San Diego Housing Bubble News and Analysis

In many developments it's against the HOA rules ... and in some cities (notably in Orange Frickin' County) artificial turf is illegal. Drought or no drought.

YIKES! Even in your backyard? Let's see... no noise and air pollution from the lawn guys and no need for watering so that is good. All in favor of making it illegal say AYE.

ox
...man arrested for installing nylon, NEWs at 11

We have mulled it over but not seriously yet.

But I must warn you about the early poll returns, and I'm not sure if this is important to you...but artificial grass will not impress women - drought or no drought. Every time I mention that we may do it to a female I get a crinkled nose reaction followed by the utterance of the word "no". Which is something I generally don't like to hear from their lips.

Just a warning.

try and xeriscape

My friends and I considered it.

Some things to consider

1. Some of the fake grass has high lead content (not all)...Usually the cheaper stuff skimp on material...Yeah, I was surprised about this. But considering that lead is also found in some electrical cords used for the outdoors, I'm not surprised. So if you have kids that will actually play on this, you've been warned. (I was surprised some poway schools were considering putting in fake grass).

http://yubanet.com/california/Legal-Acti...

http://www3.signonsandiego.com/stories/2...

2. The fake grass tends to heat up and get really hot in direct sun, plus the reflection of it makes it look fake when used on a large section

3. Cleanup isn't as easy as people lead it to be.

4. Expensive for ones that look more real. Not really cost effective.

We've seriously looked at it. A few of our neighbors have done it... Observing theirs - some are more realistic than others.

Some are artifically turfs are made locally some are made further afield - which reduces the "environmentally friendly" factor when you look at the carbon footprint of shipping it to the US.

We're looking at a combination with zeroscaping... where the fake grass is a small portion of the landscaping... I've noticed that it looks more realistic when you do that.

I say do it, especially since you already have to do something. I bought a dead lawner and suprisingly within a few weeks of watering it, it came back to life. Had it not, I would have gone fake in the back. HOA's are starting to come around, mine allows xeriscapes in the front now as long as you submit plans. Do some research as to the various loose materials they use to keep it fluffed up. My kid plays football on an artificial turf field and they use ground tire bits, it smells horrible and gets everywhere in the house, it looks like someone spilled a pepper shaker, avoid that kind if they even use that for residential use.

We did it. Look great, feels great, not problem exercising on it (from previous post). Don't skimp, get good stuff and have professionals install it with the nice base so it feels real when you walk over it. Some have just put the turf down themselves over dirt, and it it terrible.

Contributing to Global Warming
Why would we contribute to global warming by removing life that removes carbon dioxide from our atmosphere?

According the non-profit group Athena Institute, the replacement of one grass field would require the planting of 1,861 trees, and allowing them to grow for 10 years, to offset the amount of "carbon dioxide sequestration" lost with the grass fields.

David Brown, a public health toxicologist, wrote a column for the Sunday New York Times explaining some of the dangers of creating playing fields out of petroleum products.

He said each square foot of synthetic surface has 10 or so pounds of tire crumbs, which results in about 225 tons of ground-up tires for a field 300 feet long by 150 feet wide. Silver Terrace is at least twice that size.

"(Studies) found that dust from the rubber crumbs contained carcinogens that could be inhaled into the deepest portions of the lung," Brown wrote.

As well, the water that drains off the synthetic fields is channeled into the city's sewer system, which means it is treated and discharged into the Pacific Ocean. It does not go back into the underground aquifer. (Wasn't that the problem with Lake Merced?)

Our sewer system can't handle all of the water during a heavy rain and sometimes untreated effluent is dumped directly into the ocean. This will make that problem worse.

The SF Board of Supervisors passed legislation in 2002 to ban the paving over of small green spaces in the front of people's homes in an effort to keep water flowing into the underground aquifers and out of the city's storm drainage system. Recently, it passed legislation calling for fines of up to $500 for violators.

But the City is the biggest violator of its own policy. Surprise.

http://www.sunsetbeacon.com/archives/Sun...

Agree very much with Veritas' post.

Perhaps you could go somewhere like Quail Botanical Gardens, and ask them what they would suggest. They have some beautiful gardens with native and/or drought-resistant plants and trees that help clean the environment and are healthier for you and your family. You can copy some of their ideas and incorporate them with ideas of your own. You do not need to cover the yard with grass (real or fake) in order to have a beautiful yard.

http://www.qbgardens.org/

Thanks for the input folks. Ya'll rock. I like the ideas. Might hit Quail tomorrow.

ox
...closing in on closing

the current synthetic grasses "perc". The water DOES drain into the ground underneath - hence recharging the aquafer. It is not the same as an impermiable concrete which forces the water into the storm water system. Rain will soak into the ground similar to if it were real grass. If it's a hard clay surface underneath the synthetic grass then it won't drain... but it wouldn't drain if it were real grass over hard clay.

Lawns in San Diego make no sense... they make sense in places with lots of rain like Pennsylvania, Western Washington, etc... but here you cannot maintain a lawn without irrigation. It's a hold back to the old english estates where you had rolling hills and sheep to keep them cropped.

I don't understand why places like Jersey and SF are putting in artificial turf. it really does make a lot of sense for socal. drainage is not an issue. the fine rubber tire pallets are a concern.

Veritas, If you are making an argument about water running over crushed water, dont you also have to consider ill effects of fertilizer and lawn treatments? I also don't think its clear that if there is any truth to the rubber dust argument, that it would maintain the same potency over time, vs. repeated applications of fertilizers that will always be full potency.

As for petroleum products in general, what do you think the exposure is to grass, vs. a wii controller, cell phone case, car interior, toys, furniture, etc.

We live in San Marcos too and my friends just installed it in their newly built home.
They said they LOVE it. They have a dog and used to have grass which the dog left a mess and was a lot of trouble to upkeep. This has made it a piece of cake. The water bill, no mowing etc.

The only con they have found is that it heats up in the summer. They just spray it down with a hose for a few minutes and it is good to go.

I am considering it and was surprised how good it looks these days.

On thing of concern. It costs about as much as installing hardwood flooring.

fake grass is disgusting. you want your children to play on chemicals that are off gassing in the sun? I don't get it. For the record I do not think real grass belongs in dry parts of socal either. The amount of toxic chemicals and precious water required is just nutty. Go with low water plantings natural to our area. They are beautiful - they flower - the hummingbirds like them and you will too!

I'm with disimilar on this. The whole fake grass thing seems less like a real solution and more like a fad. Why not fake trees and a plastic dog too? I suspect that a few years from now everyone will be trading tips on how to tear this stuff out. It will be looked on like shag carpets and avocado-colored appliances. We live surrounded by plastic, do you want your yard to be one more plastic place? And don't get me started on the chemicals, lead, etc.

There is so much wonderful landscaping that can be done with drought tolerant plants. Think of that yard as a canvas! Do something real with it! And you can always have a *small* real lawn for kids to play on, to take a nap on, etc.

-Lou

To bob2007, Keeping it real is better. I think the fake grass can also be a fire hazard.

Fertilizer: Organic (Natural) versus Chemical (Inorganic)
"The argument continues. The organic proponents say only organic should be used. The chemical proponents have their argument of high analysis and quicker availability. Why don't we consult Nature and see how she has been feeding plants life since the very beginning?"

"A bag of organic fertilizer has all the carbon/energy to meet the needs of the soil microbes. A bag of chemical fertilizer has no energy. If organic matter is not already present in the soil, the chemicals can quickly become stressful, even toxic, to the plants. This causes plants to be susceptible to disease and insect problems."

"Organic fertilizers are believed to be slower acting than the chemical fertilizers. This is true to a degree. Being a lower NPK analysis and slower acting, organic fertilizers can be used in higher volume around plants without danger of burning. However, there are some organic fertilizers that are fast acting, such as bat guano or fish meal, that can show results as quickly as the chemical fertilizers do. They are still slower to burn the plants than the chemicals and last much longer in the soil."

"Unless chemical fertilizers are impregnated or coated with a microbe inhibitor and some substance to keep them from quickly dissolving, they must be used very cautiously. Especially in sandy soils, they can burn the roots of the plants and quickly leach beyond the reach of the roots. They generally end up polluting a water supply because they are too quickly dissolved and moved out of the soil. In heavy clay soils or any soil with a high organic and humus content, this is less of a problem."

"Chemical fertilizers that are blended to perfectly fit a given soil and then used in the correct season and correct amounts can do nothing more than grow a plant. They do not build or sustain a healthy soil. Organic fertilizers contain the energy and the many other things that continually build soil fertility, crumb structure, increased water holding capacity, food for all the beneficial soil life, condition the soil and contribute to the hundreds of other yet-unknown things that cause a plant to grow healthy and perfect."

"Only healthy and perfectly grown plants can feed and support healthy and perfect animal and human life."

It is entirely up to you what you want to put on your plants and in your yard. It is still a free country last time I checked.

http://www.malcolmbeck.com/books/gv_meth...

I personally would rather remove all my grass and lay a nice flagstone patio with and build an outdoor living room instead of wasting water on a lawn. There are enough parks for my kids to play at that I dont need a massive lawn.

Back east I wanted a lot of space bc i didnt want my neighbors on top of me but here I dont want the maintenance.

Fake grass melts but does not combust. At least the brands we looked at. We live above San Clemente Canyon and are in a designated fire zone on the fire maps put out by the county...

It gets ruined (melted) in a fire - but does not add to the fire hazard.

That is good to know, thanks for the information. I thought because is was petro. based it might burn.

U-T had a nice article on xeri-grasses (low-thirst grasses). There are several native species of grasses and grassy-looking sedges which make nice-looking "lawns" and only need water once a week (sometimes less) once established.

Check out the article, very interesting.

I personally think fake grass is the future, as the price of water goes up, people are going to look for ways to cut costs.

Using natural plant life won't give an area for kids to run through, so fake grass it will be. You can get it without lead, drains, and doesn't heat up too badly.

Dog pisses on it, you just rinse it off..

Visit the companies and ask if you can have addresses of real customers to see how it looks in real life with other landscaping after X number of years. I have seen plenty of them done around here and the quality really varies. It looks a lot better if it is disguised with landscaping around it like bordered by a hedge, bushes, grasses, flowers etc. and you can go low water on all of that. It typically looks SUPER lame around a tree. I have yet to see that done well. Keep in mind all of the other landscaping around it. If you have messy trees and such you're going to be out there raking or blowing that stuff when you would have just run the lawn mower over it. Unless you don't mind all of the stuff on your grass. (Actually it looks a heck of a lot more real when leaves have blown on it.)

Are we still talking about fake grass? No. It's gross. Don't you have enough plastic in your life?

We have it and love it. It's a small area in the back. My dog killed the sod 3 different times, finally we installed this with a rock and sand base. It is awesome. Just hose it down once in awhile. It's been in for about 3 years, and still looks good!
I was able to decrease my gardener bill by half,and the H2O has gone down too.

Not to get gross or anything, but anyone who has owned a dog knows that what they deposit is not always, shall we say, firm. It is going to get down between those blades and, if you don't catch it for say a day or so (entirely possible), it is going to dry and be next to impossible to rinse out with a hose.

Even if you don't have a dog, there are birds flying overhead who often do rude bomb releases, there are the wandering rodents, there are all kinds of things leaving stuff behind in your yard.

At least with real grass, it gets rinsed every couple of days, vacuumed (with a mower), and even replaced through the grow-n-mow cycle.

I personally can't imagine having what amounts to outdoor green shag carpeting covering my property.

To each their own, though.

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Save the land as is, and start a vegetable garden instead. You will be able to eat your own fresh vegetables and learn a valuable skill which could be necessary in our future.