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NO. Clever strategy??? Are you crazy? That's an insult to both Obama and the black community. In case you missed it I'm BLACK and your thread is highly offensive to me and most other African-Americans. Obama distances himself from those with radical ideas or harsh, inappropriate words, he doesn't distance himself from BLACK people. Note that in your above posts, he is critical of black fathers who aren't responsible. He would be critical of men of ANY race who didn't live up to their responsibilities. Obama would never distance himself from someone because they happen to be black. Do you actually think he's RACIST against his own people??

Both you and your post are beyond STUPID!

You wish it was like that, but it's not.

You wish OBAMA was like that, but he's not.

Weren't you posting a picture of a skinny white leg with black boot, saying it was yours? Weren't you asking me to sniff your underwear at one point? Bullshit is all I've got to say to you! Quit stalking me. You're the type of person Obama really needs to distance himself from.

BTW I am voting for Obama yet I think that to discount these recent media spectacles as mere coincidence is "beyond stupid". They are clearly meant to appeal to white voters. It is indeed racist but to win the presidency in a white-dominated country you must appeal to the majority and distance yourself from things less appealing to the mainstream. I think it is a great strategy to clinch the election. White people (and other races) are going to feel more comfortable voting for a black man who has taken a stand against the unsavory aspects of the black community. All the more convincing that Jackson is lashing out at Obama, conveniently on the air. This is an old-school technique, you can even see it in Hitchcock's North By Northwest.

As my good friend (who is black) puts it: Southern white people aren't going to vote for a half-black son-of-a-nigger-lovin' mother and a muslim father.

Go ahead, be offended, pull the race card, I don't care.

Stalking you? You WISH Nostradamus.

The *shapely* "white" leg is MY leg.

Don't you know black people come in all colors?? (shaking my head)

You post the filth you did, considering my race, you knew chances were high that I was going to respond.

I didn't ask you to sniff my underwear. That's all I'll say on that.

Ok, so it's a contrived tactic to win the nomination orchestrated by Jackson and Obama. BRILLIANT. You figured it all out!

Marion's leg

And that's MY leg, you dumbass. You deserve that title because only someone stupid and bigoted wouldn't know that African-Americans come in ALL colors. Yeah, and neither of my parents are white.

What did you think all us black people had black skin and nappy hair?

Nice leg!

BTW, two regulars on here have already seen the pics of my whole body including my face. So it's known on here that THAT "leg" belongs to a light-skinned BLACK woman with long, silky hair.

You're so ridiculous it's embarrassing.

P.S. I have a boyfriend, he's the one who sniffs my panties. I don't need nor would I want someone like you to have that honor.

Peace

marion YOU have made some really dumb off topic posts here.

obama needs too separate himself from the race hating blacks
if whites are going to vote for him .

Are you telling me your boyfriend sniffs your underwear? And you send body shot pics to other blog posters? Man, you are a classy chick! I had no idea you were black, why would I? I never read your posts!

Anyhoo, in the words of Obama, grow up! Get over yourself and post something worth replying to, I gladly will. If all you have is insults at least try to make them original (not "your sister is a whore" or "your penis is small" or "you're a racist bigot" those are old). Give me something I can laugh at! I feel like your mind is trapped in the 3rd grade or something. Show us what you got!

Peace to you!

If McCain thought going to Mecca in appropriate Muslim attire would get him elected we would see that in a minute. It is just the same thing. They all do it. Of course I hope Obama is countering these crab in a barrel, race card exploiting types on principle, at least to a degree. I believe he is. All due respect to the topic of course.

One question. Why can't Obama be Muslim? Isn't freedom from schisms related to religion a strong fundamental of this country? What if he were Buddhist or Hindi. I think he is playing the voters from Christendom like the best of them. Has he kissed the Pope's feet yet? I ask because he has been kissing plenty of something else in that realm.

Not that it's none of your nasty little business, but I do send fully-clothed pic to those who I wish to identify myself to. I might add this was BEFORE I had a boyfriend. One of them was even a pic in my graduation gown. Wow! The shame! lol.

Ok, play dumb. I'll explain it again. AFTER I posted on THIS thread I was black, you challenged that by saying I posted a pic of my "skinny white leg". The fact that you thought I couldn't be black because my leg appeared "white" is ignorant, bigoted, pathetic.

And you need to get off the underwear sniffing topic, it's very telling that you can't seem to though. It's painfully obvious you don't have that opportunity.

P.S. Please don't confuse "get off" with "get off ON", although I'm pretty sure you've already done the latter.

marion: I have to agree with Nost on this one. I saw the same behavior on another thread from you. Any perceived insult is greeted with an immediate and overwhelming tirade.

Was there anything in his post that is considering race baiting? Similar to John's pointing out in another post that Jesse Jackson has exploited his relationship with MLK, Jr. and being treated as though this were some sort of blasphemy.

If there is going to be any intelligent discourse, this sort of nonsense (and, yeah, it is nonsense) needs to stop.

Look at that points he is making and then, if you disagree, respond with a well reasoned counter argument or facts (remember the blog's caveat about bringing data?) that dispute his points. Anything else is just noise and the insults are truly grade school.

Hi, I'd like to know where to subscribe to the Official Republican Talking Points (tm) RSS feed, thx!

/snark

Hi, I'd like to know where to subscribe to the Official Republican Talking Points (tm) RSS feed, thx!

/snark

afx: Check Obama's website. He's starting to parrot them more effectively than McCain.

Yes, Allan, I do tend to have a knee-jerk reaction to certain posts. However, I am responding to a poster that is truly disgusting. And yes, that is my opinion.

While his post had some points that were worthy of discussion, the underlying tone of his thread was ugly. I'm sure if you go back and look hard enough, you should be able to ascertain what I'm talking about.

For example, Nostradamus made a statement about Obama distancing himself from the "unsavory" behavior of blacks. Doesn't that sound kind of ugly to you, Allan?

OR maybe it doesn't.

marion: I would point out that opinion is not fact. I would also point out that I didn't find the post or the poster disgusting. This idea that ethnicity is somehow driving the debate is wrong-headed and it stifles the discussion. You have, in partypup, somehow who shares your gender and ethnicity, yet is perfectly willing to go along with the notion that we are here to discuss, debate and entertain.

Not check our brains at the door and ruthlessly attack anyone that we feel somehow doesn't subscribe to identity or gender politics (and that is what you are doing).

And, BTW, I did go back and look at both the post and the context. Where is the underlying tone you mention? The post was to the point and straightforward. I think knee jerk is exactly the right phrase to describe your reaction.

Allan, that remains to be seen. I highly doubt that. But, again, that just happens to be my opinion.

marion: So if it doesn't sound ugly to me, then I'm a racist?

As I mentioned before, this is identity politics at its worst. If I don't agree with your point, it makes me a racist. Whereas, the reality is that I don't agree with your point because it is wrong or factually incorrect.

What, specifically, do you find offensive about the word "unsavory"? Do you feel that this label is somehow being applied to all blacks? Do you feel that blacks, as a group and a race, don't ever engage in unsavory behavior? You need some specificity in your response, marion.

It sounds as though there is some history between you and Nost and that is coloring the response. And, no, I am not using the word "coloring" as any sort of pun or putdown.

marion: That remains to be seen? Wow. So you are responsible now for vetting someone in terms of race and gender?

I found her response to thoughtful, well reasoned and without any sort of malice. How is that a bad thing?

Read my post under "McBama".

Allan: You are an arrogant fool if you assume that anything said here so far qualifies beyond opinion. I'm so tired of that stance. No one has a monopoly on being unbiased, i.e., no one is unbiased. You throw around "facts" without extremely strong studies, evidence, and logic, you are wading way out into the sea of the unknown.

Claiming that what someone says is "biased" and "knee jerk" is exactly what I would call "stifling". It's an empty observation.

In my OPINION I do see a few people scratching around in the dirt over a debate of questionable merit. It seems to me like so far everyone has been really terrible at describing their real premises and conclusions. If I was more cynical I'd say marion was baited by nostradamus. And that possibly nostradamus said nothing truly untoward. But please don't pretend that a discussion of politics can be free of bias and emotion. Don't claim that you, yourself, are free of bias. It's absurd. There's no high ground here. We're all a bunch of fools.

While you're at it, you also might be smart not to assume that punctuation marks are an honest indicator of emotion and bias. And could you please explain, for the group, what you mean by "subscribing to identity and gender politics"? It might be enlightening.

Is that a ruthless attack? How you like them apples?

So you start off with calling me an arrogant fool, and questioning my intelligence, but then ask me to respond, apparently without bias and emotion, to your post?

How do I like what apples? And, no, I wouldn't characterize your attack as ruthless. Pompous and high handed perhaps, but not ruthless.

Yes, everyone is biased. However, that completely obscures the nuance that there are degrees to bias, ranging from slight to extreme. Reacting strongly to anything regarding your color or ethnicity solely on that basis alone is a strong bias and wrongheaded. When I refer to gender and identity politics, that is exactly what I mean. A knee jerk response to something solely because it offends a PC notion of what it means to be a woman or black in modern American society. Jackson, Sharpton and the afrocentric movement have made a fine living off that fat hog and woe betide any white person for pointing out the truly vile nature of preying on one's own people.

As with using the phrase "questionable merit". According to whom? You? Who gets to be the arbiter of that? If you don't agree with the topic or the merits of the topic, don't participate. Simple as that. However, referring to people as stupid doesn't have a place here.

My two cents:

Nothing in the original post was overtly "racist", though it deals with race directly, so I can see how it could be intepreted as such. It really is an observation on true Machiavellian tactics, which seem to be required to get elected in this country.

Really? I would assume that black people would have to be black. It kind of seems like the defining characteristic. Now someone of African-American descent may have varying skin tones...

Marion - You DO tend to overreact and in all honesty, you appear to have Narcissitic Personality Disorder, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Narcissisti...
which would better explain your diatribe and feeling that this post (as well as countless other comments on this blog) were a personal attack. You also tend to use emotionally charged words and ad hominem attacks.

As for bias, everyone has theirs. The key is to recognize this and evaluate topics as objectively as possible.

As for Allan, I have generally enjoyed his posts and found them enlightening, even though I know his conservative viewpoint differs from mine.

Maybe you can help me with this, Marion. Here's what I don't understand.

So many people in this country act like they have a right not to be offended. They act like they are a victim if they are offended. They act like, if they call another person out for offending them, that they (the offended) are righteous and the offender is guilty of some crime. I don't understand that.

In my opinion, the only thing people who are offended are a victim of is their own weak minds. If someone spouts something ignorant (in your opinion), and you don't have a weak mind, your response (in my opinion) would be to say, "I think you're ignorant, and here's why I think that." Or to ignore them. Why does it hurt you that someone else is ignorant? Ignorance is ubiquitous world-wide. People are saying ignorant things on a constant basis. What difference does it make that what they're saying is said in your vicinity and on a subject you care about?

You say, "In case you missed it I'm BLACK and your thread is highly offensive to me and most other African-Americans." What is your point? Are you saying that therefore he shouldn't have posted his post?

If someone says something ignorant or untrue, and you let it offend you or hurt you, that's your fault. If what a person says really does show ignorance or bias or hate or whatever, that says something about that person. Not about you. So why does it offend you? It's really got nothing to do with you. Unless you let it bother you. But why would you let it bother you? And (and this is the part that really confuses me) why would you get all righteous about it?

Disclaimer: I'm not calling anyone ignorant or biased or hateful. I'm saying that Marion appears to see them that way.

You misunderstood.

* I called all of us fools - that includes me.
* I disagree with your presumption of what is biased and what isn't.
* I didn't ask you to respond without bias. I just said that you are as biased as all the rest.
* I am suspicious of people who label other comments as being "race card", "biased", "knee jerk", and so on.
* Everything is of questionable merit.
* I said you were a fool IF you believed that you're able to somehow free yourself of bias. I didn't actually call you a fool.

So, again, in my opinion...I expect more of you, if you're going to start to try to delineate which posts are "valid" and "invalid" based on "ethnic bias" you have a long way to go to even state your case, much less prove it.

I like participating in the discussion, it is not above me. Like you, I just jumped in. I wanted to challenge you not to assume that marion didn't have a point, just because she wasn't stating it so well. Doesn't it strike you as *possible* that you're the one doing a "knee jerk" by assuming that outrage is emotional and therefore not valid?

I'm sorry, but it does. I stated I was black, Nostradamus called me a liar by responding:

[Quote] Nostradamus: Weren't you posting a picture of a skinny white leg with black boot, saying it was yours?