorcycle.
* Quite a lot of theatre tickets
* Skiing!
* Musical instruments

Cars just don't rank high on my list of things that I give a crap about, unless the car is interesting in some way and/or classic. Having a more comfortable way to be stuck in traffic is like asking whether I want my teeth pulled or be punched in the face by a mugger.

As far as the old car, to hell with donating it to some bum. Price it right on Craigslist and someone will show up to pick it up, cash in hand, within a few days.

This being said, I actually didn't want a car as old as mine. I was looking for a post-2000 Subaru, called on a CL ad about a Subaru, and found out that the guy had already sold it. "But I have another car, and I'm flexible on price since I'm moving to FL next week..." OK, so I was in the area, so I took a ride down there! Saw that the car was basically in beautiful condition, and offered a bit over half his ask, thinking he'd never take it. Surprisingly he did, and at that point I couldn't exactly refuse.

Scaredy, how about a compromise. Go out and find a sweet newer used car. Besides the economics, there is an environmental aspect to the decision. Keep that old beater running is probably better for the environment overall.

Flu, I see what you mean, but not everybody likes cars the way you do. For many, a car is an appliance to get you from one place to another. I do like cars and lust after BMWs, Audis, Mercedes, even Lexus, and I could afford to buy a new one of those every 3-5 years, even pay cash, but I'm pretty sure the novelty will wear off after a few days or weeks, and that fancy German car won't feel much different than my trusty, 11-year old Mustang.

Scardey's purchase is as close to getting an appliance as possible. BUT as scardey says. It has A/C. It probably doesn't have a bad smell. It actually has some safety elements that his 10+ civic doesn't.And it will be one purchase he makes in like 20 years... 20 years....

Shit, in 20 years he probably won't be driving anymore, sitting around wearing depends garment, and thinking remembering this thread that FLU posted regretting the fact that his last car was 20+civic with no A/C and will never again drive something with A/C and without a bad smell..Because he listened to the rest of you guys instead of me...I mean, crap if he's already getting "old people" jokes at the stealership, I can't imagine what another 20 years will be like. (Yes, granted he'll probably still have another 10 years on a 30 year mortgage...but that's besides the point)....

He's not gonna be changing a car every 1,2 or 5 years. Like i said. keep the money...watch it grow that 1-2% a year. Or let uncle sam eat it out of taxes. Die... pass it on to his kids... watch uncle sam take more of that...and then watch his kids blow his hard earned savings on booze, babes, and boobs.....Ummm. No thanks...I think scardey has earned his right to endulge a little...Like a car with A/C....And not put up some bad smell.

There are a lot of people 90% in america that overindulges...Scardey isn't one of them. Live a little, ok?

delete.

im only afraid if I don't buy a new car I'll have an accident and get hurt.

I promise not to regret holding on for any other reason.

The Accord is a good car. My girlfriend has a 2000 model which has never had a problem. She had it in the shop for a day to get the brakes serviced, and they gave her a new accord to use, and that thing was damn nice.

Go for it. It may be a new purchase, but for a car, it's a prudent choice.

flu - I'm pretty sure I for one won't regret not buying a f**king appliance like an Accord. The "old age" argument falls flat unless he gets a Tesla Roadster, Vette, or something overpowered, silly, classic, or any combo of the three.

You hit the nail right right on the head. Holding on to an old old car could be a false economy.

All it takes is one accident, and a new car will very very likely improve your chances of avoiding injury or worse. Or even avoiding an accident altogether.

It's insurance. Cars are safer today than they were, maybe even just 5 years ago, not to mention 10 or more years.

You can and will get more money.

You can't replace...well, you know where this is going I'm sure.

I got rid of a perfectly good minivan because I didn't like my son having to sit in the 3rd row (essentially no crush zone).

If anything you should be scared of not having a modern safe car given the way people drive in so cal.

You can now lease a Honda Civic for $99 per month. Not a bad deal if you drive less than 12,000 miles per year.

Including down-payment of $3,500, lease payments and taxes and license, it works out to about $250 per month for 3 years.

I have a friend who drives little but needs to have a car. She got that one.

Remember, if you buy a car outright, you still need to pay sales taxes and annual registration/property taxes.

I'd personally fall asleep and drive off a bridge driving an Accord. Same goes for a new Camry. Had one as a rental, ick. So safe and baw-ring that it'd probably kill me.

If I go new-ish, I'm going BR-Z. Or Tesla. Or Boxster. Maybe even a nice Miata with a turbo. Perhaps a SmartCar with Hayabusa engine. Anything but a bloody appliance marketed to terminal nancy worrywarts.

But hey, at least it's not a fake-truck cutie-utie that's designed to make soccer moooommies feel like they're driving a UPS truck.

Lastly, I've sold quite a few cars and bikes that I bought used at a nice profit. Generally enough to cover insurance, registration, misc taxes paid, and repairs. Making my avg monthly payment pretty dern close to nada.

The diesel is sort of slow, but the Miata and Saab 900turbo were both a riot to drive, especially after the latter's boost regulation computer was appropriately adjusted.

I would think a V6 Accord or Camry would be pretty exciting to drive.

Not a 335, but still a nice ride.

When asked I always suggest that car buyers who live in the west go for the larger engine.

Lot's of mountains and non turbo/super charged engines can lose significant power @ higher altitudes.

Almost can't have to much power in the mountain west.

Personally: give me a manual or even a dual-clutch turbo-4 over a V-6 with a slushbox. Neither Camry nor Accord V-6 can be had with a real gearbox. Nor is the correct set of wheels driven :)

BTW, even a low-power turbo engine solves the mountain driving problem, since input pressure stays basically constant once the turbo is spooled. Far better than the Neanderthal solution of mo' cylinderz, mo' displacements, dawg.

I don't get the "need more HP to merge" argument either. Ever seen many East Coast highways? No acceleration ramps to speak of, yet I've done fine with anything ranging from 70 hp up to 250 hp.

personally, ive never felt or experienced any need to go faster.

slow is beautiful.

i did attempt to buy one yesterday but was thwarted by the failure to agree on a price. We got stuck about $600.00 apart. I felt misled by a dealer's promise to beat another dealer's quote. I'd rather not go into the details of who and what, but...perhaps the internet hasn't changed everything. I thought we had an agreement in principle and they thought I was just another dude to work over with four square boxes (although they put that away pretty fast when I told them to...) and repeat trips to the back room to implore their manager to sell a car.

Ah well...

If the dealer lied, you SHOULD post their name. **** 'em. And the answer to "I'll speak to my manager" is simple ... "If you can't make a decision on price, then bring out the manager who can or I'm leaving in five."

Also, if you're arguing about $600, you might not want a new car all that much. Get a decent used car for $4000-5000, stick it on a 2-yr promo card for a low rate, and be done with it.

Scardey..don't step inside a dealership without an email/contract with out the door price already in hand.

Go back to the thread I talked about. You should be able to do everything over email these days. When I dealt with buying cars, I had the internet sales/fleet sales email a price quote. And I always ask for OTD pricing telling them I live in San Diego with SD sales tax (versus L.A. county sales tax).

(Always ask for OTD pricing. One trick stealers love to play is tell you XXXX below invoice, and than tack on/pad a bunch of marketing/sales fee...Some brands might have them, but you'll find out once you compare versus other dealers...)

Some dealers will insist on you coming in. Don't...They're the stealerships that are trying to get you in, wear you down, waste your time, play all these stupid "old salesman" games...Usually old salesman/women do this. Also, some salesman/women try to place the race card.. Hey I'm chinese too, I get you a good deal and even go as far as try to speak your dialect. Flu says..Um, no thank you..Unless you speaka engrisha, get me a new sales person please.

Tell them you don't have time to waste coming in, you have 3-4 other dealers that sent your their prices over email, and if you don't that's fine, I won't buy from you..More than often, they will send it. It takes no time, and if they can beat the price, they will. And if they won't they won't and you can move on. Because it doesn't take much time for them to haggle...The only type of sales people I now that still employ to old "drag people into showroom" are the old fart salesman/woman who probably doesn't even know what the internet is.
Same old fart salespeople that (if they aren't successful in gouging you will say some bullshit like "maybe you're too young and not ready to buy a real car". To which, you should have no problem breaking character and say "fvck you, you old fart sales prick"...

Most folks who are in the internet/sales dept don't want to waste time haggling either because they figure they can move a lot more cars a lot more quickly via email than having someone show up in person.
Honda's are good because there soo many dealerships. If you want a reference, I have a dealership in L.A... A classmate's parents one's that one i think..

Before you go into the dealership, you should already have the OTD pricing agreed, the salesperson should have already faxed you the sales contract, with the exact car's VIN and mileage. Even stupid shit like if he's going to have to move a car from one dealer to another, you must have in writing that it will be flatbedded, not "driven" from one dealership to another by some porter....You can even put a deposit down on credit card and with the "written" note that it is fully refundable if you don't like the car for any reason the day you show up.

Show up with your printed emails, printed invoice, etc. DO NOT ADD/CHANCE anything once you are at the dealership. Just pick up the car, make sure the vin matches, make sure the mileage is correct, and make sure there's no body damage/etc. Say "no thank you" to the nice lady in the financing office who tries to upsell you an extended warranty, uncoating, vin etching, blah blah blah blah blah (insert your favorite bullshit pad item here)....

If the stealer deviates from the invoice they gave you, find the sales director and raise hell and threaten you have written proof and threaten to sue. Trust me, it won't get to that point...IF you already have everything in writing...In fact, you might even throw in a hint or to that you are an attorney..That also usually does the trick...

Get it in writing before you show up at the stealership. Otherwise, you're just wasting time.
Especially if you are buying a toyota or honda. Toyota stealerships are the worst. Honda's are close #2.

I find Honda dealers to be very proud of their honda's - and I would avoid dch Honda in Temecula.

scaredy, a cursory Auto Trader check of Accord EX-L (FULLY LOADED model) private party sales within 50 mi of Temecula (most in the OC) reveals these avail vehicles ... for starters.

http://www.autotrader.com/cars-for-sale/...

http://www.autotrader.com/cars-for-sale/...

http://www.autotrader.com/cars-for-sale/...

http://www.autotrader.com/cars-for-sale/...

http://www.autotrader.com/cars-for-sale/...

http://www.autotrader.com/cars-for-sale/...

http://www.autotrader.com/cars-for-sale/...

http://www.autotrader.com/cars-for-sale/...

2006-2011 model years asking $14,900 to $25K. Ironically, some of the ones claiming the lowest mileage are the oldest model years! Why play games and haggle over $600 when you can have a fully loaded model where someone else paid for all the extra goodies and dealer prep?

Hint: when a PP vehicle-seller has a lien, you can get pre-approved at your bank or cc for loan in advance (if you wish to finance) and go to their lender (if local) to get their payoff from the horse's mouth and pay them directly to consummate the transaction or arrange a wire transfer from your lender. OR, you can do the transaction from your bank during a biz day where your banking officer can get a faxed or telephonic payoff amt from the seller's lender. The seller's lender will then mail you (or your lender) the title in a few business days.

A PP seller often needs to get out of their vehicle loan ASAP for various reasons. Unlike the stealership, they don't need to make a dime over that.

If what they owe is just under the PP Bluebook value and you are getting all the goodies (options) with it as well, why not go this route?

These PP sellers aren't "trading in" because they either don't want to replace the vehicle or must get out of the loan and can't get enough on a trade in to do so or for both reasons.

Work it, scaredy. It's what you do best ... remember??

Edit: removed rant about penny pinching when I realized you actually made an attempt to buy something new.

My step-father-in-law is as stubborn and cheap as they come, but even he has the sense to buy a safe car. He was also t-boned in it recently, by someone even older than he is, and he walked away - which would not have happened without the side curtain airbag.

You can get invoice price, which is a decent (if not great) deal, via email without going into a dealer. Or just buy a 3-year-old Camry and forget about it.

bought new Accord today for $17,999 plus tax, title and reg.

Spreen Honda. They honored their carwoo.com internet price.

I'm just too scared to buy a used car. I cannot handle that risk.

And too scared suddenly to drive my old car with my kids in it.

.09% financing for 60 months.

Not .9%, but .09%. With nothing down.

I think the payment is $329.00 a month or thereabouts.

Congrats. And at least it's not an SUV or crossdresser.

none of the extras on any used car are worth anything to me. I don't care about any option. All I want is a warranty and no problems.

weird thing happened right when I left the dealership. I was driving hesitantly. and about a 1/2 mile from the dealer a cop pulled behind me and followed close behind me for a few miles. felt for sure I was gonna get pulled over, thought maybe i had failed to use a turn signal or something...

but did not..