Mission Ranch Estates - 4S Ranch

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Submitted by OntheSideLine on September 3, 2012 - 9:57pm

25 Estate Homes by California West -
Beautiful homes, large lots
Residence 1 approx 4238 to 4429 sq ft
Residence 2 approx 4555 to 4710 sq ft
Lots from 12,000 sq ft to 48,000 sq ft in first 2 phases
Prices from $988,900 to $1,084,900
We have been waiting a long time to find large home on a large lot in
4S Ranch but $1 million for 10-15K usable net lots???
Overpriced or worth it as this will be last community built in 4S Ranch?

Submitted by ocrenter on September 3, 2012 - 11:19pm.

What's the HOA, MR, and MR payoff?

Add $250k to the purchase price and ask yourself can you buy a comparable resale home in 92127?

Submitted by OntheSideLine on September 3, 2012 - 11:37pm.

HOA $85, Tax rate including MR is 1.5% (length probably the same as
rest of 4S Ranch). Why add $250K to purchase price - upgrades and
landscaping? 20K incentive towards upgrades. Thanks for your thoughts.

Submitted by ocrenter on September 4, 2012 - 7:23am.

OntheSideLine wrote:
HOA $85, Tax rate including MR is 1.5% (length probably the same as
rest of 4S Ranch). Why add $250K to purchase price - upgrades and
landscaping? 20K incentive towards upgrades. Thanks for your thoughts.

yup, $250k is the average for upgrades in and out for houses of that caliber and lot size.

$20k incentive toward upgrades = $10k in street value of the same upgrades aftermarket.

$1 million is pretty hefty for 4S IMHO. Are these truly Ivy Gate/Santa Monica/Marisol/The Lakes caliber homes? If so I suppose it may be worth it. Or are these simply larger versions of CalWest's smaller tract homes in 4S? That's a very important question you need to answer.

Submitted by sdnerd on September 4, 2012 - 8:48am.

I haven't toured the finished models yet, but I walk by them everyday.

Personally, I wouldn't pay ~1.2M to live there.

I like the houses, and the location back in the hills but the process of getting there and overall integration kills it for me.

You get there either via Alva Rd or down the middle of 4S. Both routes take you past a sea of apartments, and homes priced in the 600-700K range. These houses really aren't that separated from the rest of the area.

I guess it just doesn't feel like a separate, significantly nicer area. Instead, it's more like a small pocket of "most expensive homes in the neighborhood."

Submitted by OntheSideLine on September 4, 2012 - 3:24pm.

I think we could get by with less them 250k

Better than Mirasol...not as large as Ivy Gates.
Similar to Santa Fe Valley homes or Lakes.
We actually like that these are large homes within
4S Ranch...we don't want our kids to be
raised in gated communities or private schools.

A little over-priced but I guess if we are staying
long term...it might be worth it...inching closer
to pulling the trigger. Thanks

Submitted by Essbee on September 4, 2012 - 8:23pm.

Have you checked out this neighborhood in South 4S?

http://www.zillow.com/homedetails/9663-D...

9663 Deer Trail Pl
San Diego, CA 92127
or similar "Talavera" models? (4053 sq feet, built by Davidson)

The one listed is cul de sac/canyon rim, not brand new but therefore fully landscaped with upgrades already done, walking distance to elementary, middle, and high school. I think this neighborhood is great!
(Yes, forgive me, I moved here a few months back, so I'm a cheerleader.)

Submitted by henrysd on September 4, 2012 - 9:54pm.

All new homes in north 4S ranch have 1.9% property tax. How come this one has only 1.5%? I know 4S new homes have 2 Poway USD school bonds to pay in Mello-Roos.

Another impression is the extremely high fire danger as the small community is like island surrounded by wild brushes. Technically in a 360 degree circle, 320 degrees face wildness.

Submitted by ocrenter on September 4, 2012 - 10:03pm.

OntheSideLine wrote:
I think we could get by with less them 250k

Better than Mirasol...not as large as Ivy Gates.
Similar to Santa Fe Valley homes or Lakes.
We actually like that these are large homes within
4S Ranch...we don't want our kids to be
raised in gated communities or private schools.

A little over-priced but I guess if we are staying
long term...it might be worth it...inching closer
to pulling the trigger. Thanks

It is certainly possible to go lower, $150k in and out is very possible, and still have everything come out looking like $250k of improvement. Just there would be a lot more headache.

I was going to say if you have the patience you should be able to find an appropriate resale within the $1 million to $1.2 million range with Santa Fe Valley/Santaluz/Ivy Gate/the Lakes. Problem is they are all gated so tht would not fit with your criteria.

Might also want to consider KHov resales in south 4S for much cheaper. For example:

http://www.sdlookup.com/MLS-120038281-15...

Submitted by OntheSideLine on September 5, 2012 - 2:33am.

Essbee,
We actually looked at this house. The upgrades were
of lower quality then the standard in Mission Ranch. The house
also felt smaller and more dated. The big plus
was the pool.

Mission Ranch is 100k overpriced but comparable
to Reunion at its peak (also by Davidson...a few streets
away).

We won't be getting the best deal but also
not the worse.

I would rather buy resell and get the best deal
possible but the spouse liked new...

Submitted by ocrenter on September 6, 2012 - 7:58am.

http://www.sdlookup.com/MLS-120006839-73...

with occasional deals like above still squeezing through, how do you justify a million for brand new construction with base carpet/laminate on 1/3-1/2 acre of dirt?

Submitted by joec on September 7, 2012 - 6:57am.

Maybe go to the initial phase release and see how crazy it is. If there are 100+ people there buying up all the homes at the listed price, it may be tough to get cheaper. I think some of the recent sold ones on smaller lots/houses went for 800k or so.

Your wife wants new which will make it hard to find new homes without MR now. Carmel Valley has lower tax rate and less MR I think, but prices are quite a bit more and most aren't 4k in size.

Submitted by earlyretirement on September 7, 2012 - 6:19pm.

I agree ocrenter.

We didn't look at homes in Mirasol but we did in Santa Monica last year. There were some beautiful homes on large 1/2 acre lots. The only thing I didn't like were all the power lines around Santa Monica. I'm not sure if that is the case with Mirasol as well.

Onthesideline -- Just out of curiosity, why are you against gated communities? Some of them are really great and it's not like your kids would be spoiled or anything for the mere fact you live in a gated community.

I don't think it's the same thing as sending them to private schools. I was just curious on that one.

We looked at homes in 4S Ranch and we really didn't see the attraction there. Much of the houses there looked to be of inferior quality to other areas.

Carmel Valley we felt was definitely not worth it, especially in areas like Pacific Highland Ranch which had mostly million dollar homes on postage size lots where all your neighbors could see into.

Even Collins Ranch with bigger homes on bigger lots didn't seem too special to me either.

Submitted by ocrenter on September 8, 2012 - 12:46pm.

earlyretirement wrote:
I agree ocrenter.

We didn't look at homes in Mirasol but we did in Santa Monica last year. There were some beautiful homes on large 1/2 acre lots. The only thing I didn't like were all the power lines around Santa Monica. I'm not sure if that is the case with Mirasol as well.

Onthesideline -- Just out of curiosity, why are you against gated communities? Some of them are really great and it's not like your kids would be spoiled or anything for the mere fact you live in a gated community.

I don't think it's the same thing as sending them to private schools. I was just curious on that one.

We looked at homes in 4S Ranch and we really didn't see the attraction there. Much of the houses there looked to be of inferior quality to other areas.

Carmel Valley we felt was definitely not worth it, especially in areas like Pacific Highland Ranch which had mostly million dollar homes on postage size lots where all your neighbors could see into.

Even Collins Ranch with bigger homes on bigger lots didn't seem too special to me either.

I think both Santa Monica and Marisol have homes adjacent to power lines.

Agree with you about the gated community status. typically it is seen as a premium. although it does increase the cost of the HOA.

Submitted by OntheSideLine on September 9, 2012 - 6:18am.

OC renter...we toured that property. The standard options in Mission Ranch are
nicer than upgrades in that home. The only advantage would be the landscaping.
We would need to replace flooring and paint either home. Mirasol is surrounded by power lines. Paying for small gated communities with no parks and higher HOAs is not appealing to me. I grew up in a gated community and felt isolated as a child. 4S is surrounded by parks, trails, markets, schools, and has regular neighborhood activities like the annual Easter Egg hunts. We have friends who in Mirasol and they drive to 4S for grocery shopping, the library, and parks. Mission Ranch is about 100k more than I want to spend but has lower HOA and no power lines. Still deciding but inching closer to buying...

Submitted by ocrenter on September 9, 2012 - 1:08pm.

OntheSideLine wrote:
OC renter...we toured that property. The standard options in Mission Ranch are
nicer than upgrades in that home. The only advantage would be the landscaping.
We would need to replace flooring and paint either home. Mirasol is surrounded by power lines. Paying for small gated communities with no parks and higher HOAs is not appealing to me. I grew up in a gated community and felt isolated as a child. 4S is surrounded by parks, trails, markets, schools, and has regular neighborhood activities like the annual Easter Egg hunts. We have friends who in Mirasol and they drive to 4S for grocery shopping, the library, and parks. Mission Ranch is about 100k more than I want to spend but has lower HOA and no power lines. Still deciding but inching closer to buying...

In regard to shopping, 4S Commons is suppose to be the hub for the entire 92127, including the whole black mountain ranch development. Certainly if the goal is to be as close to shopping as possible, then a development within 4S would be best.

If you and the wife are happy with what Mission Ranch has to offer, sounds like you should just go for it. I agree with you, I think it is about $100k too much. But I think there is enough demand to support the price. After all, CalWest sold quite a number of 3000 sqft tract homes on tiny 6000 sqft lots for $800k.

Submitted by flyer on September 9, 2012 - 4:27pm.

OTSL

I have to completely agree with you about your thoughts on living in 4S with regard to convenience--especially with children. We have friends who live there, and love it--for all the reasons you have mentioned. Carmel Valley is also another great community you might like--again, for all the same reasons.

My wife and I were raised in La Jolla, and we raised our kids in Rancho Santa Fe where we still live. In both of these communities you do a LOT of driving as a parent, and in general, so choosing a "Planned Community" will definitely save you lots of time over the years.

Good luck!

Submitted by kcal09 on September 9, 2012 - 9:42pm.

I think that you will do fine if you don't expect any significant appreciation and plan to keep the home for at least 10 years. Space in San Diego is limited and there will always be demand for homes this size. However, I would recommend looking for existing homes also as great deals can be found. Another area that is attractive for families is Scripps Ranch.

Submitted by Essbee on September 10, 2012 - 11:13pm.

Essbee wrote:
Have you checked out this neighborhood in South 4S?

http://www.zillow.com/homedetails/9663-D...

9663 Deer Trail Pl
San Diego, CA 92127
or similar "Talavera" models? (4053 sq feet, built by Davidson)

The one listed is cul de sac/canyon rim, not brand new but therefore fully landscaped with upgrades already done, walking distance to elementary, middle, and high school. I think this neighborhood is great!

I just checked and this property is now listed as sold on 8/31/12 for $960K. I feel like the market really is turning a corner!

I hope you enjoy Mission Ranch Estates. I'd like to see the model(s) at some point. Again, I don't know that specific area, but I have very much enjoyed living here in 4S.

Submitted by ocrenter on September 11, 2012 - 12:34pm.

Essbee wrote:
Essbee wrote:
Have you checked out this neighborhood in South 4S?

http://www.zillow.com/homedetails/9663-D...

9663 Deer Trail Pl
San Diego, CA 92127
or similar "Talavera" models? (4053 sq feet, built by Davidson)

The one listed is cul de sac/canyon rim, not brand new but therefore fully landscaped with upgrades already done, walking distance to elementary, middle, and high school. I think this neighborhood is great!

I just checked and this property is now listed as sold on 8/31/12 for $960K. I feel like the market really is turning a corner!

I hope you enjoy Mission Ranch Estates. I'd like to see the model(s) at some point. Again, I don't know that specific area, but I have very much enjoyed living here in 4S.

the market has turned, and this is why CalWest can ask for the prices they are asking for. Certainly with only 25 homes they need to build, they'll be able to sell out within a few months.

as for north vs south, hands down south side of 4S is significantly better. one concern with Mission Ranch is it will be 1.5 miles deep away from the nearest major street (Camino Del Norte), with 4S and Ralph Ranch roads, you simply cant go very fast because of the large number of stop signs and homes they run thru.

Submitted by all on September 11, 2012 - 12:48pm.

ocrenter wrote:

as for north vs south, hands down south side of 4S is significantly better. one concern with Mission Ranch is it will be 1.5 miles deep away from the nearest major street (Camino Del Norte), with 4S and Ralph Ranch roads, you simply cant go very fast because of the large number of stop signs and homes they run thru.

Alva rd will take you to Rancho Bernardo rd quickly.

Submitted by paranoid on September 11, 2012 - 6:32pm.

Within walking distance (~20 minutes)of the Mission Ranch lies Lake Hodges. You feel the breeze most time of the year.

You will be surprised how good the environment is around that corner.

Submitted by ltsdd on September 11, 2012 - 9:00pm.

4S is a great community to live in especially if you have young kids. If your kids are into sports, take them to the 4s ranch community park on a Saturday and you'll see one of the reasons why people love it there.

I toured the 2 models of the Mission Ranch Estates a few weeks ago and I'll have to say that I like the layout of the KHov's Palomino on the south side better, but I don't think it's enough for me to pick a 10 year old house over a brand new one.

Submitted by OntheSideLine on September 11, 2012 - 11:13pm.

Why do you like the south side better? The
S side has bigger average lots and lower MR however
there are fewer parks....also the trail from the North side
to Lake Hodges is very nice. Given that there are large lots
and lower Mello Roos of 1.5% than other homes on the
N side...we will buy...now just deciding on the 2 available lots vs
waiting for the next phase. We do like this home more than any
other development in 4S other than Ivy Gate (nicer homes but
I didn't want to be in a gated community and it would have cost
more than Mission Ranch). We have seen all the floorplans in 4S
in person over the last few years, looked at Mirasol/Santa Monica/Santa
Fe Valley and plan on staying long term. Thanks everyone for your advice.

Submitted by Essbee on September 12, 2012 - 5:55am.

I like the south side better because it lacks that "grid-like" feeling (lots of straight streets) seen on the north side. Sometimes I have driven around in there and had a feeling of being in an endless sea of cookie cutter houses. I have not felt that way on the south side. I imagine that in the Mission Ranch area, it does not feel that way, either.

On the south side, I am not such a big fan of the Palomino area. To me, it is too much of a hodgepodge to have a brick colonial home next to what I'll term a "Miami Vice" home. The styles of the homes just do not match at all and it ends up looking odd.

I agree that Ivy Gate is very nice. However, I have not seen any homes for sale there in the past 6 months.

I have not been on the trail to Lake Hodges, but I plan to check that out. It sounds nice. As I mentioned, I live in the Deer Trail area (Talavera). I live within 2 blocks of two different pocket parks. Each of these has access to trails which go down into the canyons and/or soccer fields. I have been on hikes of 4+ miles on those trails. You can apparently walk to Del Sur and beyond to Santaluz, although I have not done so. I'm sure as Del Sur develops further, the views will be less spectacular, but for now it is quite lovely.

Submitted by ocrenter on September 12, 2012 - 6:25am.

OntheSideLine wrote:
Why do you like the south side better? The
S side has bigger average lots and lower MR however
there are fewer parks....also the trail from the North side
to Lake Hodges is very nice. Given that there are large lots
and lower Mello Roos of 1.5% than other homes on the
N side...we will buy...now just deciding on the 2 available lots vs
waiting for the next phase. We do like this home more than any
other development in 4S other than Ivy Gate (nicer homes but
I didn't want to be in a gated community and it would have cost
more than Mission Ranch). We have seen all the floorplans in 4S
in person over the last few years, looked at Mirasol/Santa Monica/Santa
Fe Valley and plan on staying long term. Thanks everyone for your advice.

IMHO, the south side is better planned. the larger lots and lower MR are two huge factors as well.

a portion of the north side was suppose to be a planned golf course for neighboring Santa Fe Valley communities. during the bubble, they vastly expanded the number of homes planned for the north side, and squeezed in as much homes as possible. therefore the north side appears a lot more crowded. and from afar it really provides the prototypical suburban picture of rows of homes after homes after homes. there are parks, but I don't think there's more compared to the south side. especially if you count by household, since the north side is denser.

I did forget about Alva, it should provide a decent alternative to 4S and Ralph Ranch.

given there's only 25 homes planned for Mission Ranch, if you guys like it you should go for it. 4S does have a lot of appeal and the prices offered is grounded on current market conditions.

Submitted by ltsdd on September 12, 2012 - 7:06am.

Generally, I like the feel of the south side better. Being to the model homes (Pulte's & Calwest's) in that part of the north side, I would say that it's not too bad, either - very unlike the Silvercrest homes around that main street that cut across 4S Ranch Rd. I think if you like Mission Ranch then just go for it. I think market fluctuations is just noise if you're in for the long run. One great plus thing is, outside of Ivy Gate and Santa Fe Valley, you're not going to find homes in 4s with bigger lots.

Somewhat a thread-jack: Where does the trail to lake hodges started in 4s?

Submitted by ocrenter on September 12, 2012 - 7:32am.

Agree, silver crest is an abomination. Those homes by buie along alva were quite awful as well.

That's another thing about the north side, there are large chunk of just atrocious homes built just prior to the bubble bust that frankly would be better off leveled and rebuilt.

Submitted by all on September 12, 2012 - 7:42am.

ltsdd wrote:

Somewhat a thread-jack: Where does the trail to lake hodges started in 4s?

You can get to the trail through the pocket park at the end of Hunters Ridge Rd (two blocks from the new Liberty park which could use restroom facilities). It is more of a natural trail, not as developed as the one on the south side that goes from Camino San Bernardo to Oak Valley school.

Submitted by sdnerd on September 12, 2012 - 11:05am.

I live on the North side, literally right next to Mission Ranch.

The vegetation on the South side is a lot more mature. The trees lining the streets, the parks, houses, etc - it's a lot "greener" and gives off a completely different feel.

The North side, a large # of homes were just put up in the last 2 years. All the trees are small, and there's still a lot of construction going on.

As a result, you see "a lot more house" and it does give off a very cookie cutter feel right now. In a couple years I think it'll feel very different.

On the North side things spread out with bigger lots the further back you go. But it's definitely a trek back there, and you go past a lot of apartments and packed in houses on the way.

I'm going to walk through the models this week to check them out.

Submitted by bobby on September 12, 2012 - 11:41am.

HOA of $85 for a million dollar property? Sounds low. May want to check the figures again. Wouldnt want to be surprised AFTER the house is purchased.

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